Archbishop urges governor to refrain from Communion

I don't agree with the Governor's stand on abortion, but I also don't believe that should stand in the way of sharing Communion. Communion and whether to take it or not is between the person and God. The only time the Bible states one shouldn't share in Communion is when you are at odds with a Christian brother or sister and have not reconciled your differences. The Archbishop has overstepped his authority.

If all the pro-life and divorced people followed the letter of the 'Roman' law their churches would be empty, thus they don't enforce what they believe....

Pastoral advice delivered through a public newsletter? Why not just contact to Gov and ask to speak with her? Sounds to me like the AB is playing politics rather than pastoral advisor.

earlpittsamurican wrote:

I don't agree with the Governor's stand on abortion, but I also don't believe that should stand in the way of sharing Communion. Communion and whether to take it or not is between the person and God. The only time the Bible states one shouldn't share in Communion is when you are at odds with a Christian brother or sister and have not reconciled your differences. The Archbishop has overstepped his authority.

"Therefore whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will have to answer for the body and blood of the Lord." 1 Cor. 11:27
In St. Paul's time, the expression "to answer for the body and blood" of someone meant to be guilty of murder, of shedding that person's blood.
The Archbishop is correct in warning the Gov. that her pro-abortion record makes her unworthy to receive communion.
"A person should examine himself, and so eat the bread and drink the cup. For anyone who eats and drinks without discerning the body, eats and drinks judgment [damnation] on himself." 1 Cor. 11:28-29

"A person should examine himself"

I would assume that Governor Sebelius has, and that her conscience, like the conscience of many prochoice individuals is clear. These individuals are guided by understanding, sympathy and compassion for women seeking the termination of an unwanted pregnancy.

This public stunt is nothing but a stunt.

Minnesota Mary wrote:

<quoted text>
"Therefore whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will have to answer for the body and blood of the Lord." 1 Cor. 11:27
In St. Paul's time, the expression "to answer for the body and blood" of someone meant to be guilty of murder, of shedding that person's blood.
The Archbishop is correct in warning the Gov. that her pro-abortion record makes her unworthy to receive communion.
"A person should examine himself, and so eat the bread and drink the cup. For anyone who eats and drinks without discerning the body, eats and drinks judgment [damnation] on himself." 1 Cor. 11:28-29

Perfect response! Abortion terminates life,a modern day behemouth of social action against unwanted innocence.It is deep in our consciences, but the Bible says also that "in the last days they will sear their consciences with hot irons."That which is convenient,is easily discarded as well.

May I remind those who are so in accord with the Archbishop that the Governor represents ALL Kansans, not just those with a particular belief. The church, as the founding fathers so wisely saw, needs to stay out of governmental matters. What a catholic Kathleen Sibelius does as a person may be subject for a personal and private ecclesiastical reprimand...what GOVERNOR Sibelius does is quite separate. THANK GOD FOR SEPARATION>

Sebelius, like so many other pro-abort "Catholic" pols, is trying to compartmentalize Christianity. Catholic or not, one who is truly Christian, does not sanction the killing of innocent babes in the womb anymore than one would sanction slavery, murder of adults, sex with minors, or a host of other crimes just because not everyone holds to the Judeo-Christian belief system.

You can't have it both ways. Christ says in Revelation 3:14-17:

"I know thy works; thou art neither cold nor hot. I would that thou wert cold or hot. But because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I am about to vomit thee out of my mouth..."

Minnestoa Mary said: "Christ says in Revelation 3:14-17:...."

Really? I thought it was John who wrote those words.

I repeat, a governor acts as governor of all people ...not just christians, or jews, or muslims, of confucians and yes atheists and agnostics as well. I thought we solved this question with John Kennedy.

Kssenior wrote:

Minnestoa Mary said: "Christ says in Revelation 3:14-17:...."
Really? I thought it was John who wrote those words.
I repeat, a governor acts as governor of all people ...not just christians, or jews, or muslims, of confucians and yes atheists and agnostics as well. I thought we solved this question with John Kennedy.

Go back to the first Chapter of Revelation verses 1-3:

"The Revelation of JESUS CHRIST which God gave Him, to make known to His servants the things that must shortly come to pass; and He sent and signified them through His angel to His servant John; who bore witness to the word of God and to the testimony of JESUS CHRIST, to whatever he saw..."

John Kennedy made the choice to serve man instead of God when he back-peddaled away from his Faith in order to obtain the votes of anti-Catholics.

Kathleen Sebelius appears to have likewise made that same choice, and therefore, she should not take Communion in the Catholic Church. A true Christan, Catholic or otherwise, would never put a state job ahead of their allegiance to Christ.

I presume that you are not a Catholic. Therefore, what right do you have to tell the Archbishop how to do his job of guiding souls? Aren't you doing the same thing that you are accusing the Archbishop of doing?

"A person should examine himself, and so eat the bread and drink the cup. For anyone who eats and drinks without discerning the body, eats and drinks judgment [damnation] on himself." 1 Cor. 11:28-29

A person should examine himself. It doesn't say that the Archbishop should examine the person. Communion is strictly between God and the partaker. No human has the right to restrict another's worship of God. Not even the Pope. The Pope is a fallible human just like any other and has no right to interfere in another's worship. Like I said, I don't agree with her stand, but no one on earth is truly worthy of taking Communion. We all have unresolved sin in our lives. And if anyone says he doesn't, he's guilty of lying. We only are allowed to share in Communion because of the grace of God.

Well said earlpittsamurican. It brings it where it should be... a personal decision and choice...and we're back where we started.

I think the archbishop should refrain from distributing communion until all victims of abuse at the hands of priests are identified and all those guilty within the Catholic Church are exposed.

I will believe in this or any bishop's right to judge others when they have cleaned their own house.

To KSSENIOR,

You wrote:
"The church, as the founding fathers so wisely saw, needs to stay out of governmental matters."

Sorry to inform you, but the founding fathers never wisely saw the church being seperated from government as a good thing.

Remember this, the Bill of Rights is pretty clear as to which party is restricted. It is always the government that suffers the restrictions.
Go back and read them again, and re-educate yourself.
Never is any restriction levied on the people or the church. Only the Government.

Our founding fathers, did place a wall between the church and state, but it was a one-directional wall preventing the state from establishing a state (religion) church. It was not a restriction preventing the church to be involved in government.

In fact, if you take the time to read old books and documents, you will discover that most politicians from that era always first consulted with the clergy before passing any laws.
That was to insure those laws in question did not violate what the scriptures had to say.

If you check the writings of the founding fathers, such as the Federalist papers, you will become better informed.

the lenexan wrote:

I think the archbishop should refrain from distributing communion until all victims of abuse at the hands of priests are identified and all those guilty within the Catholic Church are exposed.
I will believe in this or any bishop's right to judge others when they have cleaned their own house.

Perhaps they could refrain from 'consecrating' the Eucharist as well...

earlpittsamurican wrote:

"A person should examine himself, and so eat the bread and drink the cup. For anyone who eats and drinks without discerning the body, eats and drinks judgment [damnation] on himself." 1 Cor. 11:28-29
A person should examine himself. It doesn't say that the Archbishop should examine the person. Communion is strictly between God and the partaker. No human has the right to restrict another's worship of God. Not even the Pope. The Pope is a fallible human just like any other and has no right to interfere in another's worship. Like I said, I don't agree with her stand, but no one on earth is truly worthy of taking Communion. We all have unresolved sin in our lives. And if anyone says he doesn't, he's guilty of lying. We only are allowed to share in Communion because of the grace of God.

The Archbishop is a leader of the Church. 1 Timothy 4:6-16 gives instructions to leaders of the Church.

"If you give these instructions to the believers, you will be a good servant of Christ Jesus, as you feed yourself spiritually on the words of faith and of the true teaching which you have followed..."

"Give them these instructions and these teachings. Do not let anyone look down on you because you are young, but be an example for the believers in your speech, your conduct, your love, faith, and purity..."

"Watch yourself and watch your teaching. Keep on doing these things, because if you do, you will save both yourself and those who hear you."

1 Titus 2:1--"But you must teach what agrees with sound doctrine."

The Archbishop is following this Biblical advice. He is warning Sebelius that she has placed her soul in grave jeopardy.

The teachings of Jesus include the right to life.

"Whatsoever you do to the least of mine, that you do unto Me."

DID YOU KNOW? As you walk up the steps to the building which houses the U.S Supreme Court you can see near the top of the building a row of the world's law givers and each one is facing one in the middle who is facing forward with a full frontal view .. it is Moses and he is holding the Ten Commandments!

DID YOU KNOW?
As you enter the Supreme Court courtroom, the two huge oak doors have the Ten Commandments engraved on each lower portion of each door.

DID YOU KNOW?
As you sit inside the courtroom, you can see the wall,
right above where the Supreme Court judges sit,
a display of the Ten Commandments!

DID YOU KNOW?
There are Bible verses etched in stone all over the Federal Buildings and Monuments in Washington , D.C.

DID YOU KNOW?
James Madison, the fourth president, known as 'The Father of Our Constitution' made the following statement:

'We have staked the whole of all our political institutions upon the capacity of mankind for self-government, upon the capacity of each and all of us to govern ourselves, to control ourselves, to sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments of God.'

DID YOU KNOW?
Patrick Henry, that patriot and Founding Father of our country said:
'It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded not by religionists but by Christians, not on religions but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ'.

DID YOU KNOW?
Every session of Congress begins with a prayer by a paid preacher, whose salary has been paid by the taxpayer since 1777.

DID YOU KNOW?
Fifty-two of the 55 founders of the Constitution were members of the established orthodox churches in the colonies.

DID YOU KNOW?
Thomas Jefferson worried that the Courts would overstep their authority and instead of interpreting the law would begin making law . an oligarchy .

the rule of few over many.

DID YOU KNOW?
The very first Supreme Court Justice, John Jay, said:
'Americans should select and prefer Christians as their rulers.'
How, then, have we gotten to the point that everything we have done for 220 years in this country is now suddenly wrong and unconstitutional?

Lets put it around the world and let the world see and remember what this great country was built on.

Chamber , US House of Representatives
I was asked to send this on if I agreed or delete if I didn't. Now it is your turn...
It is said that 86% of Americans believe in God. Therefore, it is very hard to understand why there is such a mess about having the Ten Commandments on display or 'In God We Trust' on our money and having God in the Pledge of Allegiance. Why don't we just tell the other 14% to Sit Down and SHUT UP!!!

This happens because Christians do nothing. I for one will do something. I will voice my opinion. How about a little help to our leaders and not just to each other!!!!

I feel that an effective leader would have spoken to her privately first. Matthew 18:15 states, "If your brother sins against you, go and show him his fault, just between the two of you. If he listens to you, you have won your brother over." The next step is to take one or two others with you. Then he is to be taken to the congregation. Even if the archbishop did the first two privately, I don't believe the media is a part of the Catholic church. I still say he over-stepped his authority by allowing the media to get hold of this.

earlpittsamurican wrote:

I feel that an effective leader would have spoken to her privately first. Matthew 18:15 states, "If your brother sins against you, go and show him his fault, just between the two of you. If he listens to you, you have won your brother over."

The next step is to take one or two others with you. Then he is to be taken to the congregation. Even if the archbishop did the first two privately, I don't believe the media is a part of the Catholic church. I still say he over-stepped his authority by allowing the media to get hold of this.

Often it is the miscreant that blabs to the press when they are chastened by a prelate. When a bishop makes public a reprimand, such as was done with Gov. Sebelius, it is because a high profile "Catholic" has been giving scandal to the Church. When scandal is given to the Church, without correction from the bishop, it encourages the rank and file Catholics to disobey since a high profile Catholic is doing it without consequences. Also, the Church can then be accused of treating her members differently.

The Archbishop has done nothing wrong in warning Gov. Sebelius that her pro-choice rhetoric and governing have placed her soul in eternal jeopardy. He has also made known publicly what the teachings of the Church are to Catholics who have probably been confused for years. May his numbers increase!

She is, indeed being treated differently. If a rank and file Catholic was to be called on the carpet, I cannot believe the Archbishop would do it publicly. He needed to follow the steps laid out by Jesus, himself, regardless of who it is. Jesus did not make any distinction between politicians and ordinary people, so neither should have the Archbishop.