NON-EUROPEAN ORIGIN of the Shiptars!

Constantin-I-illyrian wrote:

Black Ruski whith a mix off illyrian , fack off from west fyrom, goe back to sibira where you slaw's come from , and take the greeks and bulgars whith you. Neither off you are people who you claim to be.

Slavs come from Poland / Belarus / Ukraine.

Albanians come from the Caucasus!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caucasian_Albani...

Albanians are the brothers of the Chechen terrorists / gangsters & the ASHkeNAZI Jewish Khazarian terrorists / gangsters.

The Albanian / Jew / Chechen dirty terrorist gangster INC

Dirty brothers of the same dirty horde.

this is the true wrote:

The Albanians are generally and probably accurately identified by impartial authorities as the descendants of the ancient Illyrians,

Albanians come from Albania in the Caucasus!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caucasian_Albani...

a)The Albanians were never mentioned in Byzantine,(not even of the works by Constantine VII Porphyrogenitus), Arab, Armenian or any other texts before the 12th cent.

b)Language:
Albanian is classified as an IE language only because no one has been able to classify it into any other group, and this is because no one has yet studied all the Caucasus languages.
Albanian might have IE sounding words, but its basic structure and syntax are more similar to Chechen and Udish than to any IE language. Many Albanian words do sound Indo-European, because Albanian has borrowed over 80% of its vocabulary, more than any other European language.
The Chechen language is similar to Albanian. They both have similar grammar and similar sounds such as SQ, PSHQ, which are not common in any IE languages, but are very common in Caucasus languages like Chechenian.
The Albanians call themselves "Shqip-tari". This name is not Indo-European in origin and contains in it the Ural-Altaic suffix "ar" or "tar". Much like: "Khaz-AR", "Av-AR", "Magy-AR", "Bulg-AR", "Hung-AR", "Ta-TAR" - "Ship-TAR". see:
CHECHENIA=ICHQERIA
ALBANIA=SHQIPTERIA

c)Their alphabet interestingly enough, had Arabic letters until 1908 when the alphabet they use today was adopted.

d)The most ancient loanwords from Latin in Albanian have the phonetic form of eastern Balkan Latin, i.e. of proto-Romanian, and not of western Balkan Latin, i.e. of old Dalmatian Latin. Albanian, therefore, did not take its borrowings from Vulgar Latin as spoken in Illyria.

e)The Adriatic coast was not part of the primitive home of the Albanians, because the maritime terminology of Albanian is not their own, but is borrowed from different languages.

f)Another indication against local Albanian origin is the insignificant number of ancient Greek loanwords in Albanian. If the primitive home of the Albanians had been Albania itself, then the Albanian language would have to have many more ancient Greek loanwords.

g)Just a few, of the many identical place-names between Albania and Caucasus:
Albo-Arnauti -Caucasus- Arnauti
(Turks and Balkan peoples call Albanians by this name; likely from arch. Turk: Arran)
Albo-Bushati - Caucasus-Bushati (also the name of an Albanian tribe)
Albo-Baboti - Caucasus-Baboti
Albo-Baka -Caucasus-Bako
Albo-Ballagati - Caucasus-Balagati
Albo-Ballaj,Balli - Caucasus- Bali
Albo-Bashkimi - Caucasus-Bashkoi
Albo-Bathore- Caucasus- Batharia
Albo-Bater- Caucasus- Bataris
Albo-Geg - Caucasus-Gegi, Gegeni, Geguti (Term used by Albanians in their language to denote their brethre north of the Shkumbi R.)
Albo-Demir Kapia - Caucasus-Demir Kapia (Turkish term: "iron gates"; term by which Turks refered to the Caspian Sea or arch: Albanian Sea)
Albo-Kish, Kisha...- Caucasus-Kish (Eight different toponyms in Albania begin with "kish")
Albo-Kurata,Kuratem,Kurateni(v illages)-Caucasus-Kura (river)(Nine different toponyms in Albania begin with "Kura")
Albo-Luginasi - Caucasus-Lugini
Albo-Rusani - Caucasus-Rusian
Albo-Sheshani, Shoshani, Shashani - Caucasus-Shashani
Albo-Sheshaj, Sheshi - Caucasus-Sheshleti
Albo-Skalla - Caucasus-Skaleri
Albo-Shiptari Shipyaki, Shkhepa,- Caucasus-Shkepi
Albo-Shkoder - Caucasus-Shkeder, Shked, Shkoda
Albo-Shekulli - Caucasus-Shekouli
Albo-Skuraj - Caucasus-Skuria

h) The fact that Albanian is totally alien to the Illyrian language based on the Messapic inscriptions found in tombs. So we must come to the conclusion that they either came from a different location (Caucasus theory) or the Illyrian tribes had absolutely NO ability of communicating with each other.
(that does sound stupid don't you think?)

i) The Illyrian city names mentioned in ancient times that were kept do not follow the Albanian sound change laws, suggesting that they were late borrowing from an intermediary language (most likely Romance or Slavic), rather than inherited (for example ancient Aulona should have been inherited in modern Albanian as Alor? instead of Vlore.

j)Ptolemy in Book 5 chapter 15 titled "Location of Illyria or Liburnia, and of Dalmatia" (The Fifth Map of Europe)
Never mentions the alleged "albanopolis" that they support he has, and can be found at 46 degrees and 41 degrees 45', but when you look up what he really has writen, you find the city of Thermidava
Ptolemy's Geography can be found at :
penelope.uchicago.edu/Tha.../home.html

k) Now, when we look at apostle Bartholomew's life, we find he labored in the area around the south end of the Caspian Sea, in the section that was then called Armenia. The modern name of the district where he died is Azerbaijan and the place of his death, called in New Testament times ALBANOPOLIS!!!, is now Derbend which is on the west coast of the Caspian Sea.

l) Out of a list of 40-50 Illyrian city names known to us only 2-5 of the Albanian city names can be connected to them.

m) There is NO MEMORY!!! of the Illyrian past in the Albanian cultural heritage.

n) One of the interesting facts that connect the Albanians to the Caucasus and that they are not the descendants of the Ancient Illyrians is the Turkish name for the Albanians. "Arnauti", which means "those who have not returned" in Arabic, for the Turks were aware of the origins of the Albanians. And they truly did not return, they stayed in Serbian and Byzantine lands.

o) Hard evidence is the Turkish censuses carried out in 1455, they indicate that Albanian names are found in only 80 of the 600 villages listed in the area, and that they did not constitute territorial groups, ruling out any assumptions that zones evenly and continuously inhabited by Albanians existed at the time.

p) The first Albo dictionary was published in 1635 and contained only 5,000 words, when today any pocket dictionary contains at least 250.000 proving that their language was still under development.

q) The most interesting fact is our knowledge of the Arab conquer of the Albanian Caucasus sometime around the 7th cent based on Byzantine, Arab and Armenian sources.
They were converted to Islam and used as military troops to attack Sicily, dividing it into two parts,(hence there was the Kingdom of the two Sicilies). In order to populate their part of Sicily, the Arabs brought with them Old Albanians from the Caucasus.

Then in 1042, the Byzantine Empire attacked the young Serbian state after having defeated the Arabs in Sicily and having brought the Sicilian Albanians under their command and christianizing them. The leader of the Byzantines who led the Albanians was named Georgius Maniakos. Maniakos brought Albanian mercenaries from Sicily to fight the Serbs and they settled in two waves in modern day Albania, first the mercenaries came, and then came the women and children. After the defeat of Maniakos, the Byzantines would not let the Albanians return, thus the Albanians requested that the Serbs let them stay on the land. They settled under mount Raban and the city of Berat and from this, the Serbs called them "Rabanasi" or "Arbanasi". The city of Berat was known as Belgrad also, before the Albanians came to settle there. They mostly tended sheep and cattle and lent themselves out to Serbian nobles as brave soldiers.

A fact to support this except the texts themselves is their flag. I'm sure you know that the Byzantine war flag was a double headed eagle on a red background.

Source (http://www.last.fm/user/sinisha/journal/2008/... )

Albania, Colchis, Iberia, and the neighbouring countries
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons...

"The Albanians are divided into four tribes. These are, the Gheghides and Mirdites, the Toskides, the Tsamides, and the Liapides..........

The Toskides are the most handsome of the Albanians. They have noble features, indicating the mixture of Georgian blood, which probably flows in their veins; less warlike than their countrymen of the other tribes, their stature is also less Herculean. They are supposed to have derived their name from the Toxidse, mentioned by Chardin as inhabiting Mingrelia*.

In their own language they call themselves 'Skipetar', which name bears some affinity with that of of the Skitekip, mentioned by the Armenian geographers as inhabiting a territory near the Caspian (sea)."

('The Albanians' by Henry Skene. Journal of the Ethnological Society of London, Vol. 2. 1850)

* MINGRELIA, a former principality of Transcaucasia, which became subject to Russia in 1804, and since 1867 has belonged to the government of Kutais. The country corresponds to the ancient Colchis.

Filip II Reincarnated wrote:

"The Albanians are divided into four tribes. These are, the Gheghides and Mirdites, the Toskides, the Tsamides, and the Liapides..........
The Toskides are the most handsome of the Albanians. They have noble features, indicating the mixture of Georgian blood, which probably flows in their veins; less warlike than their countrymen of the other tribes, their stature is also less Herculean. They are supposed to have derived their name from the Toxidse, mentioned by Chardin as inhabiting Mingrelia*.
In their own language they call themselves 'Skipetar', which name bears some affinity with that of of the Skitekip, mentioned by the Armenian geographers as inhabiting a territory near the Caspian (sea)."
('The Albanians' by Henry Skene. Journal of the Ethnological Society of London, Vol. 2. 1850)
* MINGRELIA, a former principality of Transcaucasia, which became subject to Russia in 1804, and since 1867 has belonged to the government of Kutais. The country corresponds to the ancient Colchis.

but you are bulgarians what exactly makes u ancient macedonian??? from the same book you ....

Besides the three great families of Turks, Greeks, and Albanians, there are to be found, in the Greek provinces of European Turkey, two other tribes, equally distinct from these and from each other, though infinitely less numerous. These are the Bulgarians and the Vlachs.

The Bulgarians are a race of Sclavonian origin, and are supposed by some to have been a tribe of the Huns. Their physical appearance is totally different from that of the Greeks and Albanians. More powerful in form, they are of a heavy build, while their features are coarser, and devoid of the acute and intelligent expression which is so remarkable in the Greek and even in the Albanian physiognomy. The Bulgarians are brave but cruel, strong workmen, but brutal in their habits and manners; and the best and most advantageous of their characteristics is their aptness for country labour. They are, in fact, the best agriculturists of European Turkey: diligent husbandmen, they have consequently spread their colonies partly over Thrace, and partially even in Macedonia; although in the middle ages they had extended them over the greatest part of what is called now European Turkey.

are we clear now my bulgarian neighbour

HugeKielbasa wrote:

<quoted text>
Slavs come from Poland / Belarus / Ukraine.
Albanians come from the Caucasus!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caucasian_Albani...
Albanians are the brothers of the Chechen terrorists / gangsters & the ASHkeNAZI Jewish Khazarian terrorists / gangsters.
The Albanian / Jew / Chechen dirty terrorist gangster INC
Dirty brothers of the same dirty horde.

The Bulgarians(modern macedonians) crossed the Danube before the reign of Justinian, and kept constantly pouring down from the vast plains of Poland, Lithuania, and Russia, during the sixth century; and they continued gradually gaining ground in the fine countries of Macedonia and Illyria, until the fall of the Byzantine empire.

altin dublin wrote:

<quoted text>
The Bulgarians(modern macedonians) crossed the Danube before the reign of Justinian, and kept constantly pouring down from the vast plains of Poland, Lithuania, and Russia, during the sixth century; and they continued gradually gaining ground in the fine countries of Macedonia and Illyria, until the fall of the Byzantine empire.

poland wasn't really slavic before but germanic... the only slavs there before were around the boarder of ukraine,or beleruse

HugeKielbasa wrote:

i) The Illyrian city names mentioned in ancient times that were kept do not follow the Albanian sound change laws, suggesting that they were late borrowing from an intermediary language (most likely Romance or Slavic), rather than inherited (for example ancient Aulona should have been inherited in modern Albanian as Alor? instead of Vlore.
j)Ptolemy in Book 5 chapter 15 titled "Location of Illyria or Liburnia, and of Dalmatia" (The Fifth Map of Europe)
Never mentions the alleged "albanopolis" that they support he has, and can be found at 46 degrees and 41 degrees 45', but when you look up what he really has writen, you find the city of Thermidava
Ptolemy's Geography can be found at :
penelope.uchicago.edu/Tha.../home.html
k) Now, when we look at apostle Bartholomew's life, we find he labored in the area around the south end of the Caspian Sea, in the section that was then called Armenia. The modern name of the district where he died is Azerbaijan and the place of his death, called in New Testament times ALBANOPOLIS!!!, is now Derbend which is on the west coast of the Caspian Sea.
l) Out of a list of 40-50 Illyrian city names known to us only 2-5 of the Albanian city names can be connected to them.
m) There is NO MEMORY!!! of the Illyrian past in the Albanian cultural heritage.
n) One of the interesting facts that connect the Albanians to the Caucasus and that they are not the descendants of the Ancient Illyrians is the Turkish name for the Albanians. "Arnauti", which means "those who have not returned" in Arabic, for the Turks were aware of the origins of the Albanians. And they truly did not return, they stayed in Serbian and Byzantine lands.
o) Hard evidence is the Turkish censuses carried out in 1455, they indicate that Albanian names are found in only 80 of the 600 villages listed in the area, and that they did not constitute territorial groups, ruling out any assumptions that zones evenly and continuously inhabited by Albanians existed at the time.
p) The first Albo dictionary was published in 1635 and contained only 5,000 words, when today any pocket dictionary contains at least 250.000 proving that their language was still under development.
q) The most interesting fact is our knowledge of the Arab conquer of the Albanian Caucasus sometime around the 7th cent based on Byzantine, Arab and Armenian sources.
They were converted to Islam and used as military troops to attack Sicily, dividing it into two parts,(hence there was the Kingdom of the two Sicilies). In order to populate their part of Sicily, the Arabs brought with them Old Albanians from the Caucasus.
Then in 1042, the Byzantine Empire attacked the young Serbian state after having defeated the Arabs in Sicily and having brought the Sicilian Albanians under their command and christianizing them. The leader of the Byzantines who led the Albanians was named Georgius Maniakos. Maniakos brought Albanian mercenaries from Sicily to fight the Serbs and they settled in two waves in modern day Albania, first the mercenaries came, and then came the women and children. After the defeat of Maniakos, the Byzantines would not let the Albanians return, thus the Albanians requested that the Serbs let them stay on the land. They settled under mount Raban and the city of Berat and from this, the Serbs called them "Rabanasi" or "Arbanasi". The city of Berat was known as Belgrad also, before the Albanians came to settle there. They mostly tended sheep and cattle and lent themselves out to Serbian nobles as brave soldiers.
A fact to support this except the texts themselves is their flag. I'm sure you know that the Byzantine war flag was a double headed eagle on a red background.
Source (http://www.last.fm/user/sinisha/journal/2008/... )

Excellent review!

HugeKielbasa wrote:

a)The Albanians were never mentioned in Byzantine,(not even of the works by Constantine VII Porphyrogenitus), Arab, Armenian or any other texts before the 12th cent.
b)Language:
Albanian is classified as an IE language only because no one has been able to classify it into any other group, and this is because no one has yet studied all the Caucasus languages.
Albanian might have IE sounding words, but its basic structure and syntax are more similar to Chechen and Udish than to any IE language. Many Albanian words do sound Indo-European, because Albanian has borrowed over 80% of its vocabulary, more than any other European language.
The Chechen language is similar to Albanian. They both have similar grammar and similar sounds such as SQ, PSHQ, which are not common in any IE languages, but are very common in Caucasus languages like Chechenian.
The Albanians call themselves "Shqip-tari". This name is not Indo-European in origin and contains in it the Ural-Altaic suffix "ar" or "tar". Much like: "Khaz-AR", "Av-AR", "Magy-AR", "Bulg-AR", "Hung-AR", "Ta-TAR" - "Ship-TAR". see:
CHECHENIA=ICHQERIA
ALBANIA=SHQIPTERIA
c)Their alphabet interestingly enough, had Arabic letters until 1908 when the alphabet they use today was adopted.
d)The most ancient loanwords from Latin in Albanian have the phonetic form of eastern Balkan Latin, i.e. of proto-Romanian, and not of western Balkan Latin, i.e. of old Dalmatian Latin. Albanian, therefore, did not take its borrowings from Vulgar Latin as spoken in Illyria.
e)The Adriatic coast was not part of the primitive home of the Albanians, because the maritime terminology of Albanian is not their own, but is borrowed from different languages.
f)Another indication against local Albanian origin is the insignificant number of ancient Greek loanwords in Albanian. If the primitive home of the Albanians had been Albania itself, then the Albanian language would have to have many more ancient Greek loanwords.
g)Just a few, of the many identical place-names between Albania and Caucasus:
Albo-Arnauti -Caucasus- Arnauti
(Turks and Balkan peoples call Albanians by this name; likely from arch. Turk: Arran)
Albo-Bushati - Caucasus-Bushati (also the name of an Albanian tribe)
Albo-Baboti - Caucasus-Baboti
Albo-Baka -Caucasus-Bako
Albo-Ballagati - Caucasus-Balagati
Albo-Ballaj,Balli - Caucasus- Bali
Albo-Bashkimi - Caucasus-Bashkoi
Albo-Bathore- Caucasus- Batharia
Albo-Bater- Caucasus- Bataris
Albo-Geg - Caucasus-Gegi, Gegeni, Geguti (Term used by Albanians in their language to denote their brethre north of the Shkumbi R.)
Albo-Demir Kapia - Caucasus-Demir Kapia (Turkish term: "iron gates"; term by which Turks refered to the Caspian Sea or arch: Albanian Sea)
Albo-Kish, Kisha...- Caucasus-Kish (Eight different toponyms in Albania begin with "kish")
Albo-Kurata,Kuratem,Kurateni(v illages)-Caucasus-Kura (river)(Nine different toponyms in Albania begin with "Kura")
Albo-Luginasi - Caucasus-Lugini
Albo-Rusani - Caucasus-Rusian
Albo-Sheshani, Shoshani, Shashani - Caucasus-Shashani
Albo-Sheshaj, Sheshi - Caucasus-Sheshleti
Albo-Skalla - Caucasus-Skaleri
Albo-Shiptari Shipyaki, Shkhepa,- Caucasus-Shkepi
Albo-Shkoder - Caucasus-Shkeder, Shked, Shkoda
Albo-Shekulli - Caucasus-Shekouli
Albo-Skuraj - Caucasus-Skuria
h) The fact that Albanian is totally alien to the Illyrian language based on the Messapic inscriptions found in tombs. So we must come to the conclusion that they either came from a different location (Caucasus theory) or the Illyrian tribes had absolutely NO ability of communicating with each other.
(that does sound stupid don't you think?)

Excellent review!

Ahahahahahhohohohoahah
thees filthy babarian slavs are envius becuase their religion(orthodoks christian) are inveted by an albanian(constatin I) and biuld est rome(contantinople) which is the is the religion and art center of theese garbage slav people. Many kings of contatinople slew and murderet theese ruski gypsis, and still thees slav are orthodok christian( which b.t.w are not christians at alll) hahahahihihihohoho what a great history theese filthy ruski have. And now they do every thing they can to distort the albanian history. But there is Only slav historians who has these theoris abaut albanians and some times the seaGypsis(greks)
Hahahahwhehe
what a farce.

Filip II Reincarnated wrote:

<quoted text>Excellent review!

whatever makes u happy my bullgarian neighbour

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caucasian_Albani...

"The Shiptarian language is admixture of many diferent NON-Albanian sources. Out of 5140 studied words Romance (Latin) element is the most present, found in some 1420 borrowed words; Tataro-Turkic in 1180 words; so called "Greek" within 840 words, and the rest 540 words are of the Macedonic provenance. Some 400 words are found to be of African origin."
('Maps and Politics', R. Wilkinson, Liverpool, 1951.)

lol i love these pathetic posts people post on here..they try to irritate albanians with pathetic posts....

we all know albanians are some crazy ass people, and i advise you not to fck with them.

We all know albanians were the anceint illyrians,
the arvanities are albanians and the weak greeks hellenized them to put courage and bravery in the greek dna. albanians were the seed for all of the balkans..

i just love how the modern history and modern governments use propaganda against albanians to make their people STUPID and avoid the truth.
the balkans should consider the albanians their forfathers.it just sucks that if albania was in the level of italy all of the balkan states especially greece would kiss our a22es

Albania, Colchis, Iberia, and the neighbouring countries
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons...

Filip II Reincarnated wrote:

Albania, Colchis, Iberia, and the neighbouring countries
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons...

by your logic the iberian should be the spanoils, becouse there is iberia in spain and they come from Dagastan.
Stupid filthy propagandist black slav. Stalin is dead. Get a education.

VHN

You seem to be typing a lot of smart wording, for something you know nothing about and that is not very smart.

If you so call yourself educated, you should learn to let go the hate inside you. It is not good for you, relax ,chill, worry about your own origin. Albanians they know theirs and they are proud of it.

THAT'S WHY THEY ARE THE DESCENDANTS OF ILLYRIANS.

Just like Illyrians, Albanians, are true fighters,believers and non religious, and it is in their nature to take battle anything that comes their way.

I would peacefully advise you to ShxT the Fxxk UP BxxxH.

vhn wrote:

<quoted text>
At least read the Wikipedia page you cite:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caucasian_Albani...
It makes it clear that Caucasian Albania has nothing to do with the Balkans Albania are unrelated.
The Albani and Albanopolis were mentioned in the Balkans (in the location of present day Albanians) more than two centuries prior to this time. Go to your local library and look up Ptolemy's geography Book Three Chapter XII. Or just click on the link below:
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/albania/T0UI...
Of course no historian in her right mind would dream of the Caucasian Albania being related to the Balkans Albania.
"This dispute revolves around the history of the Caucasian Albanians (not to be confused with present-day Albanians)."
Dudwick Nora. The case of the Caucasian Albanians : Ethnohistory and ethnic politics. In: Cahiers du monde russe et soviétique. Vol. 31 N°2-3. Avril-Septembre 1990. pp. 377-383.
"In this small corner of the world, the eponym Albania bears no relation to the modern nation-state located on the Balkan Peninsula. The reference is to Caucasian Albania instead, an ancient multiethnic state that was located in a smallish territory stretching over the current border between southern Daghestan and northern Azerbaijan."
Murtazali S. Gadjiev, The Writing of Caucasian Albania Facts and Falsifications
"There was an Asian state of Albanians on the western side of the Caspian (see Ptol 5.12.2; Strabo 11.501 – 3), but the language that survives as Udi or Alban belongs to the eastern Caucasian family and is unrelated to Albanian."
Helen Abadzi, Historical Greek-Albanian Relations: Some Mysteries and Riddles, pg 51
"The apparent survival of (Indo-European) Illyrian as modern Albanian seems to be due partly to the Albanians' isolation in rugged terrain, partly to their living in a borderland between Greek and Latin where the two languages diluted each other's influence."
Warren Treadgold, A History of the Byzantine State and Society, Stanford University Press, 1997, pg. 921
You are the personification of folly. Instead of doing something productive you spend your time misinforming others.

SON OF ILLYRIAN LAND wrote:

VHN
You seem to be typing a lot of smart wording, for something you know nothing about and that is not very smart.
If you so call yourself educated, you should learn to let go the hate inside you. It is not good for you, relax ,chill, worry about your own origin. Albanians they know theirs and they are proud of it.
THAT'S WHY THEY ARE THE DESCENDANTS OF ILLYRIANS.
Just like Illyrians, Albanians, are true fighters,believers and non religious, and it is in their nature to take battle anything that comes their way.
I would peacefully advise you to ShxT the Fxxk UP BxxxH.
<quoted text>

o fraer i amerikes mua me folish. Cka thash gabim?