Thousands Protest Roe V. Wade Decision

Full story: Newsday

Thousands of abortion opponents marched from the National Mall to the Supreme Court on Tuesday in their annual remembrance of the court's Roe v. Wade decision.

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Aug 11, 2012
 

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The kind of woman who needs a late-term abortion

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/a-true...

By Christy Zink, Published: July 27The Washington Post Introduce me to the woman who has an abortion after 20 weeks because she is cruel and heartless. Introduce me to the lazy gal who gets knocked up and ignores her condition until, more than halfway through her pregnancy, she ends it because it has become too darn inconvenient for her selfish lifestyle.

If such a woman exists, I have never met her. Sadly, however, she appears to have influenced the thinking of even savvy, politically informed people in this country. Otherwise, how could they argue that carrying to term is always the right decision late in pregnancy? In fact, the myth of such callous women has been compelling enough to push along a bill that would ban abortion in the District after 20 weeks of pregnancy; the bill was approved this month by the House Judiciary Committee, moving it forward for consideration by the full House, perhaps as soon as Tuesday.

Believing this fabrication of the radical right depends on oneís ability to conjure at once a perfectly unfeeling woman and a perfectly healthy child, a stand-in for the much more tragic and complex reality. Meet, instead, a real live, breathing woman who terminated a much-wanted pregnancy at almost 22 weeks, when her baby was found to have severe fetal anomalies of the brain.

My sonís condition could not have been detected earlier in the pregnancy. Far from lazy, I was conscientious about prenatal care. I received excellent medical attention from my obstetrician, one of the Districtís best. Only at our 20-week sonogram were there warning signs, and only with a high-powered MRI did we discover the devastating truth of our sonís condition. He was missing the corpus callosum, the central connecting structure of the brain, and essentially one side of his brain.

If he survived the pregnancy and birth, the doctors told us, he would have been born into a life of continuous seizures and near-constant pain. He might never have left the hospital. To help control the seizures, he would have needed surgery to remove more of what little brain matter he had. That was the reality for me and for my family.

Meet, too, the many real women I know who belong to one of the saddest groups in the world: those carrying babies for whom there was no real hope and who made the heartbreaking decision to end their pregnancies for medical reasons. Meet the women among this group who had gotten, they thought, safely to the middle of pregnancy, who had been planning nurseries and filling baby registries, only to find they would need to plan a memorial service and to build, somehow, a life in aftermath.

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#252358
Aug 11, 2012
 

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We are not reckless, ruthless creatures. Our hearts hurt each day for our losses. We mourn. We speak the names and nicknames of each otherís babies to one another; we hold each other up on the anniversaries of our losses, and we celebrate new babies and new accomplishments, all bittersweet because they arrive in the wake of grief. We extend our arms to the women who must join our community, and we lament that our numbers rise every day.

Medical research from the Guttmacher Institute shows that post-21-week terminations make up less than 2 percent of all abortions in this country. Women like me can seem an exception. You also rarely hear stories like mine, because they involve intensely private sorrow and because there is no small amount of shame still associated with terminating a pregnancy, no matter how medically necessary.

The consequences of the House bill, if it becomes law, will be inhumane. If the restrictions in this bill had been the law of the land when my husband and I received our diagnosis, I would have had to carry to term and give birth to a baby who the doctors concurred had no chance of a real life and who would have faced severe, continual pain. The decision my husband and I made to terminate the pregnancy was made out of love ó to spare my son pain and suffering.

The ugly politics in this Congress and the sheer number of Republicans mean that this bill will likely pass in the House. I understand any citizenís hesitancy when the issue of the right to middle-term to late-term abortion arises. But I also know from my own experience that this bill would have calamitous ramifications for real women and real families, and that the women it would most affect could never imagine they would need their right to abortion protected in this way.

Women and their families must be able to trust their doctors and retain their access to medical care when they most need it. To make sure that happens, members of the Senate and ordinary people across this country must see through the stereotype of the late-term aborter and see, instead, the true face of a woman who has been in this situation. I extend my hand; it is an honor to make your acquaintance.

“...sigh”

Since: Nov 09

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#252359
Aug 11, 2012
 

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marysaidyes2life wrote:
<quoted text>You take too much credit. You got the wrong poster child. Your post was also not spot on, but maybe just another spot on the carpet.
You have no class, and are too cowardly to admit you don't understand most of what you read.

I thought you might be better than this.

I was mistaken.

“docendo discimus”

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#252360
Aug 11, 2012
 

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ThomasA wrote:
<quoted text> Why exclude rape victims? That would open the door for ALL women to cry rape when the situation was just really a bad date. Writing rules for exceptions and figuring how to determine and who determines those exceptions would be impossible.
Many abortion laws and legislation do have exceptions for rape, or are shot down, like the recent one in Mississippi. Written laws are meant to deter bad behavior, not to punish the innocent because they find them self in an unusual circumstance, with no "intent" for such bad behavior. Of course some may try to take advantage of "exceptions", but we cant make a blanket law which prosecutes those with no intent to do wrong. As well, we can not shy away from policing our society because "exceptions" would be too complicated, or make laws/decisions so vague that they serve absolutely no purpose when challenged. It's like the old saying " the right answer is not always the easy answer".

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#252361
Aug 11, 2012
 

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Long Night Moon 13 wrote:
<quoted text>
A C-section is major abdominal surgery. Any major surgery comes with serious risks. I agree with your post.
There's also the issue of forcing a premature child, and all the lifetime health problems that child may have, on to a woman and her family. People like Lily are quick to judge a woman in such a situation, but are invisible when it comes to raising that child, and dealing with the effects it may have on the entire family. Obviously, a woman in that situation, of having to abort to save her life, did not choose to have to make that decision and is traumatized enough without self-righteous morons telling them they have absolutely no right to abort.

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#252362
Aug 11, 2012
 

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LiIrabbitfoofoo wrote:
<quoted text>
I forgot to comment on Elise's comments as well. I also dont agree, I've learned a LOT from people not of the same views on this topic as me - as well as learning a lot about many OTHER topiocs as well LOL!!
Yes, absolutely!

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#252363
Aug 11, 2012
 

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LiIrabbitfoofoo wrote:
<quoted text>I've learned a lot about the Catholic faith from you personally Pups, and I thank you for that. I've learned much from you off these forums as well, and I apprecaite you as a friend and as a poster. Just sayin LOL!
I totally agree with this statement!!
1 post removed

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#252365
Aug 11, 2012
 
LadiLulu wrote:
<quoted text>
"Temporary, reversible moods," such as those induced by extremely stressful situations, perhaps?
Would Susan Smith fall under that category? I wonder if, had she been able to, she would have ended any of her pregnancies because of her emotional "fragility" and the helplessness she felt under her husband's "regime." I wonder if this would have empowered her in some way, giving her the strength to say "enough is enough," enabling her to leave the situation she was in? This is purely speculative, of course. And not a terribly good example, I'm afraid. But if a woman is suffering from a legitimate panic attack or nervous breakdown, which are bot "temporary, reversible moods," are you of a mind to strap her to her bed and force her to continue the gestation? What if she's suicidal?
These are tough ethical dilemmas, BA. I feel a clinical psychiatrist could best make the determination as to the state of her mental health. There's something frightening and barbaric (IMO) about forcing a woman to gestate a pregnancy when she's experiencing a psychotic episode. I feel that the likelihood of it being "faked" is so small that the "benefits" (i.e. the humanity towards the women with true psychological issues) far outweigh the risks (i.e. the "wrongness" of allowing a woman to end a viable pregnancy for simply cosmetic reasons). I simply do not want to throw the "sick" woman under the bus because (what I feel is) a few women are shallow, simply put.
I understand what you're saying La, and again, I would agree with you that a clinical psychological evaluation should be necessary. But, I'm not sure I agree that it's so "rare", relatively speaking, again, I would refer to the reasons Gosnells patents sought to abort their viable fetus through him. And not having any restrictions out of fear that a few women would be misdiagnosed, well, isn't that throwing the compelling and important State's interest of protecting life "under the bus"? Again, I believe the answer lies some where in the middle, all human life should be considered precious to a moral society, including potentail life. Allowing a woman to abort a viable fetus for temporary "emotional health" issues, that are reversible is not moral, IMO. I'm not talking about tying down a clinically psychotic woman and forcing her to continue the pregnancy, that would be immoral as well, but our laws have to be based on definite distinctions, not vague court decisions.

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#252366
Aug 11, 2012
 
LiIrabbitfoofoo wrote:
We are not reckless, ruthless creatures. Our hearts hurt each day for our losses. We mourn. We speak the names and nicknames of each otherís babies to one another; we hold each other up on the anniversaries of our losses, and we celebrate new babies and new accomplishments, all bittersweet because they arrive in the wake of grief. We extend our arms to the women who must join our community, and we lament that our numbers rise every day.
Medical research from the Guttmacher Institute shows that post-21-week terminations make up less than 2&#8201;percent of all abortions in this country. Women like me can seem an exception. You also rarely hear stories like mine, because they involve intensely private sorrow and because there is no small amount of shame still associated with terminating a pregnancy, no matter how medically necessary.
The consequences of the House bill, if it becomes law, will be inhumane. If the restrictions in this bill had been the law of the land when my husband and I received our diagnosis, I would have had to carry to term and give birth to a baby who the doctors concurred had no chance of a real life and who would have faced severe, continual pain. The decision my husband and I made to terminate the pregnancy was made out of love ó to spare my son pain and suffering.
The ugly politics in this Congress and the sheer number of Republicans mean that this bill will likely pass in the House. I understand any citizenís hesitancy when the issue of the right to middle-term to late-term abortion arises. But I also know from my own experience that this bill would have calamitous ramifications for real women and real families, and that the women it would most affect could never imagine they would need their right to abortion protected in this way.
Women and their families must be able to trust their doctors and retain their access to medical care when they most need it. To make sure that happens, members of the Senate and ordinary people across this country must see through the stereotype of the late-term aborter and see, instead, the true face of a woman who has been in this situation. I extend my hand; it is an honor to make your acquaintance.
Good article and good points Foo. This makes strong arguments for exceptions to abortion laws. Personally, I believe that severe fetal defects should be an exception to any abortion law, just as the woman's life or health, or rape and incest should be. When it comes to the abortion issue, both sides seem to want "all or nothing". This article would suggest that no restrictions should apply becuase LTAs are rare and women with legitimate reasons would not be considered, yet many more women would/could choose to abort viable fetuses for no legitimate reason if there were no restriction. On the other hand, the PLM want restrictions on abortion at 20 weeks irregardless of the circumstances, yet this would be immoral and cruel to women in such circumstances as described in the article.
The answer is real discussion and compromise, laws with reasonable exceptions. What is wrong with this country that we can not try to understand and appreciate both sides of such a critical issue?

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#252367
Aug 11, 2012
 

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viktor wrote:
abortion is evil. Even if it is currently legal, it is evil.
You are welcome to belief that. I don't agree.

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#252368
Aug 11, 2012
 
*believe that*

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#252369
Aug 11, 2012
 

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pupsee wrote:
<quoted text>
I agree with elise, but I do see your point about learning ..
I did learn something .. that my hate filled attitude was getting me nowhere .. I also learned that the majority of the pl slant was nothing but hate ..
I learned that pc was not pro abortion as pl would have you believe ..
Nice to see you as always, Badaxe !!
Wow, I appreciate and respect you for being open-minded and open-hearted, Pups. I also have to amend my statement about Topix never being a learning venue. I guess I should be careful of making blanket statements, myself:)

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#252370
Aug 11, 2012
 

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Katie wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you believe consent to sex equals consent to pregnancy, BA?
LOL, I hear that here and I always ignore it as too stupid to answer to, but hey, I'm being nice to you now, so I will. I have known since I was 12 or so, that sex could lead to pregnancy and that I would be responsible for that child for the rest of my life. Believe it or not, I have had many chances for sex that I have turned down because of this realization. In fact, it's very hard for me to feel sorry for anyone who got pregnant, or got someone pregnant, when I think of all the fine things I have walked away from. Anyway, hunting for bear with a bow may be exhilarating, but if the bear gets you, even by accident, remember, you put yourself in that situation, and you have no one to blame but yourself, you're accountable for you own actions, even if it seemed like fun at the time.

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#252371
Aug 11, 2012
 

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Long Night Moon 13 wrote:
<quoted text>
It's not always productive here, that is for sure.
How much more school do you have to go?
Two, for my BSN.

“docendo discimus”

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#252372
Aug 11, 2012
 

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cpeter1313 wrote:
You are making assumptions here, such as saying that ONLY clinical depression is to be acknowledged when the other types can be just as severe. Emotional states are not the same as "moods"; the latter is a vague term usually delineating a change in external demeanor--it's not a clinical term. Who are you to dismiss the very real emotional problems a woman undergoes?
<quoted text>
I didn't say that ONLY clinical depression qualifies as "mental health" moron, dont twist things. I said clinical depression would be covered under R v W's definition of "mental health". "Emotional" is the vague term when used to define "mental health" becuase it does include temporary, reversible MOODS. Who are you to pass a death sentence on a viable fetus because you are incapable of appreciating the value of life over temporary, "emotional" mood swings?

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#252373
Aug 11, 2012
 
pupsee wrote:
<quoted text>
I agree with elise, but I do see your point about learning ..
I did learn something .. that my hate filled attitude was getting me nowhere .. I also learned that the majority of the pl slant was nothing but hate ..
I learned that pc was not pro abortion as pl would have you believe ..
Nice to see you as always, Badaxe !!
Elise's point was that she didn't believe people were here to learn or educate, yet you admit that you learned something from the debate here? Pupsee, I like you, and I have always stood up for you and probably always will, but you have to forget about the idiots here on the PL side that turned on you and speak your own PL mind again. Your views haven't changed, just who you consider friends has changed. A little secret, few like me because I will never sell my own opinions for the sake of being friends, and I wouldnt have it any other way. PC is about necessary choice, but some here have no consideration for the fetus at all, tell me, do you consider abortion to be 100% about the woman's choice until the cord is cut? Or do you believe that some restrictions should be imposed?

“docendo discimus”

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#252374
Aug 11, 2012
 

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OLD LADY wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm not getting this,and I'm not trying to be a smart -ass. Even if the percent,is not that high,or only a few would do this,don't you think ,only a few is too many? For goodness sake your talking about healthy viable entities.
I would agree that any life that could be saved is worth trying to save. Many on the PC side try to play down the significance of restrictions on LTA by saying how rare it is, look at any post or link from the PC side and the first thing they say is about how rare it is, relative in percentage, never the numbers. I dont think you fully understand where I am coming from on this, but I'm open to discussion, nice to meet you Old Lady.

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#252375
Aug 12, 2012
 

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elise in burque wrote:
*believe that*
Thank goodness you corrected yourself otherwise no one would have any idea about what you meant! Bwhahahahahah ;)

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#252376
Aug 12, 2012
 

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LiIrabbitfoofoo wrote:
We are not reckless, ruthless creatures. Our hearts hurt each day for our losses. We mourn. We speak the names and nicknames of each otherís babies to one another; we hold each other up on the anniversaries of our losses, and we celebrate new babies and new accomplishments, all bittersweet because they arrive in the wake of grief. We extend our arms to the women who must join our community, and we lament that our numbers rise every day.
Medical research from the Guttmacher Institute shows that post-21-week terminations make up less than 2&#8201;percent of all abortions in this country. Women like me can seem an exception. You also rarely hear stories like mine, because they involve intensely private sorrow and because there is no small amount of shame still associated with terminating a pregnancy, no matter how medically necessary.
The consequences of the House bill, if it becomes law, will be inhumane. If the restrictions in this bill had been the law of the land when my husband and I received our diagnosis, I would have had to carry to term and give birth to a baby who the doctors concurred had no chance of a real life and who would have faced severe, continual pain. The decision my husband and I made to terminate the pregnancy was made out of love ó to spare my son pain and suffering.
The ugly politics in this Congress and the sheer number of Republicans mean that this bill will likely pass in the House. I understand any citizenís hesitancy when the issue of the right to middle-term to late-term abortion arises. But I also know from my own experience that this bill would have calamitous ramifications for real women and real families, and that the women it would most affect could never imagine they would need their right to abortion protected in this way.
Women and their families must be able to trust their doctors and retain their access to medical care when they most need it. To make sure that happens, members of the Senate and ordinary people across this country must see through the stereotype of the late-term aborter and see, instead, the true face of a woman who has been in this situation. I extend my hand; it is an honor to make your acquaintance.
You know I adore you, but you gotta know, my attention span is three sentences,,, MAX. Once in a while, a post that's more than that will catch my attention,,,, this is not one of those posts! Bwhahahah

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#252377
Aug 12, 2012
 

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LiIrabbitfoofoo wrote:
We are not reckless, ruthless creatures. Our hearts hurt each day for our losses. We mourn. We speak the names and nicknames of each otherís babies to one another; we hold each other up on the anniversaries of our losses, and we celebrate new babies and new accomplishments, all bittersweet because they arrive in the wake of grief. We extend our arms to the women who must join our community, and we lament that our numbers rise every day.
Medical research from the Guttmacher Institute shows that post-21-week terminations make up less than 2&#8201;percent of all abortions in this country. Women like me can seem an exception. You also rarely hear stories like mine, because they involve intensely private sorrow and because there is no small amount of shame still associated with terminating a pregnancy, no matter how medically necessary.
The consequences of the House bill, if it becomes law, will be inhumane. If the restrictions in this bill had been the law of the land when my husband and I received our diagnosis, I would have had to carry to term and give birth to a baby who the doctors concurred had no chance of a real life and who would have faced severe, continual pain. The decision my husband and I made to terminate the pregnancy was made out of love ó to spare my son pain and suffering.
The ugly politics in this Congress and the sheer number of Republicans mean that this bill will likely pass in the House. I understand any citizenís hesitancy when the issue of the right to middle-term to late-term abortion arises. But I also know from my own experience that this bill would have calamitous ramifications for real women and real families, and that the women it would most affect could never imagine they would need their right to abortion protected in this way.
Women and their families must be able to trust their doctors and retain their access to medical care when they most need it. To make sure that happens, members of the Senate and ordinary people across this country must see through the stereotype of the late-term aborter and see, instead, the true face of a woman who has been in this situation. I extend my hand; it is an honor to make your acquaintance.
Actually,,, the beginning of this one is kinda catchy, I should give this one a go.....

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