Rev. Jeremiah Wright Gets LGBT Support

Oh get off the cross already. You aren't a slave, you never were a slave, nobody you know has been a slave here in the USA, and nobody you're related to is a slave here in the USA. You can stop beating that horse now, because no white man in the USA today is or has been a slave owner.

That you EXCUSE the bigotry of Jeremiah Wright tells me everything I need to know about YOU. As long as they continue to whine and bitch and moan about everybody else keeping "the black man" down (when it's their own damn laziness and sense of entitlement keeping them down, not anybody else), they'll always be down. Jeremiah Wright seems to have been able to be successful in spite of being black. Obama seems to have been able to be successful in spite of being black. The CEOs of several Fortune 500 companies seem to have been able to be successful in spite of being black. The Mayors and Congressmen and doctors, lawyers, business owners, etc. numbering in the millions around the country seem to have been able to be successful in spite of being black. So again, who is holding them down? THEY ARE!

The only bigotry on display is coming from YOU and Jeremiah Wright and those like him. My black boyfriend and his friends have said the same thing as me. BTW, he's successful, too.

BTW, I voted for Obama in the primary and I regret it now. Just as you get everything else wrong, you got your little judgment of me wrong, too.

I think that when you put the word "African" in front of American, then you are setting yourself up for unequality. Why not just drop that from your vocabulary for starters, and just accept the fact that you are American. You have never been to Africa, and probably have no desire to return,(despite alot of peoles wishes for you to return) which is stupid,the same as I don't wish to go to Europe even to visit. I don't know anybody there. As for the statements made by Jeremiah Wright, he has the right to say whatever he likes as a freedom of speech. BUT I have the right to be offended by hese statements, and use what he says to make up my mind that he IS racist, prejudiced, and bigoted. That is his right to be that way. And if Barack Obama plays along with his way if thinking, then I have every right to judge him as well,even if only by association. But the fact that he is from this church's congregation, supports this church and Rev Wrights views, then that says ALOT about HIS character. No, I don't agree with ALL the views of my preacher, or church, but they welcome ALL and would not make statments like this, lest they loose members, and financial gain. I left a church years ago because they denounced Catholics. I felt they (as a Church) had NO right to put down ANY religion. So for the Obamas to continue to stay in this church after knowing what is in Rev Wrights heart is either wrong, or that they agree with him.

Beware wrote:

<quoted text>
Thank you for your clarification...it's blatant hypocracy.

Jumping on your soapbox declaring that you never owned slaves doesn't give you the right to dismiss me as being a racist hypocrite. Nor does it erase the bloody history of this country nor the effects of that history that live on today.

Jumping on the bandwagon of self righteousness over a soundbite is easy. Looking deeper into the big picture on why some people feel the way they do is a bit more difficult. Talking about those things and doing what you can to mend fences is even more difficult.

You were so quick to jump up and shout that you didn't own any slaves. Did your great grandparents or their parents own slaves? Did they prosper from that free labor and pass some of their estate down? Did you ever ask me what type of history my family had that would make me feel disillusioned, disenfranchised, disgusted? Have you ever picked up a Black publication like Ebony, Jet, Black Enterprise to see where people like me might be coming from, to learn a little more about me and where I (and my family - past and present) fit into the history of this United States?

Let me remind you, slavery wasn't that long ago. My great grandmother was the descendant of a slave. My great grandfather was the descendant of a slave owner. My grandfather (who lived until I was 23) was conceived in the late 1800’s as the result of a my great grandmother being raped while share cropping on the Louisiana plantation my great grandfather’s family owned. He was never prosecuted. The product of that rape, my grandfather, worked on that plantation. My father and his siblings worked picking cotton on that same plantation. The overseers (if that’s what they were still calling them) taunted my father and his siblings saying, "Ha ha ha! That looks like our cousins." They were cousins by blood although my dad and his siblings were never acknowledged or treated as family. Nor do I or any of my generation have any personal knowledge or relationship with them. Maybe they don’t want to acknowledge the crimes some of them committed that resulted in the openly hidden side of the family. Maybe they’re more afraid that we’d be owed part of the family’s inheritance by acknowledging the common blood that runs through our veins. Maybe they're terrified that Black people are still pissed and would turn around and treat them the same way their predacessors treated my predacessors.

Whatever the case may be, nothing is ever going to change as far as race relations in this country until somebody has the courage to step off their little self righteous soap boxes and acknowledge the truth about it all. It may hurt ... but a wound left unchecked will never heal and will only fester.

Patel wrote:

<quoted text> You want to be equal stop thinking like childern and stop killing each other.
I came here with 1 change of clothing. I am now a business owner. I work everyday.I don't dress like a clown and drink 40oz. I can speak the language..I give respect and I get respect
I tink you people have mental limits.

I'm happy for you. I work every day, too, and so does my family. Your statement, "I TINK you people have mental limits," speaks volumes about your mental and emotional capacity. I don't dress like a clown nor do I drink 40's. I know how to speak the language very well AND I know how to spell THINK.

fuzi wrote:

Oh get off the cross already. You aren't a slave, you never were a slave, nobody you know has been a slave here in the USA, and nobody you're related to is a slave here in the USA. You can stop beating that horse now, because no white man in the USA today is or has been a slave owner.
That you EXCUSE the bigotry of Jeremiah Wright tells me everything I need to know about YOU. As long as they continue to whine and bitch and moan about everybody else keeping "the black man" down (when it's their own damn laziness and sense of entitlement keeping them down, not anybody else), they'll always be down. Jeremiah Wright seems to have been able to be successful in spite of being black. Obama seems to have been able to be successful in spite of being black. The CEOs of several Fortune 500 companies seem to have been able to be successful in spite of being black. The Mayors and Congressmen and doctors, lawyers, business owners, etc. numbering in the millions around the country seem to have been able to be successful in spite of being black. So again, who is holding them down? THEY ARE!
The only bigotry on display is coming from YOU and Jeremiah Wright and those like him. My black boyfriend and his friends have said the same thing as me. BTW, he's successful, too.
BTW, I voted for Obama in the primary and I regret it now. Just as you get everything else wrong, you got your little judgment of me wrong, too.

And you have the nerve to call someone else a bigot. Look at all of the racist stereotypes you spewed. PS ... Just because you voted for Obama doesn't mean you are suddenly absolved of all of your bigotry. I never said anything about the white man holding the black man down. I simply stated that the history of this country is not what people want to believe. By stating that this country's past is at the root of some of it's problems today, I am suddenly a bigot and a racist. If you would stop and listen for a moment without becoming so defensive, maybe you could learn something. If people would just listen and try to understand something about somebody that isn't a cookie cutter version of themselves ... maybe we could erase racism, sexism, and gender identity biases. Just looking at some of the responses I've gotten it's obvious that some people just won't get it no matter how it's presented.

disgusted wrote:

<quoted text>
And you have the nerve to call someone else a bigot. Look at all of the racist stereotypes you spewed. PS ... Just because you voted for Obama doesn't mean you are suddenly absolved of all of your bigotry. I never said anything about the white man holding the black man down. I simply stated that the history of this country is not what people want to believe. By stating that this country's past is at the root of some of it's problems today, I am suddenly a bigot and a racist. If you would stop and listen for a moment without becoming so defensive, maybe you could learn something. If people would just listen and try to understand something about somebody that isn't a cookie cutter version of themselves ... maybe we could erase racism, sexism, and gender identity biases. Just looking at some of the responses I've gotten it's obvious that some people just won't get it no matter how it's presented.

Disgusted, I agree that one of our problems is that we do not stop and listen. I would also like to add that for some reason we do not ask questions. It is as if we are afraid of the answers. I think this applies not only to racial differences but also to faith issues, cultural, sexual orientation and physical differences.

I have always tried to look at people as just that - people. After listening to Obama's speech I realized that I had a lot more work to do - understanding why the African American community feels the way that they do about white America.

I have always felt comfortable asking questions of my black friends and have asked many but I have never been asked by them why whites feel the way that they do. I feel that if we are to solve our differences that it has to be a two way conversation.

However, it is not just a black and white issue. If we do not include Hispanic, Muslim and any other groups of people we will never live in a society that first sees the person and then the color of the skin.

I am amused when I hear people refer to Obama as a black man when he is just as much a white man. I think that if we all traced our family history we would find out that we are all a part of each other.

As far as my ancestors owning slaves, I do not know the answer to that. I have my doubts though. We seem to have been fairly poor as far back as I have been able to trace. No family inheritance here.

Thank you for your thought provoking posts.

disgusted wrote:

<quoted text>
And you have the nerve to call someone else a bigot. Look at all of the racist stereotypes you spewed. PS ... Just because you voted for Obama doesn't mean you are suddenly absolved of all of your bigotry. I never said anything about the white man holding the black man down. I simply stated that the history of this country is not what people want to believe. By stating that this country's past is at the root of some of it's problems today, I am suddenly a bigot and a racist. If you would stop and listen for a moment without becoming so defensive, maybe you could learn something. If people would just listen and try to understand something about somebody that isn't a cookie cutter version of themselves ... maybe we could erase racism, sexism, and gender identity biases. Just looking at some of the responses I've gotten it's obvious that some people just won't get it no matter how it's presented.

History is history, the past is past. You and every black person in America has the power already to make your life better, you have the exact same opportunities as any other person regardless of color. But you want to wallow in the past and expect a handout, you want some special treatment, you feel you are entitled to something because of what happened to your ancestors over a century ago. Get over it already. There are way too many examples of successful black people who have made a successful life in the USA for your argument to be valid. If they can do it, why can't you? The problem is not white America, the problem is the culture of Black America that seeks to keep you in the ghetto and hold you back. It is your own culture that is harming you, not "the white man". Sadly, you can't seem to realize that, and thus you will remain bitter and feeling you're entitled.
But that is your choice.

disgusted wrote:

<quoted text>
Jumping on your soapbox declaring that you never owned slaves doesn't give you the right to dismiss me as being a racist hypocrite. Nor does it erase the bloody history of this country nor the effects of that history that live on today.
Jumping on the bandwagon of self righteousness over a soundbite is easy. Looking deeper into the big picture on why some people feel the way they do is a bit more difficult. Talking about those things and doing what you can to mend fences is even more difficult.
You were so quick to jump up and shout that you didn't own any slaves. Did your great grandparents or their parents own slaves? Did they prosper from that free labor and pass some of their estate down? Did you ever ask me what type of history my family had that would make me feel disillusioned, disenfranchised, disgusted? Have you ever picked up a Black publication like Ebony, Jet, Black Enterprise to see where people like me might be coming from, to learn a little more about me and where I (and my family - past and present) fit into the history of this United States?... but a wound left unchecked will never heal and will only fester.

I don't know what f^&king planet you fell to earth from however:
My relatives came here as Indentured Servants (lokk it up poindexter). We worked for our freedom and never looked back when we obtained it. We pledged ALLEGIANCE to this new nation and ASSIMILATED. I have yet to see assimilation of many cultures within our nation...including Chinese (Chinatown), Blacks, Hispanics ad nauseum.
If you want to sell your horssh&t...the best place is at the foot of the U.N building...where we seem to cede to every 3rd world sh*t hole nation, the liberties we have fought hard to secure and protect.
No...I dindn't own any slaves...nor did ANY of my ancestors...we worked beside them...in sevitude as well. Get off your stump...and preach to those that have (and had) the chance to assimilate to ASSIMILATE! It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out where priorities lay within ethno-centric groups.
When blacks and hispanics have a horrid rate of high school drop-out rates...the educational system comes up with "dumbing down" our educational programs so no child is left behind. What needs to happen is:
1. No Federal, State, or local aid...unless you are a High School graduate.
2. If you have kids, and you're underage, your parents are responsible for you and any other puppy you want to pop out.
3. If you're an illegal alien...you're repatriated and your puppies are registered as legal citizens of the country of repatriation.
4. If you don't want to assimilate...then emmigrate to a country that wants you. II guarantee that they'll require amarketable skill before they let you enter their country though).
It's time to take RESPONSIBILITY for actions (or inactions) of those that do not want to assimilate. The TOOLS are THERE! Quit bitching and use your God- given talents and brains to do what is right!

fuzi wrote:

<quoted text>History is history, the past is past. You and every black person in America has the power already to make your life better, you have the exact same opportunities as any other person regardless of color. But you want to wallow in the past and expect a handout, you want some special treatment, you feel you are entitled to something because of what happened to your ancestors over a century ago. Get over it already. There are way too many examples of successful black people who have made a successful life in the USA for your argument to be valid. If they can do it, why can't you? The problem is not white America, the problem is the culture of Black America that seeks to keep you in the ghetto and hold you back. It is your own culture that is harming you, not "the white man". Sadly, you can't seem to realize that, and thus you will remain bitter and feeling you're entitled.
But that is your choice.

Who said I was looking for a hand out and who said I didn't make it? You are still making assumptions about me and you know nothing about me. I'm just asking you to step out of your neat little box for a moment and try to understand someone else point of view. You need to get over yourself. You are part of the problem that racism persists. You are the one that sounds bitter. For the record ... I have a very good career ... I own my own home ... I have a new car that I paid for ... I have one child graduating from college this semester ... one that is attending a private university - and no, she isn't going on grants. It's being paid for by her black family ... my youngest is in her freshman year of high school and she has the top spot in the orchestra playing both violin and cello. I am done responding to you because you seem to be intent on wallowing in your own ignorance. May you receive all of the love, understanding, and compassion that you give to other people when you need it most. Blessing or curse ... that depends upon you.

Beware wrote:

<quoted text>
I don't know what f^&king planet you fell to earth from however:
My relatives came here as Indentured Servants (lokk it up poindexter). We worked for our freedom and never looked back when we obtained it. We pledged ALLEGIANCE to this new nation and ASSIMILATED. I have yet to see assimilation of many cultures within our nation...including Chinese (Chinatown), Blacks, Hispanics ad nauseum.
If you want to sell your horssh&t...the best place is at the foot of the U.N building...where we seem to cede to every 3rd world sh*t hole nation, the liberties we have fought hard to secure and protect.
No...I dindn't own any slaves...nor did ANY of my ancestors...we worked beside them...in sevitude as well. Get off your stump...and preach to those that have (and had) the chance to assimilate to ASSIMILATE! It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out where priorities lay within ethno-centric groups.
When blacks and hispanics have a horrid rate of high school drop-out rates...the educational system comes up with "dumbing down" our educational programs so no child is left behind. What needs to happen is:
1. No Federal, State, or local aid...unless you are a High School graduate.
2. If you have kids, and you're underage, your parents are responsible for you and any other puppy you want to pop out.
3. If you're an illegal alien...you're repatriated and your puppies are registered as legal citizens of the country of repatriation.
4. If you don't want to assimilate...then emmigrate to a country that wants you. II guarantee that they'll require amarketable skill before they let you enter their country though).
It's time to take RESPONSIBILITY for actions (or inactions) of those that do not want to assimilate. The TOOLS are THERE! Quit bitching and use your God- given talents and brains to do what is right!

You are an idiot ... and I couldn't show anybody better than you have done yourself.

OkieDarren wrote:

Pops Racer--"So Rev. Wright is a Black Racist and is anti-American but tolerant of homosexuals?"
I absolutely deny he's a "racist," and anti-American is pretty darn hard to swallow, too.
"Big deal. Even a broken clock is right twice a day!
Barack Obama still should have MUCH MORE forcefully separated himself from this guy."
Horsecrap. Obama has expressed his views on the issues, end of story. Wright's not running for office and HIS views on issues are not relevent. It's sleazy as all hell to continue trying to make this an issue, and it shows how racist our nation still is that people don't get the different ways we approach church and faith in this country and have such outrage at people who have different ways of doing so.
"I agree with "Beware." What if a White politician had been a long time buddy of David Duke or went to one of those White Racist "Christian Identity" Churches? Everyone would (rightly) be all over him for that."
That comparison is too stupid to be BELIEVED! You cannot POSSIBLY think that a person who is outraged WITH VERY GOOD REASON at the racism of this nation and said some outrageous things in anger is comparable to white people who think blacks are a lesser race of people or that gays should be stoned to death. That's assinine.
"But just because it's Black Racists that Obama is a fellow traveler with, my fellow liberals treat it like it's OK?"
The comparison is ridiculous, invalid, and DEFINATELY calls your liberal claim into question.
"Well, I bet I'm one of the most liberal people out here in Lake County Illinois, and it's definitely NOT OK with me."
May I suggest if you're really liberal you GET OVER THIS NON-ISSUE which has been drummed up by racists who know white America cannot STAND seeing a black person this close to being president.
By the way I say all this as a Hillary Clinton supporter. If folks want to take shots at Obama on the issues and on his record, swell, but these vicious attacks against his MINISTER are gutter politics at their worst. And while I disagree with a lot of what Rev. Wright had to say there are ministers on the right who say far more offensive and dangerous and hateful and ugly things every day and are absolutely worshiped as great Americans. When I hear politicians getting blasted in this fashion for hanging around bigots like James Dobson, THEN we can discuss Wright.

Thank you, thank you, thank you! FINALLY!!! Someone gets it!

Junker wrote:

<quoted text>
Disgusted, I agree that one of our problems is that we do not stop and listen. I would also like to add that for some reason we do not ask questions. It is as if we are afraid of the answers. I think this applies not only to racial differences but also to faith issues, cultural, sexual orientation and physical differences.
I have always tried to look at people as just that - people. After listening to Obama's speech I realized that I had a lot more work to do - understanding why the African American community feels the way that they do about white America.
I have always felt comfortable asking questions of my black friends and have asked many but I have never been asked by them why whites feel the way that they do. I feel that if we are to solve our differences that it has to be a two way conversation.
However, it is not just a black and white issue. If we do not include Hispanic, Muslim and any other groups of people we will never live in a society that first sees the person and then the color of the skin.
I am amused when I hear people refer to Obama as a black man when he is just as much a white man. I think that if we all traced our family history we would find out that we are all a part of each other.
As far as my ancestors owning slaves, I do not know the answer to that. I have my doubts though. We seem to have been fairly poor as far back as I have been able to trace. No family inheritance here.
Thank you for your thought provoking posts.

I would also like to thank you for your response. I am shocked and saddened that people in this forum would be so closed minded and rigid knowing the struggles and discrimination that we as GLBT people face every day. I don't pretend to have all of the answers ... but I think that if people would just talk, listen, and treat people the way they'd want to be treated would be a good start. Thank you again. Your honesty and openness are greatly appreciated.

disgusted wrote:

<quoted text>
Who said I was looking for a hand out and who said I didn't make it? You are still making assumptions about me and you know nothing about me. I'm just asking you to step out of your neat little box for a moment and try to understand someone else point of view. You need to get over yourself. You are part of the problem that racism persists. You are the one that sounds bitter. For the record ... I have a very good career ... I own my own home ... I have a new car that I paid for ... I have one child graduating from college this semester ... one that is attending a private university - and no, she isn't going on grants. It's being paid for by her black family ... my youngest is in her freshman year of high school and she has the top spot in the orchestra playing both violin and cello. I am done responding to you because you seem to be intent on wallowing in your own ignorance. May you receive all of the love, understanding, and compassion that you give to other people when you need it most. Blessing or curse ... that depends upon you.

You still don't get it, then. If you're successful, how? If you and your children are able to "make it", how? With all the supposed "keeping you down" perpetrated by "the man", how have you been able to succeed? I would wager that you did what everyone else who succeeds does: you worked for it. Amazing, huh? You took advantage of the opportunities that we all have and made a go of it. There is absolutely no reason why everyone else can't do the same, regardless of their color. We all have some issue, be it color or sexual orientation or physical stature or a myriad of other qualities, that might be a hindrance to our success. But we learn to overcome them if we want to succeed, and the ability to overcome them exists FOR EVERYONE.

Bitching and moaning about something you're "entitled" and blaming your failures on ancient history is patently absurd.

fuzi wrote:

<quoted text>You still don't get it, then. If you're successful, how? If you and your children are able to "make it", how? With all the supposed "keeping you down" perpetrated by "the man", how have you been able to succeed? I would wager that you did what everyone else who succeeds does: you worked for it. Amazing, huh? You took advantage of the opportunities that we all have and made a go of it. There is absolutely no reason why everyone else can't do the same, regardless of their color. We all have some issue, be it color or sexual orientation or physical stature or a myriad of other qualities, that might be a hindrance to our success. But we learn to overcome them if we want to succeed, and the ability to overcome them exists FOR EVERYONE.
Bitching and moaning about something you're "entitled" and blaming your failures on ancient history is patently absurd.

You are the one that still doesn't get it. I did overcome a lot of obstacles ... but I have also had to fight harder for it than some people have. I was originally passed over for the position I currently hold, although I was the only one with experience in that particular position. None of the four people that were initially hired were Black. I wasn't offered a position until one of them couldn't cut the mustard. Since I've been there, I have trained the majority of the people that have come aboard after me.

I have also applied for other positions within the "entity" I am affiliated with. Each time, I have been turned down - sometimes not even being offered an interview. Again, I worked in that same position in a bigger "entity" that happens to be 4 times the size of this one. I handled much bigger accounts and more money in one day than this one deals with in a week. When they administered the test, I got the highest test score ... they no longer administer a test.

Now, lets go back a few years. In the early 70's I was among one of the first classes to participate in voluntary integration in the city I grew up in. Many of those white children had never seen a black person "in person." We had to have a police escort following our bus the first year because of all the threats and people following our bus throwing things at us. There were times that we had to be locked down in our classrooms because KKK would come drop their literature all over the front of the school. I can't tell you how many times I was walking through the hallways and a group of boys would block the path and call me N****R. I had one kid grab a handful of my hair and yank with all his might because he thought I had on a wig. It never dawned on him that some black people have long hair, too.

I was in honors classes for science, English, math, Spanish (I graduated a year early because there were no more classes to offer me) and I tutored during lunch. The white kids never came back. So don't tell me that I or any black person in this country doesn't have the right to have some issue about this country and how we've been treated. I'll say it again ... people like you are the reason that racism persists. People like you that spew out a bunch of hateful stereotypes and assume you know all about us. You totally dismiss our experiences, many of which are still happening.

And before you make any assumptions about where I grew up ... It was California.

disgusted wrote:

<quoted text>
You are the one that still doesn't get it. I did overcome a lot of obstacles ... but I have also had to fight harder for it than some people have. I was originally passed over for the position I currently hold, although I was the only one with experience in that particular position. None of the four people that were initially hired were Black. I wasn't offered a position until one of them couldn't cut the mustard. Since I've been there, I have trained the majority of the people that have come aboard after me.
I have also applied for other positions within the "entity" I am affiliated with. Each time, I have been turned down - sometimes not even being offered an interview. Again, I worked in that same position in a bigger "entity" that happens to be 4 times the size of this one. I handled much bigger accounts and more money in one day than this one deals with in a week. When they administered the test, I got the highest test score ... they no longer administer a test.
Now, lets go back a few years. In the early 70's I was among one of the first classes to participate in voluntary integration in the city I grew up in. Many of those white children had never seen a black person "in person." We had to have a police escort following our bus the first year because of all the threats and people following our bus throwing things at us. There were times that we had to be locked down in our classrooms because KKK would come drop their literature all over the front of the school. I can't tell you how many times I was walking through the hallways and a group of boys would block the path and call me N****R. I had one kid grab a handful of my hair and yank with all his might because he thought I had on a wig. It never dawned on him that some black people have long hair, too.
I was in honors classes for science, English, math, Spanish (I graduated a year early because there were no more classes to offer me) and I tutored during lunch. The white kids never came back. So don't tell me that I or any black person in this country doesn't have the right to have some issue about this country and how we've been treated. I'll say it again ... people like you are the reason that racism persists. People like you that spew out a bunch of hateful stereotypes and assume you know all about us. You totally dismiss our experiences, many of which are still happening.
And before you make any assumptions about where I grew up ... It was California.

Oh you poor poor thing, you had to face some obstacles on your path to success. How unfortunate. EVERYBODY faces obstacles of some kind. That's what you don't seem to understand. You want some special treatment because your ancestors were slaves... boo hoo. Where's MY affirmative action, I'm sure I was denied a promotion because I'm gay, do I get redress? No, I just work harder and earn it the old fashioned way. Just like my sister does to overcome the sexist "glass ceiling". Why should you get special treatment just because you're black?

All of your experiences are in the past, I'll say it again: the only thing holding any one back TODAY is of their own making. If anyone wants to succeed, they can. Crying "racism" like the boy crying wolf only makes genuine cases of true racism seem less important.

Stop being part of the problem and use your success to be part of the solution. It isn't racism that has over 50% of black males under 30 years old in trouble with the law, it is black culture and attitudes like yours that does it. It isn't white people forcing young black women to have so many children without a father in the home, it is black culture and attitudes like yours. If you want to solve the problems in the black community, stop blaming those who have nothing to do with it.

fuzi wrote:

<quoted text>Oh you poor poor thing, you had to face some obstacles on your path to success. How unfortunate. EVERYBODY faces obstacles of some kind. That's what you don't seem to understand. You want some special treatment because your ancestors were slaves... boo hoo. Where's MY affirmative action, I'm sure I was denied a promotion because I'm gay, do I get redress? No, I just work harder and earn it the old fashioned way. Just like my sister does to overcome the sexist "glass ceiling". Why should you get special treatment just because you're black?
All of your experiences are in the past, I'll say it again: the only thing holding any one back TODAY is of their own making. If anyone wants to succeed, they can. Crying "racism" like the boy crying wolf only makes genuine cases of true racism seem less important.
Stop being part of the problem and use your success to be part of the solution. It isn't racism that has over 50% of black males under 30 years old in trouble with the law, it is black culture and attitudes like yours that does it. It isn't white people forcing young black women to have so many children without a father in the home, it is black culture and attitudes like yours. If you want to solve the problems in the black community, stop blaming those who have nothing to do with it.

It's obvious that you don't want to get what I'm saying because you are determined to bury your head in the sand and pretend that what I'm saying isn't true. It's attitudes like yours and people just like you that feed into the stereotypes that are splashed across the media every day. When you have someone that doesn't fit the little mold that you'd like to place all of the black community in, then you start pretend that your biased little opinion is based upon fact. Talking to you is like talking to a brick wall. One day you'll realize what I'm talking about because history repeats itself when people don't learn the lessons. Next time, you might be on the receiving end ... but who's going to be fighting for you?

Fuzi, as a white person, I am ashamed by your insistent ignorance. It seems disgusted has several times attempted to tell you she has busted her butt to get where she is and has not taken any of these "handouts" you are talking about, yet you ignore that and continue ranting as if she is some poor black person who doesn't understand anything but cotton picking. Open your eyes dude! I teach in a horrible section of Baltimore. The median family income is 17,000 (thats for a family of 4.) Yes, there certainly is a lot the community is not doing to help themselves, but there are many more people that have no idea HOW to help themselves. I am a fond believer in the saying "give a man a fish, feed him for a day, teach a man to fish, feed him for life," yet I do not see enough people doing the teaching. It is good and dandy for you to sit there flapping your lips about an issue you think you understand, but until you are willing to go spend your time trying to make a difference, not just for the black community, you need to sit down and shut up. If we do not take steps to educate our children (and believe me, there are SAVAGE inequalities in the city schools verses county schools) we will continue to perpetuate the cycle of poverty and violence these kids are growing up in and no change will happen. "Handouts" do nothing for these kids. They need people who care about them. Fuzi, you have made it clear that you don't. Disgusted, I'm on your side :)

BmoreTeacher wrote:

Fuzi, as a white person, I am ashamed by your insistent ignorance. It seems disgusted has several times attempted to tell you she has busted her butt to get where she is and has not taken any of these "handouts" you are talking about, yet you ignore that and continue ranting as if she is some poor black person who doesn't understand anything but cotton picking. Open your eyes dude! I teach in a horrible section of Baltimore. The median family income is 17,000 (thats for a family of 4.) Yes, there certainly is a lot the community is not doing to help themselves, but there are many more people that have no idea HOW to help themselves. I am a fond believer in the saying "give a man a fish, feed him for a day, teach a man to fish, feed him for life," yet I do not see enough people doing the teaching. It is good and dandy for you to sit there flapping your lips about an issue you think you understand, but until you are willing to go spend your time trying to make a difference, not just for the black community, you need to sit down and shut up. If we do not take steps to educate our children (and believe me, there are SAVAGE inequalities in the city schools verses county schools) we will continue to perpetuate the cycle of poverty and violence these kids are growing up in and no change will happen. "Handouts" do nothing for these kids. They need people who care about them. Fuzi, you have made it clear that you don't. Disgusted, I'm on your side :)

If you are an example of the quality of teachers in that community, no wonder there are still such problems. Is "following context" a foreign idea, perhaps? I've not made any reference to "disgusted" taking handouts, I've made only general references about those who do.

The problems you mention in the community in which you teach remain problems because the culture of those people perpetuates it. No amount of help or money thrown at that community is going to change anything until the people decide to help themselves. They already have the power to do that without any extra help, but they sit back waiting for that magic handout that is going to whisk them off to "the good life". Unfortunately, that never comes and generation after generation continues the cycle they bring upon themselves.

Part of the problem is the political-correct mentality of people like you who are afraid of being called "racist" (even though it isn't racist to speak the truth) or insensitive. What is insensitive is to sit around and coddling people who choose to do nothing to help themselves. No amount of money thrown at them is going to change that until THEY decide they want a change from the status quo.

You have no idea what and who I care about nor my extensive history in communities as bad as and worse than those you describe. You make baseless accusations because your ideology of appeasement is threatened. Maybe if we had better teachers who weren't so entrenched in the status quo, there would be more progress and incentive for people to lift themselves up? People like "digusted" prove that there is nothing holding anyone back if they want something bad enough. We all have obstacles of some time to overcome, and some of us manage to do that. But, we didn't do it by sitting back wringing our hands and expecting someone else to do all the work for us.

disgusted wrote:

<quoted text>
Next time, you might be on the receiving end ... but who's going to be fighting for you?

As always, I fight for me, I don't sit around and wait for someone else. My culture isn't holding me back by accepting the status quo.

As I have read these posts I have been amazed that neither side has really listened to the other. I firmly believe that until we are willing to put aside our preconceived ideas we will never hear what the other person is saying. As a result we will never educate ourselves on what the racial problems are in our society. Thus we will never begin to solve them.

When my son told me he was gay I realized that I truly knew nothing about the GLBT community. I wanted to support him but I didn't even know were to begin. I knew that this community had experienced discrimination but I didn't know how or why. So I began a journey of trying to educate myself. I had never condemned the GLBT community but I had also never went out of my way to try to understand their lives - not until I had to deal with it in my own life. I am sorry that I waited until now to learn about the lives of a community that is a part of the society that I live in.

There are always truths to both sides of an issue. There are always reasons as to why we feel as we do based on our own personal experiences. Until we are ready to put all of this aside we will never begin to understand each other. It does not mean that anyone has to change their beliefs it just means that we have to accept that others feel differently.

Only until we all stop pointing fingers and accept that there is work to do on both sides of the fence will we be able to have meaningful conversations. We all must be willing to lay it all on the table. We all must be willing to respect others opinions.

Again, I will say that I have read valid arguements on both sides of this debate. What I haven't read is either side acknowledging that there might be some truth in what the other person is saying.