Interest for Estonian citizenship among Russians grows - The Baltic Times

Veritas wrote:

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And obviously, Russians have far less -- as evidenced by the fact that they must go to other countries to shop.

it is impoossible because all the trading companies of those countries have their molls in Russia as well - simply delivery costs money as well as import taxation and so you can get the same stuff cheaper back in its country of origin - thats the reason of that shopping fashion which is profitable for Russians couse they go anyways for weekends for recreation fun in Finland - actually as a person who lived in Canada I can attest that a Russian who lives in big Russian city has more choices in shopping then a Canadian or American who lives in small town in North America. Don't know how big is your town in this connection to claim that I have better shopping opportunities here in St.Petersburg then you have in your place, but it actually MAY be so (judjing by some Canadian towns I have visited)....

hmmmm wrote:

<quoted text>and that shows ! In healthy economy any new customer is a blessing

You are mistaken.
If the shopping preferences of local natives are different from the preferences of tourists, then with enough tourists the local shops will start to align with tourists. That actually leaves locals LESS local choice than without tourists. Of course, one can shop online, or go shopping in Germany or London for example.

hmmmm wrote:

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look at Finland, they specifically developped infrastructure for Russian customers in Southern Finland even with service in Russian language

Specific infrastructure for russians?
Are you suggesting Finland is practicing segregation policies?

PS. I am sure that russians get better russian language service in Estonia than in Finland.

hmmmm wrote:

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and they thrive because of Russian interest in the region - not only tourist visits, but deliberate russian shoping over there as well...

And over here as well.

But I am not all that sure that most of the locals like these developments.

tarmo wrote:

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You are mistaken.
If the shopping preferences of local natives are different from the preferences of tourists, then with enough tourists the local shops will start to align with tourists. That actually leaves locals LESS local choice than without tourists. Of course, one can shop online, or go shopping in Germany or London for example.
<quoted text>
Specific infrastructure for russians?
Are you suggesting Finland is practicing segregation policies?
PS. I am sure that russians get better russian language service in Estonia than in Finland.
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And over here as well.
But I am not all that sure that most of the locals like these developments.

I believe historic sites the service is equal regarding language assuming there even is any significant historic sites for them to visit in Estonia. I mean sites that influenced them hundred years ago. Not 1000 years ago. If I am not mistaken there is a russian military cemetery in Estonia but that is it.

To list just two major events for russian history that happen here. Lenin and Stalin first met in 1905 right here on Finland. Russian Baltic Fleet achieved its first major victory here against the swedes. Now what Estonia has? Battle of Narva during the Great Northern War?

Lukashenko is Dr Phil wrote:

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I believe historic sites the service is equal regarding language assuming there even is any significant historic sites for them to visit in Estonia. I mean sites that influenced them hundred years ago. Not 1000 years ago. If I am not mistaken there is a russian military cemetery in Estonia but that is it.

Well, there is the quite impressive Russalka monument erected in Tallinn in 1902. It would certainly be a tragedy if Estonia's renaissance consumed such a magnificent work of art. I suppose that since the model for the angel was the sculptor's housekeeper Juliana Rootsi, whose grandson is politician Tiit may ameliorate today's Estonian temperament somewhat.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons... ä.jpg/450px-Rusalka_Memorial-L eo-setä.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Rusalka_Mem... ä.jpg

Forsensic Pathologist wrote:

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Well, there is the quite impressive Russalka monument erected in Tallinn in 1902. It would certainly be a tragedy if Estonia's renaissance consumed such a magnificent work of art. I suppose that since the model for the angel was the sculptor's housekeeper Juliana Rootsi, whose grandson is politician Tiit may ameliorate today's Estonian temperament somewhat.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons... ä.jpg/450px-Rusalka_Memorial-L eo-setä.jpg

Estonians can build all the monuments they want but the russians will remember them only by the fact that british and finnish aid in 1919 saved them and rest of the balts from total inhalation. Otherwise all estonians would have ended up like their brothers in Russia did. Estonia's main income during the 30s was exporting butter and milk to Finland. No really. I would also say our mark was stronger than theirs. I am sure Tarmo remembers how Estonia lost millions because were not smart enough to be careful when playing with Ivar Kreuger.

Lukashenko is Dr Phil wrote:

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Estonians can build all the monuments they want but the russians will remember them only by the fact that british and finnish aid in 1919 saved them and rest of the balts from total inhalation.

Why save them from inhalation? They might have ended up like Amsterdam, perpetually stoned and prosperous. ;-)

Lukashenko is Dr Phil wrote:

Lenin and Stalin first met in 1905 right here on Finland.

Strictly speaking, that was soviet history, not russian history.

Lukashenko is Dr Phil wrote:

Russian Baltic Fleet achieved its first major victory here against the swedes. Now what Estonia has?

We can show them the 1032 battle they lost between the Aegna island and Rohuneeme / Raudneeme / Iron Gate (sea battle of the Iron Gate).

We can show them the land whose soldiers gave them the gates of Sigtuna.

Lukashenko is Dr Phil wrote:

Battle of Narva during the Great Northern War?

The biggest soviet /russian losses in one place happened in the Battle of Sinimäed, 1944. Sõrve battles were also quite deadly.

But why should russians travel abroad to see battle sites anyway?
And soviet battles in particular?

Lukashenko is Dr Phil wrote:

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Estonians can build all the monuments they want but the russians will remember them only by the fact that british and finnish aid in 1919 saved them and rest of the balts from total inhalation.

Oh, I know they remember much more than that.
The foreign help might have come at a decisive moment, and the finnish soldiers were a good addition, but let's remember that finns and brits did not help Estonia against Landeswehr.
The help of finnish soldiers in January 1919 might have been 20-40% of the force on the Estonian side, but it was already below 10% by March 1919.

And strangely, russians somehow mostly remember the Yudenich army twice attacking St. Petersburg. But they do not remember, that it was the Estonian troops that broke through the soviet defenses and set up the Yudenich attacks, and it was Estonian troops who stopped the advancing soviet troops after Yudenich troops had failed.

It was also the Estonian troops who beat the Latvian Red Rifles.
And who beat the Landeswehr.

Lukashenko is Dr Phil wrote:

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Otherwise all estonians would have ended up like their brothers in Russia did.

Perhaps.
Perhaps not.

In December 1918, soviet attack was winding down anyway. And taking Tallinn would have been difficult even without finnish soldiers.

Actually the british naval help was more important, because it checked the Baltic Fleet, it enabled for brits to give and sell weapons, food and clothes for Estonia.

Lukashenko is Dr Phil wrote:

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Estonia's main income during the 30s was exporting butter and milk to Finland.

Really?
Are you sure it wasn't Viru Valge?

Lukashenko is Dr Phil wrote:

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No really. I would also say our mark was stronger than theirs.

Well, it would have been pathetic (for Finland) if it were the other way around, don't you agree?

Lukashenko is Dr Phil wrote:

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I am sure Tarmo remembers how Estonia lost millions because were not smart enough to be careful when playing with Ivar Kreuger.

You mean the match monopoly? That was hardly an Estonian problem.
More like European wide problem.

Estonia's real problem at that time was too much reliance on trade with Soviet Russia and later on Soviet Union.
That is why reindependent Estonia is wary of having too much business with Russia - because losses from that direction are a decadal matter even today. 5-15% of foreign trade with Russia is optimal, 20% is risky, anything more is playing with fire.