GREEKS labelled as "BARBARIAN" in Antiquity

Even in ancient times the word came to have also a cultural rather than a merely linguistic significance, and described people outside the orbit of the Greek city-states, whether or not they spoke Greek; barbarians were therefore thought to be uncivilized, cowardly, cruel, treacherous, and lacking in self-control.
EXAMPLES
1.The word barbarism was originally used by the Greeks for foreign terms used in their language.
Note that a barbarism is an error of morphology, while a solecism is an error of syntax.
http://www.answers.com/topic/barbarism-lingui...
2.verb,
barbarizein, "to act like a foreigner"
http://www.google.com/search...
3.
So we have an noun "Barbarus"
which means (in ancient greek)
a NON-Greek person
and an adjective "Barbarus"
which also means NON-Greek
but as temporal characterization
NOUN
a person, place, thing (PERMANENT MEANING)
ADJECTIVE
The part of speech that MODIFIES a noun
http://www.answers.com/topic/adjective
See below
4."And Clearchus. in the second book of his treatise on Friendship, says,-" Stratonicus the harp-player, whenever he wished to go to sleep, used to order a slave to bring him something to drink; ' not,' says he,'because I am thirsty now, but that I may not be presently.'" And once, at Byzantium, when a harp-player had played his prelude well, but had made a blunder of the rest of the performance, he got up and made proclamation, " That whoever would point out the harp-player who had played the prelude should receive a thousand drachme." And when he was once asked by some one who were the wickedest people, he said, "That in Pamphylia, the people of Plaselis were the worst; but that the Sidetze were the worst in the wl-hIole world." And when he was asked again, according to the account given by Hegesander, which were the GREATEST BARBARIANS, the Boeotians or the Thessalians he said, " The Eleans."
Athenaios VIII 350a
5.Plato characterized the Lesbian Aeolic Greek dialect as ‘a BARBARIAN register’ while addressing Pittakos of Mytilene. We do know though Aeolic was a Greek dialect. Another example about the abuse of the term “barbaros”
[Protagoras 3410]

6.Another example is the dialogue between Socrates and Strepsiadis in Aristophanes “Clouds”. At a certain moment Socrates call Strepsiadis “antropos amathes outosi kai barbaros” This make even clearer the term “barbaros” was used as a derogatory term since Strepsiadis…was a well-known Athenian. Unless they insist on believing Atheneans werent greeks either.
Quote:
SOCRATES aside
Oh! the ignoramus! the BARBARIAN!
to STREPSIADES
I greatly fear, old man, it will be necessary for me to have recourse to blows. Now, let me hear what you do when you are beaten

Aristophanes,‘Nephelae’(line 491)

7.The truth is, he is so tactless,so BARBARIAN in his temperament, that when he sees you somewhat angry with anyone and rather more exasperated than the occasion calls for, he at once anticipates your wishes in the moment of your wrath and so opposes your interests.

Demosthenes Against Aristogiton II 17

8.You have perhaps imagined, because he solecizes(makes syntactical errors) in his speech, that he is a BARBARIAN and a man readily to be despised. The fellow is indeed a barbarian in that he hates those whom he ought to honor; but in villainy and in bringing matters to ruin he is second to none.

Demosthenes, Against Stephanus I 40

9.Here’s another fine example: Aeschines, On the Embassy 2 183
Quote:
A word more and I have done. One thing was in my power, fellow citizens: to do you no wrong. But to be free from accusation, that was a thing which depended upon fortune, and fortune cast my lot with a slanderer, a BARBARIAN, who cared not for sacrifices nor libations nor the breaking of bread together; nay, to frighten all who in time to come might oppose him, he has fabricated a false charge against us and come in here. If, therefore, you are willing to save those who have laboured together with you for peace and for your security, the common good will find champions in abundance, ready to face danger in your behalf.

Here Aeschines when attempting to refute Demosthenes’ accusations, clearly titles him a “barbarian” that “fabricated a false charge” against him

http://www.google.com/search...
http://historyofmacedonia.wordpress.com/2007/...

Tell us about all Demosthenes's adversaries referring to him as a "barbarian".

Here he married a woman who was rich, I grant you, and brought him a big dowry, but a Scythian by blood. This wife bore him two daughters, whom he sent hither with plenty of money. One he married to a man whom I will not name--for I do not care to incur the enmity of many persons,--the other, in contempt of the laws of the city,1 Demosthenes of Paeania took to wife. She it was who bore your busy-body and informer. From his grandfather, therefore, he would inherit enmity toward the people, for you condemned his ancestors to death and by his mother's blood he would be a Scythian, a Greek-tongued barbarian--so that his knavery, too, is no product of our soil.

http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/cgi-bin/ptext...

So that by his grandfather in the female line, he is an enemy to the state, for this grandfather was condemned to death by your ancestors; and by his mother he is a Scythian—one who assumes the language of Greece, but whose abandoned principles betray his barbarous descent.

Aeschines, Demosthenes' greatest political rival, maintained that his mother Kleoboule was a Scythian(Barbarian) by blood
That's why his barbarian character(knavery)
is not product of our soil

[Aeschines, Against Ctesiphon,]

http://www.bartleby.com/268/1/19.html

hahahah look out your window now, there's a pink flying pig

Anti-Macedonian Athenean party doesn't constitute anything near an unbiased source but on the contrary an extremely biased thus non-credible source if we keep in mind Demosthenes was even tried for taking “Persian gold” to oppose as much he could Macedonian Hegemony.

"Now however the (Persian)King's treasure has drowned his extravagance--but even that will not be enough for no conceivable wealth can survive evil habits Worst of all he makes a living not out of his private sources of income but out of your danger"

[Aeschines, Against Ctesiphon]

http://www.google.com/search...

alexanders descendant wrote:

hahahah look out your window now, there's a pink flying pig

It's your mother, I think, she's been out there looking for you.

She asked me to tell you to stop taking expired drugs and start eating proper slop just like your brothers and sisters do.

Oink, oink!!!

Pou na katalavoune re aytoi ainai koutsoura apelekita.

E-re kourdisto portokali pou sas xreiazetai.

The meaning of the word barbaros is here: http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/cgi-bin/ptext...

I hope the link words.

Lindell-Scott is the most valuable dict of ancient Greek language.

->AFTER THE PERSIAN WAR(490-479 bc)
IT MEANS ALSO BRUTAL,RUDE

A. barbarous, i.e. non-Greek, foreign, not in Hom.(but cf. barbarophônos); b. psuchai Heraclit.107 ; esp. as Subst. barbaroi, hoi, originally all non-Greek-speaking peoples, then specially of the Medes and Persians, A.Pers.255, Hdt.1.58, etc.: generally, opp. Hellênes, Pl.Plt.262d, cf. Th.1.3, Arist.Pol.1252b5, Str.14.2.28; barbarôn Hellênas archein eikos E.IA1400 ; b. kai doulon tauto phusei Arist.Pol. 1252b9 ; hoi b. doulikôteroi ta êthê phusei tôn Hellênôn ib.1285a20; b. polemon war with the barbarians, Th.2.36 codd.; hê barbaros (sc. gê), opp. hai Hellênides poleis, Th.2.97, cf.A.Pers.187, X.An.5.5.16. Adv.-rôs, opp. Hellênikôs, Porph.Abst.3.3.

2. esp. of language, phônê b. A.Ag.1051 , Pl.Prt.341c; glôssa b. S.Aj.1263 , cf. Hdt.2.57, Str. l. c. supr., etc.; sullraphai Hippias 6 D.; of birds, Ar.Av.199. Adv., barbarôs,ônomastai have foreign names, Str.10.3.17.

3. Gramm., of bad Greek, Gell.5.20.5; to b., of style, opp. Hellênikon, S.E.M.1.64.

II. after the Persian war, brutal, rude, amathês kai b. Ar.Nu. 492 ; to tês phuseôs b. kai theois echthron D.21.150 ; skaios kai b. ton tropon Id.26.17 ; b. anêleês te Men.Epit.477 : Comp.-ôteros X. Eph.2.4: Sup., pantôn barbarôtatos theôn Ar.Av.1573 , cf. Th.8.98, X.An.5.4.34.

http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/cgi-bin/ptext...

But still the original meaning is the meaning that counts!!!!

JOVE wrote:

But still the original meaning is the meaning that counts!!!!

Not at the times of Demosthenes.
Anyway, Demorsthenes was a politician.

Politician words are true ONLY they are against their friends or in favour of their political enemies. That's why Demosthenes' words are LIES while Gligorof's ones are true: "we are just SlavoSkopians"

Istor wrote:

<quoted text>
Not at the times of Demosthenes.
Anyway, Demorsthenes was a politician.
Politician words are true ONLY they are against their friends or in favour of their political enemies. That's why Demosthenes' words are LIES while Gligorof's ones are true: "we are just SlavoSkopians"

Ha ha ha. It doesn´t mean what it means when it´s in your favour. How convincing!

JOVE wrote:

<quoted text>
Ha ha ha. It doesn´t mean what it means when it´s in your favour. How convincing!

Jove, the word barbaros had a new meaning (in parallel to old one) after Persian Wars. So, Demosthenes' words say nothing. Let alone that he was a politician and spoke about his enemies.

One can make also a list

of medieval or modern Greeks

who are labelled as foreigners

for POLITICAL REASONS,as well

Stricking example

Eamovoulgaroi
http://www.google.gr/search...
(Eamo-Bulgarians)

a label by greek nationalists

on greek communists

JOVE wrote:

But still the original meaning is the meaning that counts!!!!

You are a moron. Take your head out of the sand and see the evidence for what it is.

If you named yourselves something other than just Macedonian than this issue goes away.

Or if you kept the name Macedonian but renounced all attempts at stating that the Ancient Macedonians were not Hellenic - then maybe a compromise might be able to come to fruition.

However, what your people have done is steal the name, insist that there was never anything Hellenic about Macedonia - ever, that Alexander the Great was not a Hellene and he did not spread the Hellenic language, that the Macedonians of the bible were not Hellenic - these stupidities go on and on.

Your people are the reason why this issue will not go away. We have tried to negotiate in good faith but your country has ignored all such attempts.

So now - we will continue to tell the world that you are frauds, that you are not who you say you are, that you are thieves - until eventually - a world body or agency will force both sides to come to the table and hear all grievances.

At this point - your people will have to show evidence of all you claim. It will be at this exact moment that Hellenes will prevail – showing the world all the evidence just how much of a Hellene Alexander was.

Only then will your country be humiliated into a negotiated settlement. If not - then know this - we will never give up our lineage to anything Hellenic - including Hellenic Macedonia.

That means that your people will never have an uncontested identity.

You will always be confused with being a Hellene because Macedonians were always Hellenic.

Live a lie, die a liar!

GfC wrote:

<quoted text>
You are a moron. Take your head out of the sand and see the evidence for what it is.
If you named yourselves something other than just Macedonian than this issue goes away.
Or if you kept the name Macedonian but renounced all attempts at stating that the Ancient Macedonians were not Hellenic - then maybe a compromise might be able to come to fruition.
However, what your people have done is steal the name, insist that there was never anything Hellenic about Macedonia - ever, that Alexander the Great was not a Hellene and he did not spread the Hellenic language, that the Macedonians of the bible were not Hellenic - these stupidities go on and on.
Your people are the reason why this issue will not go away. We have tried to negotiate in good faith but your country has ignored all such attempts.
So now - we will continue to tell the world that you are frauds, that you are not who you say you are, that you are thieves - until eventually - a world body or agency will force both sides to come to the table and hear all grievances.
At this point - your people will have to show evidence of all you claim. It will be at this exact moment that Hellenes will prevail – showing the world all the evidence just how much of a Hellene Alexander was.
Only then will your country be humiliated into a negotiated settlement. If not - then know this - we will never give up our lineage to anything Hellenic - including Hellenic Macedonia.
That means that your people will never have an uncontested identity.
You will always be confused with being a Hellene because Macedonians were always Hellenic.
Live a lie, die a liar!

To me you speak barr-barr therefore you are a barbarian.

Istor wrote:

<quoted text>
Jove, the word barbaros had a new meaning (in parallel to old one) after Persian Wars. So, Demosthenes' words say nothing. Let alone that he was a politician and spoke about his enemies.

The ancient greeks used it first and farmost for those who spoke barr-barr. It was not just Demosthenes who spoke of the Macedonians as barr-barr speakers but many other greeks as well. If Demosthenes was wrong about the Macedonians being barr-barr speakers he would never have been able to use this as an argument against the Macedonians.
And the truth will prevail.
Macedonia for the Macedonians!!!

JOVE wrote:

<quoted text>
The ancient greeks used it first and farmost for those who spoke barr-barr. It was not just Demosthenes who spoke of the Macedonians as barr-barr speakers but many other greeks as well. If Demosthenes was wrong about the Macedonians being barr-barr speakers he would never have been able to use this as an argument against the Macedonians.
And the truth will prevail.
Macedonia for the Macedonians!!!

So typically ignorant wishful thinking!! Demosthenes also called Barbarian the Athenean Stephanos therefore for our clueless west-Bulgar that makes Atheneans...non-Greeks. But wait there are references to Thessalians as Barbarians therefore for our lying west-Bulgar, Thessalians are non-Greeks either.

When you finally get a clue about history come back!!

What a nice quote from Athen. Deipnosop.

"And when he was asked again, according to the account given by Hegesander, which were the greatest barbarians, the Boeotians or the Thessalians he said, " The Eleans." "

For some retards, this is proof Boeotians, Thessalians and Eleans didnt...speak Greek. Go figure!!