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North Carolina

Is America Ready to Quit Coal?

Posted in the North Carolina Forum

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“Climate Realist”

Since: Dec 08

Apo, AE

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#369
Mar 19, 2009
 

Judged:

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We need hydrogen power, I want a space ship on my driveway. The computer was invented to communicate and calculate, your computer models don't impress me.
Notjustamom

Buffalo, NY

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#371
Nov 6, 2009
 
just an allusion wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, America IS ready to quit coal and actually has been for sometime now (as has been most, if not all, countries), though the oil companies have been feverishly burning reserves in hopes of recuperating some of the inevitable losses they're faced with on the backside of our full conversion to alternative fueling for our power generation by perpetrating a need for reversion back to petroleum fueling.
Let me explain...
Natural gas also offers a number of environmental attributes. Natural gas, due to its unique molecular structure, is the cleanest burning fossil fuel. During combustion, natural gas produces fewer polluting emissions than other fossil fuels and its combustion does not damage the ozone layer. Natural gas production and use contributes less to global warming, as compared to other fuels.
Natural gas, composed primarily of methane, exhibits the main products of it's combustion are carbon dioxide and water vapor, the same compounds we exhale when we breathe. Coal and oil are composed of much more complex molecules, with a higher carbon ratio and higher nitrogen and sulfur contents. This means that when combusted, coal and oil release higher levels of harmful emissions, including a higher ratio of carbon emissions, nitrogen oxides (NOx), and sulfur dioxide (SO2). Coal and fuel oil also release ash particles into the environment, substances that do not burn but instead are carried into the atmosphere and contribute to pollution.
The combustion of natural gas, on the other hand, releases very small amounts of sulfur dioxide and nitrogen oxides, virtually no ash or particulate matter, and lower levels of carbon dioxide, carbon monoxide, and other reactive hydrocarbons.
If you are going to make quotes like this, you should at least site them. This came directly from the NaturalGas.org site. Don't plagiarize the work of someone else.(http://www.naturalgas.org/environment/natural... )
I am appalled that you did this. God, at least reword it.
just an allusion

Louisville, KY

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#372
Nov 6, 2009
 
Notjustamom wrote:
<quoted text>
If you are going to make quotes like this, you should at least site them. This came directly from the NaturalGas.org site. Don't plagiarize the work of someone else.(http://www.naturalgas.org/environment/natural... )
I am appalled that you did this. God, at least reword it.
I actually got the information from the Dept. Of Energy's "Energy Information Administration":

http://www.eia.doe.gov/

And, yes, I did forget to include the sponsoring link because I was multitasking at the time and contributing to other threads, amongst other things, simultaneously.

Be that as it may, my error of omission does nothing to detract from the relevance of the information I've submitted in substantiating the real benefits of conversion to natural gas from that of "coal", or even "oil" for that matter, as a source of fuel for our industrial and commercial applications, even our commuter needs as well as a matter of fact.

So, in accepting my apology for the honest mistake, may I ask that you direct your attentions in the more so positive fashion of addressing the actual subject matter at hand INSTEAD of contributing to a thread in the somewhat derogatory fashion of attacking it's contributors?
just an allusion

Louisville, KY

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#373
Nov 6, 2009
 
Mothra wrote:
<quoted text>
You make some good arguments for natural gas as a fuel source, but it would be stronger if you would drop the whole global warming nonsense, and just focus on pollution, cost and energy potential.
You ARE aware that my "focus on pollution", albeit ANYONE'S focus, inevitably, unavoidably, encroaches upon the issue of "Global Warming", yes?!

Why else would the issue of eliminating our dependence on "coal" come up in conversation? Other than the loss of life that coal workers continuously risk, what other reason would there be?
just an allusion

Louisville, KY

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#374
Nov 6, 2009
 
Northie wrote:
"Coal is 80 percent of the planet's problems...The number one enemy is coal and we should not forget that."
-Dr. James Hansen
And here is Hansen's letter to Barack Obama on what to do about this:
http://www.columbia.edu/~jeh1/mailings/200812...
I'm curious why he overlooked the viability of Natural Gas...I'll have to contact him about that.
just an allusion

Louisville, KY

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#375
Nov 6, 2009
 
dont snow me wrote:
<quoted text>Great idea! And when all the natural gas has been burned up, we can bring back coal trucks, coal bins and shoveling coal into our furnaces, like we did when I was a kid.
Actually, Natural Gas is in relatively infinite supply on this planet just in our already drilled oil wells alone (ever wonder what is being constantly burned in those flares above refineries and wells?) as it is NATURALLY emitted byproduct of concentrations of oil.

We could even avoid opening any wells at all by merely tapping the stores of oil we already have on hand in our reserves...All that would be required is the installation of the appropriate pumping, transmission and storage infrastructure, after that, converting our industrial, commercial and commuter machinery to be powered by Natural Gas is merely a matter of the simple and inexpensive installation of atomizing injectors and increased air cfm intakes.
just an allusion

Louisville, KY

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#376
Nov 6, 2009
 
Demand factor wrote:
<quoted text>Georgia replaced coal power plants with natural gas and drove the price of natural gas sky high. Natural gas went from being the cheapest energy to the most expensive.
Which is where government regulation comes into play as there is absolutely no reason at all to increase the cost of Natural Gas as it is in plentiful, inexhaustible supply and cheaply extracted.

Natural Gas, as a fuel source, has traditionally been the CHEAPEST by far of ANY of the presently available fuel sources. To this end, anyone exploiting this commodity for their own personal gain should be held accountable...I suggest that you try contacting your state's representative and just address the FACTS of the situation while refraining from the expression of any animosity for the rise in Natural Gas fueling costs.
just an allusion

Louisville, KY

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#377
Nov 6, 2009
 
WillB wrote:
<quoted text>
Where is the electric coming from?
Coal (coke) plays a very vital role.
Actually, the electricity produced by coal-fired plants is derived from firing the coal to produce heat that will produce steam by boiling tanks of water that, in turn, spin the turbines that generate the electricity.

That's Coal + Fire + Water = Steam + Turbine = Electricity.

Now adding Natural Gas to the equation would amount to:

Natural Gas + Heat (which can be initiated by merely igniting the gas, constrictive channeling, or magnetic induction)+ Turbine = Electricity.

With Natural Gas burning umpteen times hotter than Coal or Oil-derived fuels, it is both more efficient AND effective as a fuel source, as well as far less pollutant, the least of all current energy sources by far.

By way of a real world example, Natural Gas has two main advantages as, say, an automotive fuel over the petroleum-derived gasoline, or even diesel. The methane in natural gas burns hotter than petroleum-based fuels. With its higher energy-to-mass ratio, a car gets more bang from the same amount of fuel.

The second is that methane burns cleaner than petroleum-based fuels, with a 93 percent reduction in the remissions of carbon monoxide, and all other pollutants are reduced by between 30 and 50 percent.

So not only are Natural Gas fuel sources more so efficient, they are also more so CLEANER.
just an allusion

Louisville, KY

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#378
Nov 6, 2009
 
SFC wrote:
Even if the entire US went to solar and wind, it wouldn't make a difference, because the rest of the world would still us coal and oil. So the will have cheaper electricity and no worries if the wind doesn't blow and the sun doesn't shine. If we were to build 20 new nuclear power plants, how much money would be saved? How many construction and maintanence jobs? The French are on 90% nuclear power and if those worthless b*st*rd can do it, so can we. But until they are completed, drill for oil here, and keep the coal fires burning.
Natural Gas is actually FAR cheaper than Coal AND Nuclear energy, not to mention FAR less harmful to us or the environment...

Just saying.
just an allusion

Louisville, KY

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#379
Nov 6, 2009
 
Aero_Engineer wrote:
With the tech we currently have there is simply no way to stop using coal unless we go to nukes, which I am against due to its radioactive waste that takes thousands of years to break down.
A fairly through overview with but one exception, you overlooked the viability of Natural Gas, truly an inexhaustible resource that we can readily make use of to supplant our dependence on both Coal and Oil, which is available to us through our current technology.
just an allusion

Louisville, KY

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#380
Nov 6, 2009
 
ron wrote:
i fail to see how you can eliminate one power source without first providing alternatives. right now, notwithstanding the possibility of some invention that would revolutionize the power industry, viable alternatives would appear to exist only well into the future.
Two(2) words:

NATURAL GAS.
Northie

Spokane, WA

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#381
Nov 6, 2009
 
just an allusion wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm curious why he overlooked the viability of Natural Gas...I'll have to contact him about that.
No doubt, gas will help get us over the hump. However, although far better than coal, gas is still a major source of CO2 so it cannot be more than a temporary solution.
Earthling

Elche, Spain

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#382
Nov 6, 2009
 
British Gas began the conversion of domestic appliances to natural gas in 1967, a while before AGW was heard of, the changeover was completed in 1977.
Part of the end result, was a saving of life, the number of deaths from gas related incidents was down from 1,246 in 1965, to 271 in 1970.
Around 40 million domestic appliances were converted during that period.

The idea wasn't to reduce emissions, but to use a newly found and abundant by product of North Sea oil, a cheap substitute for coal gas.

“Climate Realist”

Since: Dec 08

Bad Windsheim, Germany

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#383
Nov 7, 2009
 
Natural gas isn't very dense; it takes too much room for vehicle propulsion. Oil is the best solution we have for transport fuel.
Northie

Spokane, WA

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#384
Nov 9, 2009
 
Pickens just declared that the US has no more than thirty years of gas reserves at present, so gas is inadequate as a long-term energy source; it is merely a bridge to renewables.

“Climate Realist”

Since: Dec 08

Dallas, TX

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#385
Nov 9, 2009
 
N., you didn't believe Pickens back when he was producing oil, what makes him more believable now?

Its like those artificial sweeteners, you can advertise them all you like but they haven’t hurt sugar sales. You don’t have to advertise if you have a vital commodity.

“dening those who deny nature. ”

Since: Jun 07

Norfolk va

ISP: Norfolk, VA

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#386
Nov 10, 2009
 
Northie wrote:
Pickens just declared that the US has no more than thirty years of gas reserves at present, so gas is inadequate as a long-term energy source; it is merely a bridge to renewables.
They made the same claim about oil thirty years ago and look how that prediction turned out. There are others who are predicting that we have a century or more of natural gas. Right now I would not be willing to bet on thiers any more than I would on Pickens predictions.
Northie

Spokane, WA

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#387
Nov 10, 2009
 
tina anne wrote:
<quoted text>
They made the same claim about oil thirty years ago and look how that prediction turned out. There are others who are predicting that we have a century or more of natural gas. Right now I would not be willing to bet on thiers any more than I would on Pickens predictions.
"They"? Who are they? Pickens? If so, please tell us what he said about oil depletion.

And, no matter what anyone may or may not have said decades ago, our domestic oil is indeed nearly gone, and we live in the most throughly explored, most drilled land on Earth, so we can be quite sure that no huge fields at economic depth remain. Are you in favor of slavery to the Saudi Royals, to Chavez, Putin, Ahmadinijad and the rest of the foreign oil gangsters?

Since: Nov 09

Jacksonville, FL

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#388
Nov 10, 2009
 
yes, since there has been a boom in natural gas demand

Since: Nov 09

Jacksonville, FL

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#389
Nov 10, 2009
 
Northie wrote:
<quoted text>
"They"? Who are they? Pickens? If so, please tell us what he said about oil depletion.
And, no matter what anyone may or may not have said decades ago, our domestic oil is indeed nearly gone, and we live in the most throughly explored, most drilled land on Earth, so we can be quite sure that no huge fields at economic depth remain. Are you in favor of slavery to the Saudi Royals, to Chavez, Putin, Ahmadinijad and the rest of the foreign oil gangsters?
last time i checked u.s. government still has oil in reserves its just they want to cut consumption for everyone else
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