The Two Faces of New Atheism

sweetromance2 wrote:

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My religion has killed no one. People did that.

False. People ARE your religion.

And? If you support that religion? YOU have indirectly murdered people BY ASSOCIATION.

Think about *THAT* for a bit.

sweetromance2 wrote:

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God is there for anyone who truly seeks him. That takes more than just calling yourself a Christian. It means double checking every action to see if it is of love. Always stopping to explore your own motivations.
More than that, it involves understanding that there truly is an afterlife. The civilizations that God wiped out, were his to do with as he chose. However, if you understand that children are safe in God's love. Those children that you are feeling so badly for are surrounded in total complete love. As they will always be.
For me, I had to do a lot of prayer and fasting before I could understand these things. Literally, for God, it was nothing more than a parent calling his children into the house after they've misbehaved.
God doesn't judge people the same way we do. Instead of judging them for their mistakes, he judges them for what is actually in their hearts.
Once your heart has changed about a sin, then comes true repentance, and forgiveness.

This is just self-hypnosis in action.

Your god is no more real than Santa Claus.

And? You would have had the EXACT SAME results, had you been Buddhist or Hindi....

...EXACT same results.

For the change came *entirely* from within yourself.

You do not give yourself enough credit.

AND?

You give the evil bible's god too much credit-- the bible's god is simply evil.

sweetromance2 wrote:

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It is not my desire to be a pain. If you have scriptures that have offended you, give them to me if you like, and I will try to help. Otherwise I will leave you in peace.

Start with Genesis 1.1 and continue all the way through Revelations 22.20

Pretty much the entire thing is corrupt...

Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:

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...Simple, really. The results do not lie.
Being a christian changes a person....not one bit.

I think it does change people

for the worst

nina wrote:

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I think it does change people
for the worst

:)

I truth? I think those folk were already evil: christianity attracts those sorts most of all.

Just today, on Pharyngula, "http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/" ;, he had a bit about how the christian congress critters are more apt to have affairs than not.

Nice./end sarcasm

NoamChimpsky wrote:

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Many of those people were inspired to kill because of your religion.

Many people were inspired to kill because of your non-religion.

sweetromance2 wrote:

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You obviously read the Bible with a great deal of hate. It's a shame that you are so focused on anger that you cannot see the great immense love God has for you.
While you sit and condemn my religion, I do know one thing. If you truly believed that I was defective of mind and so much worse off than you are, and your way was so much more loving, would you be so quick to ridicule me? I doubt it.

Noam and Billybob of quantumintelligence et al are fine examples of atheistic thought (or non thought, depending on yourperspective). They will never acknowledge that a Christian has a point because they have 1.too much hatred in their lives and 2.an insecurity which demands total belief in atheism. Redicule is all they say because that is all they are. They know little and say it often, always relying on atheistic web sites for validation.

jack13 wrote:

<quoted text> From what I have read in the bible, I'd say your god is a homicidal maniac. I prefer to think that man, without a mythical god who orders his leaders to kill, is much more likely to respect the others in society who differ in their beliefs than any christian I've yet to meet.

That is one of the dumbest thinks I've heard .

Boomer wrote:

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Many people were inspired to kill because of your non-religion.

Really? Name one war fought for atheism.

Boomer wrote:

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Noam and Billybob of quantumintelligence et al are fine examples of atheistic thought (or non thought, depending on yourperspective). They will never acknowledge that a Christian has a point because they have 1.too much hatred in their lives and 2.an insecurity which demands total belief in atheism. Redicule is all they say because that is all they are. They know little and say it often, always relying on atheistic web sites for validation.

Please explain how a lack of belief is a belief.
Calling atheism a belief is like calling bald a hair color.

Boomer wrote:

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Many people were inspired to kill because of your non-religion.

Noam is right; you are wrong.

madscot wrote:

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Really? Name one war fought for atheism.

I didn't say war. I grant you there is bad behavior of both Christians and Atheists. The general behavior of Christians though is good to great. What good do atheists do? That is, what hospitals bear the name of Atheists? What great philanthropic endeavor has an atheist done?

Some good things done by Christians:
1. They helped Jews escape the Holocaust.
2. Building projects like Habitat for Humanity.
3. Community reorganization.
4. Built hospitals.

Atheists have killed:
Stalin was responsible for 20 million deaths.
Mao Zedong was responsible for 70 million deaths.
Hitler was responsible for 10 million deaths including about 6 million Jews. Hitler was a secular Darwinist combined with Nietzsche’s atheist philosophy.
Pol Pot was responsible for 1.5 to 2.0 million deaths. This was 20% of Cambodia and they were directly influenced by the atheist Sarte.
The list of atheist killers goes on and on -Enver Hoxha, Nicolae Ceausescu, Fidel Castro, and Kim Jong-il.

Religion has inspired killing and though wrong, cannot compare to atheist killings.

madscot wrote:

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Please explain how a lack of belief is a belief.
Calling atheism a belief is like calling bald a hair color.

Bald? Bald?- now you might be getting personal.

About belief i said, atheists "have 1.too much hatred in their lives and 2.an insecurity which demands total belief in atheism. Redicule is all they say because that is all they are." Now you go polite on me and say please, well, here goes.

You believe there is no god. You believe Christianity is wrong and bad. You believe Christianity is populated by hypocrites, yadayada yada. You have a lot of beliefs that comprise the idea of atheism.

Thank you for being polite.

Boomer wrote:

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I didn't say war. I grant you there is bad behavior of both Christians and Atheists. The general behavior of Christians though is good to great. What good do atheists do? That is, what hospitals bear the name of Atheists? What great philanthropic endeavor has an atheist done?
Some good things done by Christians:
1. They helped Jews escape the Holocaust.
2. Building projects like Habitat for Humanity.
3. Community reorganization.
4. Built hospitals.
Atheists have killed:
Stalin was responsible for 20 million deaths.
Mao Zedong was responsible for 70 million deaths.
Hitler was responsible for 10 million deaths including about 6 million Jews. Hitler was a secular Darwinist combined with Nietzsche’s atheist philosophy.
Pol Pot was responsible for 1.5 to 2.0 million deaths. This was 20% of Cambodia and they were directly influenced by the atheist Sarte.
The list of atheist killers goes on and on -Enver Hoxha, Nicolae Ceausescu, Fidel Castro, and Kim Jong-il.
Religion has inspired killing and though wrong, cannot compare to atheist killings.

Which of these people, Boomer, killed in the NAME of atheism? Even one?

How many have killed in the name of religion?

Boomer wrote:

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I didn't say war. I grant you there is bad behavior of both Christians and Atheists. The general behavior of Christians though is good to great. What good do atheists do? That is, what hospitals bear the name of Atheists? What great philanthropic endeavor has an atheist done?
Some good things done by Christians:
1. They helped Jews escape the Holocaust.
2. Building projects like Habitat for Humanity.
3. Community reorganization.
4. Built hospitals.
Atheists have killed:
Stalin was responsible for 20 million deaths.
Mao Zedong was responsible for 70 million deaths.
Hitler was responsible for 10 million deaths including about 6 million Jews. Hitler was a secular Darwinist combined with Nietzsche’s atheist philosophy.
Pol Pot was responsible for 1.5 to 2.0 million deaths. This was 20% of Cambodia and they were directly influenced by the atheist Sarte.
The list of atheist killers goes on and on -Enver Hoxha, Nicolae Ceausescu, Fidel Castro, and Kim Jong-il.
Religion has inspired killing and though wrong, cannot compare to atheist killings.

Hitler was never an atheist at all, and that lie has been debunked so many times I'm not going to waste my time going over it again.

But it's interesting that you guys always bring up Stalin, who may or may not have been an atheist, when you're attacking atheists.

One could make a valid claim that since Stalin attended a Russian orthodox seminary (from 1894 to 1899) as a teenager in Tiflis, the dogmatic black or white outlook of the world influenced his subsequent actions. As the historian Alan Bullock in his book Hitler and Stalin: Parallel Lives (1991) explained:

The fact that it was a Church education helped to form the mind of a man who was to become known for his dogmatism and his propensity for seeing issues in absolute terms, in black and white. Anyone reading Stalin's speeches and writings will notice their catechistic structure, the use of question and answer, the reduction of complex questions to a set of simplified formulas, the quoting of text to support his arguments. The same Church influence has been noted by biographers in his style of speaking or writing Russian:'declamatory and repetitive, with liturgical overtones.'

Boomer wrote:

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Noam and Billybob of quantumintelligence et al are fine examples of atheistic thought (or non thought, depending on yourperspective). They will never acknowledge that a Christian has a point because they have 1.too much hatred in their lives and 2.an insecurity which demands total belief in atheism. Redicule is all they say because that is all they are. They know little and say it often, always relying on atheistic web sites for validation.

Ad-hom. Meaningless drivel.

And?

Not ONE SINGLE RATIONAL point to be made in the entire rant!

:ROFL:

Boomer wrote:

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Many people were inspired to kill because of your non-religion.

Name one.....what? Can't?

Wow....your pants are on fire....!

Boomer wrote:

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That is one of the dumbest thinks I've heard .

Proof that you do not actually....think.

:ROFL:

Boomer wrote:

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I didn't say war. I grant you there is bad behavior of both Christians and Atheists. The general behavior of Christians though is good to great.

This is clearly false. The general behavior of Christians is *exactly* the same as the general behavior of 70-75% of the US population: the percentage who are Christian according to some.

That is? Some are pretty good. Some are average. Most just live their lives as best they can, and try to get along.

A few? Do really good things. ONLY a few.

A few? Do really bad things. Gee, what a surprise...!

How do we know? Because the prisons have the SAME ration of christian to non-Christan as the general population!

In short? Being a christian does not change what a person WAS GOING TO DO ANYHOW.

Any more than painting a house white is the same as fixing it's leaky roof...

Boomer wrote:

What good do atheists do? That is, what hospitals bear the name of Atheists?

Have you looked? No? Then you are just guessing....

...as for those "christian" hospitals? Dig a bit deeper: you'll find some wealthy family behind it all....maybe christian maybe not, doesn't matter. It was wealth, not religion that created it.

End of 1 of 2

2 of 2

Boomer wrote:

What great philanthropic endeavor has an atheist done?
Some good things done by Christians:
1. They helped Jews escape the Holocaust.

Not exclusive to Christians, dude.... not by a long shot.

And? How about the MAJORITY of christians who STOOD BY AND DID NOTHING?

You cannot give credit to the WHOLE for the extraordinary actions of a VERY FEW INDIVIDUALS.

Moreover? These individuals WOULD HAVE HELPED REGARDLESS of them being christian or jewish or hindi or whatever.

That is? They did NOT help BECAUSE of their being christian....not even slightly.

They helped because of who they were-- christianity had little or nothing to do with it.

Boomer wrote:

2. Building projects like Habitat for Humanity.

Again? Not 100% christian.....and again? Not BECAUSE OF christianity, but IN SPITE of it...

Boomer wrote:

3. Community reorganization.
4. Built hospitals.

See above. Same counter-arguments apply here.

Boomer wrote:

Atheists have killed:
Stalin was responsible for 20 million deaths.

Really? Gonna need some PROOF for this one, dude!

Boomer wrote:

Mao Zedong was responsible for 70 million deaths.

So? If he was an atheist, that was incidental. Had he been a christian? He would've done *EXACTLY* the same thing: it's the sort of person he was.

PLENTY of examples in history where CHRISTIANS did EXACTLY the same thing....

He did NOT murder those BECAUSE OF being atheist! It was because of other things: power, corruption, being a FANATIC (i.e. religious), etc.

Boomer wrote:

Hitler was responsible for 10 million deaths including about 6 million Jews.

HITLER WAS A CHRISTIAN, YOU IGNORANT DOLT!

Boomer wrote:

Hitler was a secular Darwinist combined with Nietzsche’s atheist philosophy.

Bullship. Hitler ADORED christian thinking; he wrote that he was doing "God's Holy Work", and firmly believed he was doing it in the NAME OF the christian god....

...not that it matters. As I said? Being a christian does NOT CHANGE people-- they will do what they want to do REGARDLESS.

Hitler is proof enough of THAT.

Boomer wrote:

Pol Pot was responsible for 1.5 to 2.0 million deaths. This was 20% of Cambodia and they were directly influenced by the atheist Sarte.

Again? Not BECAUSE OF being an atheist. Had he been Christian? He would've done EXACTLY the same-- if not worse.

For being a CHRISTIAN, he could've JUSTIFIED his actions by claiming to be GOD'S PROPHET!

And who could say otherwise? That's the rub, isn't it?

ANYONE CAN CLAIM TO BE A CHRISTIAN AND SPEAK FOR THE CHRISTIAN GOD!

No real rules, are there? <eyeroll>

Boomer wrote:

The list of atheist killers goes on and on -Enver Hoxha, Nicolae Ceausescu, Fidel Castro, and Kim Jong-il.
Religion has inspired killing and though wrong, cannot compare to atheist killings.

B.S. Again. Pure, unadulterated B.S.

These folk would've made FINE christians, for they acted in the FINE tradition of christianity in the past: murdering their enemies, and justifying it with their FANATICAL BELIEFS.

Each of the above were fanatics in one stripe or another.

You know....religious nutters.