Evolution vs. Creation

Full story: Best of New Orleans

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008.

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RU CRS

Bellevue, WA

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#37489
Aug 12, 2012
 

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We have imperfections here on Earth because of mankinds stupidity and disobedience to our Creator in the first place. Even death was brought about because of man and his willful stupid disregard for the Creator. The cursed imperfect things on this Earth didn't have to be here if our forefathers had listened and obeyed.

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Since: Dec 10

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#37490
Aug 12, 2012
 
RU CRS wrote:
We have imperfections here on Earth because of mankinds stupidity and disobedience to our Creator in the first place. Even death was brought about because of man and his willful stupid disregard for the Creator. The cursed imperfect things on this Earth didn't have to be here if our forefathers had listened and obeyed.

Pack your bags folks , RU CRS is taking you on a guilt trip!

Since: Feb 08

Tampa, FL

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#37491
Aug 12, 2012
 
RU CRS wrote:
We have imperfections here on Earth because of mankinds stupidity and disobedience to our Creator in the first place. Even death was brought about because of man and his willful stupid disregard for the Creator.
So there wouldn't have been any death if Adam and Eve hadn't sinned?

Wouldn't that have caused a serious population problem among the animals and plants?
RU CRS

Bellevue, WA

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#37492
Aug 12, 2012
 
We are all born with imperfections that we have inherited, and each one of us will face death here on this Earth. The good news is that this trip we are taking through life is only a choosing ground as to where we will spend eternity. If we choose eternal life through Gods Son Jesus, we will go to a place that he has prepared where we will be like we should have been in the first place. Jesus can speak and through his power it will be done instantly and death will be done away with. All power is his to do as he will, and he said he has prepared a place for whosoever will trust and believe in him.
RU CRS

Bellevue, WA

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#37493
Aug 12, 2012
 
Jesus commanded his followers to love one another, and he said he loved everyone so much that he was willing to lay his life down for whosoever would come to him and obey him. Because Jesus willfully suffered and went to the cross, he is able to give us whatever he will through grace and forgiveness that is accepted by God through his sacrifice.
HTS

Williston, ND

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#37494
Aug 12, 2012
 
Thomas Robertson wrote:
I wrote:
I have two specific questions:
1. When has "any part of the structure of any one species ... been formed for the exclusive good of another species"?
2. Assuming that such an event has taken place, how does that disprove evolution?
We didn't say that would disprove evolution, Darwin said that would disprove evolution.
HTS wrote:
There are hundreds of examples of medicinal plants that benefit humans and not the plants. For example, the foxglove plant produces digitalis which has saved the lives of thousands of heart patients.
Edible roots benefit animals and are a detriment to plant survival and reproduction. These modifications cannot be explained by an proposed mechanisms of evolution.
HTS, thank you for addressing my first question.
Will you please address my second question?
The theory of evolution demands that any modification the appears in an organism over time benefit that organism's survival and reproduction. If a bird evolved the ability to fly, it was to help the bird survive, so it reproduced. Darwin another evolutionists have relied on this assumption to justify the belief that every complexity in nature evolved through natural selection. If a plant evolves an edible root, it hinders the plant's chances for survival. An edible root enhances the survival of other species (animals). Therefore, one would expect that if plants were created by evolution all plant roots would be. In edible. Medicinal plants produce very complex chemical substances that benefit humans alone. What atheistic force in nature would be driving hundreds of plants to produce beneficial drugs for man, when they don't enhance the plant's survival?
HTS

Williston, ND

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#37496
Aug 12, 2012
 
Thomas Robertson wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm confused, then.
On page 1810, you wrote, "Intelligent design is the only scientifically proven force in the universe capable of creating complexity from randomness."
That was 11 hours ago.
On page 1802, you wrote, "Evolution states that no intelligent design exists."
What I meant by "intelligent design" in that context was that human intelligence (and to a lesser degree animal intelligrnce) is the only force capable of creating complexity. Therefore, it is logical to conclude that some sort of intelligence created life, which is the greatest complexity in the universe.
Elohim

Chester, CT

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#37497
Aug 12, 2012
 
wolverine wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes Sir....I Tend To Think Mankind Is Lost....Other Then The Hard Working Middle Class...
Greed, Coruption, Agendas, Political Hacks, Entitlements....
This Is Not America Anymore.
America was founded on and by Greed, Coruption, Agendas, Political Hacks, Entitlements.... It just out in the open today.
Elohim

Chester, CT

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#37498
Aug 12, 2012
 
PROFESSOR X wrote:
<quoted text>
That's because you serve "the phony god of self" and that false god allows you act any way you want. But no matter how much you desperately try to deceive yourself, the truth always resurfaces and you are accountable to it. There is freedom and deliverance from the spirit of Perversion. Furthermore, you prove my point that most Atheists are homosexuals. Romans 1:16-32
The Psychology of Atheism
http://cross.tv/84577
.
I have found The Truth. The Truth is Bob. The
spirit of perversion is right there in your phoney religion. Your kind condones pedophiles leading the flocks of sheep.
Elohim

Chester, CT

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#37499
Aug 12, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>Like the religion of atheistic evolution.
This religion you speak of exists only in the minds of creaotards and their ilk.
HTS

Williston, ND

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#37500
Aug 12, 2012
 
Thomas Robertson wrote:
<quoted text>
So Evolutionists at one time believed human behavior was determined solely by DNA?
I've never heard that before.
Could you tell me where I could find out more about this?
Did all Evolutionists believe this, or just some Evolutionists?
There is an entire field of "evolutionary psychology" that studies, for example, animal behaviors and draws conclusions about humans based on the evolutionary assumption that all animals are genetically relatd and that man's behavior is determined solely by genetics. An example of this can be found in the research of biologist Randy Thornhill and anthropologist Craig T. Palmer. In their book A Natural History of Rape, Biological Basis of Sexual Coercion, the authors note the prevalence of forced copulation in various animal species such as ducks and geese. In their conclusions, they note,

"Rape is viewed as a natural, biological phenomenon that is a product of human evolutionary heritage."

*, Randy, and Palmer, Craig: "Why Men Rape", New York Academy of Sciences, January-February, 2000, http://iranscope.ghandchi.com/Anthology/Women...

As in rape, other forms of moral degeneration are theorized to be a result of evolution. For example, adultery is argued to be an adaptation produced by environmental “pressure” to spread one’s genes, and many evolutionary psychologists believe that men are genetically hardwired for infidelity.**

*Klein, Richard G. 2008 Out of Africa and the Evolution of Human Behavior. Evolutionary Anthropology 17:267-281.

*For a discussion of moral systems from an evolutionary perspective, see Alexander, R. D.(1987) The biology of moral systems. New York: Aldine de Gruyter.

The modern theory of evolution contends that everything in nature is explained solely materialistically... That no spiritual dimension. Therefore, man has no free will, because everything he does is the result of genetics and environment. William B. Provine, Ph.D, a renowned historian of science and professor at Cornell University, summarized the effects of evolution on man's thinking:

"Naturalistic evolution has clear consequences that Charles Darwin understood perfectly. 1) No gods worth having exist; 2) no life after death exists; 3) no ultimate foundation for ethics exists; 4) no ultimate meaning in life exists; and 5) human free will is nonexistent."

(Provine W.B., "Evolution: Free will and punishment and meaning in life." Abstract of Prof. William B. Provine's 1998 "Darwin Day address, "Darwin Day" website, University of Tennessee Knoxville TN, 1998

I'd be happy to provide you with more information if you're interested.

Since: Apr 09

Elmont, Long Island NY

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#37501
Aug 12, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>
What I meant by "intelligent design" in that context was that human intelligence (and to a lesser degree animal intelligrnce) is the only force capable of creating complexity. Therefore, it is logical to conclude that some sort of intelligence created life, which is the greatest complexity in the universe.
and who created the "intelligence" that created life?

no matter how you dice it, Intelligent Design is just creationism repackaged.

its intelligent designers all the way down

Since: Apr 09

Elmont, Long Island NY

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#37502
Aug 12, 2012
 

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HTS wrote:
<quoted text>
There is an entire field of "evolutionary psychology" that studies, for example, animal behaviors and draws conclusions about humans based on the evolutionary assumption that all animals are genetically relatd and that man's behavior is determined solely by genetics. An example of this can be found in the research of biologist Randy Thornhill and anthropologist Craig T. Palmer. In their book A Natural History of Rape, Biological Basis of Sexual Coercion, the authors note the prevalence of forced copulation in various animal species such as ducks and geese. In their conclusions, they note,
"Rape is viewed as a natural, biological phenomenon that is a product of human evolutionary heritage."
*, Randy, and Palmer, Craig: "Why Men Rape", New York Academy of Sciences, January-February, 2000, http://iranscope.ghandchi.com/Anthology/Women...
As in rape, other forms of moral degeneration are theorized to be a result of evolution. For example, adultery is argued to be an adaptation produced by environmental “pressure” to spread one’s genes, and many evolutionary psychologists believe that men are genetically hardwired for infidelity.**
*Klein, Richard G. 2008 Out of Africa and the Evolution of Human Behavior. Evolutionary Anthropology 17:267-281.
*For a discussion of moral systems from an evolutionary perspective, see Alexander, R. D.(1987) The biology of moral systems. New York: Aldine de Gruyter.
The modern theory of evolution contends that everything in nature is explained solely materialistically... That no spiritual dimension. Therefore, man has no free will, because everything he does is the result of genetics and environment. William B. Provine, Ph.D, a renowned historian of science and professor at Cornell University, summarized the effects of evolution on man's thinking:
"Naturalistic evolution has clear consequences that Charles Darwin understood perfectly. 1) No gods worth having exist; 2) no life after death exists; 3) no ultimate foundation for ethics exists; 4) no ultimate meaning in life exists; and 5) human free will is nonexistent."
(Provine W.B., "Evolution: Free will and punishment and meaning in life." Abstract of Prof. William B. Provine's 1998 "Darwin Day address, "Darwin Day" website, University of Tennessee Knoxville TN, 1998
I'd be happy to provide you with more information if you're interested.
interesting that you would take the work of two men as what all evolutionists believe.....

two men whose work is highly controversial and not generally accepted.

for starters they believe rape is committed by men for sexual reasons to procreate and keep the species alive.

From what I've read from most Psychologists and criminal experts, rape isn't so much about sex as it is about power.

Craig and Thornhill make the claim that attractive young women are often the victims of rape to support their claim, completely ignoring the fact that young women are typically not married and dating, which leads to date rape.

"Naturalistic evolution has clear consequences that Charles Darwin understood perfectly. 1) No gods worth having exist; 2) no life after death exists; 3) no ultimate foundation for ethics exists; 4) no ultimate meaning in life exists; and 5) human free will is nonexistent."
1)True
2)true
3)its up to the individual to give meaning to their lives, not some mythological skydaddy
4)false, we all have free will

Since: Apr 09

Elmont, Long Island NY

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#37503
Aug 12, 2012
 
wolverine wrote:
<quoted text>
Didn't Mean To Insult Your Liberal Slant....America " Is " The Greatest Country To Ever Be Known On Earth...I Wont Apologize For That.
While Other Countries Diddle Monkeys And Create Aids....WE Have Protected, Fed, Clothed, Built, Taught, Gave...Until We Bled.
This Did Not Come From Liberals/ Atheists...This Came From Religious Patriots...Who Understand Liberty And Freedom Does Not Mean Entitlements. It Does Not Mean Free Health Care,
The Rest Of The World Aspires To Be Like Us....Liberals Aspire To Be Like The Rest Of The World.
Exceptional-ism ?....You Bet
And Damn Proud Of It.
http://www.youtube.com/watch...

It's not the greatest country in the world," he fumes. "We're seventh in literacy, 27th in math, 22nd in science, 49th in life expectancy, 178th in infant mortality, third in median household income, No. 4 in labor force, and No. 4 in exports.... So when you ask what makes us the greatest country in the world, I don't know what the f*** you're talking about."

http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/02/us/american-exc...

In 2011, the United States spent 18% of its gross domestic product on health, much more than its allies.

Contrast those figures with Japan. The Asian country of 125 million spent just 8.5% of its GDP on healthcare in 2009, among the best figures in the developed world. Yet, despite lower costs, it's No. 3 on the list of life expectancies (behind tiny Monaco and Macau) and 220th (out of 221) in infant mortality, according to the CIA Factbook. The United States ranks 50th in life expectancy and 173rd in infant mortality.

Perhaps surprisingly for a country that prides itself on its ability to do business, the United States does not lead the world in several indices of commerce. The International Finance Corporation and the World Bank ranked 183 countries in 11 areas; the United States didn't finish first in any of them, ending up fourth behind Singapore, Hong Kong and New Zealand in ease of doing business, 20th in trade across borders, and a dismal 72nd in paying taxes.

New Zealand, in fact, ranks highly in several areas. It's No. 1 in the world for starting a business, protecting investors and incorruptibility. The World Bank list placed it No. 3 overall. On last year's Forbes list of best countries for business, it was No. 2, behind Canada. The United States was 10th.

THE FIRST STEP IN SOLVING A PROBLEM IS RECOGNIZING YOU HAVE ONE, SOMETHING PEOPLE SUFFERING FROM AMERICAN EXCEPTIONALISM CAN'T DO.

But fortunately we have liberals with open minds that haven't been indoctrinated with American exceptionalism. There is hope for America
wolverine

Greeley, CO

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#37504
Aug 12, 2012
 
Yankee Yahoo wrote:
What is sad is that people are so stuck on this issue, that science is the real victim here. It has suffered major setbacks because of this dispute.
Neither Creationists or Evolutionists have it right. What a travesty for humankind.
Hey...Its The Yankster....

How You Been ?

By The Way....This Travesty As You Call It, Is By Design.
Forces Unseen By Us Are Laughing At us Like Mice Chasing Cheese On A Spinning Wheel.

It Is our Destiny To Seek Knowledge And Miss The Truth.

Go With The Flow... Eventually, A Hand While Reach In And Stop The Wheel....LOL

Good To see You Back In The Forum.

Since: Apr 11

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#37505
Aug 12, 2012
 
RU CRS wrote:
Jesus commanded his followers to love one another, and he said he loved everyone so much that he was willing to lay his life down for whosoever would come to him and obey him. Because Jesus willfully suffered and went to the cross, he is able to give us whatever he will through grace and forgiveness that is accepted by God through his sacrifice.
You are blessed...

Since: Apr 11

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#37506
Aug 12, 2012
 
Karma is a_______ wrote:
<quoted text>
and who created the "intelligence" that created life?
no matter how you dice it, Intelligent Design is just creationism repackaged.
its intelligent designers all the way down
He is not dicing any thing but explaning the un-explanables. Evolution from non-human to human, is a fiasco...
wolverine

Greeley, CO

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#37507
Aug 12, 2012
 
Karma is a_______ wrote:
<quoted text>
http://www.youtube.com/watch...
It's not the greatest country in the world," he fumes. "We're seventh in literacy, 27th in math, 22nd in science, 49th in life expectancy, 178th in infant mortality, third in median household income, No. 4 in labor force, and No. 4 in exports.... So when you ask what makes us the greatest country in the world, I don't know what the f*** you're talking about."
http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/02/us/american-exc...
In 2011, the United States spent 18% of its gross domestic product on health, much more than its allies.
Contrast those figures with Japan. The Asian country of 125 million spent just 8.5% of its GDP on healthcare in 2009, among the best figures in the developed world. Yet, despite lower costs, it's No. 3 on the list of life expectancies (behind tiny Monaco and Macau) and 220th (out of 221) in infant mortality, according to the CIA Factbook. The United States ranks 50th in life expectancy and 173rd in infant mortality.
Perhaps surprisingly for a country that prides itself on its ability to do business, the United States does not lead the world in several indices of commerce. The International Finance Corporation and the World Bank ranked 183 countries in 11 areas; the United States didn't finish first in any of them, ending up fourth behind Singapore, Hong Kong and New Zealand in ease of doing business, 20th in trade across borders, and a dismal 72nd in paying taxes.
New Zealand, in fact, ranks highly in several areas. It's No. 1 in the world for starting a business, protecting investors and incorruptibility. The World Bank list placed it No. 3 overall. On last year's Forbes list of best countries for business, it was No. 2, behind Canada. The United States was 10th.
THE FIRST STEP IN SOLVING A PROBLEM IS RECOGNIZING YOU HAVE ONE, SOMETHING PEOPLE SUFFERING FROM AMERICAN EXCEPTIONALISM CAN'T DO.
But fortunately we have liberals with open minds that haven't been indoctrinated with American exceptionalism. There is hope for America
Boy Are You Gullible...Most Of Those Surveys Are Not Accurate And Do Not Take All Of The Factors Into Consideration.

Literacy...??? Because We Are The Only Country That Allows Unrestricted Immigration, We Have A Unnatural Amount Of Scum Coming From Mexico.

Health Care Costs.....See Above

We Pay For Illegals To Have Babies, Then Afford Them Citizenship.

If You Wanna BE Like The Rest Of The World...Go, Be Free,
I'll Buy You A One Way Ticket.

Liberals, Are The Problem....Please Take Them With You, When You Leave....The Next 8 Years , Ain't Going To Be Too Nice For You.

Since: Apr 09

Elmont, Long Island NY

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#37508
Aug 12, 2012
 
wolverine wrote:
<quoted text>
Boy Are You Gullible...Most Of Those Surveys Are Not Accurate And Do Not Take All Of The Factors Into Consideration.
Literacy...??? Because We Are The Only Country That Allows Unrestricted Immigration, We Have A Unnatural Amount Of Scum Coming From Mexico.
Health Care Costs.....See Above
We Pay For Illegals To Have Babies, Then Afford Them Citizenship.
If You Wanna BE Like The Rest Of The World...Go, Be Free,
I'll Buy You A One Way Ticket.
Liberals, Are The Problem....Please Take Them With You, When You Leave....The Next 8 Years , Ain't Going To Be Too Nice For You.
geesh blame it on illegals, yup that's the ticket.....

well except for population of illegal immigrants has actually gone down
the number of illegal immigrants coming across the border has also decreased

you can just google it to find that out

I will admit health care costs have gone up because americans without insurance use emergency rooms for health care which drives the cost up, because
preventative care would have been cheaper
they go when their ailment is more developed and serious

other countries have illegal immigrants and they provide health care to them, so sorry blaming it all on illegal immigrants just doesn't hold water

if you can't recognize the problem, it'll never get fixed.
the number

Since: Apr 12

Beijing, China

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#37509
Aug 12, 2012
 
Drew Smith wrote:
So there wouldn't have been any death if Adam and Eve hadn't sinned?
Wouldn't that have caused a serious population problem among the animals and plants?
According to Duane Gish, we were vegetarians and all other animals were vegetarians until the Fall of Man.
Yet the fossils for most carnivorous dinosaur species show proportionately larger heads and sharper teeth.

Too bad we don't have any fossils for carnivorous species before the Fall.
I would like to see what a vegetarian tyrannosaurus would look like.

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