Abortion Debate - Philadelphia, PA

A woman's sexual/family life is not subject to public or religious review.

CherryTheTart wrote:

A woman's sexual/family life is not subject to public or religious review.

Since the victims's parents are human beings, the victims are also human beings.(It's the parents, stupid. Elementary biology.) Therefore the victims are human children and abortion is murder. I'm against murder, therefore I vote 'Never.'

Paperprofit wrote:

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Since the victims's parents are human beings, the victims are also human beings.(It's the parents, stupid. Elementary biology.) Therefore the victims are human children and abortion is murder. I'm against murder, therefore I vote 'Never.'

Murder is illegal.
Abortion is legal.
That which is illegal cannot also be legal.
Therefore abortion is not murder.

Eeezy Peezey. Boy! are you a typical authoritarian: conventional, hostile and submissive.

CherryTheTart wrote:

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Murder is illegal.
Abortion is legal.
That which is illegal cannot also be legal.
Therefore abortion is not murder.
Eeezy Peezey. Boy! are you a typical authoritarian: conventional, hostile and submissive.

It isn't 'legal' except in the minds of murderers.

Paperprofit wrote:

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It isn't 'legal' except in the minds of murderers.

Uh huh. So call the cops on your local women's clinic. Do it right now! Yell "Murder" a lot when you do. The cops have a hard job. They could use the laugh.

CherryTheTart wrote:

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Uh huh. So call the cops on your local women's clinic. Do it right now! Yell "Murder" a lot when you do. The cops have a hard job. They could use the laugh.

You begged the question: When should abortion be legal? The parents are proof the victims are children.(The parents of non-humans are non-humans.) Therefore abortion is murder. So the correct answer is 'never,' unless, of course, one is a pro-abort, like you. Then murdering babies is peachy and the answer is 'always.'

Paperprofit wrote:

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You begged the question: When should abortion be legal? The parents are proof the victims are children.(The parents of non-humans are non-humans.) Therefore abortion is murder. So the correct answer is 'never,' unless, of course, one is a pro-abort, like you. Then murdering babies is peachy and the answer is 'always.'

It is not my question. But I have MY answer. Abortion is a responsible choice when confronted with an unwanted ppregnancy. You probably should not have an abortion.

Scott wrote:

This debate really isn't a debate. The question is very simple: Is the unborn a person, or not? That question has never been positively answered. And that is extremely problematic. Because until that question can be positively answered, no other question can be asked, and the pro-life side should be given the benefit of the doubt. Why? Because so long as it remains a question, you CANNOT avoid the possibility that abortion is murder.
Every single argument that the pro-choice side uses is question-begging by nature. You cannot turn this debate into an issue of "women's rights" when you have yet to prove that the unborn are not persons. Every argument that has anything at all to do with women's rights simply ASSUMES an answer to the very question that the debate is supposed to be about. That is, unless you really are so sick to think that a mother's comfort is more important than a child's life.
The point is this:
Is the unborn a person or not?
If yes: Abortion is murder. Period. NO circumstances whatsoever can justify it.
If no: THEN, and ONLY THEN can we look to further arguments dealing with women's rights, etc.
But the problem is the pro-choice side has never providing positive reason for us to accept the idea that unborn are not persons. What IS personhood? Why do you define it that way? And why should everyone accept your definition? Until you can answer those questions in such a way that they should be considered factual answers, and not opinionated ones, the pro-choice side bears a burden of proof that it has not fulfilled. Which means pro-life has won the debate, until and unless if that burden can be fulfilled. But the fact that the pro-choice position has continuously changed its argument over history and avoided the real question in dispute does not give it a very hopeful outlook.
Face it, folks. Abortion is murder. You have NO basis on which you can deny that, because you cannot FACTUALLY justify your OPINION that unborn individuals should not be considered persons.

According to our Constitution, a legal person is BORN.

However, no born person has a right to one drop of my blood or any part or product of my body, even if s/he is dying, without my consent. So even if you got a constitutional amendment saying an embryo is a person, a woman casnnot be compelled to carry it and shed her blood for it. Sure would make for some interesting lawsuits.

CherryTheTart wrote:

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It is not my question. But I have MY answer. Abortion is a responsible choice when confronted with an unwanted pregnancy.

Not if it's murder. And since the victims have human parents, they're human children--human babies.(Not that murdering babies bothers you, obviously.)

Paperprofit wrote:

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Not if it's murder. And since the victims have human parents, they're human children--human babies.(Not that murdering babies bothers you, obviously.)

Please link me to the criminal cases that prove your assertion. I will wait.

You are ignorant. There is an abortion in the Bible for jealousy.

CherryTheTart wrote:

Please link me to the criminal cases that prove your assertion. I will wait.

For the direct killing of innocent children? Typically it's murder, except in your twisted world.

Paperprofit wrote:

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For the direct killing of innocent children? Typically it's murder, except in your twisted world.

Please link me to any criminal case in which a woman was charged with murder for having an abortion at any time in the USA (or anywhere, for that matter). I will wait.

Don't give me any shit. I did not say abortion is murder. You did. If you are correct and not just foaming away like an AH, it should be easy to prove. So prove it.

CherryTheTart wrote:

So prove it.

That abortion is murder? I already did. The victims have human parents, therefore they're human children--human babies.(Non-humans don't have human parents.) The direct killing of babies is murder. Therefore abortion is murder. QED
If you need to, use your finger to follow the argument.

Paperprofit wrote:

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That abortion is murder? I already did. The victims have human parents, therefore they're human children--human babies.(Non-humans don't have human parents.) The direct killing of babies is murder. Therefore abortion is murder. QED
If you need to, use your finger to follow the argument.

The message above does not prove abortion is murder. You said it is. Prove it. If abortion is murder, there will be convictions. Present me with one. Should be easy.

But it is not easy for you because you do not even understand the concept "proof." You seem as dumb as a stump. But you want to be in charge of my sex/family life? That is rich.

CherryTheTart wrote:

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The message above does not prove abortion is murder.

Well, not to a baby murderer it doesn't.

Paperprofit wrote:

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Well, not to a baby murderer it doesn't.

Calling me names does not prove your point. I repeat: please prove abortion is murder anywhere in the world with evidence. Should be easy to do. Court cases are easu tp find. I will wait. Or you can admit you are just foaming away like a nutjob.

Since you do not understand the concept "proof," I have provided a definition below:

Definition of PROOF
1a : the cogency of evidence that compels acceptance by the mind of a truth or a fact b : the process or an instance of establishing the validity of a statement especially by derivation from other statements in accordance with principles of reasoning
2obsolete : experience
3: something that induces certainty or establishes validity
4archaic : the quality or state of having been tested or tried; especially : unyielding hardness
5: evidence operating to determine the finding or judgment of a tribunal
6a plural proofs or proof : a copy (as of typeset text) made for examination or correction b : a test impression of an engraving, etching, or lithograph c : a coin that is struck from a highly polished die on a polished planchet, is not intended for circulation, and sometimes differs in metallic content from coins of identical design struck for circulation d : a test photographic print made from a negative
7: a test applied to articles or substances to determine whether they are of standard or satisfactory quality
8a : the minimum alcoholic strength of proof spirit b : strength with reference to the standard for proof spirit; specifically : alcoholic strength indicated by a number that is twice the percent by volume of alcohol present <whiskey of 90 proof is 45 percent alcohol>
See proof defined for English-language learners »
See proof defined for kids »
Examples of PROOF
The document was proof that her story was true.
He claims that he was home when the murder was committed, but he has no proof.
The proof shows that the theorem is true.
Origin of PROOF
Middle English prof, prove, alteration of preve, from Anglo-French preove, from Late Latin proba, from Latin probare to prove — more at prove
First Known Use: 13th century
Related to PROOF
Synonyms: attestation, confirmation, corroboration, documentation, evidence, substantiation, testament, testimonial, testimony, validation, voucher, witness

CherryTheTart wrote:

Calling me names does not prove your point.

I didn't call you 'names.' I said my argument doesn't prove abortion is murder to a baby murderer. That's impossible. However, for anyone else, it does.

Paperprofit wrote:

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I didn't call you 'names.' I said my argument doesn't prove abortion is murder to a baby murderer. That's impossible. However, for anyone else, it does.

Murder is a serious charge.

Please present me with even one criminal case in which a woman was charged and convicted of murder for having an abortion.

You cannot or you would do so.

You came here to foam and rant. You seem incapable of rational and logical discussion. I must say I find that true of many of you ForcedBirthers.

CherryTheTart wrote:

Murder is a serious charge.

Yes it is. And since the victims of abortion have human parents, they're human beings--human children. And since the direct killing of children is always murder, government sanctioned or not, abortion is always murder.

Paperprofit wrote:

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Yes it is. And since the victims of abortion have human parents, they're human beings--human children. And since the direct killing of children is always murder, government sanctioned or not, abortion is always murder.

No woman has ever been convicted murder for having an abortion. I asked you to prove abortion is murder. You cannot do so.

Therefore you are a ranter and a liar and no sensible person is going to listen to anything you say.

Please explain why a woman should give birth to a child she does not want and/or cannot care for, give birth to a defective or dying child, or die in childbirth.

We will see if you are capable of thought at all. I doubt it.