Proponents of Prop. 8 don't follow Jesus' teachings

That's beautiful!

Thanks so much for standing up against bigotry!
I applaud you!

To reply to John Morris' letter it is obvious he is not a theologian but a humanist and his Jesus is not the Jesus of the Bible. He has a misunderstanding of Jesus' life & purpose. The "essential point of His life" was not to resolve social ills but as MT 1:21 says, And she will bear a son; and you shall call His name Jesus for He shall save His people from their sins." As you submit your life to Christ you will begin the journey to become more Christlike Jesus did not dilute His ministry by addressing the social issues of day or to overthrow the Romans but to die and be resurrected thereby reconciling us to God. The "Hope of modern Christianity" is becoming Christian and submitting to the Sovereignty of God. Jesus and Bible never contradict each other. It is clear that marriage is between a man and a woman; that is God's determination, not man's view or opinion. No court or even electorate will change God's Word.

How is it bigotry when we were asked to vote on it? I guess if you didn't vote for Obama because he was black people would call that bigotry. The fact that a certain number of citizens of this state did not agree with Prop 8 automatically makes them bigots? Wow, be careful what you say to anyone, it might get you identified as something that you're not. It appears to me that the no on 8 folks are more upset because they assumed that they were living in the most liberal state in the union. Apparently they aren't. They assumed and we know what that is when broken down don't we? As Newsom Gavin said "Like it or not, it's here to stay!" It would be curious to see what was said if prop 8 had failed. I wonder then if the word bigot would have even shown up in conversation. Oh well, we'll never know.

Violet, bigotry? Oh please, it isn't about bigotry or human rights. If a civic union doesn't meet all the "rights" you want, talk to your representative in the Assembly or Senate. Marriage was ordained by God, not men. He has standards. Where is your outrage that siblings cannot marry? Is it bigotry that first cousins can't marry? Oh by the way, no one, according to our government, can marry without a license so it is a priviledge to marry, not a right. And for Sandy, yes John's understanding is "beautiful" but it is not correct.

To The Author.

There are NO "modern Christianity" mention in regards to the "King James" version of The Bible.[To which I know of].

In needs to go back and read up as to the ending of "Sodom and Gomorrah".

[Sodom and Gomorrah
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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"Gomorra" redirects here. For the Italian film, see Gomorra (film).
For other uses, see Sodom and Gomorrah (disambiguation).

The Destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah, John Martin, 1852.
The Sodom and Gomorrha motive from the Nuremberg Chronicle by Hartmann Schedel, 1493. Note Lot's wife, already transformed into a salt pillar, in the center.According to the Old Testament Biblical book of Genesis, Sodom (Arabic:سدوم SadÅ«m,Hebrew:×¡Ö°×“×•Ö Standard SÉ™dom Tiberian SÉ™á¸�ôm, Greek Σόδομ and Gomorrah (Arabic:عمورØAmÅ«rah, Hebrew:×¢Ö²×ž×•Ö Standard Ê¿Amora Tiberian Ä É™môrÄ�h /Ê¿Ä‚môrÄ�h, Greek ΓόμοÏ� were two cities in the Bible which were destroyed by God.

For the sins of their inhabitants Sodom, Gomorrah, Admah, and Zeboim were destroyed by "brimstone and fire from the Lord out of heaven" (Genesis 19:24-25). In Christianity and Islam, their names have become synonymous with impenitent sin, and their fall with a proverbial manifestation of God's wrath (Jude 1:7, Qur'an [1]).

Sodom and Gomorrah have been used as metaphors for vice and sexual deviation. The story has therefore given rise to words in several languages, including the English word "sodomy", a term used today predominantly in law (derived from traditional Christian usage) to describe non-vaginal intercourse, as well as bestiality.]

Think about what you write before placing herein.

I'm a "bigot" because I support marraige in the fundemental way??? When can not we have our own opinions? It has nothing to do with intolerance. So, it's okay to have 5 wives too? After all, thats their opinion.

Actually, bigots would be the people who spray-painted hate slogans and an anti-prop 8 message on the front of the LDS church in Ukiah, and then dug up their flowers and threw them at the front doors. THAT is bigotry.

But it's wrong for me to be angry about that because Jesus said so...?

Oh please, listen to all of you crying that you "are not bigots." Prop H8 was a proposition that allowed the majority to take away the rights of a minority and write discrimination into our state constitution. You can protest that you are not bigots, but I think that prop. H8 pretty much defines bigotry. And your religious beliefs are no excuse. You bought the title with your vote, you own it.

You are misled! You need to understand your flaw. First, Prop 8 wasn't an action of hate, but a love of family (like my wife and kids), the basic unit of society. I recognize and revere the significance of the traditional family structure, and I hope you may as well. For example, it is not only self-evident, but through literally hundreds of studies, its been proven that children raised by a mother and father develop better socially and mentally than other types of parent structures. I want the unique family structure, which is build on the institution of marriage, to last! Second, To be tolerant of people's actions is not to accept the wrong-doing, but to love the wrong-doer. To be tolerant is to condemn the sin, while showing compassion for the sinner. Jesus didn't preach gay marriage! Jesus taught, Luke 13:3 "except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish". He also taught Mark 10:7 "For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife". To show love and compassion for a child, isn't letting them define food as to include dog poop.

Good story, that's what religion should be, love, acceptance and all that. But in this case it's a show of power by the religious leaders and nothing else, just like ayatollah Khomeiny and the Shah, Ben Laden and his Mollahs and the Western world.

>You bought the title with your vote, you own it.

Really? Hmmm, all I remember is voting my conscience even though I knew I would be called a bigot by those who can't see any other perspectives on this issue. I'm aware of hurt feelings and a perception of reduced rights on both sides...

...And why is the solution to what you perceive as bigotry to become a bigot yourself?

Olgadawg: you seem to know so much about Sodom and Gommoreah the shots you might have got to cure you from it must have affected your brain.

Dennis Scoles: You seem to be so very technical in your knowledge of the bible, thence you cannot be a humanist, where does that leave you? A technical idiot or a hate monger? Or just a parrot.
Did you read what Connecticus 5.0 had to say about this?

Chuck Savage: the well named, no you're not a bigot, it's worse.

Ben from Utah: So many kids would be so much happier and probably way more socially adapted if they didn't have parents at all especially if they're like you, go dance under the rainbow bridge.

Fern, obviously you don't know what a humanist is: they prefer human wisdom over Godly wisdom. Where does that leave me? Right next to the Living God, Christ Jesus. Tolerance has no compassion, Truth does. Tolerance says go ahead, do whatever you want regardless of the consequences. Truth warns that you are doing wrong and will suffer the consequences. Yes Fern, I am a theological, I believe God's Word. Humanist are left to their own devices which is very, very sad.

Good News wrote:

>You bought the title with your vote, you own it.
Really? Hmmm, all I remember is voting my conscience even though I knew I would be called a bigot by those who can't see any other perspectives on this issue. I'm aware of hurt feelings and a perception of reduced rights on both sides...
...And why is the solution to what you perceive as bigotry to become a bigot yourself?

We were attacked and now find ourselves surrounded by those who see us as second-class citizens and feel proud of themselves for taking away our rights and breaking up our families or our chances of having our own. To understand that these people hate us enough to hurt us this badly and did it all in the name of their god... which is definetely not MY god. If understanding that the majority hates us, reviles us, and is intolerant enough of us to do this to us... and then have the gall to claim that "we don't hate gays..." It's almost too much to take, but please -- stop with the innocent act -- you meant to hurt us and you succeeded. Is it bigotry to recognize hatred in others? Is it bigotry to realize that we have been attacked and our family units ruined? Not to my understanding -- Prop. H8 was the most bigotted action of the century, and YOU were a part of why it passed. Yeah, I'm a little bitter, and am defensive because me and the people I care the most are surrounded by enemies, who if they are not beating us, taunting us or harrassing us are taking away our hopes of family and happiness through their evil little bigotted propositions. But go on and gloat and feel like you don't deserve our distain and distrust.

>you meant to hurt us and you succeeded

Sorry, but this is just an example of where you're listening only to your own perspective.

I'm sorry you think I hate you and want to take away your rights.(Is that really what you think?)

>Is it bigotry to realize that we have been attacked and our family units ruined?

Nope, it's bigotry to irrationally suspect or hate a particular group, race, or religion.

>Yeah, I'm a little bitter, and am defensive because me and the people I care the most are surrounded by enemies, who if they are not beating us, taunting us or harrassing us

I wonder if you really are surrounded by enemies, and if you are, I wonder if you've even talked to any of them about your feelings. 52% of the state are not bigots, and the more you treat them that way, the more you undermine positive progress.

Please don't let propagandists turn your vision of society into one big false dichotomy.

There is a huge difference between "tolerance" - as Morris describes Jesus' actions, and "acceptance." After Christ chided the accusers of the woman caught in adultery, he didn't tell her that her behavior was now acceptable, rather, he supported the Old Testament teachings and told her to "sin no more." No where did Jesus condone homosexual behavior/gay marriage, but he did condone marriage between a man and a woman (Matt. 19:5).

Ben wrote:

You are misled! You need to understand your flaw. First, Prop 8 wasn't an action of hate, but a love of family (like my wife and kids), the basic unit of society.

It was absolutely an act of hate. You may love your family, but we love ours too and your hate is doing its best to destroy our families. Marriage equality would not have affected your family at all, what you did you did out of bigotry and hate.

essay wrote:

There is a huge difference between "tolerance" - as Morris describes Jesus' actions, and "acceptance." After Christ chided the accusers of the woman caught in adultery, he didn't tell her that her behavior was now acceptable, rather, he supported the Old Testament teachings and told her to "sin no more." No where did Jesus condone homosexual behavior/gay marriage, but he did condone marriage between a man and a woman (Matt. 19:5).

He also taught love and acceptance of others... which I just don't see in modern "Christianity." I would love to see him write in the sand at your feet and see what colour you would turn.

Good News wrote:

>you meant to hurt us and you succeeded
Sorry, but this is just an example of where you're listening only to your own perspective.
I'm sorry you think I hate you and want to take away your rights.(Is that really what you think?)
>Is it bigotry to realize that we have been attacked and our family units ruined?
Nope, it's bigotry to irrationally suspect or hate a particular group, race, or religion.
>Yeah, I'm a little bitter, and am defensive because me and the people I care the most are surrounded by enemies, who if they are not beating us, taunting us or harrassing us
I wonder if you really are surrounded by enemies, and if you are, I wonder if you've even talked to any of them about your feelings. 52% of the state are not bigots, and the more you treat them that way, the more you undermine positive progress.
Please don't let propagandists turn your vision of society into one big false dichotomy.

That is absolutely "what I think." There was no other reason to vote for Prop H8, except to TAKE rights away from a minority population.
"Irrationally suspect a group?" Are you kidding me here? Look at any one of the posts on this board... look at the TV ads and the statements of religious leaders... RELIGION, especially Mormonism and fundamentalist Christianity, was the impetus behind the H8 debacle and our loss of rights. That is not irrational, that is reality. Christianity and Mormonism worked their butts off to prove themselves hateful bigots in their attack on us. I may not hate all Christians now, but I do distrust and disbelieve anything they say and have an absolute belief that they are not followers of Christ at all.
It IS one dichotomy. There is the GLBT community, our allies (god love them!), our friends and the rest of you who will continue to do your best to battle us at every turn and would be more then happy to see us have every right stripped away from us, our families dissolved and us shoved back into the "closet" where you are assurred we belong.
Before you go preaching love and all that other flim-flammery please remove this knife from our backs... it is kinda hard to listen with it there.