Bill would ban horse slaughter

Humane, legal, and needed? Please tell me how slamming a captive bolt (which usually is too short to reach a horse's brain to render him painless) into a horse's forehead (repeatedly) is humane?

I believe the lawmakers need to get off their ass and do something to earn their paychecks, why not let it be helping nature's beauty? Tell me, what do they have to do that is so pressing or important? This country is screwed, and they aren't helping one bit. It wouldn't hurt for them to help with matters that affect the people that live here and would like to see changes made.

People that don't have the knowledge, money, or compassion to properly care for an animal, should not have one in the first place.

A horse (in these days) is considered a companion by most. So, why do many people agree with closing down puppymills, yet could care less about a horse's fate?

Hmmm, unmwanted horses fate.... Well, if human didn't need so many damn places to shop til they drop, there would be land left for horse preservations, in which, breeding could easily be controlled.

Horses are considered companions by most? Oh, you're not living in the Horse Capital of the World. That figures...leave it to someone who has no clue! Equine businesses add up to a multimillion dollar a year industry. Most of those businesses are not supported by the "companion" viewpoint.

And you know, I'm sick and tired of hearing how "inhumane" slaughter is. FACT is, it's more INHUMANE to allow an animal to starve to death. Or go without medical treatment for common illnesses that, left untreated, turn into life threatening illnesses.

I see you're from Lyndell, PA. Would that be Chester county? I doubt you have any REAL idea what it's like in the South. Trust me, it's a far cry different than Eastern PA. You have good things like decent animal shelters and animal control officers who actually do their jobs, instead of putting a bullet into a dog's head because they didn't feel like taking it somewhere.(And that's IF they show up.) I had an issue with the neighbor's dog, so I called our "animal control officer" and was told, "you might as well just shot the dog and save me to trip out there to do it". Horses get even less attention.

Horses are NOT considered companions here in KY by the majority. And it's like that on the big ranches out west, and in most of the country. Ask anyone running a business related to horses if they want horses status changed to that of a companion animal. They'll tell you no. Why? There goes their tax deductions. No tax deductions mean more money is spent per year on those horses. More money spent means less people can afford to won their horses. They are LIVESTOCK. Deal with it.

But hey, let's push to get the bill passed so there is no more slaughter. Then we'll hear nothing but crickets chirping as we're left to deal with 90,000 plus horses each and every year that will have NO WHERE to go. You think the government is going to do anything then? Nope. And most people, who don't even know anything more than "slaughter is bad", won't be aware of the real suffering that will continue to grow each year.

Yeah, ending slaughter is the answer...

But you know what? The horses will STILL be slaughtered. JUST NOT FOR HUMAN CONSUMPTION. Most of you who are against slaughter seem to forget that. AND, the horses will still be transported across our borders to slaughterhouses that are even LESS humane (if you can imagine) than what we have here.(It's already happening because the slaughterhouses here have more horses on hand than demand for meat. In other words, they're FULL.) Once thebill is passed, I'm sure all of you will pat yourself on the backs and turn a blind eye to THOSE facts. Every law has a loop hole. This one has several and all of them spell and even worse end for the horses. But you guys are so blind by the "horror" of slaughtering for human consumption to realize that.

I just love how people think death is the worst thing that can happen. I can think of, and find news stories of actual events happening NOW, that are much worse for these animals. Boo hoo, horses are being killed...

Do you feel the same way about all the millions of dogs and cats being killed each year for lack of homes? And they're cheaper to keep than horses. Yet people still dispose of them, imagine that.

Whats Fair wrote:

Horses are considered companions by most? Oh, you're not living in the Horse Capital of the World. That figures...leave it to someone who has no clue! Equine businesses add up to a multimillion dollar a year industry. Most of those businesses are not supported by the "companion" viewpoint.
And you know, I'm sick and tired of hearing how "inhumane" slaughter is. FACT is, it's more INHUMANE to allow an animal to starve to death. Or go without medical treatment for common illnesses that, left untreated, turn into life threatening illnesses.
I see you're from Lyndell, PA. Would that be Chester county? I doubt you have any REAL idea what it's like in the South. Trust me, it's a far cry different than Eastern PA. You have good things like decent animal shelters and animal control officers who actually do their jobs, instead of putting a bullet into a dog's head because they didn't feel like taking it somewhere.(And that's IF they show up.) I had an issue with the neighbor's dog, so I called our "animal control officer" and was told, "you might as well just shot the dog and save me to trip out there to do it". Horses get even less attention.
Horses are NOT considered companions here in KY by the majority. And it's like that on the big ranches out west, and in most of the country. Ask anyone running a business related to horses if they want horses status changed to that of a companion animal. They'll tell you no. Why? There goes their tax deductions. No tax deductions mean more money is spent per year on those horses. More money spent means less people can afford to won their horses. They are LIVESTOCK. Deal with it.
But hey, let's push to get the bill passed so there is no more slaughter. Then we'll hear nothing but crickets chirping as we're left to deal with 90,000 plus horses each and every year that will have NO WHERE to go. You think the government is going to do anything then? Nope. And most people, who don't even know anything more than "slaughter is bad", won't be aware of the real suffering that will continue to grow each year.
Yeah, ending slaughter is the answer...
But you know what? The horses will STILL be slaughtered. JUST NOT FOR HUMAN CONSUMPTION. Most of you who are against slaughter seem to forget that. AND, the horses will still be transported across our borders to slaughterhouses that are even LESS humane (if you can imagine) than what we have here.(It's already happening because the slaughterhouses here have more horses on hand than demand for meat. In other words, they're FULL.) Once thebill is passed, I'm sure all of you will pat yourself on the backs and turn a blind eye to THOSE facts. Every law has a loop hole. This one has several and all of them spell and even worse end for the horses. But you guys are so blind by the "horror" of slaughtering for human consumption to realize that.
I just love how people think death is the worst thing that can happen. I can think of, and find news stories of actual events happening NOW, that are much worse for these animals. Boo hoo, horses are being killed...
Do you feel the same way about all the millions of dogs and cats being killed each year for lack of homes? And they're cheaper to keep than horses. Yet people still dispose of them, imagine that.

great post, but bleeding hearts rarely tend to listen...

I know Hunter, I know. They'd rather have slaughter banned, then turn a blind eye to the suffering it will eventually cause. While on the one hand horses will still be slaughtered, whether for animal consumption or after being transported to other countries, the numbers won't be as high as they are now.

It's easy to say, "if you can't afford to take care of an animal then don't have it". But guess what? People have free will and WILL do as they please. Just as they will continue to breed horses with no mind as to what will happen to them 20 years down the line.

No, the answer isn't ending slaughter. The answer is to end over population so horses don't end up unwanted and cast off. If the supply of horses meets the demand for them, people won't be as likely to just throw them away.

But I'm the one that "hates" horses because I;d rather see them slaughtered than left to die a LONG slow death.

You do realize a horse in good condition will starve to death in over 6 months? That's at least 6 months of suffering vs. a few days... How about if all of you who want to end slaughter starve for just a few days to see how it feels. Then tell me YOU'D rather the horses be left to THAT fate.

Whats Fair....
No, I'm not from Chester county or Lyndell, Pa., that's just what this site says I'm from.
I didn't realize the ban on slaughter only affected you southern people. What a crock. And I do have a freaking clue! You go on and on about the horse business people and the ole might dollar, and that is exactly why we have these conflicts of interest.
So, you mean to tell me YOU were elected to speak on behalf of the ranches out west and the majority of horse business owners? I don't remember asking you to speak on behalf of my farm.
Yes, I do feel the same way about the killing of dogs and cats.
The world wouldn't have these conflicts and "problems" if human wouldn't have screwed with things. All I am saying is it's nothing that the animal itself has done to deserve what WE do to them.
I am against the killing of any animal that is healthy, that is NOT needed to feed our families.
You state: FACT is, it's more INHUMANE to allow an animal to starve to death. Or go without medical treatment for common illnesses that, left untreated, turn into life threatening illnesses.... and who do you think is responsible for doing these acts?

Nugs Mom wrote:

Whats Fair....
No, I'm not from Chester county or Lyndell, Pa., that's just what this site says I'm from.
I didn't realize the ban on slaughter only affected you southern people. What a crock. And I do have a freaking clue! You go on and on about the horse business people and the ole might dollar, and that is exactly why we have these conflicts of interest.
So, you mean to tell me YOU were elected to speak on behalf of the ranches out west and the majority of horse business owners? I don't remember asking you to speak on behalf of my farm.
Yes, I do feel the same way about the killing of dogs and cats.
The world wouldn't have these conflicts and "problems" if human wouldn't have screwed with things. All I am saying is it's nothing that the animal itself has done to deserve what WE do to them.
I am against the killing of any animal that is healthy, that is NOT needed to feed our families.
You state: FACT is, it's more INHUMANE to allow an animal to starve to death. Or go without medical treatment for common illnesses that, left untreated, turn into life threatening illnesses.... and who do you think is responsible for doing these acts?

listen up, mom, you might find what he says a bit harsh, but reality IS harsh.
the REALITY is horses are animals. you might find them beautiful and cosmic, or whatever, but they are still livestock, no more deserving of special treatment than cattle.
are you a vegetarian? i noticed you said nothing about the millions of cattle that are slaughtered every single week so we can have burgers, steaks, and leather shoes.
let me tell you a little story. i was working in idaho a few years ago, at a j.r. simplot factory.
this operation supplied french fries and beef to macdonald's restuarants. all the waste potato products(peels, floor droppings, rotten potatoes, sludge, etc) were collected, put into tanks, and allowed to ferment to produce ethanol. after the ethanol was drawn out of the tanks, the remaining sludge and waste was fed to the cattle awaiting slaughter for two reasons:
1-they ate it, and the high alcohol and acidity(supposedly tenderized the meat.
2-it was free feed
the ethanol sludge would eat the linings from their digestive tracts, and they were shitting blood all over themselves in the last day or two before slaughter.
these cattle were standing knee-deep in mud created by their own feces and urine, outdoors, in near or sub-freezing temperatures.
i have never felt so sorry for an animal in my life.
but i still love a tender, juicy steak, and i haven't stopped wearing my leather workboots, or burned my leather sofa.
animals are animals. if you want to make a campanion of YOURS, have at it. i have a small stray dog that i would not trade for half the humans i know. that doesn't mean i want to save every stray dog on the planet.

Yes humans are the reason we have these problems with over population. So aside from speaking loudly about ending slaughter, as you have been doing, how about throwing out some ideas that could actually work? In other words, put your money where your mouth is.

I never said slaughter applied only to the south. I simply said it's different here. And it is. Shockingly so in some cases.

Saying that humans cause the problem isn't going to change anything. Ending slaughter is only going to prolong the suffering that many of these animals have to live with because a "quick" death will no longer be forthcoming.

I guess I'd be upset too at the fact that ending slaughter is sentencing these animals to a longer, more inhumane death. But that's OK, you obviously know what you're talking about and have NO problem whatsoever with the "what's going to happen afterwards" thought process that anyone with half a brain can think about and see.

A fate worse than death...that's what you antislaughter people are setting up for these horses.

I noticed you didn't address anything else I said about horses still being slaughtered for animal consumption, or being transported across the borders to be slaughtered in worse slaughterhouses than we have here. I guess you blindly think that's not going to happen...

I don't have to be elected to speak for anyone. My common sense is enough. Fact is, if people really did want horses changed to a companion animal statuus, the IRS would be more than happy to do so for them. Companion animal status means no more tax deductions for businesses relating to them, which means more money for the government. But what do I know? Oh yeah, it's that most business owners want to make as much money as possible and take every possible deduction they can...Duh! If you don't do that with your farm, and you're running a business there, you're an idiot.(By the way, changing the status would also allow for changing the zoning on properties that have horses. They'd no longer be agricultural and would be able to be taxed at the normal (and much higher) residential rate.

Sometimes, the level of ignorance astounds me...

Ignorance astounds you? Have you looked in the mirror lately? I don't know why you continue to feel so defensive when I came here simply to post my hatred towards slaughter. There is much ignorance in the world, and I honestly didn't think it would lead to this.

I have my opinions and you have yours. And yes, I would (if at all possible) save each and every animal. I do not agree with the slaughter of cows, pigs, horses, sheep, goats, the killing of dogs, cats, etc...

Yes, when I was old enough to learn where hamburger really came from.... I gave up meat.(many years ago)

But, I didn't come here to post my comments solely based on slaughter of horses for consumption, my comments were geared towards all slaughter.

Have a nice life with your insults.... instead of sitting here lashing back, I'm putting my time to better use..... Joining and fully supporting the possibility of ending slaughter.

FYI: I have no problem paying higher taxes, if need be, to insure the life of any animal.

Yup, that's generally how the discussion always ends. Once shown the reality of the situation, as hard and harsh as it is, those against slaughter usually leave without posting any real information as to what can be done to help the situation of unwanted horses.

You misunderstand my stance. I'm not FOR slaughter. I'd love nothing more than to have no REASON for it. But until we can find a solution to the tens of thousands of unwanted horses created each and every year, there is still a reason for it. Until such an answer can be found, a more humane method of slaughter should be the focus.(Actually, the real issue that deserves focus is over population, but since regulating breeding won't be happening any time soon, I'm ot sure how to go about that.)

You're a typical example of anti slaughter people. You really are. You simply get involved in a discussion to spew your "hate of slaughter", but offer no real solution to anything.(Except, of course to put a captive bolt through anyone's head the for slaughter. If that was you that said that.)

I think it's great that you'd be willing to pay higher taxes, I really do. Nice gesture on your part. However, there are some horse owners that can't afford to do that and paying higher taxes may actually mean the difference of whether or not those horses still have homes. Horses are expensive enough for most people. Some of us have no problems paying what we have to to take care of the ones we have. Others aren't so lucky. Not everyone has endles pockets. Sure, you could say, "if you can't afford horses, you shouldn't have them". But you know what? That's a pointless statement because people are free to do what they want. People will continue to buy a horse because they "want one" without actually taking into account how much they cost to keep. It's no different with any other pets.

It's also funny that you think I'm defensive. I have nothing to be defensive about. Anything I've said is easily researched and found to be true. I'm sorry, but I still haven't found ANYTHING relating to the cattle industry getting money for the slaughter of horses. I've been involved in this discussion in many places, with many people, and you're the first one that's ever said that.

I really hope that everyone who's pushing for the end of slaughter will also remain just as gung ho once the bill is passed and the meat buyer start looking for other means to get horses to slaughter. I also hope that these same people will help to fund rescues and educate the general public about responsible breeding and ownership. The government isn't going to do that. They'll pass the bill, pat themselves on the back, and sit back and wait for the votes from the people who supported this bill in the next election. It's really sad.

In the long run, it's the horses that end up suffering, and I'm sorry, but that's just not right.

Nugs,
The unfortunate fact is the people that shouldn't have horses do have horses and we need to think of the best way to take care of those unwanted animals.
Is a captive bolt humane. Yes. Veterinarians say it is. I have to trust someone and I choose a vet over those who do not know. Is abuse and neglect humane. No. Veterinarians say it is not. I have to trust them on this as well.
Nugs, I do agree with your second post where you say "what we do to them." Horse owners must become responsible parties. However, it's the wealthy horse owners that must step up and help those who don't care for their animals. What if every horse registered in a breed association, meaning AQHA, APHA, AHA, TOBA, Jockey Club, and I could go on and on, were to pay $5 per horse they registered to go towards educating horse owners about caring for horses and for helping out more rescue facilities. I don't think the general public, non-horse owning publics, should pay for the mistakes of bad breeding practices. While I love a wild horse like the next person, I should have pay to keep them alive, which is what you and I and everyone else are doing. We American's support the BLM program. We should not have to. So what's the next program that we will be supporting. The unwanted horse (UWH) program. That's what will happen is slaughter is banned. You and I will be paying to support 80,000 plus horses, and actually, that number will rise because there will be no bottom for the equine market. Think about it. Nugs, I appreciate your comments and respect your opinion, even though I don't agree. Feel free to pay higher taxes to insure the life of an animal. Gee, what if we didn't spay and neuter cats and dogs. How many would you be taking care of? Food for thought.
I agree with Whats Fair. We need to stop talking about slaughter and start talking about ways to help unwanted horses. If we develop solutions, then the number of horses going to slaughter will decrease until a point that slaughter will not be needed or the plants won't have enough supply to operate.
Let's hear rational solutions, please!

A horse has more right to be here on the planet than George Bush!

When I first begin owning horses I was very much against slaughter. Then I realized that it had its benefits also. For horses that are very old(which means lost there teeth and can't eat, or can't get around very well, suffering with pain from wore out joints)that it was the human thing to do. At least by taking them to the slaughters you are feeding someone or something else. and the horse is not suffering any more. A Slaughter house is better than the horse owners just shotting the horse and leave it laying or throw it over a bank somewhere.

Horse Lover wrote:

When I first begin owning horses I was very much against slaughter. Then I realized that it had its benefits also. For horses that are very old(which means lost there teeth and can't eat, or can't get around very well, suffering with pain from wore out joints)that it was the human thing to do. At least by taking them to the slaughters you are feeding someone or something else. and the horse is not suffering any more. A Slaughter house is better than the horse owners just shotting the horse and leave it laying or throw it over a bank somewhere.

Than....you won't mind one of those slaughter houses for humans either, will you? There actually were some, at one time for those human beings, they were called "Concentration Camps", by the Nazis. Spew your bullcrap elsewhere. Your mindset is on profits, not humanity or dignity.

Not hardly. I see no profit at all for horse slaughter. But I can't stand to see one suffering or dead one laying out somewhere. that is cruelity. Evidently you don't own horses, or you would understand. I guess you would rather see one starve to death that can't eat, or one just lay there and suffer. As for a slaughter house for humans, that is stupid. We could not help what the nazis did. People who are not prisoners can get out and work or get help. Tell me how a horse can fend for itself. It can't. It depends on humans to help them when they are suffering and to feed them. Even wild horses out west has company's and people that feed them.

Horse's fended for themselves long before us. And a few of you need to get comments correct before posting them. I never said anything about the slaughter of cattle and others benefiting from it, and I have offered up a few suggestions of possiblities to ending slaughter along the way. Honestly, in my opinion, I would much rather see a horse put down than to see a young 4 year old stallion, prodded down the shute, stung in the head, still alive... hoisted by a hind leg, and feel the pain and suffering of being slaughter while still alive. And yes, this happens. The horses going to slaughter aren't all old, useless, or sick horses. And that's the worst part. It's beefy, healthy horses still in their prime. And, it's those horse owners that have the big dollars that sell to slaughter houses to turn an additional profit. Are you kidding me, they can't take a loss on their investments. It's us smaller horseowners who work more hours and are dedicated to providing safe, loving homes ...that want to see ignorant american's educated about the correct way to treat an animal. As for me, I'd live in my car if I had to in order to see that my animals were provided for. Unfortunately, many people today just don't care, and that's what we're all beating our heads against the wall over.

A good website for those searching for more info on the whole slaughter subject:
http://www.equineadvocates.com/hs/inside.html

Nugs Mom wrote:

A good website for those searching for more info on the whole slaughter subject:
http://www.equineadvocates.com/hs/inside.html

i am still waiting for some horse lover to tell me how horses are any better than cattle. why is it you have no problem with the slaughter of cows, pigs, and chickens, deer hunting, etc., but horses deserve some special place? animals are animals, and their respective beauty, or importance, rests soley in the eye of the owner.
you stated that you have no problem paying higher taxes to pay for the upkeep of these unwanted horses. do you think people that have never owned horses, never will, and have nothing to do with the current problem should pay this tax, also? be realistic. if you can give me one scientifically sound reason that equestrian mammals are more deserving of life than bovine mammals, i am all ears.

But don't misunderstand my position. I love horses. I'm just not in favor of higher taxes. BTW, my favorite movie is Brokeback Mountain. I love the gay cowboy scenes. skinny

QUOTE who="skinny man".. why is it you have no problem with the slaughter of cows, pigs, and chickens, deer hunting, etc., but horses deserve some special place?......
Do you ever read ALL the posts put on here? For crying out loud! Once again, I NEVER said horses are better. I AM AGAINST ALL SLAUGHTER! Yes, I'm a freakin veggie lover. No, I do not eat meat. Good grief! I truly believe that unless you are personally starving and you live in the woods, there is no need to kill an animal. If you are starving, and your kids have no loin-cloth to wear, then go hunting....Let's face it, this isn't the caveman era.

Oh, and news flash. If you work, your tax dollars go to support millions on welfare who could support their own family if they simply got a job. You have no problem paying to support welfare recipients, and even if you do, where is your choice in that matter? But, you'd have a problem with some of your tax dollars going towards helping animals? Unbelievable.