Russia could claim Crimea if Ukraine joins NATO - MP

Smetana wrote:

I guess Russia should give the Kuril Islands back to Japan since they were taken during the Soviet Union as well, according to Mr. Paines reasoning.

Japs would attack USSR and take any land in Siberia they could swallow, if their war with USA had been more successful.

Mike wrote:

The only reason you have relatives in Ukraine was because of the russian policy of exterminating Ukrainians.
It was Stalin who did this he said there are 42million Ukrainians in Ukraine.. and thats 42 million too many.. get rid of them..thats genocide!!!
after he had all the millions of Ukrainians killed or deported he moved russians into their homes and lands...and you talk about Ukrainians and russians getting as one people...you dont know and dont want to know the truth, and posting your russian propaganda only shows how ignorant you are of the truth.
you went to school and was told all the lies of the soviet union the biggest liars in history.. and you believe it!!... just think how you will feel when at last you open your eys and realise that you are a slave..a slave to the power hungery ex KGB with their dinosour mentality and how you helped to elect them with your ignorance.
I also have been to Kharkiv and I also have spoken with people there yes they speak russian as well as Ukrainian (and a majority of them do not want russian slavery), they speak russian but only because they were forced to learn it in the schools, it was taught over the language of the people who lived there.
Take your corrupted history and you go back to the land of the slaves.. who only want to kiss the boots of the persons who shot their grandfathers...russia where everything is so good the people must not do anything for themselves and want to be told what to do and how to think!! WAKE UP!!
If you cant believe this then stay home you have no business outside of Russia
<quoted text>

I'm sorry, what a load of bollocks. First of all there were Ukrainians in the Soviet government too, in fact Russians were in minority if you look who was in the top of communist party especially at the time of the civil war. Stalin and Beria were Georgians, hope dont need to remind you.

There are millions of ukrainians living in Russia, and the ethnic line between Russians and Ukrainians is very thin.

vvv wrote:

<quoted text>
I'm sorry, what a load of bollocks. First of all there were Ukrainians in the Soviet government too, in fact Russians were in minority if you look who was in the top of communist party especially at the time of the civil war. Stalin and Beria were Georgians, hope dont need to remind you.
There are millions of ukrainians living in Russia, and the ethnic line between Russians and Ukrainians is very thin.

Are you saying that when the people of eastern Ukraine where moved to siberia it was of the own accord... they wanted to be good soviet citizens?.
That the people in eastern Ukraine starved themselves to death because they should... so instead the people who lived in russia could gorge themselves to death on the very food stolen from them?.
and that stalin did not say that he wanted all Ukrainians dead?

Out of the 50 millions that where killed in ww2 10 million were Ukrainian and that was because they were deliberately put in harms way on the front line to get rid of them.
and in their empty homes and land they moved russians into the "growing room"

And total "bollocks" which history book do you read? the one written by the soviets who wrote what history they wanted to and killed anyone who questioned it?
if they are the same people what nation does this to its own people??
the people who call themselves russian are and were originaly muscovites and because they wanted claim to the heritage of Kyiv rus they changed their name to russian.. that you cant deny.
And yes there may well have been Ukrainians (and people from other nations) in the the soviet payroll...look at yanokovich another example of someone who is happy to sell his people for thirty pieces of silver..you will always find someone willing to kill your brother for money if the price is right.
the soviet union was for the russians they invented it they ran it!! anyone who helped them was in it beacuse they either believed the lies told them or were just kissing ass or mad manic's like stalin.

And you want to start all this again?
What is happening now has nothing to do with Nato or western countries, its about power mad dinosours who think its their right to capture and control other countries, they have dreams of being Tsar (ceaser) and having their own empire...thats what really is total bollocks.

If russia is so worried about nato why dont they apply to join it?? that way how would they be attacked they would have nothing to worry about then and they could help in the defence of Europe...they wont because it would end their power crazed plans to control other countries thats why.
Whats wrong russia does not have enough land in its own right that they want everyone elses?

use your brain instaed of the lies that are told you by your own press (who also have to do as they are told or else)

Mike wrote:

<quoted text>
Are you saying that when the people of eastern Ukraine where moved to siberia it was of the own accord... they wanted to be good soviet citizens?.
That the people in eastern Ukraine starved themselves to death because they should... so instead the people who lived in russia could gorge themselves to death on the very food stolen from them?.
and that stalin did not say that he wanted all Ukrainians dead?
Out of the 50 millions that where killed in ww2 10 million were Ukrainian and that was because they were deliberately put in harms way on the front line to get rid of them.
and in their empty homes and land they moved russians into the "growing room"
And total "bollocks" which history book do you read? the one written by the soviets who wrote what history they wanted to and killed anyone who questioned it?
if they are the same people what nation does this to its own people??
the people who call themselves russian are and were originaly muscovites and because they wanted claim to the heritage of Kyiv rus they changed their name to russian.. that you cant deny.
And yes there may well have been Ukrainians (and people from other nations) in the the soviet payroll...look at yanokovich another example of someone who is happy to sell his people for thirty pieces of silver..you will always find someone willing to kill your brother for money if the price is right.
the soviet union was for the russians they invented it they ran it!! anyone who helped them was in it beacuse they either believed the lies told them or were just kissing ass or mad manic's like stalin.
And you want to start all this again?
What is happening now has nothing to do with Nato or western countries, its about power mad dinosours who think its their right to capture and control other countries, they have dreams of being Tsar (ceaser) and having their own empire...thats what really is total bollocks.
If russia is so worried about nato why dont they apply to join it?? that way how would they be attacked they would have nothing to worry about then and they could help in the defence of Europe...they wont because it would end their power crazed plans to control other countries thats why.
Whats wrong russia does not have enough land in its own right that they want everyone elses?
use your brain instaed of the lies that are told you by your own press (who also have to do as they are told or else)

"Ukraine where moved to siberia it was of the own accord... they wanted to be good soviet citizens?"

And you think millions of Russians who were shot or rot in the Gulags "it was of the own accord..."

What you dont understand that Stalins regime was equally brutal to everyone, and they didnt specifically target Ukrainians in favor of Russians or say Georgians.

I'm ethnically ukrainian by the way, and my grand fathers were in gulags, nothing to do with their nationality.

vvv wrote:

<quoted text>
"Ukraine where moved to siberia it was of the own accord... they wanted to be good soviet citizens?"
And you think millions of Russians who were shot or rot in the Gulags "it was of the own accord..."
What you dont understand that Stalins regime was equally brutal to everyone, and they didnt specifically target Ukrainians in favor of Russians or say Georgians.
I'm ethnically ukrainian by the way, and my grand fathers were in gulags, nothing to do with their nationality.

You miss the point..
this very same regime never left.. its still there, just different people with different job titles..
Its time it stopped before "the good old days return" and you my friend will not be able to write to me or anyone else in a free and uncensored manner as we do here today...this I think is the point of many of the postings I have read on this and other sites.
If it does go the way it did before, were you can not travel without permission, you cannot speak without your words being censored and you must keep your thoughts secret...whats the point of defending rulars who would rather see you and your whole family dead so that they can be the next Tzar

vvv wrote:

<quoted text>
"Ukraine where moved to siberia it was of the own accord... they wanted to be good soviet citizens?"
And you think millions of Russians who were shot or rot in the Gulags "it was of the own accord..."
What you dont understand that Stalins regime was equally brutal to everyone, and they didnt specifically target Ukrainians in favor of Russians or say Georgians.
I'm ethnically ukrainian by the way, and my grand fathers were in gulags, nothing to do with their nationality.

Russia used class warfare and collectivism and other terrorism as a "fog of war" to disguise colonialism by genocide.

A good example of that was the Holodomor genocide in Ukraine in 1932-1933 in which the Ukrainians were targeted for genocide.

Russia later colonized the depopulated areas and brought in brutal Russification policies to try and destroy the Ukrainian nation forever.

Genocidal Russia used genocide on Crimean Tatars and dozens of other nations like Belarus and Kazakhs.

Neofascist Russia used genocide in Afghanistan and continues the tradition of genocide in Chechnya and now in the newly conquered territories of democratic Georgia which neofascist, narcissistic, and psychopathic Putin will try to absorb to satisfy his pathalogical control and grandiosity needs.

Red wrote:

<quoted text>
Russia used class warfare and collectivism and other terrorism as a "fog of war" to disguise colonialism by genocide.
A good example of that was the Holodomor genocide in Ukraine in 1932-1933 in which the Ukrainians were targeted for genocide.
Russia later colonized the depopulated areas and brought in brutal Russification policies to try and destroy the Ukrainian nation forever.
Genocidal Russia used genocide on Crimean Tatars and dozens of other nations like Belarus and Kazakhs.
Neofascist Russia used genocide in Afghanistan and continues the tradition of genocide in Chechnya and now in the newly conquered territories of democratic Georgia which neofascist, narcissistic, and psychopathic Putin will try to absorb to satisfy his pathalogical control and grandiosity needs.

Holodomor??? And a hunger in Russia in 1932-1933 was only a coincidence? It was a climate disaster and a terrible mistake of plan economic system. People were dying in Ukraine and in Russia.
What? Genocide of Belarus and Kazakhs? And why they treat Russia friendly. Maybe you'll blame Russian of genocide of African tribe Tumba-Yumba tommorrow?

vvv wrote:

<quoted text>
"Ukraine where moved to siberia it was of the own accord... they wanted to be good soviet citizens?"
And you think millions of Russians who were shot or rot in the Gulags "it was of the own accord..."
What you dont understand that Stalins regime was equally brutal to everyone, and they didnt specifically target Ukrainians in favor of Russians or say Georgians.
I'm ethnically ukrainian by the way, and my grand fathers were in gulags, nothing to do with their nationality.

Also I envy that you at leat knew your Grand Parents, mine died many years ago and I never got to meet them.
My Father was 21 when he left for war and he arrived here in the UK unabled to be sent back too the soviet union to be machine gunned as many thousands of other people who tried to escape the soviet empire.
at least he had a taste of freedom which was not available to many millions of people left behind.

And its heading the same way again I suggest you get out of the lions den and prepare for what is to come with your friends at your side rather than pretend ones at your back

See Rule 8:

Neofascist Russia's Rules of Denial and Disinformation:

1. When something positive is discussed and credit is to be earned, then it is Soviets (which is practically synonymous with "Russian" in the West) or Russians as in "Russians won WWII,,,," or 'Russian losses fighting Naziism" but when it is negative publicity, then be sure to identify some other group. Always claim all moral capital.

2. Never mention Bolshevism --for obvious reasons.

3. When discussing WWII, it is always "Russians fighting Nazis" never "Bolsheviks fighting Germans." Never mention the Nazi German-Bolshevik Russian Friendship Pact that instigated the joint invasion and partition of Poland and the beginning of WWII and the Holocaust in Eastern Europe. Try to imply that all "Soviet" WWII casualties were Russians.

4. Blame the victims of genocide and atrocities and always deflect guilt onto others --especially the uppity and ungrateful Ukrainians who must be labeled as Nazi war criminals, didn't you know?.

5. Always make sure there is a token and obligatory reference to Ukrainian "antisemitism" or Naziism especially when the real culprits and perpetrators were ethnic Russians, and despite the fact that the overwhelming majority fought Naziism during WWII and the overwhelming majority of Ukrainians were victims of Nazism

6. Oh, and persistently attempt to vilify Ukrainians by references to 14th Waffen SS Grenadiers Division, even though it was completely exonerated by Allies and even though none of its members have ever been convicted of war crimes.

7. If there is a heroic Ukrainian figure, then imply they were Russian or even Polish. Do not support or acknowledge anything, even in the slightest, that supports Ukrainian sovereignty or self-determination. It is especially important to vilify groups like the Ukrainian Insurgent Army which challenged the Russian genocidal occupation army. Most of all try and confuse the Ukrainian Insurgent Army, which fought both Nazi Germany and Bolshevik Russia, with other military organizations, especially those allied with Nazi Germany.

8. Projecting guilt on others is very useful in denials of Russian genocides like Bolshevik Terror-Famine of 1932-1933 [Holodomor] against Ukrainian farmers. Blame Georgians, Jews, Latvians, the weather, the victims themselves ---but never Russia. Imply the victims deserved it. Say they were lazy. Also try to blame figures like Krushchev and try to imply he was Ukrainian --even though he self-identified as an ethnic Russian.

9. Always when referring to Russians it must be "heroic", but when referring to opponents like Chechens then use words like "terrorists."

10. When discussing murders of 220 Russian FR journalists since 1992, then insinuate that they are useless, counterproductive, mentally ill, and better still traitors.

11. Try to split groups and incite hatreds for the benefit of Russia's divide and conquer policy. Try to vilify, demonize, and incite hatreds against independence and self-determination movements, such as the Chechen, for the benefit of Russia's imperial divide and conquer policy. Racist dupes, neoBolsheviks, and Russophilistines abroad are especially useful for this purpose.

12. Vilify groups, Belarusans, Chechens, Estonians, Georgians, Kazakhs, Crimean Tatars, Ukrainians and many others who have struggled to get from under the bloody Russian imperial boot and who raise international awareness of Russian genocides, such as the Russian Bolshevik Terror-Famine [Holodomor] of 1932-1933. Call them fascists.

13. As for Russia, "It's Not Fascism When We Do It,"

Alexander wrote:

<quoted text>
Holodomor??? And a hunger in Russia in 1932-1933 was only a coincidence? It was a climate disaster and a terrible mistake of plan economic system. People were dying in Ukraine and in Russia.
What? Genocide of Belarus and Kazakhs? And why they treat Russia friendly. Maybe you'll blame Russian of genocide of African tribe Tumba-Yumba tommorrow?

Your statment is in error in what was the biggest harvest of the decade people starved to death because the food was taken from them at gun point anyone who resisted was shot or sent to siberia.

interesting that the russian leaders did not starve have you looked at the phtos of big fat bastards who where in charge at the time ..how they must have suffered eating well while others died.
I was because they wanted to remove these people from their lands and they abused their power and sent thousands of russians into Ukraine and areas around to block roads so no one could escape knowing full well what they were doing..thats genocide!!!
Stop quoting the lies you have been told that hide the truth...your history book was written by the biggest liars in history..I suggest you get a new one thats up todate and does not have crap in it.

Jimmy Gatts wrote:

<quoted text>
Would you trust them as NATO members to fight against fellow russians? This all Ukraine as NATO member is just nonsense.

Yea, the Eastern part of Ukraina will fight against NATO. Actually they are Russians. May be the Western Ukrainians want to NATO, but really they will not join military. Maybe some percent will.
People from that regions do not like to fight for somebody (US, you know). Rememeber Romania that is near West Ukraina. This country was a Nazy German ally, but its real acting was tiny. They gave up on the next day after the Red Army entered Romania.
US strategists, including JohnnyOK from Kharkiv, are wrong. Their anglo-saxon propaganda was efficient when they urged any Indian tribe to fight against another in the colonist times. So, they consider Ukrainians and Russian as the tribes they can bribe.

No one in Ukraine will believe the Russians will really pull out of Georgia.

These are just some Russian manoeuvering to buy time and wait for signals of splitting and weakness by the west European appeasers.

Neofascist Russia's invasion is seen by others, who are more experienced with Russian "diplomacy" --like the Ukrainians--, as a dress rehearsal for the invasion of Ukraine.

As a result there is growing support in Ukraine for joining NATO.

....Those who fear U.S. domination in NATO should only consider the case of Iraq. Despite strong U.S. urgings and incentives, only 10 NATO states have contributed forces to the U.S. led “coalition of the willing” in Iraq. Apparently, the other 16 members were not very “willing” and have decided to stay out. In short, the simple fact remains that NATO membership requires Ukrainian participation only in the defense of threatened NATO member states….all other military operations are discretionary with each member state. Although NATO and the Warsaw Pact are often considered as analogous organizations, they were very different creatures. NATO participation is voluntary, based on consensus, and entirely defensive in nature. Can anyone imagine a communist Bulgaria or Romania insisting on withholding troops from the Warsaw Pact?

But what about Russian objections to NATO membership for Ukraine? It’s time for Russians to get over it. They pose the biggest – probably the only – threat to Ukrainian independence and their concerns should have the least bearing on Ukraine’s choice of a defensive alliance. Russian foreign policy has always been that of a pragmatic bully. They will squeeze those who are vulnerable (like Georgia), but seek good relations with those who are of equal or greater strength. Ukraine can only gain their respect as an equal within a defensive alliance such as NATO. A decision against NATO membership will only exacerbate relations with Russia, not improve them.

Europe’s and Ukraine’s answer to Russian brutality and aggression in Central Asia should be expedited and full membership in NATO.

http://www.kyivpost.com/opinion/oped/29442/

Do you know how many Russians are living in the Ukraine. Near 15 millions. And that their rights are infringing. What to say, some "defenders of the rights" close eyes on this. The Orange Revolution on the U. S. money take the U. S. lap dog Yushchenko to the power in Ukraine. He dismissed Rada because opposition got too many places there. It's an example of "true" democraty. The dream of all Russophobes was to make a conflict between two brother nations - Ukrainian and Russian.

Mike wrote:

<quoted text>
Your statment is in error in what was the biggest harvest of the decade people starved to death because the food was taken from them at gun point anyone who resisted was shot or sent to siberia.
interesting that the russian leaders did not starve have you looked at the phtos of big fat bastards who where in charge at the time ..how they must have suffered eating well while others died.
I was because they wanted to remove these people from their lands and they abused their power and sent thousands of russians into Ukraine and areas around to block roads so no one could escape knowing full well what they were doing..thats genocide!!!
Stop quoting the lies you have been told that hide the truth...your history book was written by the biggest liars in history..I suggest you get a new one thats up todate and does not have crap in it.

No, I understood what I wrote. Somebody forgets about the collectivisation in Russia in 1929-1933 when all peasants were made to work in kolkhosy (collective proprietorships) and peasants began to resist. It was planned that the most of grain would be taken from Ukraine but the harvest was bad. More than 1/3 of harvest was taken. Peasants began to hide grain - the repressions started. Most of victims of hunger were at the Ukraine but there were many of them in Russia too. It was a result of rude politics of collectivisation. If you think that I take the informations from Soviet textbooks of History you are wrong. The information paraphrased and translated above is taken of the sourse N. Vert's book "The History of Soviet State".

Alexander wrote:

Do you know how many Russians are living in the Ukraine. Near 15 millions. And that their rights are infringing. What to say, some "defenders of the rights" close eyes on this. The Orange Revolution on the U. S. money take the U. S. lap dog Yushchenko to the power in Ukraine. He dismissed Rada because opposition got too many places there. It's an example of "true" democraty. The dream of all Russophobes was to make a conflict between two brother nations - Ukrainian and Russian.

Again you are in error.
Russia is so used to getting its own way they interfere with another countries electoral process.
Backing of yanokovich for starters and what about suppling arms for a coup againstthe Ukrainian government before the elections?...yes a russian warship in the crimea was supposed to unload weapons to be used in Kyiv and the elections that yanokovich lost 2004.
Luckly the Ukrainian secret service found out about it and they were stopped.
Is this an example of the USA interfeering or Russian?

If Russia had its way we would all be slaves.
Its old dinosour thinking "lets rule the world" instead of making the world a better place.
Putin had a good chance to make Russia a good country instead its going back to the old ways..control everyone.

You are a fool if you think the rest of the world believes that the ex KGB boys have good intentions for anyone but themselves.
You just keep thinking the way you are and remember when it was so easy to be able to log onto a website like this and voice your opinion.
those days will soon be gone for you.
Your press cannot speak unles it checks first that its ok with the kremlin to print and broadcast their stories.
Your mobiles will soon be censored or better still anyone with a mobile will be had up for potential subvertion.
how far will they go? will you have to give up your ipods because they have a microchip in them.
you will be back to 486i processors just in case you start to think for yourselves.
Maybe you have forgotten those glorious days?
when you had a "yaboka" computer clone...dust them off you may need them again

Russian respond to Russophobes. Watching the Russophobes and their manners.
A, B, C of Russophobe:
The antirussian doctrine: wars begin in the minds of people that's why we must win the information war against Russia so all means are good:
1. Circle attention on the negative at negative points of Russian history (imperialistic politics of Russian Empire, Soviet History). Never compare with imperialistic politics of other nations (British Empire in India, genocide of Indians in North America, for example).
2. Provide antirussian prejudices ("evil", "drunkers", "low-educated", "agressive", "barbaric"). Take a information about Russian family at the bottom and claim it an average Russian family.
3. Ignore tragic pages of Russian history. Show only one side of the coin. It can spoil the image of "victims of Russian aggression" (Poland, Crimean Tartars).
4. Claim all ethnic minorities in Russia were brutally conquered. None of them became a part of Russia on its owwn will. Claim Russian committed genocide, destroyed their culture (it isn't understood how they saved their language, how they even saved).
5. Don't divide Russian of Communists or Nationalists (at the beginning of XX century).
6. Ignore "incorrect" and "lying" sourses of information, show only you need. Use only antirussian sourses.
7. Look down at Russians call them "fascists", "drunkers", "monkeys" and even "sub-men" or simply ignore them.
8. Create as many antirussian topics and pols on the forums. Act as a bot, post as many simple antirussian messages as you can. In every topic.
9. You can use the dirtiest kinds of antirussian propaganda on the forums (call yourself Russian, insult Russians, provokate them).
10. Use dogmas without proofs such as "neofashist" Russia, barbarians and e. t. c. Try to persuade readers that its doesn't needs proofs because it is easy to demolish them.
11. Use overstatements, epithets, metaphors but not fact. It is more effective.
12. If Russian uses "inconvinient" for you fact, try to change the topic of discussion to "inconvinient" for Russian facts.

Alexander there are some from both sides here. I try my best not to condem anyone. I try to stick to facts. I have always said I like the Russian people I do not like their government. Others have said that here also. Not to you Alexander but to others that do not know history.

It is a fact that a document was written to deport all the Ukirainians. Not just some but all. The only thing that stopped it was logistics. That is fact. If I recall it was the Ukrainians that sufferned the most casualties in WWII percentage wise. I have never seen anyone here say it was the Ukrainians that prevented Hitler from succeeding. I do hear it was the Russians though. Facts mean nothing to some people.

Mike wrote:

<quoted text>
Again you are in error.
Russia is so used to getting its own way they interfere with another countries electoral process.
Backing of yanokovich for starters and what about suppling arms for a coup againstthe Ukrainian government before the elections?...yes a russian warship in the crimea was supposed to unload weapons to be used in Kyiv and the elections that yanokovich lost 2004.
Luckly the Ukrainian secret service found out about it and they were stopped.
Is this an example of the USA interfeering or Russian?
If Russia had its way we would all be slaves.
Its old dinosour thinking "lets rule the world" instead of making the world a better place.
Putin had a good chance to make Russia a good country instead its going back to the old ways..control everyone.
You are a fool if you think the rest of the world believes that the ex KGB boys have good intentions for anyone but themselves.
You just keep thinking the way you are and remember when it was so easy to be able to log onto a website like this and voice your opinion.
those days will soon be gone for you.
Your press cannot speak unles it checks first that its ok with the kremlin to print and broadcast their stories.
Your mobiles will soon be censored or better still anyone with a mobile will be had up for potential subvertion.
how far will they go? will you have to give up your ipods because they have a microchip in them.
you will be back to 486i processors just in case you start to think for yourselves.
Maybe you have forgotten those glorious days?
when you had a "yaboka" computer clone...dust them off you may need them again

You are wrong. I'm not the fan of Putin, even I don't support some of his politics I learnt that Russian Media tells only half-truth. I know about the censore in press. But I can tell exactly that USA would like destroyed, defeated Russia as at Yeltsin's time. Russia dependent, not dangerous, weak. But Russian's wouldn't like it. I am living in Russia and I heard patriotic rhetoric of Putin, I saw that it differed real facts and that opinion of Russia wasn't regarded with real politics. I asked my friends why they thought Russia was being regarded but they couldn't answer. But because of Georgian provokanion Russian government chosen the least of two evils: to be an aggressor in eyes of world community or to be a betrayer in eyes of Russian citizens. Why the colorful revolutions began and why they always brought pro-American leaders? I don't deny Russia trying to influence other countries' politics but it is less successful than American one. And I regret hearing Russophobes telling lies of whole Russian nations.

The eastern Ukrainians are becoming more and more and more in favor of NATO now that they understand what it is all about a little better. Certain parties do not get to just give out their brand of truth and information.

The understanding is that even if you are a NATO member you do not have to have NATO bases here. That worried the people. Now that they are understanding this they are more in favor of NATO.

But according to some I do not live in Kharkiv and also am a CIA agent. LOL

Alexander wrote:

<quoted text>
You are wrong. I'm not the fan of Putin, even I don't support some of his politics I learnt that Russian Media tells only half-truth. I know about the censore in press. But I can tell exactly that USA would like destroyed, defeated Russia as at Yeltsin's time. Russia dependent, not dangerous, weak. But Russian's wouldn't like it. I am living in Russia and I heard patriotic rhetoric of Putin, I saw that it differed real facts and that opinion of Russia wasn't regarded with real politics. I asked my friends why they thought Russia was being regarded but they couldn't answer. But because of Georgian provokanion Russian government chosen the least of two evils: to be an aggressor in eyes of world community or to be a betrayer in eyes of Russian citizens. Why the colorful revolutions began and why they always brought pro-American leaders? I don't deny Russia trying to influence other countries' politics but it is less successful than American one. And I regret hearing Russophobes telling lies of whole Russian nations.

Which bit am I wrong about the attempt coup?

That russia is slipping into the dark old ways and taking the people with it?

Or that you may have to dust off your old Yaboka computer?

Or that the US is too busy with their elections.

at least they get to have an open election, and the president can only have a certain time in office as president... unlike President/Primeminster (tzar) Putin and his glove puppit...oh whats his name Demi something... you know the guy stands at the back... and puts his hand up if he wants to say something