Evolution vs. Creation

CBOW wrote:

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Yet the earth remains in a constant orbit around the sun. That would be "fixed"......

Look at the linguistic contortions you have to do to make the Bible and reality agree. Did the authors mean that the Earth was fixed in an orbit around the sun? Just tell us what they understood of astronomy back then.

LowellGuy wrote:

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Temporary discomfort in exchange for eternal bliss is not your idea of getting off Scot free?

Noooooo, should it? C'mon lowell, please try harder to get my goat.....

LowellGuy wrote:

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Look at the linguistic contortions you have to do to make the Bible and reality agree. Did the authors mean that the Earth was fixed in an orbit around the sun? Just tell us what they understood of astronomy back then.

Fixed, never changing course. Does it change course lowell, going off on a tangent beyond the orbit? NO! Indy 500, Daytona 500 lowell.

CBOW wrote:

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That's assuming that you desire to take the evolution theory all the way back to square one. In that case, what is the scientific data achieved that explains the very beginning of life, and the very beginning of earth itself? "Close to unanimous" opinion? It's not unanimous? mmmmm

So you demand proof of HOW life was started before you will allow yourself to beleive that life evolved from that start? And even if that is discovered you will move the goal posts back to how Earth and universe started?

Would you require the same be done before you believe any scientific discovery? Of course not...so let's not be so unreasonable. You either believe we evolved from simple forms or you don't...the fact that you are moving goal posts tells me you are pretty convinced of it...but you don't want to admit it.

CBOW wrote:

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If you give specifics on the alleged flaws I can answer. Are you referring to the old testament's directions for self salvation? That's why the new covenant came about, because we are incapable of self salvation because of disobedience. Thus, God sent Jesus Christ.

Humans are so sinful and imperfect...yet they managed for at least one time in the course of history to produce a humongous holy book without error...yet they were crafty enough to make it look like it was full of errors...

I fish wrote:

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In your opinion.

Opinion is all that is required when discussing religion.

crocoduck wrote:

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So you demand proof of HOW life was started before you will allow yourself to beleive that life evolved from that start? And even if that is discovered you will move the goal posts back to how Earth and universe started?
Would you require the same be done before you believe any scientific discovery? Of course not...so let's not be so unreasonable. You either believe we evolved from simple forms or you don't...the fact that you are moving goal posts tells me you are pretty convinced of it...but you don't want to admit it.

Now, croc, you know that I believe in evolution to a certain degree, right? I don't believe we evolved from primordial ooze. I do believe that with this vast universe that our beginnings are more than that. I admit that there are many subjects that mankind has no answers for, and that there is scientific data to support evolution, but not evolving from a fish or an ape. If we did, why did we evolve and fish and apes still exist and didn't evolve?

crocoduck wrote:

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Humans are so sinful and imperfect...yet they managed for at least one time in the course of history to produce a humongous holy book without error...yet they were crafty enough to make it look like it was full of errors...

Can you list the alleged errors you claim are in the Bible? Remember that the scriptures are hand written by scribes by the direction of God. Many people I have spoken to over the years have said that the Bible contradicts itself, yet when I read it from cover to cover; and in the chronological order it was intended, I found no evidence of contradiction.

CBOW wrote:

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Many of our programs are socialist, but garbage collection? C'mon that's private here. Our police are funded by private donations mainly as well as our fire dept. with volunteers. Snow removal perhaps, public schools certainly. Keep government out of religious "business"! What's fair is fair.

I agree...government should not have any part in religious business...federal funding included.

CBOW wrote:

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Yet the earth remains in a constant orbit around the sun. That would be "fixed"......

It is nice to see you grasping at straws to defend an idiotic claim.

The Earth is in orbit about the Sun, but there is nothing "fixed" about it. The Earth does not retrace its path. Each time around the Sun is slightly different from the previous one. Each orbit is unique. How is that fixed.

And don't forget, according to your magic book the Sun goes around the Earth.

CBOW wrote:

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Fixed in a gravitational field?

REALLY reaching...

You can make ANYTHING 'fit' with THAT kind of stretch...

CBOW, let me ask you the question that I have asked other Christians. You know that your Bible is a flawed book. There are quite a few errors in it and even you don't follow all of its orders. Why do you insist on believing in Adam and Eve and I assume Noah when all of the scientific evidence is against those myths? There are Christians that do just fine believing the T o E.

CBOW wrote:

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Fixed, never changing course. Does it change course lowell, going off on a tangent beyond the orbit? NO! Indy 500, Daytona 500 lowell.

*THIS* guy disagrees with you.

And he uses the Bible for his proof.

"The Bible and all real evidence confirms that this is precisely what He did, and indeed:

The Earth is not rotating...nor is it going around the sun.
>>>The universe is not one ten trillionth the size we are told.<<<

Today’s cosmology fulfills an anti-Bible religious plan disguised as "science".

The whole scheme from Copernicanism to Big Bangism is a factless lie.

Those lies have planted the Truth-killing virus of evolutionism
in every aspect of man’s "knowledge" about the Universe, the
Earth, and Himself."

<<more at>>

http://www.fixedearth.com/

Kong_ wrote:

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*THIS* guy disagrees with you.
And he uses the Bible for his proof.
"The Bible and all real evidence confirms that this is precisely what He did, and indeed:
The Earth is not rotating...nor is it going around the sun.
>>>The universe is not one ten trillionth the size we are told.<<<
Today’s cosmology fulfills an anti-Bible religious plan disguised as "science".
The whole scheme from Copernicanism to Big Bangism is a factless lie.
Those lies have planted the Truth-killing virus of evolutionism
in every aspect of man’s "knowledge" about the Universe, the
Earth, and Himself."
<<more at>>
http://www.fixedearth.com/

Do you agree with him?

crocoduck wrote:

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I agree...government should not have any part in religious business...federal funding included.

Hey, we finally agree. Cool. At least about this, huh?

CBOW wrote:

<quoted text>As did the native Americans, what's your point?

No history of Native Americans invading the middle east or any other established nation to overtake land, resources and spread spiritual beliefs.

Subduction Zone wrote:

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It is nice to see you grasping at straws to defend an idiotic claim.
The Earth is in orbit about the Sun, but there is nothing "fixed" about it. The Earth does not retrace its path. Each time around the Sun is slightly different from the previous one. Each orbit is unique. How is that fixed.
And don't forget, according to your magic book the Sun goes around the Earth.

What book and verse does it say the sun goes around the earth? Please advise. We remain the 3rd rock from the sun....

FossilBob wrote:

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REALLY reaching...
You can make ANYTHING 'fit' with THAT kind of stretch...

Did you notice the question mark at the end of it bab?

CBOW wrote:

<quoted text>Interesting how you see it. I see eternity as the reward for doing right. Our lives are reflections of us. Do you "waste" time at work "waiting' to punch out at 5 o'clock? If you do, that could be part of the problem. Productivity during the "work day" is the goal, punchout time is the reward.

Actually a paycheck for doing something you enjoy is the reward.

So what happens in your eternal afterlife?

CBOW wrote:

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Fixed, never changing course. Does it change course lowell, going off on a tangent beyond the orbit? NO! Indy 500, Daytona 500 lowell.

YOU have defined it as "never changing course"... The Bible says "fixed"; it says nothing about "moving", or "course".

You have invented your own version of the Bible concerning this subject...

Your claim about "what the Bible meant" carries no weight; we can only look at what the Bible SAID (or DIDN'T say); and it DIDN'T say that the Earth is in a reasonably stable orbit around the Sun, nor that it varies in distance from the Sun, nor that alignment of the axis varies due to rotational wobble, etc...

Claiming that "fixed" means all THAT is extremely misleading...

The Bible didn't get the 'flood" right, either... It was written by people with VERY limited knowledge about the Earth and the natural processes that operate in our Universe. It's not surprising that they didn't get much of that part right!