Missouri child-support law change touches many issues

BTW fighting mad dad, you and stepmom continue to want to take this back to the two of you, and it's not about you. It's about children and families that you do not know, that you have never met, but you have had a hand in impacting their lives. You two not only dig the control, you seek attention.

Watch for my ad.

Fighting Dad wrote:

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You presumptuous, arrogant, near sided idiot. I am done trying to explain this to you. You continue to spout off the same crap! Go away. No one wants to hear from you anymore. I have said time and time again, this is not about money I did not want to pay. To be truthful, I have overpaid in my support obligation. READ THE DAMN statute. There are provisions in it for children with DIAGNOSED mental deficiencies. Quit bringing that up as an issue....IT IS NOT VALID....LIKE YOUR POSITION. My "first" situation is really none of your business, quit tying to make it your business. I shared my story to illustrate the injustice and inequality of our current support statutes. This is also not about parenting styles, not sure even how it fits. When does changing a law to try to make all Missourians equal, when it comes to post majority support, have anything to do with the way I choose to raise my kids. I suppose you can twist someting to fit though. No wonder you are divorced and sounds like you have been for a long long time. Hopefully you haven't roped in another clown to your circus. No one is the victim here. I stood up and tried to have the law fairly applied...a judge didn’t see it my way. Do you see or hear me ranting and raving about that....NO. We are making valid comments and conversations related to the current CS statutes. None of which impact you...so again, go away. Your stupid little jabs about directing our anger in the years to come, and getting what we deserve....that is downright ignorant. I thought you said you were an educated person! I bet when someone tells you to raise your right hand, you won’t be able to do it. Gonna be hard with two left hands....that is how far left you are. Please don't waste any more of our time with your complete nonsense. Other bloggers please follow my lead and do not respond anymore to this idiots crap. We are done with you. Go get yourself gratification somewhere else. Nothing you say is relevant to this topic.
That's a smack down from 6000 miles away you one-track minded dumba$$
God Bless form Iraq!

Well worded Dad! Where I come from you actually have to do something for your allowance. It's the same principal. Some of these 'lefties' would have us paying, without a choice, thru grad school. Nothing you, or any of us say will get them to think our of the box. I have a cousin that is the same way. He even says that Saddam never massacred his own people. Keep safe!

Responder wrote:

BTW fighting mad dad, you and stepmom continue to want to take this back to the two of you, and it's not about you. It's about children and families that you do not know, that you have never met, but you have had a hand in impacting their lives. You two not only dig the control, you seek attention.
Watch for my ad.

Again, very presumptuous on your part. Are you a fortune teller? This is not about me. I just happen to be the one who said…enough! This is about all the NCP's who have gotten the shaft by Missouri over RSMo 452-340(5). This is about equality in application of the law. If our adult children cannot meet the criteria to remain eligible for support, support should automatically be terminated. The burden of proof should not fall on the NCP to prove. At this point the age is a moot point. This is not about NCP trying to 'get out' of an obligation. I am sure there will be some, but do you believe for a second that CP's, for the most part make sure they are getting every dime they think they are entitled to? I do. Adults should have some adult responsibilities, even if it’s a part time job to help with incidentals. Our adult children will never learn to function in the adult world, be responsible, show up to work on time, pay their bills, develop any type of work ethic, if we, hand them everything on a silver platter. You, by your own admittance, made sure your kids had 'choices' and a wrong choice had negative results. What's wrong with the rest of us wanting the same treatment. The ability to give our kids 'choices'. Your very shallow, superficial point of view fails and if you read back, it has been pointed out numerous times to you that your point of view actually validates my case. You fail to answer any of the questions put to you, yet you attack others. You still haven't mentioned how this affects you, or are you just a pot stirrer? I have laid it all out there. I expected some negative comments about the law, but never thought anyone would attack me personally and challenge my parental ability or my motive. Please have the guts to leave your name and number with Representative Bakers office. I look forward to a conversation with you. This back and forth bantering in this forum is a cop out. I am not trying to change your position, I welcome the challenge, but I don’t think you have presented a position, only attacked others. They in turn feel attacked and retaliate. That's human nature, especially when there is passion and motive to influence change. I look forward to the ad. Any publicity, even negative will get people talking and hopefully get involved to continue to influence change for equality. Please let Rep Bakers office know when and where it will be published. He can get word to me. With that said...I have nothing else to say to you here. Look forward to that call.

Responder wrote:

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Back at you Fighting Mad Dad, from 6000 miles away. I think that when people resort to the language you just used, it is supportive of everything I have said here.
You are a controller, you don't get your way so you resort to abusive tactics. The statute - read it - does not provide for the post HS child who does not meet the criteria of continuing education vocational school. If that explanation is wrong, it is way YOU explained it.
It does not alter the fact that a law was changed that benefitted young people, and now it does not. College is expensive, MOST families help out with those expenses. That law gives men who resent paying child support an out of a FAMILY obligation. I will keep working to reverse what you have done.
Did that without calling you a single name. You have demonstrated who you are - from 6000 miles away.

Responder...you just said it here yourself...MOST families help out with those expenses. Helping doesn't mean the exact $ amount every month. It means HELPING... What about my child who's father died when she was 18 months old...the government is not going to HELP her when she reaches the age of 18, she will have to get scholarships, loans, and a job. While we continue to pay the same amount every month to the CP of my husband's children so they can continue their education. That is crap, anyway you look at it. The money won't even go to them it will go to the EX or as you put it the 1st wife, to do with as she pleases. That isn't helping it is called sticking it to the NCP. While my child is learning to stand on her own, learning that if you want something in life, you have to earn it. She will be the better person for it. Not having it handed to her thinking someone still owes her. That's life and when having to work for something makes you appreciate it; kids learn just exactly what their parents do for them and the sacrifices that are made for them. Life isn't easy, I love my kids, continuing to support them after high school, does not constitute as love, it is enabling them. I never said I wouldn't help my kids, his kids, or our kids, but part of being an adult is learning the value of a dollar. Child support should cease at the age of 18, or graduation from high school.

Just Mom wrote:

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Responder...you just said it here yourself...MOST families help out with those expenses. Helping doesn't mean the exact $ amount every month. It means HELPING... What about my child who's father died when she was 18 months old...the government is not going to HELP her when she reaches the age of 18, she will have to get scholarships, loans, and a job. While we continue to pay the same amount every month to the CP of my husband's children so they can continue their education. That is crap, anyway you look at it. The money won't even go to them it will go to the EX or as you put it the 1st wife, to do with as she pleases. That isn't helping it is called sticking it to the NCP. While my child is learning to stand on her own, learning that if you want something in life, you have to earn it. She will be the better person for it. Not having it handed to her thinking someone still owes her. That's life and when having to work for something makes you appreciate it; kids learn just exactly what their parents do for them and the sacrifices that are made for them. Life isn't easy, I love my kids, continuing to support them after high school, does not constitute as love, it is enabling them. I never said I wouldn't help my kids, his kids, or our kids, but part of being an adult is learning the value of a dollar. Child support should cease at the age of 18, or graduation from high school.

"To do with as she pleases"? What makes you think her gas, electric, or mortgage is any less than yours? Or that the price of the shoes she puts on her children, or the clothes she buys them are less than what anyone else pays for their children? I'm sure it pleases her very much to pay her bills and feed and clothe her children.

I really am sorry to hear your child lost her father at such a young age. If he was in the military, of course, there are benefits to help his child through college - of course, Fighting Dad might know more about that - not that he is going to tell his children about it - but he might update you.

I suppose what strikes me as odd is that as a parent I wanted the world for my children, and I worked hard to give it to them. As children, they have been very grateful and appreciative of what I gave them. I have no regrets, and they make me very happy. However, I devote a lot of time to advcoacy, and I see a lot of stories like the ones above. I am saddened that men and especially women resent paying for a child that they clearly had no problem participating in producing. There is something very, very wrong with that.

Wtih regard to these innuendos about these women out there partying - wow - you people are shocking. When was the last time you went to the movie, dinner, or celebrated a special occassion with friends? What an ex does and with whom she does it with, is really none of your business. Where in her divorce papers does it say she has to check in with an ex-husband or, more importantly, that she must consult with 2nd wife (relationship, whatever)? You can look, but it's not in there. Ex wives owe no one explanations for how they spend their money or conduct their lives.

You folks really have some control issues. Seek therapy.

Responder wrote:

Wtih regard to these innuendos about these women out there partying - wow - you people are shocking. When was the last time you went to the movie, dinner, or celebrated a special occassion with friends? What an ex does and with whom she does it with, is really none of your business. Where in her divorce papers does it say she has to check in with an ex-husband or, more importantly, that she must consult with 2nd wife (relationship, whatever)? You can look, but it's not in there. Ex wives owe no one explanations for how they spend their money or conduct their lives.
You folks really have some control issues. Seek therapy.

If you go back and read fighting dad's post, he was referring to the college student partying and failing and continuing to receive support...

Just Mom wrote:

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Responder...you just said it here yourself...MOST families help out with those expenses. Helping doesn't mean the exact $ amount every month. It means HELPING... What about my child who's father died when she was 18 months old...the government is not going to HELP her when she reaches the age of 18, she will have to get scholarships, loans, and a job. While we continue to pay the same amount every month to the CP of my husband's children so they can continue their education. That is crap, anyway you look at it. The money won't even go to them it will go to the EX or as you put it the 1st wife, to do with as she pleases. That isn't helping it is called sticking it to the NCP. While my child is learning to stand on her own, learning that if you want something in life, you have to earn it. She will be the better person for it. Not having it handed to her thinking someone still owes her. That's life and when having to work for something makes you appreciate it; kids learn just exactly what their parents do for them and the sacrifices that are made for them. Life isn't easy, I love my kids, continuing to support them after high school, does not constitute as love, it is enabling them. I never said I wouldn't help my kids, his kids, or our kids, but part of being an adult is learning the value of a dollar. Child support should cease at the age of 18, or graduation from high school.

Hi Mom....
I am continually amazed at the lack of common sense that some 'Responder's have to contribute to this forum. Your straight forward approach is appreciated and is very valid. I am not sure what she advocates, but whatever it is, it can't be any good. Responder is still attacking me here and I guess she knows more about the military than I do. Wonder when the last time she was in Iraq, fighting for the freedoms that she takes for granted here. I dont know of any educational benefits that can be passed directly to the children. If I can find something out, I will be pleased to pass it on. There are great educational benefits if your child decides to enlist. I used them to get my degree. My parents could not afford to pay for my college. It was not their burdon. They raised me to be a young man. I decided to enlist. From there, I was allowed to make my own decisions, and I was treated like an adult by them. Now, years later, I still listen to their advice. I will always be their child, but do not expect them to pave my way.

He still griped about having no control over how the money he paid was spent.

Fighting Dad wrote:

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Hi Mom....
I am continually amazed at the lack of common sense that some 'Responder's have to contribute to this forum. Your straight forward approach is appreciated and is very valid. I am not sure what she advocates, but whatever it is, it can't be any good. Responder is still attacking me here and I guess she knows more about the military than I do. Wonder when the last time she was in Iraq, fighting for the freedoms that she takes for granted here. I dont know of any educational benefits that can be passed directly to the children. If I can find something out, I will be pleased to pass it on. There are great educational benefits if your child decides to enlist. I used them to get my degree. My parents could not afford to pay for my college. It was not their burdon. They raised me to be a young man. I decided to enlist. From there, I was allowed to make my own decisions, and I was treated like an adult by them. Now, years later, I still listen to their advice. I will always be their child, but do not expect them to pave my way.

I take nothing for granted, Fighting Mad Dad about child support - I spent a year working with our soldiers who came home from Iraq wounded, who suffered horrible injuries. I am proud of the work I did with and on behalf of those men. I also do a great many other things on behalf of not just today's military personnel, but the Vietnam veterans, Gulf War veterans, and even those soldiers who have not fought in any war.
There's your B-slap from 6000 miles away soldier.
I am as red-white-and blue as you.

Responder wrote:

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"To do with as she pleases"? What makes you think her gas, electric, or mortgage is any less than yours? Or that the price of the shoes she puts on her children, or the clothes she buys them are less than what anyone else pays for their children? I'm sure it pleases her very much to pay her bills and feed and clothe her children.
I really am sorry to hear your child lost her father at such a young age. If he was in the military, of course, there are benefits to help his child through college - of course, Fighting Dad might know more about that - not that he is going to tell his children about it - but he might update you.
I suppose what strikes me as odd is that as a parent I wanted the world for my children, and I worked hard to give it to them. As children, they have been very grateful and appreciative of what I gave them. I have no regrets, and they make me very happy. However, I devote a lot of time to advcoacy, and I see a lot of stories like the ones above. I am saddened that men and especially women resent paying for a child that they clearly had no problem participating in producing. There is something very, very wrong with that.

No he was not in the military, it was cancer, are there benefits to help her because of that? Once the adults are in college, why should the NCP have to continue to help the CP with mortgage, utilities, etc?

Fighting Dad wrote:

<quoted text>
Hi Mom....
I am continually amazed at the lack of common sense that some 'Responder's have to contribute to this forum. Your straight forward approach is appreciated and is very valid. I am not sure what she advocates, but whatever it is, it can't be any good. Responder is still attacking me here and I guess she knows more about the military than I do. Wonder when the last time she was in Iraq, fighting for the freedoms that she takes for granted here. I dont know of any educational benefits that can be passed directly to the children. If I can find something out, I will be pleased to pass it on. There are great educational benefits if your child decides to enlist. I used them to get my degree. My parents could not afford to pay for my college. It was not their burdon. They raised me to be a young man. I decided to enlist. From there, I was allowed to make my own decisions, and I was treated like an adult by them. Now, years later, I still listen to their advice. I will always be their child, but do not expect them to pave my way.

I am grateful for people like you that chose to be in the military to fight for our freedom, and our right to freedom of speech. Responder doesn't get what we are trying to say. I am not talking about feeding kids when they are 10, I am talking just as you about 18 year olds being responsible for their path in life. That does not mean that the NCP should have to continue to pay. My child is going to go into pre-med, and will have to get scholarships,loans and a job to pay for college. Where as my step-son, wants to be a mechanic and attend trade school.(Nothing wrong with being a mechanic) so while the child that wants pre-med has to work extra, so we can continue paying CS for the mechanic. If we weren't forced to continue to pay support, we could HELP both.

Responder wrote:

<quoted text>
"To do with as she pleases"? What makes you think her gas, electric, or mortgage is any less than yours? Or that the price of the shoes she puts on her children, or the clothes she buys them are less than what anyone else pays for their children? I'm sure it pleases her very much to pay her bills and feed and clothe her children.
I really am sorry to hear your child lost her father at such a young age. If he was in the military, of course, there are benefits to help his child through college - of course, Fighting Dad might know more about that - not that he is going to tell his children about it - but he might update you.
I suppose what strikes me as odd is that as a parent I wanted the world for my children, and I worked hard to give it to them. As children, they have been very grateful and appreciative of what I gave them. I have no regrets, and they make me very happy. However, I devote a lot of time to advcoacy, and I see a lot of stories like the ones above. I am saddened that men and especially women resent paying for a child that they clearly had no problem participating in producing. There is something very, very wrong with that.

And another thing, I received child support from my ex-husband, when my oldest turned 18,(and went to college) I didn't not force him to continue to pay, he helped when he could. Yes, he had another family too, I was the type of ex-wife that thought more about the entire family, and how it affected my child. She is grateful that I took that stance, as her dad, step-mom, sister, and our family are close. To me that means more than the money, the happiness of the child.

Just Mom wrote:

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And another thing, I received child support from my ex-husband, when my oldest turned 18,(and went to college) I didn't not force him to continue to pay, he helped when he could. Yes, he had another family too, I was the type of ex-wife that thought more about the entire family, and how it affected my child. She is grateful that I took that stance, as her dad, step-mom, sister, and our family are close. To me that means more than the money, the happiness of the child.

Amen! You fostered the type of relationship that would benefit your child. You are a good mom and your daughter is lucky to have you!

Responder wrote:

He still griped about having no control over how the money he paid was spent.

HELLO....MCFLY!!?....For the last time, it's not control, it's the right to be able to choose!

Mom of 3 wrote:

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Amen! You fostered the type of relationship that would benefit your child. You are a good mom and your daughter is lucky to have you!

DITTO!

I am here to pose a question. First, some background. My child, who is 18, will graduate from high school on May 31st. She has verbally informed me, on March 22,2008, that she has decided that she will not attend college this fall. Instead, she wants to work for a year. Furthermore, her mom, who receives the monthly child support check, also told me, on May 2, that my daughter will not be attending college in the fall, and she wants to work for a year before she begins college. Missouri law states that the child has until October 1 to enroll in a program of higher education (i.e. college). Her mother says that, by her understanding, I must continue to pay child support over the summer and up until the end of September, even though the child will not be going to college in the fall. I want to file an Affadavit For Termination of Child Support on June 2, so I can put closure to this child support situation. I went to the County Clerk's Office, and picked up all of the necessary paperwork pertaining to this. I have a copy of the Answer Objecting, Acknowledgment Agreeing, etc., So, with all of this background in mind, can anyone tell me if I can start the termination process on June 2, or will I have to wait until October 2 to do it? Will I have to continue to pay child support all summer? Realize that not only is child support involved here, but also the expense of the monthly health insurance premium for my daughter. If anyone can enlighten me on this, I would really appreciate it.

Redeagle wrote:

I am here to pose a question. First, some background. My child, who is 18, will graduate from high school on May 31st. She has verbally informed me, on March 22,2008, that she has decided that she will not attend college this fall. Instead, she wants to work for a year. Furthermore, her mom, who receives the monthly child support check, also told me, on May 2, that my daughter will not be attending college in the fall, and she wants to work for a year before she begins college. Missouri law states that the child has until October 1 to enroll in a program of higher education (i.e. college). Her mother says that, by her understanding, I must continue to pay child support over the summer and up until the end of September, even though the child will not be going to college in the fall. I want to file an Affadavit For Termination of Child Support on June 2, so I can put closure to this child support situation. I went to the County Clerk's Office, and picked up all of the necessary paperwork pertaining to this. I have a copy of the Answer Objecting, Acknowledgment Agreeing, etc., So, with all of this background in mind, can anyone tell me if I can start the termination process on June 2, or will I have to wait until October 2 to do it? Will I have to continue to pay child support all summer? Realize that not only is child support involved here, but also the expense of the monthly health insurance premium for my daughter. If anyone can enlighten me on this, I would really appreciate it.

Hum...good question. You might have to file for emancipation. I'm not sure.$100 to consult an attorney. Might be worth the call.

Redeagle wrote:

I am here to pose a question. First, some background. My child, who is 18, will graduate from high school on May 31st. She has verbally informed me, on March 22,2008, that she has decided that she will not attend college this fall. Instead, she wants to work for a year. Furthermore, her mom, who receives the monthly child support check, also told me, on May 2, that my daughter will not be attending college in the fall, and she wants to work for a year before she begins college. Missouri law states that the child has until October 1 to enroll in a program of higher education (i.e. college). Her mother says that, by her understanding, I must continue to pay child support over the summer and up until the end of September, even though the child will not be going to college in the fall. I want to file an Affadavit For Termination of Child Support on June 2, so I can put closure to this child support situation. I went to the County Clerk's Office, and picked up all of the necessary paperwork pertaining to this. I have a copy of the Answer Objecting, Acknowledgment Agreeing, etc., So, with all of this background in mind, can anyone tell me if I can start the termination process on June 2, or will I have to wait until October 2 to do it? Will I have to continue to pay child support all summer? Realize that not only is child support involved here, but also the expense of the monthly health insurance premium for my daughter. If anyone can enlighten me on this, I would really appreciate it.

Ok...beware you are approaching some deep and rough waters! First, consult an attorney, but I'll give you my 2 cents. I do believe there is no way you will be able to emancipate before that deadline is up. The deadline is in place in order to give them time to decide what they want to do. They will give her those months to change her mind and the law allows her to do that. You may consider just waiting it out and not rocking the boat. Believe me...we have rocked the boat, big time and it was very expensive! I completely understand how unfair it seems, but the way the statute is set up right now, they are going to get the money until October and there really isn't anything you can do. Again, ask an attorney, but I think you'll find the same answer. Please let us know what you find out and good luck to you!

Redeagle wrote:

I am here to pose a question. First, some background. My child, who is 18, will graduate from high school on May 31st. She has verbally informed me, on March 22,2008, that she has decided that she will not attend college this fall. Instead, she wants to work for a year. Furthermore, her mom, who receives the monthly child support check, also told me, on May 2, that my daughter will not be attending college in the fall, and she wants to work for a year before she begins college. Missouri law states that the child has until October 1 to enroll in a program of higher education (i.e. college). Her mother says that, by her understanding, I must continue to pay child support over the summer and up until the end of September, even though the child will not be going to college in the fall. I want to file an Affadavit For Termination of Child Support on June 2, so I can put closure to this child support situation. I went to the County Clerk's Office, and picked up all of the necessary paperwork pertaining to this. I have a copy of the Answer Objecting, Acknowledgment Agreeing, etc., So, with all of this background in mind, can anyone tell me if I can start the termination process on June 2, or will I have to wait until October 2 to do it? Will I have to continue to pay child support all summer? Realize that not only is child support involved here, but also the expense of the monthly health insurance premium for my daughter. If anyone can enlighten me on this, I would really appreciate it.

One more thing - When my husband filed the emancipation papers because his daughter didn't meet the requirements anymore, we were given a court date for the case to be discused before a judge. We didn't get into court until 1 year after he filed the papers. You might find you prolong your situation by filing the papers...you might ask an attorney that too.