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“For a Democratic Vietnam”
Joined: Jun 19, 2008
Comments: 1040
Glen Waverley, Australia
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Ryan Boston wrote: <quoted text> How's about the Unites States of America Government and its Officials? Is it a safer bet? URL: http://www.loc.gov/index.html Government official records should be treated as such. Materials compiled by government officials often reflect the government policies and perspectives. Reports to the US government could be distorted for whatever purposes the authors wished to pursue. The public has to make its own judgement about these things. Each of us, by our education levels and knowledge will form our own opinions about these facts. One should always read these records with open mind so that can see through these facts and figures independently. It isn't an easy task.
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“Another Victory For Hanoi”
Joined: Aug 20, 2007
Comments: 1687
Hochiminh City, aka Saigon
ISP:
United States
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Obviously you and me do not speak the same language. Phiengung wrote: <quoted text>
"la chuyen truyen mieng thoi, nghia la thuoc pham tru giai thoai, Folklore, chu khong thuoc pham tru lich su"., GS Tran Q Vuong.
Let assume all is true. Is there anything to do with “this Great Patriotic Vietnamese” and what he had done for his people and his country? The answer is NO.
You are Nuts. Phiengung wrote: <quoted text>
This thread is about history. Emotion clouds judgement. Gian mat khon. Simple. You should not let your emotion overcome you when discuss about history. Once again, it proves that elders who are intellectually dishonest like you could only hurt younger generations with your full-filled hatred minds. What is history and what is fair tale, a sane person must be very clear abt them both. Am I angry? Yeah I'm angry not because the so call historian was telling a fairy tale, but rather people like you who stupid enough for not knowing it was a fairy tale and crying out loud and attacking a dead person with your fairy-fact. This is outrageous.
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“Another Victory For Hanoi”
Joined: Aug 20, 2007
Comments: 1687
Hochiminh City, aka Saigon
ISP:
United States
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Obviously you and me do not speak the same language. Ryan Boston wrote: "la chuyen truyen mieng thoi, nghia la thuoc pham tru giai thoai, Folklore, chu khong thuoc pham tru lich su"., GS Tran Q Vuong.
Let assume all is true. Is there anything to do with “this Great Patriotic Vietnamese” and what he had done for his people and his country? The answer is NO.
You are Nuts. Phiengung wrote: This thread is about history. Emotion clouds judgement. Gian mat khon. Simple. You should not let your emotion overcome you when discuss about history. Once again, it proves that elders who are intellectually dishonest like you could only hurt younger generations with your full-filled hatred minds. What is history and what is fair tale, a sane person must be very clear abt them both. Am I angry? Yeah I'm angry not because the so call historian was telling a fairy tale, but rather people like you who stupid enough for not knowing it was a fairy tale and crying out loud and attacking a dead person with your fairy-fact. This is outrageous.
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“For a Democratic Vietnam”
Joined: Jun 19, 2008
Comments: 1040
Glen Waverley, Australia
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Ryan Boston wrote: Obviously you and me do not speak the same language.
<quoted text>
<quoted text>
Once again, it proves that elders who are intellectually dishonest like you could only hurt younger generations with your full-filled hatred minds.
What is history and what is fair tale, a sane person must be very clear abt them both. Am I angry? Yeah I'm angry not because the so call historian was telling a fairy tale, but rather people like you who stupid enough for not knowing it was a fairy tale and crying out loud and attacking a dead person with your fairy-fact.
This is outrageous. Ryan, "Intellectually dishonest"! That sounds harsh and it isn't an unjust charge. Rumours. Let me tell you a few stories. The liaison between J. F. Kennedy and his brother with the world famous blonde actress M. Monroe was well know for at least nearly four decades before the press finally acknowledged it. Same with François Mitterrand. The French president had mistress while he was holding the highest office but the press did not report it even though it was wellknown to many people for many years. For a well known and respected historian like Tran Quoc Vuong to pen down a story known to Nghe an people long before Ho Chi Minh became the president of Vietminh lead government is something extremely important. Here is part of what I wrote again: Phiengung wrote: <quoted text>
This thread is about history. Emotion clouds judgement. Gian mat khon. Simple. You should not let your emotion overcome you when discuss about history.
Ho Chi Minh is a historical figure. As such, anything to do with this person is of interest for historians.
You should note that the story told by Tran Quoc Vuong wasn't disrespectful to Ho Chi Minh or his father Nguyen Sinh Huy. Tran Quoc Vuong simply told a story known to people in Nghe An for many generations
Ho Chi Minh personal live has been the interest of many people. Historians carry with them the duty to tell future generations as much about this historical figure. Folklores, rumours aren’t always false but as history has proven, are ways to tell true stories which otherwise can not be told officially. So far, apart from accusing me of intellectually dishonesty, you have not come up with anything of value. Care to explain why a historian chose to write about the rumour about the ancestor of Ho Chi Minh knowingly that it might get him into strife with vietcong regime? In fact, vietcong made it known to him and other in Vietnam of their displease about his work thus it was published in an overseas forum rather than in Vietnam.
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Stateless
Concord, NH
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Phiengung wrote: <quoted text>
Ryan,
"Intellectually dishonest"! That sounds harsh and it isn't an unjust charge.
Rumours. Let me tell you a few stories.
The liaison between J. F. Kennedy and his brother with the world famous blonde actress M. Monroe was well know for at least nearly four decades before the press finally acknowledged it.
Same with François Mitterrand. The French president had mistress while he was holding the highest office but the press did not report it even though it was wellknown to many people for many years.
For a well known and respected historian like Tran Quoc Vuong to pen down a story known to Nghe an people long before Ho Chi Minh became the president of Vietminh lead government is something extremely important.
Here is part of what I wrote again:
<quoted text>
So far, apart from accusing me of intellectually dishonesty, you have not come up with anything of value.
Care to explain why a historian chose to write about the rumour about the ancestor of Ho Chi Minh knowingly that it might get him into strife with vietcong regime? In fact, vietcong made it known to him and other in Vietnam of their displease about his work thus it was published in an overseas forum rather than in Vietnam. old bamboo, are you attacking a bamboo shoot or teaching him some his story? remember, "everything is relative, but some things are more relative than others" history of Vietnam has been messed up for hundreds of years. Messed by Vietnamese Messed up by Chinese Messed up by French Messed up by the us of a Messed up by VNCH the 1st Messed up by VNCH then 2nd Messed up by Viettan Messed up by VNCS too which version(s) are you on?
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Uncle Pumblechook
Montreal, Canada
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Most anti-communist Vietnamese (remnants of the VNCH - Republic of South Vietnam) living in the US oten cite Freedom and Democracry as the reason why they left Vietnam for the US because Vietnam lack both (sic). Why did they not go to India and settle down there. India has more than one billion inhabitants and is known as the biggest democracy in the world It is understandable that people move to where they can make a living and feed their families. I do not blame them for going to rich countries like the US, France, Canada, Australia where jobs and food can be found. Let s call a spade a spade, shall we? They left Vietnam in quest of a better life like many other Mexicans, Indians, Bangladeshis. The south Vietnamese army debacle in April 1975 and its aftermath has given many of our people an opportunity to leave VN by boat or by plane and settle down in rich countries. Some of these Vietnamese abroad today have chosen to voice their political opinions about Freedom, democracy, human rights or lack of those in Vietnam, Why ???? Because they want revenge against the communist liberators. To these people, South Vietnam has been invaded and occupied by the communists (sic) It is noteworthy to mention that these anti-communist vnch remnants now have food, clothes in abundance and have time to think, whereas before when first settled down in the US, they were so busy to look for food to feed their families. No money, no honey no politicking. I personally do not undertand what kind of Freedom democracry and human rights these people are talking about? Did they have them before in South Vietnam. The anwswer is NO. In 1954, NgoDinhDiem a jobless wanderer, while living abroad was shipped back to Vietnam by the US to become prime minster,, under a puppet French suppported BaoDai government and then to become President of VNCH (In Engish Republic of South Vietnam) thru a rigged referendum. http://www.youtube.com/watch... http://www.youtube.com/watch... http://www.youtube.com/watch...
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Uncle Pumblechook
Montreal, Canada
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[ continued ] http://www.youtube.com/watch... http://www.youtube.com/watch... http://www.youtube.com/watch... Diem a despot, ruled Vietnam with an iron hand. He, his family and his secret police would imprison any one any party leader who dared oppose or challenge his rule. And many monks burnt themselves to death in protest of the mistreatment of Buddhist religion and buddhist monks. In 1963, Diem and his brother were shot by a bunch of vnch military men in a coup encouraged by the CIA. These greedy militia men killed their own president in exchange for a few dollars and the support of their own rule by the USA. http://www.youtube.com/watch... 1964.... South Vietnam was now in total chaos. Instead of building the country, the military junta toppled each other in order to grab more power for themselves. In 1965 they sent young girls to Danang with flowers (sic) to welcome the first American GI's to Vietnam to bomb and kill innocent people. http://www.youtube.com/watch... ( girls with flowers to greet the American GIs ) In 1967, election was organised hastily and Nguyen VanThieu became president of a puppet regime, called VNCH II, hand picked and fully supported by the US. Thieu and his acolytes continued to follow American policy of containment of communism in S.E.A to the letter thus killing their own brethen in the name of Freedom democracy a` la USA. In 1972, When Nixon went to China and shook hands with comrade Mao Tse Tung, Thieu and south Vietnam became irrelevant to the US. 1973, the American government decided to throw South Vietnam away they way they would throw a banana peel by signing a peace treaty with North Vietnam that would allow the Americans to withdraw its troops and bring back American POWs. The VNCH panicked and now every one was fending for himself and was trying to stash usd abroad and send their children to the USA, knowing that their glorious days were numbered. What happened next every one of us knows. http://www.youtube.com/watch... In summary, South Vietnam before 1975 was no more than a house without foundation propped up by Hollywood to make a movie. When the movie was over the house simply collapsed unable to sustain by its own. Finally, If one day your son comes and asks you this: "Daddy, when are you going to buy us a big house, the one Bill Gates has right now.?? what would you answer your son. Most probably "Yes my Son. You will have a big house like that of Mr. Bill Gates one day. Can't you see that Daddy is working very hard doing nails and haircuts ... Son You would not want Daddy to hold up a bank or to go to Bill Gate s house to steal his money would you Son?? ..........
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smith1
Houston, TX
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Ryan Boston wrote: REMEMBERING 04-30-1975 The Pinky show present "Journey Back to Vietnam History" Bunny and Pinky discuss the origins of the American War (also known as the 'Vietnam War' in America) from the library of Congress, DC. Wikipedia (Vietnam War) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_War How did the U.S. get involved in Vietnam? Why did the U.S. have to fight that War? Real reason vs. the reason the U.S. Government wanted American public to believe and Misrepresentation. Let start this journey with a statement made by President John F Kennedy in 1962. How was the relationship between Vietnam and the U.S.? Wikipedia (JFK) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_F._Kennedy "As you know, the US for more than a decade has been assisting the government, the people of Vietnam, to maintain their independence"(JFK-1962) How could anybody have any problem with that? But actually there is a HUGE Problem with his statement. The first half of that sentence is Misleading "As you know, the US for more than a decade has been assisting the government, the people of Vietnam" And the second half is simply Untrue "to maintain their Independence" For example, when President JFK referred to the Government, the people of Vietnam; he failed to mention which Government? It is obviously very important because during the Vietnam War era, there was more than one government struggling for control. And the one had the strongest supports among Vietnamese people was NOT the one that the U.S. was supporting. Also when President Kennedy said, "assisting the people of Vietnam, to maintain their Independence". It sounded like Vietnamese people were hopeless in the faces of some foreign aggressors, which the U.S. was helping them to repel. In reality the foreign aggressor was the U.S. Independence (In de- pen den): the quality, the state of self-governing, not subject to control by others. Wikipedia (Independence) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independence Even the word "Independence was used" is problematic. By definition, independence implies self-determination, sovereignty. But the U.S. had only started bankrolling the French War against Vietnamese people in an attempt to keep Vietnam under French colonial rules. The statement like this only makes sense if it accepts rather ridiculous idea that Vietnamese needed the US's help in order to maintain their independence from themselves --- > Independence = the quality, the state of being controlled by others? So where do we learn the things that we know about the Vietnam War / the American War. Most people think they know a little bit about the Vietnam War. Things we have seen in the movies, TVs, information we received from the Government, from newspapers, high school textbooks and so on. The problem is that most of the stuff is factually incorrect or misleading. The interpretation of facts is one thing but you can't start understanding built on outright misinformation. It just doesn't work. Next: Who was involved? Their interests, who won and why? \ If you check your sources, you will find the French was getting help from the usa before Kennedy got in office. If Kennndy had not been murdered, he had already realized his mistake in in sending more men to Vietnan and more than likely would have pulled them out. Also, We won every major battle that was fought in Vietnam.
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mojo
Union, NJ
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Judged:
1
Ryan, I am quoting, "Most people think they know a little bit about the Vietnam War. "Things we have seen in the movies, TVs, information we received from the Government..."" etc. The fact that you are utilizing the power of the free media to quote facts about the vietnam war and you have the arrogance to accuse american of being narrow minded by only turn to one source of media? If you insist in promoting democracy, do so in Vietnam where newpapers, TV and radio broadcasting staions are state regulated. And of course, you know it better.
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Pit
Los Angeles, CA
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smith1 wrote: <quoted text>\
If you check your sources, you will find the French was getting help from the usa before Kennedy got in office. If Kennndy had not been murdered, he had already realized his mistake in in sending more men to Vietnan and more than likely would have pulled them out. Also, We won every major battle that was fought in Vietnam. The American War: The U.S. in Vietnam http://www.vietnamese-american.org/contents.h... "summary: Pinky & Bunny discuss the origins of the Vietnam War (also known as the 'American War' in Vietnam). The episode is comprised of four short chapters: 1. Misrepresentations. 2. Desire and Struggle: a basic timeline of events. 3. Searching for Reasons. 4. Consequences." http://youtube.com/watch... Black Gold "Just before the Japanese surrendered, the US had been preparing for a massive invasion of the Japanese home islands and had stockpiled vast supplies of weapons and munitions on the island of Okinawa. Enough weaponry to invade Japan. What ever happened to all those military supplies?" http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtrut... Smedley wrote: Everything I see on TV is that Vietnam is doing quite well. And today, Vietnamese military personnel are training in the U.S. on military bases. Just as long as U.S. oil companies get their drilling permits in the Spratly Islands. "Xin Loi", as we used to say. http://www.topix.net/forum/world/vietnam/TPTS...
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Gio hu
Naples, FL
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Pit send virus to my PC
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Pit
Los Angeles, CA
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Gio hu wrote: Pit send virus to my PC Are you afraid of the truth? How much do you know about computers? From what you said, there are a lot of things you still need to learn yet.
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Gio hu
Naples, FL
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This is second PC to send out this massage Pit.
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Pit
Los Angeles, CA
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Gio hu wrote: This is second PC to send out this massage Pit. http://www.advite.com/tuvan.htm
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“For a Democratic Vietnam”
Joined: Jun 19, 2008
Comments: 1040
Melbourne, Australia
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Stateless wrote: <quoted text>
old bamboo,
are you attacking a bamboo shoot or teaching him some his story?
remember, "everything is relative, but some things are more relative than others"
history of Vietnam has been messed up for hundreds of years.
Messed by Vietnamese
Messed up by Chinese
Messed up by French
Messed up by the us of a
Messed up by VNCH the 1st
Messed up by VNCH then 2nd
Messed up by Viettan
Messed up by VNCS too
which version(s) are you on? Stateless, Believe it or not, but I give this young Ryan more credit and respect than some of your friends. If you don't want to be friend with them, let me make it clear, the one who posts the lie about the stolen gold and the one who silliness is beyond belief to post the story about "black gold". My conversations with this Ryan is just that, conversations ie "doi thoai". I don't mean to teach him anything but I am certainly open to learning from any one, any where, any time. "Bien hoc bao la bat tan". You know what I mean, don't you. Back to the point. I am quite frank about Ho Chi Minh. I have said many time, even when I was in VN, that I despite Ho Chi Minh for what he did to Vietnam. I actually told the vietcong off duty official in a drinking party and he was fine with that. However, I am not disrespectful to him and the point I raise is to show that vietcongs are notorious in history distortion. They want to create a myth about Ho Chi Minh so they do not allow any news about his life. And with their reign of terror, who dares to say or reveal anything? That's why rumours about Ho Chi Minh are ripe. I do not state those rumours but the story written by well-known and respected vietcong historian Tran Quoc Vuong is of important. I don't think young Ryan is brave enough to accept this point.
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Pit
Los Angeles, CA
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Phiengung wrote: <quoted text>
Stateless,
Believe it or not, but I give this young Ryan more credit and respect than some of your friends. If you don't want to be friend with them, let me make it clear, the one who posts the lie about the stolen gold and the one who silliness is beyond belief to post the story about "black gold".
My conversations with this Ryan is just that, conversations ie "doi thoai". I don't mean to teach him anything but I am certainly open to learning from any one, any where, any time.
"Bien hoc bao la bat tan". You know what I mean, don't you.
Back to the point. I am quite frank about Ho Chi Minh. I have said many time, even when I was in VN, that I despite Ho Chi Minh for what he did to Vietnam. I actually told the vietcong off duty official in a drinking party and he was fine with that.
However, I am not disrespectful to him and the point I raise is to show that vietcongs are notorious in history distortion. They want to create a myth about Ho Chi Minh so they do not allow any news about his life. And with their reign of terror, who dares to say or reveal anything? That's why rumours about Ho Chi Minh are ripe. I do not state those rumours but the story written by well-known and respected vietcong historian Tran Quoc Vuong is of important.
I don't think young Ryan is brave enough to accept this point. http://www.nguoi-viet.com/absolutenm/anmviewe... http://www.nguoi-viet.com/absolutenm/anmviewe... http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,20... http://www.nguoi-viet.com/absolutenm/anmviewe... http://www.nguoi-viet.com/absolutenm/anmviewe... http://www.nguoi-viet.com/absolutenm/anmviewe...
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Pit
Los Angeles, CA
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Judged:
1
Phiengung wrote: <quoted text>
Stateless,
Believe it or not, but I give this young Ryan more credit and respect than some of your friends. If you don't want to be friend with them, let me make it clear, the one who posts the lie about the stolen gold and the one who silliness is beyond belief to post the story about "black gold".
My conversations with this Ryan is just that, conversations ie "doi thoai". I don't mean to teach him anything but I am certainly open to learning from any one, any where, any time.
"Bien hoc bao la bat tan". You know what I mean, don't you.
Back to the point. I am quite frank about Ho Chi Minh. I have said many time, even when I was in VN, that I despite Ho Chi Minh for what he did to Vietnam. I actually told the vietcong off duty official in a drinking party and he was fine with that.
However, I am not disrespectful to him and the point I raise is to show that vietcongs are notorious in history distortion. They want to create a myth about Ho Chi Minh so they do not allow any news about his life. And with their reign of terror, who dares to say or reveal anything? That's why rumours about Ho Chi Minh are ripe. I do not state those rumours but the story written by well-known and respected vietcong historian Tran Quoc Vuong is of important.
I don't think young Ryan is brave enough to accept this point. Vietnam Highway 1 Retreat http://www.youtube.com/watch... "General Cao Van Vien, ARVN chief of staff, ordered his men to fight to the death, then quickly fled the country." http://www.kerala.com/wiki-ARVN http://www.vietnamwar.net/ARVN.htm http://academickids.com/encyclopedia/index.ph... "The army became confused and demoralized. President Thieu, Prime Minister Tran Thien Khiem, General Cao Van Vien, ran like scared rabbits and left the country to others. So, who was left to fight? The soldiers who remained watched their commanders flee." http://www.vietnamesecommunity.com/Community/... http://www.generalhieu.com/lvhung-2.htm 35 Years later http://www.youtube.com/watch...
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Pit
Los Angeles, CA
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Judged:
1
May ong chong cong khong co duong huong May anh chong cong san ma khong co duong huong gi ro rang, may anh doi tu do dan chu ? nhung khi nguoi khac dua ra y kien gi la may anh lam giu, khong thua gi cong san. 30 nam qua, chong cong nhu ran mat dau, khong co mot lanh tu, khong mot nguoi huong dan duong di ? neu nhu cong san cham dut tai viet nam, cac anh dan chu se lam gi day ? hay la chi la lang va dam da nhau ho hao "dan chu da dang", manh ai nay la ? May anh khong sang suot, may anh che cong san, nhung chac gi may anh hon cong san ? 30 nam cong san nam quyen tai viet nam, it ra ho co nguoi dua duong dan loi, con may anh chay quanh may chu "dan chu" roi khong biet lam gi hon nua ? Noi cho cung nguoi ban dong minh "USA" cung chay theo lam an voi Cong san, viet kieu hai ngoai cung chay ve "kheu kheu" mot it $$$, roi den dam ca si cung ve ca bai "yeu nuoc $$$", sau cung la Nguyen Cao Ky yeu thuong dong bao ta cung chay ve yeu nuoc ??? Noi chung, may anh phai doan ket lai voi nhau, ngoi lai voi nhau, lap nen mot chinh phu luu vong, co nhan tai de chong lai cong san, bang khong cung vo vong ma thoi. Mot loi khuyen chung cho cac anh, duong bao gio vu cao nguoi khac la cong san, du cho nguoi do la cong san di chang nua, mot khi ho muon di cung voi cac anh de tranh dau cho tu do dan chu, cac anh phai mo rong vong tay don ho. Cac anh co thay Cong San lam khong ? Nguyen cao Ky la dau so cua cac anh, bay gio cong san cung mo rong vong tay chao don, ho chao don ca si cua cac anh, ho chao don 270000 viet kieu ve an tet...tai sao cac anh khong chao don nhung nguoi cong san ve phia cac anh ? tai sao cac anh xua duoi nhung nguoi tranh dau dan chu cung chung cac anh ve phia cong san ? cac anh cu vu cao nguoi nay, nguoi no la cong san, la cong san nam vung... neu noi nhu cac anh, chac cong san khong dam cho 270000 viet kieu ve an tet dau, chi vi ho la viet kieu chong cong, co the ho lam gian diep cho CIA ... Thuc tinh len di may anh, thay doi tu tuong di, mo rong vong tay chao don tat ca nguoi viet du ho co theo cong san hay khong, du ho phe phai nao di chang nua, ho cung la nguoi viet nam. Neu cac anh dem duoc mot nguoi cong san ve phia dan chu thi cac anh co them duoc mot nguoi ban, neu cac anh day mot nguoi ban ve cong san thi anh co them mot ke thu. kinh chao nhung nguoi dan chu hep hoi. http://hv.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-...
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“Another Victory For Hanoi”
Joined: Aug 20, 2007
Comments: 1687
Hochiminh City, aka Saigon
ISP:
United States
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Phiengung wrote: <quoted text>
My conversations with this Ryan is just that, conversations ie "doi thoai". I don't mean to teach him anything but I am certainly open to learning from any one, any where, any time.
"Bien hoc bao la bat tan". You know what I mean, don't you. Don't continue to lie and spin around the fact that your low IQ has let you down. And your hatred trumps over evidence to the contrary in which you don't have the capacity to accept it. The issue is not how brave I am to stand up and criticize any Vietnam's officials and their wrongdoing. The issue is you keep clinging to whatever you can have a hand on to badmouth Vietnam Government anywhere, anytime. This is one striking evidence for what I am talking about. I have enough of it. You can't even learn what is history and what is fairy tail. Sorry, but I don't get paid to keep this conversation going.
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Stateless
Manchester Center, VT
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Phiengung wrote: <quoted text>
Stateless,
(1) Believe it or not, but I give this young Ryan more credit and respect than some of your friends.(2) If you don't want to be friend with them, let me make it clear, the one who posts the lie about the stolen gold and the one who silliness is beyond belief to post the story about "black gold".
(3) My conversations with this Ryan is just that, conversations ie "doi thoai". I don't mean to teach him anything but I am certainly open to learning from any one, any where, any time.
(4) "Bien hoc bao la bat tan". You know what I mean, don't you.
(5) Back to the point. I am quite frank about Ho Chi Minh. I have said many time, even when I was in VN, that I despite Ho Chi Minh for what he did to Vietnam. I actually told the vietcong off duty official in a drinking party and he was fine with that.
(6) However, I am not disrespectful to him and the point I raise is to show that vietcongs are notorious in history distortion.(7) They want to create a myth about Ho Chi Minh so they do not allow any news about his life. And with their reign of terror, who dares to say or reveal anything? That's why rumours about Ho Chi Minh are ripe. I do not state those rumours but the story written by well-known and respected vietcong historian Tran Quoc Vuong is of important.
(8) I don't think young Ryan is brave enough to accept this point. (1) ok. (2) let me make it clear, i have neither friends nor enemies here. now, the "black gold", it is only for boiling your blood. the fact that Thieu was the richest man in VN after jailing the other two rich and famous men in VN. still remember who? well, there used to be 3 rich and famous men in VN, Nguyen van Thieu, Nguyen tan Doi, and Pham Sanh. Pham Sanh was a cyclo driver (rented) in early 60s then became one of the 3 rich and famous in VN. so, did 16 tons of gold mean much to Thieu? No. http://www.daichung.com/75/07_vo_chong_thieu.... i used to transport paddy for "Tong Cuc Thuc Pham Mien Nam" under Pham Sanh control in 1973 from Long Xuyen to Sai Gon or My Tho. what did Thieu do to the two guys that held the wealth of the whole SVN, Nguyen tan Doi and Pham Sanh? (3) very good sir. (4) i know what you mean. (5) too much mystery here. (6) i said too many versions. (7) well, to make a good story, you need to have a hero, a principal character; and then an ugly guy in the opposite. (8) brave or not what does it matter? he is not the president of VN. i have seen groups and groups of officials from VN being trained at Harvard in mid 80s and at Dartmouth in late 90s. now, thousands and thousands of young Vietnamese students are around the world. so, be brave to accept that these people will make VN different days by days sir.
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