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“Just Here”
Joined: Jan 24, 2008
Comments: 5094
Hudsonville
ISP:
Wyoming, MI
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Steelie wrote: Good Day,
Wait, is the world spinning in the opposite direction? There are people actually in agreement! Wow... ANF and Pete... wow. I kid a little bit. However, ones arguement will always be respected more when one behaves like an adult. Regardless of their position.
Again, what may bug me the most about this is that there has been so little disagreement coming out of Europe. Germany made a slight reference to this, but where are the others?
Or what about Turkey? They may have a concern as a portion of their North Eastern border is shared with Georgia.
Very concerning...
Steelie Yes, people can agree on things despite having divergent opinions on certain points. It's called Intelligent discussion. And I too will respect the opinions of both posters when they can engage in that vs. just stupid name calling. Congrats to those of you who have been posting in this manner. As far a Europe, the main reason that they have not said much about this is that they can ill afford to. Europe gets much of their oil and most of their Natural Gas from Russia so Russia pretty much has Europe under their thumb. One wrong statement or move and Russia just shuts off the tap (They've don it before). The same with Turkey. I would imagine that Turkey (A supposed ally of ours) has been watching the events in Georgia very closely. The Russian's have always coveted the outlet to the Black Sea, The Dardanelles, which supposedly is an international waterway, but which Russian knows it can't completely control unless they have the strategic land of the Bosphorus around it. Turkey is probably looking at the US and NATO and seeing the lack of real response of the US (lots of words and a few cargo planes of aid) and deciding it's better to keep their diplomatic mouth shut as well or they will be next.
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Seenitbefore
Grand Rapids, MI
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aimNfire wrote: <quoted text>
I agree with all your points.
I would further say that China can not keep up what they are doing.
They are a communist/facist regime with a capitalist economy. They have been able to keep thier population in check since the Tiedemann Square incident. At some point, thier citizens (along with Iranians) will wise up and revolt. My concern is we are jumping into a very bad scenario. We are spending all of our national wealth on the military industrial complex and military engagements while shipping out all of our manufacturing "might" out to China. While China on the other hand isn't spending near, I actually don't know any figures, as much wealth on their military. In any case we are supplying them with enough wealth they can soon become what we were. So perhaps the U.S. and Russia will be buying their weaponry along with everything else from China. As China and Russia are more philosophically aligned, guess who China would favor. In China there have been several attempts at revolt and all we are doing is strengthening their monetary might that will only make it easier to squash future internal revolts. And in the mean time, between the now and if there were a successful revolt in China, what else is going to happen. There are several very bad scenarios available because of this economic treason of American companies. My son-in-law is a highly educated professional, VERY much a conservative and leans toward to the Republican Party, and he is extremely agitated at the way the Republicans and U.S. business have been systematically dismantling this country. So it's not just "the libs" that are seeing the very real dangers for this country because of this monopolistic capitalism here.
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“Boy, that escalated quickly”
Joined: Mar 14, 2008
Comments: 1942
Grand Rapids
ISP:
Milwaukee, WI
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Judged:
1
Hurley35 wrote: "Bush Impotent In Georgia"
Just in Georgia? I'm sure that some reporter is either laughing at his/her headline or desperately wishing they would have worded it differently. LOL Must be the heat and humidity down there this time of year. Whatever the case it sounds like a personal matter to me. Maybe he can hit his buddy Rush Limbaugh up for some illegal Viagra.
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Seenitbefore
Grand Rapids, MI
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Steelie wrote: Good Day,
Wait, is the world spinning in the opposite direction? There are people actually in agreement! Wow... ANF and Pete... wow. I kid a little bit. However, ones arguement will always be respected more when one behaves like an adult. Regardless of their position.
Again, what may bug me the most about this is that there has been so little disagreement coming out of Europe. Germany made a slight reference to this, but where are the others?
Or what about Turkey? They may have a concern as a portion of their North Eastern border is shared with Georgia.
Very concerning...
Steelie What has happened over the past 60+ years is the U.S. has become the "Superman" of the world and gladly accepted continuing that role once the rest of the free world was rebuilt. They look to us to take care of the world's problems. And again the U.S. has gladly said step aside and we'll handle it. Well not only have we stretched ourselves too thin, in every aspect, we have had "leaders" that have put our very credibility in question. I think the "leader of the free world" got a little caught up in their own praise. We've lost our wisdom along with our humbleness.
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Batch37 Pain Is Good
Murphysboro, IL
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We are not going to rush in and start fighting in Georgia. We are going to do what we did in Iraq. 10 years of diplomacy and UN resolutions. The Russians are going to get reams of letters letting them know that the UN is very very displeased with their action.
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Joined: Jul 9, 2008
Comments: 1259
Grand Rapids, MI
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Seenitbefore wrote: <quoted text>
My concern is we are jumping into a very bad scenario. We are spending all of our national wealth on the military industrial complex and military engagements while shipping out all of our manufacturing "might" out to China. While China on the other hand isn't spending near, I actually don't know any figures, as much wealth on their military. In any case we are supplying them with enough wealth they can soon become what we were. So perhaps the U.S. and Russia will be buying their weaponry along with everything else from China. As China and Russia are more philosophically aligned, guess who China would favor.
In China there have been several attempts at revolt and all we are doing is strengthening their monetary might that will only make it easier to squash future internal revolts.
And in the mean time, between the now and if there were a successful revolt in China, what else is going to happen. There are several very bad scenarios available because of this economic treason of American companies.
My son-in-law is a highly educated professional, VERY much a conservative and leans toward to the Republican Party, and he is extremely agitated at the way the Republicans and U.S. business have been systematically dismantling this country.
So it's not just "the libs" that are seeing the very real dangers for this country because of this monopolistic capitalism here. SIB, our military spending is less then 4% of our National Budget. I guess with China, there are 2 routes you can take, isolate them or trade with them. We have elected the latter, for better or worse. I would strongly disagree with your assertion that this is a Republican action. Globalization happend before Bush, we've been trading with China long before Bush. I do think China is an enemey of the USA. But, considering everything that is at stake, i'm not so sure trading with them is such a bad idea.
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idunno
Bloomfield Hills, MI
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aimNfire wrote: <quoted text>
SIB, our military spending is less then 4% of our National Budget.
I guess with China, there are 2 routes you can take, isolate them or trade with them. We have elected the latter, for better or worse.
I would strongly disagree with your assertion that this is a Republican action. Globalization happend before Bush, we've been trading with China long before Bush.
I do think China is an enemey of the USA. But, considering everything that is at stake, i'm not so sure trading with them is such a bad idea. bush SR. is the REAL PROBLEM way back when he was AMBASSADOR TO CHINA.We ALL know this bush has NEVER had the intelligence to run this show he is a mere puppet of SR. and cheney. bush's have SOLD AMERICA OUT a long time ago.As head of C.I.A. BUSH SR. has had EVERY major TERRORER(i made a new word just like jr.)on the payroll. So damn near EVERY problem we have NOW all goes back to THE BUSH'S..........
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Pete
Hopkins, MI
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Steelie wrote: Good Day,
Wait, is the world spinning in the opposite direction? There are people actually in agreement! Wow... ANF and Pete... wow. I kid a little bit. However, ones arguement will always be respected more when one behaves like an adult. Regardless of their position.
Again, what may bug me the most about this is that there has been so little disagreement coming out of Europe. Germany made a slight reference to this, but where are the others?
Or what about Turkey? They may have a concern as a portion of their North Eastern border is shared with Georgia.
Very concerning...
Steelie As Rock pointed out there is a lot going on here besides what we hear from our government. I started this with the impotent crack because it appeared to me that we had in part set this up and then had, again, been toothless when the law of unintended consequences took over. I am not sure but with all of these other issues concerning oil and gas and pipelines why would Georgia with or w/o our encouragement be tweaking the Big Bear? What sense does that make, did they think somehow we were going to rescue them? Shortly after this happened one news crew in Georgia was interviewing people and they were all saying "Where is the U.S." They were waiting for us to save them, where did they get that idea? Bush has been over there giving speeches it might be interesting to see the transcript of those speeches. Was the CIA in there encourging this? Did Cheney have a back channel going that encouraged this, I am not accusing anyone I am just wondering how this crisis got rolling. Did Russia taunt them into it, was there a Gulf of Tonkin moment? Just asking?
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“Just Here”
Joined: Jan 24, 2008
Comments: 5094
Hudsonville
ISP:
Wyoming, MI
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FUBAR!
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Joined: Jul 9, 2008
Comments: 1259
Grand Rapids, MI
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idunno wrote: <quoted text>
bush SR. is the REAL PROBLEM way back when he was AMBASSADOR TO CHINA.We ALL know this bush has NEVER had the intelligence to run this show he is a mere puppet of SR. and cheney.
bush's have SOLD AMERICA OUT a long time ago.As head of C.I.A. BUSH SR. has had EVERY major TERRORER(i made a new word just like jr.)on the payroll.
So damn near EVERY problem we have NOW all goes back to THE BUSH'S.......... Yea, because we all know what "powers" being an Ambassador gives you. LOL
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Julie
Grand Rapids, MI
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That's OK, George took her to Crawford to make up while Laura is house hunting without him. I bet it will be a 1 bedroom apartment with 1 twin bed... Pete wrote: Condi looked pretty stressed this morning. She is witnessing up close and personal another Bush/Cheney foreign policy fiasco on her watch as either National Security Adviso or SOS. I wonder if she is not acting as a human shield since she is only 25 miles away from the Russian tanks.
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Huck
Grand Rapids, MI
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Words od Wisdom. Idiot apples don't fall far from the tree.. idunno wrote: <quoted text>
bush SR. is the REAL PROBLEM way back when he was AMBASSADOR TO CHINA.We ALL know this bush has NEVER had the intelligence to run this show he is a mere puppet of SR. and cheney.
bush's have SOLD AMERICA OUT a long time ago.As head of C.I.A. BUSH SR. has had EVERY major TERRORER(i made a new word just like jr.)on the payroll.
So damn near EVERY problem we have NOW all goes back to THE BUSH'S..........
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Batch37 Pain Is Good
Altenburg, MO
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Hang tight, Russia is going to do something stupid over our agreement with Poland. What would the great savior Obama do?
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Seenitbefore
Grand Rapids, MI
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Batch37 Pain Is Good wrote: Hang tight, Russia is going to do something stupid over our agreement with Poland. What would the great savior Obama do? And you know exactly what savior McCain would do? Or is that you have a guess just like everyone else that isn't inside McCain's and Obama's head. My guess is Obama would listen closely to advisory from Sen Joe Bidden...who is chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee and has extensive foreign relations experience. He is also not afraid to push back hard when it's required but doesn't call to arms in response to harsh words. "Speak softly and carry a big stick." - Theodore Roosevelt
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Batch37 Pain Is Good
Altenburg, MO
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Seenitbefore wrote: <quoted text>
And you know exactly what savior McCain would do? Or is that you have a guess just like everyone else that isn't inside McCain's and Obama's head.
My guess is Obama would listen closely to advisory from Sen Joe Bidden...who is chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee and has extensive foreign relations experience. He is also not afraid to push back hard when it's required but doesn't call to arms in response to harsh words.
"Speak softly and carry a big stick." - Theodore Roosevelt McCain's stick is more experienced especially in that region.
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ALLEN
Dearborn, MI
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Fred Tornado wrote: <quoted text>You're spitting in the wind trying to argue with Bush haters. In their eyes, Bush is damned no matter what.
If he takes no action, he's a terrible president.
If he takes action, he's a terrible preisident.
He sponsors stimulus checks, he's a terrible president.
On the other hand, Obama realizes the difference between Sunni and Shia. We should elect him on this alone! the hell with obama
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ALLEN
Dearborn, MI
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ALLEN
Dearborn, MI
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The hell with obama
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Rock
Grand Rapids, MI
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aimNfire wrote: <quoted text>
**** did you tell us? Yeah, actually I did. It might not have been in this thread though, now that I think about it. Sorry...
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Rock
Grand Rapids, MI
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Batch37 Pain Is Good wrote: Hang tight, Russia is going to do something stupid over our agreement with Poland. What would the great savior Obama do? He'd throw money at them. That seems to be his answer for everything. Can't wait until my federal taxes double. Hopefully cooler heads will prevail when election time actually comes around.
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Judge it!
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