Gay Marriage Debate - Portland, OR

I come to the determination that we should let queers marry because then, people would see for themselves how much worse it fails than straight marriage has. Lets not stop them after all.. let them do it. It won't have good results anyhow. Lesbian marriage seems to function better out of the 2. Not that I am for it but it can and lesbians can at least have children.

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I favor keeping marriage standards; I'm a moderate who wants to keep marriage as is.

Brian_G wrote:

I favor keeping marriage standards; I'm a moderate who wants to keep marriage as is.

Oh, just like my mother was. She wanted to keep people of different complexions from going to the same schools, or marrying those whose didn't match.
It's called bigotry Brian, and you've already lost.
Marriage isn't just for heterosexuals now, and it will not go back.
Just resign yourself, or go live somewhere that it's unlikely to change in this century.
Afghanistan sounds like a good match for you.

NWmoon wrote:

Oh, just like my mother was. She wanted to keep people of different complexions from going to the same schools, or marrying those whose didn't match. It's called bigotry

By his own admission, NWmoon's mother was a race bigot. Race has nothing to do with gender, they only like this comparison because everyone accepts racial segregation as bigotry. They only use miscegenation laws (which were all heterosexual) to compare marriage moderates to bigots.

Now, they support gender segregation in marriage; they are the children of bigots, what else can we expect?

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NWmoon wrote:

Brian, and you've already lost. Marriage isn't just for heterosexuals now, and it will not go back.

Marriage has never been "just for heterosexuals", gays have always married under the same standards as everyone else. We haven't lost:

"Ballot Measure 36 was a 2004 initiative in the U.S. state of Oregon. It amended the Oregon Constitution to define marriage as a union of one man and one woman. The initiative passed with 1,028,546 votes in favor, and 787,556 votes against (57% to 43%) in the November 2, 2004 general election.

Measure 36 added the following text to Article 15 of the Oregon Constitution, as Section 5a:[2] "Policy regarding marriage. It is the policy of Oregon, and its political subdivisions, that only a marriage between one man and one woman shall be valid or legally recognized as a marriage.[Created through initiative petition filed March 2, 2004, and adopted by the people Nov. 2, 2004]"

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NWmoon wrote:

Just resign yourself, or go live somewhere that it's unlikely to change in this century. Afghanistan sounds like a good match for you.

See how NWmoon attempts to shut down marriage moderates? If the quote above isn't a good example of uncivil discourse, what is?

See how brian can't understand that he's already lost?
And plenty of my friends of colour find the analogy perfectly acceptable, and my mom was just as homophobic as she was racist. I just refused to learn her hate.
You've lost.
In a few years it will be all over, and nobody will pay you hateful fearful homophobes any attention at all, but to shake heads and say "how sad that they are so ignorant and hateful that they would refuse citizens their full equal rights."

I see, according to NWmoon, gender segregation marriage is the road to homosexual bigotry.

No thanks, we like marriage as is.

I laugh at you Brian, because you're doomed to live in a world that laughs at you for your hatred.
Just deal with it homophobe, you've lost already.
Every year you lose more.
Soon the only places left that will not have marriage equality will be those theocracies that also keep women in veils and trample all their rights as well. You should move to one.
I'm sure you'll be very happy there.

Keeping marriage male/female has nothing to do with 'hatred'; it's about honoring your mother and father.

More than 30 states have defined marriage as husband and wife, in their state's Constitution.

Gay rights and women's rights has nothing to do with redefining marriage to make it unisex.

Brian_G wrote:

Keeping marriage male/female has nothing to do with 'hatred'; it's about honoring your mother and father.
More than 30 states have defined marriage as husband and wife, in their state's Constitution.
Gay rights and women's rights has nothing to do with redefining marriage to make it unisex.

That will be overturned. Perhaps by SCOTUS, perhaps by new initiatives that will pass because younger voters aren't as bigoted, or a combination.
It's only a matter of time, and even at my age, I have every expectation of seeing it before I'm dead.
You? You'll just see your bigotry and hate lose. It's losing more every day.
Don't like it? Too bad, sooo sad for the homophobic haters.
You can always move to Afghanistan or one of those other theocracies that keep women and gays oppressed. I'm sure you'll fit in just fine.

Oh, and brian, you cannot KEEP something that no longer IS.
It is legal in some states now, more to follow. It's legal in many countries, even those that HAVE a state religion. Even CATHOLIC countries.
You lose.

What country that HAS a state religion, allow same sex marriage?

Brian_G wrote:

What country that HAS a state religion, allow same sex marriage?

Argentina, Portugal and Spain for three. There are more. You don't know as much as you think you do.
These are CATHOLIC countries that I listed, one of the most conservative of the mainstream Christian sects. If they've legalized it already, then it's only a matter of time.
Just resign yourself, dinosaur child, you're sort will soon be nearly extinct. Even though some of you will survive, you won't be allowed to persecute or bully others with impunity, and you'll learn to keep your homophobic comments to yourself when you're not in the company of other the irrational dinosaurs.

None of those countries has a state religion:

"Portugal is a secular state: church and state were formally separated during the Portuguese First Republic, and later reiterated in the 1976 Portuguese Constitution."

Spain: "The constitution also specifies that Spain has no state religion and that all are free to practice and believe as they wish."

Argentina: "The Constitution guarantees freedom of religion but also requires the government to support Roman Catholicism economically."

Source: Wikipedia

Brian_G wrote:

None of those countries has a state religion:
"Portugal is a secular state: church and state were formally separated during the Portuguese First Republic, and later reiterated in the 1976 Portuguese Constitution."
Spain: "The constitution also specifies that Spain has no state religion and that all are free to practice and believe as they wish."
Argentina: "The Constitution guarantees freedom of religion but also requires the government to support Roman Catholicism economically."
Source: Wikipedia

Mea Culpa, I should have used the web instead of the book. It's too old.

This is from wikapedia

The Church of England is the officially established religious institution in England, and also the Mother Church of the worldwide Anglican Communion.

Jurisdictions which recognize a Lutheran church as their state religion include Denmark, Sweden, and Iceland.

And while those other three may not have state religions anymore, they're still predominately Catholic, and it is STILL legal there.

Suck it up, buttercup.
You've lost. You're regarded with the same disgust as racial bigots are shown, because your attitudes and ideas are just as outdated and wrong.

That's the only thing gender and race have in common, in NWmoon's instance. Racial bigots aren't accepted in moderate society, and that's where NWmoon wants people who believe and advocate marriage kept between male and female. This is a fight between gender diversity marriage and gender segregation marriage. Either sex has meaning, or it doesn't.

Either a male is the same as a female or their different. If their different, their unequal. This isn't rocket science, biology says mating of male and female are required for procreation.

There is a reason so few nations recognize same sex marriage.

The gay perverts of NAMBLA are pushing same sex marriages so the gay men can eventually "marry" young boys.

Vote against the NAMBLA perverts by voting down gay marriages between men and boys!

Mary wrote:

The gay perverts of NAMBLA are pushing same sex marriages so the gay men can eventually "marry" young boys.
Vote against the NAMBLA perverts by voting down gay marriages between men and boys!

Liar. Nambla and its promotions are not supported by the gay population in general. May as well say that all heterosexuals are in favour of paedophilia.
You guys have nothing to say against equal rights if you don't lie, do you?

Mary wrote:

The gay perverts of NAMBLA are pushing same sex marriages so the gay men can eventually "marry" young boys.
Vote against the NAMBLA perverts by voting down gay marriages between men and boys!

You are delusional.

There is no gender equality right in the Constitution; no lie.