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give me a break
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Torque wrote: <quoted text> You're saying smokers are selfish, it seems more selfish to me for someone to use government to force every single bar and restaurant to conform to their desires, and their desires only, especially when those desires are going to damage the business. Would it be a bad law to have clean air? What is it going to hurt?
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Mark
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give me a break wrote: <quoted text> Would it be a bad law to have clean air? What is it going to hurt? Once again, not the point. The point is the gov't who is not supposed to intrude on individual and their property rights is telling businesses what they can and can't do with a LEGAL item. The whole health issue is taking the emphasis off where it should be, property rights and our government becoming more and more Nazi-like all the time.
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Joined: Apr 26, 2008
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give me a break wrote: <quoted text> Would it be a bad law to have clean air? What is it going to hurt? What is it going to hurt? Well for starters there's the near 200 bars that have closed in the Twin-Cities area since a ban was rushed through. That's a 400% increase per-year in bar closings.
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jayne michigan
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i am a bar owner,who is against the smoking ban.there should be mandatory sign put up in our businesses that says this is a smoking establishment or a non smoking establishment.ITS CALLED FREEDOM OF CHOICE,THAT NO LONGER EXSISTS IN MICHIGAN. jennifer is trying to double the price of liquor and double to triple the price of liquor licence.if this keeps up it will cost all of us six dollars a beer to enjoy your self at a bar.lets have all our customers standing in front of our businesses smoking.next the goverment will say that is illeagal also.michigan will not be happy until there are is,no more businesses in business.
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fluteman greg
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jayne michigan wrote: i am a bar owner,who is against the smoking ban.there should be mandatory sign put up in our businesses that says this is a smoking establishment or a non smoking establishment.ITS CALLED FREEDOM OF CHOICE,THAT NO LONGER EXSISTS IN MICHIGAN. jennifer is trying to double the price of liquor and double to triple the price of liquor licence.if this keeps up it will cost all of us six dollars a beer to enjoy your self at a bar.lets have all our customers standing in front of our businesses smoking.next the goverment will say that is illeagal also.michigan will not be happy until there are is,no more businesses in business. Your suggestion is loaded with common sense. Antis do not care about individual rights. They are ONLY interested in making sure that society lives, behaves and believes as antis do. In the process, these antis have become nazis by diminishing the value of freedom. Freedom that our soldiers fight and die for. It's so disgusting. They are lower than the crud stuck to the bottom of my shoe. Of course you're correct. A simple sign stating this is a smoking bar would solve the issue. Anyone offended by smoke can find a non-smoking bar. They exist. I've been to them. That's why they are nazis. They refuse to accept what is common sense to the rest of society, but at the expense of robbing individual rights. And on top of that, they have NO rational reasoning for their stance. They have said that private property become public domain when it's open to the public. I shot that down by giving them a US Supreme Court decision declaring private property remains private property after it's open to the public. Their other argument is the workers health. Didn't slavery end? Workers are free to choose where they work and what type of environment they work in. These are the only two arguments and they are both shot down, yet they still are pro-ban. ALL that leaves is they spit in the face of freedom. DISGUSTING!
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Sharon
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fluteman greg wrote: <quoted text>Your suggestion is loaded with common sense. Antis do not care about individual rights. They are ONLY interested in making sure that society lives, behaves and believes as antis do. In the process, these antis have become nazis by diminishing the value of freedom. Freedom that our soldiers fight and die for. It's so disgusting. They are lower than the crud stuck to the bottom of my shoe. Of course you're correct. A simple sign stating this is a smoking bar would solve the issue. Anyone offended by smoke can find a non-smoking bar. They exist. I've been to them. That's why they are nazis. They refuse to accept what is common sense to the rest of society, but at the expense of robbing individual rights. And on top of that, they have NO rational reasoning for their stance. They have said that private property become public domain when it's open to the public. I shot that down by giving them a US Supreme Court decision declaring private property remains private property after it's open to the public. Their other argument is the workers health. Didn't slavery end? Workers are free to choose where they work and what type of environment they work in. These are the only two arguments and they are both shot down, yet they still are pro-ban. ALL that leaves is they spit in the face of freedom. DISGUSTING! I for one truly believe you are correct. Our government is trying to cotrol the masses by passing laws to control all aspects of our daily lives, and we soon won't have any rights left. Total nazism.
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give me a break
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Sharon, I'm offended that you call it nazism...Is our gov't killing anyone. If anything they are saving lives! I wouldn't call it not having freedom, as much as I would, maybe they are trying to raise all the licquor and smoking taxes, so they can come down on gas taxes. I don't see that as a bad trade off...you don't need to enjoy yourself in a bar and HAVE to pay for that $6 beer, or pack of smokes thats gonna cost $8 soon...but you can enjoy gas when it goes down to $2 again!
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Mary
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give me a break wrote: Sharon, I'm offended that you call it nazism...Is our gov't killing anyone. If anything they are saving lives! I wouldn't call it not having freedom, as much as I would, maybe they are trying to raise all the licquor and smoking taxes, so they can come down on gas taxes. I don't see that as a bad trade off...you don't need to enjoy yourself in a bar and HAVE to pay for that $6 beer, or pack of smokes thats gonna cost $8 soon...but you can enjoy gas when it goes down to $2 again! If you really think that gas prices are going to go down because of this, then you better think again! The cigarrette taxes have continually gone up with NO relief in gas prices. This is another stupid act of the Senate that will just hurt the economy in the long run. The bars and resaurants have had the option to go smoke free since they opened and some of them chose not to. I think the key word here is CHOICE. The State is trying to take away their choice to do as they want and that is a form of nazism. Our country was founded on freedom of choice and we are getting more and more of our choices taken away. We really need to look into who or whom is getting a big payoff for this bill. That is what has always been consistent in our government!It all boils down to the almighty dollar and it is not going in any of our pockets.Any time you pass a Bill that will force business's to close due to lack of business that is a BAD THING!! If you don't want to smell smoke, DON"T GO THERE!!! IT is your choice!
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fluteman greg
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give me a break wrote: Sharon, I'm offended that you call it nazism...Is our gov't killing anyone. If anything they are saving lives! I wouldn't call it not having freedom, as much as I would, maybe they are trying to raise all the licquor and smoking taxes, so they can come down on gas taxes. I don't see that as a bad trade off...you don't need to enjoy yourself in a bar and HAVE to pay for that $6 beer, or pack of smokes thats gonna cost $8 soon...but you can enjoy gas when it goes down to $2 again! Nazi did more than just kill people. They took away freedom as well, just like the antis are in favor of.
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jayne michigan
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what planet are you from?do you actually think that the gas prices will go down?the goverment is lining there pockets,and that is all they care about.next the goverment will ban the sale of cigaretts in michigan.where are they going to make up for all tax money cigaretts bring in.HOW ABOUT RAISING THE GAS PRICES ONE MORE TIME.OR MAYBE THE SALES TAX,LETS START TAXING FOOD IN OUR GROCERY STORES.they have to make it up some where.
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give me a break
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New flash Jayney! They are going to do all that anyways...so why can't I sit in a non-smoking bar til then???
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Kim
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You can sit in a non smoking bar now. Just visit one. Corner Bar in Rockford is now smokeless give me a break wrote: New flash Jayney! They are going to do all that anyways...so why can't I sit in a non-smoking bar til then???
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jayne michigan
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you can go sit in a non smoking bar,there all over.go find it and sit there,you can also find smoke free restraunts all over,go sit there.if you have a problem with smoking establishment,dont go into them.its that simple.
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Mary
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give me a break wrote: New flash Jayney! They are going to do all that anyways...so why can't I sit in a non-smoking bar til then??? Why is it that non-smokers think that they can't leave the house without running into cigarette smoke? There are more places that are smoke free than not! I think that they just have to have something to complain about!!
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Kim
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Exactly Mary wrote: <quoted text> Why is it that non-smokers think that they can't leave the house without running into cigarette smoke? There are more places that are smoke free than not! I think that they just have to have something to complain about!!
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Smoke Free
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Mary wrote: <quoted text> Why is it that non-smokers think that they can't leave the house without running into cigarette smoke? There are more places that are smoke free than not! I think that they just have to have something to complain about!! Why should I have to deal with YOUR nasty harmful habit/addiction? IT'S YOURS!!! Keep it to yourself. If my habit was picking my nose WOULD YOU mind if I fling my boogers on you? SAME THING as your nasty habit.
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Randy
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As Patrick Henry once said:
"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined."
Our force is the following, write your elected officials, if they don't listen VOTE them out of office.
Patrick also said:
“The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government - lest it come to dominate our lives and interests.”
I use to smoke and to be honest I still miss it. But smoking isn't the issue here, it is that our personal freedoms are being challenged! As others have noted, what's next?
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Kim
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Smokers are not asking that of you. All we are simply saying is that we should be able to go to place where smoking is allowed if the owner of the establishment wants to make it smoking. The other day I went into Arnies for lunch knowing that it was smoke free. Did I have a fit about it? No, I knew that I was walking into a smoke free environment. Just as you know that you may walk into a smoking environment. If you hate it that much just simply go into a NON SMOKING environment. There are plenty. Smoke Free wrote: <quoted text> Why should I have to deal with YOUR nasty harmful habit/addiction? IT'S YOURS!!! Keep it to yourself. If my habit was picking my nose WOULD YOU mind if I fling my boogers on you? SAME THING as your nasty habit.
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chickie
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Smoke Free wrote: <quoted text> Why should I have to deal with YOUR nasty harmful habit/addiction? IT'S YOURS!!! Keep it to yourself. If my habit was picking my nose WOULD YOU mind if I fling my boogers on you? SAME THING as your nasty habit. thank you fellow non!!!
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Randy
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Smoke Free wrote: <quoted text> Why should I have to deal with YOUR nasty harmful habit/addiction? IT'S YOURS!!! Keep it to yourself. If my habit was picking my nose WOULD YOU mind if I fling my boogers on you? SAME THING as your nasty habit. I for one support your right to pick your nose! From the book "Green Specks on the Wall" by Pickem' and Flickem' and I quote "If a piece of snot happens to get away from you, well sometimes that is the price of freedom."
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