Ducking Climate Warming Evidence

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Fun Facts wrote:

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Do you know where the data you cite comes from?

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Fun Facts wrote:

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The most common reason manufacturing goes overseas is the ability of the foreign manufacturing to provide a skilled work force.
We are doing a very poor job of educating our workforce in manufacturing skills. Not just how to put bolt into slot, but the skills needed to run a mechanized factory are missing in this country.
Because of a lack of work force, supplies come from overseas. When the suppliers of the parts needed to manufacture are over there, then it makes sense for the assembly plant to also be over there.
In addition, we have the second highest corporate tax in the world. We have the most regulations. And we have the unions.
No one took our jobs, we sent them away.

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Fun Facts wrote:

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Let's do something even if it's wrong.....is never a good idea.

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Fun Facts wrote:

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Actually no. There are so many more costs to manufacturing than labor. Especially with products that require a number of suppliers of parts.
Being able to assemble in areas close to suppliers is a major cost consideration. And suppliers must be able to access natural resources to produce parts. Our regulations here prevent a lot of our ability to access natural resources.
Energy is also a consideration in production. The more energy costs increase the more expensive the product. Assembly in areas of lower energy costs are attractive to the end consumer.
If you can't sell it, you can't hire anyone to make it.

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tha Professor wrote:

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Sheer nonsense. There was never a problem with America "lacking a skilled workforce." Taxes, regulations, and unions are also largely bogus sources of blame, although often used as excuses by companies seeking, as I've already informed you, bigger profits.
We DID send them away, but it was not workers, unionized or not, who did it.

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CBOW wrote:

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Hybrids.

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tha Professor wrote:

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Sheer nonsense. There was never a problem with America "lacking a skilled workforce." Taxes, regulations, and unions are also largely bogus sources of blame, although often used as excuses by companies seeking, as I've already informed you, bigger profits.
We DID send them away, but it was not workers, unionized or not, who did it.

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Northie wrote:

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Hybrids don't make much difference in cold tolerance where hardy palms are concerned. Rhapidophyllum hystrix is possibly the hardiest of all. Trachycarpus fortunei and Chamaerops humilis are hardy to zone 7-8, so not quite rugged enough for Philly--yet. They're found all over Seattle and Vancouver, however.
http://www.sunpalmtrees.com/Cold-Hardy-Palm-T...

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CBOW wrote:

Wrong prof. I own a machine shop and have been in the machine shop industry for over 25 years. Skilled journeyman machinists are very hard to come by. CNC operators are out there, but they can only do light programming. Tool makers are almost non-existent in the younger generations. Very few young people go into the apprentice programs. Nobody wants to get their hands dirty anymore.

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Earthling-1 wrote:

<quoted text>It's much the same problem in Europe and I don't see it getting better.

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Northie wrote:

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Agreed. However, American manufacturing has been doing exceptionally well for quite some time. The trouble is that it has become highly automated, high-skilled, high-value added. Even as US manufacturers thrive, manufacturing jobs vanish. Those that remain are largely low-wage, non-union, sporadic positions. I know great machinists, middle aged and skilled, who make just a little more than minimum wage.
Even dirt-cheap Chinese manufacturing workers are now threatened by the inexorable march of automation.
http://www.china.org.cn/opinion/2011-11/29/co...

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CBOW wrote:

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Wrong prof. I own a machine shop and have been in the machine shop industry for over 25 years. Skilled journeyman machinists are very hard to come by. CNC operators are out there, but they can only do light programming. Tool makers are almost non-existent in the younger generations. Very few young people go into the apprentice programs. Nobody wants to get their hands dirty anymore.

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tha Professor wrote:

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As noted above, Greenland ice cores.
http://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/
This isn't exactly news.:)

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Northie wrote:

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There are a number of palms hardy in Philly, in USDA zone 7.(Of course, 25 years ago that was cooler USDA zone 6, so things might have been different then.)
http://www.arborday.org/media/mapchanges.cfm

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CBOW wrote:

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With the onset of the CNC age came an influx of "machine operators". Not to be confused with machinist of the top of the trade "toolmaker". The problem with the machine shop industry is that there are no set price ranges because many shops are in cut-rate basements and garages. Unionization of the machine shop industry could never be achieved in this area and when CAT went on strike in the late 80's in York, they successfully ran the company out of town. Those "machine operators" were making 32.00 an hour with medical. More than any private firm and they wanted more money.

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NobodyYouEverWantToKnow wrote:

Congratulations. I award you one troll dispatched. I gather he isn't going to try and bluster his way through like the more experienced trolls (i.e Earthling)

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Who wrote:

Don't listen to northie and his buddy litesong - they're both unqualified and unpublished cranks with no evidence.

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positronium wrote:

<quoted text>That sums it up pretty well...I was a toolmaker many years ago and since I drifted from it, I have only met one (like me) since....There are also some very skilled cnc persons out there that can do much more than light programming.....I for one....

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Ex Machine Operator wrote:

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Machine operator, 1979 to 1986. Worked making 'Caterpillar' engine parts in Windsor. Wages were closer to $24 and hour. And yes, it was unionized.
That was good wages back then BUT there was no pension plan, security etc. You worked overtime for 6 months and spent the other 6 months 'laid off'. So the AVERAGE wage for grinding and repetitive labor was probably closer to $15/hr with UI added. You needed about fifteen to twenty years before you got ANY security on income.
P.S. I left in 1986 to go back to University. The job was too hard and the pay was too low to stay in it. I went into programming and made more per hour without 'layoffs' as an 'entry level' hire.