Fire board is feeling the heat

Has the Belmont-San Carlos Fire Department board ever heard of the terms layoffs or pay cuts? These firefighter folks are being given huge pay, benefit, and retirement packages. Maybe they need to take a serious pay cut so they can keep their jobs.

The taxpayers have spoken and they said that they want fire protection services at a fair price.

In God We Trust has obviously never tried to become a firefighter or fire captain or paramedic. It would be foolish to joke that firing or taking away from those willing to do what she is not is the only or best solution. To answer your question, yes, the Fire Board has heard of the terms layoffs and pay cuts, they're just a bit smarter than some vocal & cheap bible-thumpers. You are requesting very high risks to save a few bucks in leiu of having adequate fire & medical protection. I hope that it works out for you. You can't buy new family members with what you are going to save by voting down the $93/year tax. Good luck. Sleep well.

Paul seems to think that no one on the Peninsula has a job, does it well, sacrifices, or has faced danger. Except of course these fire fighters.

Does huge salaries and huge retirement benefits necessarily give us fire protection? No it dosen't. What it gives you is overpaid firefighters. Paul's argument is that if you pay a firefighter more he is better. How? We paid them less twenty years ago, were those guys chumps? This life time 100% salaried retirement is unaffordable. I noted in today's papaer the fire board even talked about increasing vacation pay. These guys work on average three days a week.

People are not stupid. They see what is happening. And they know a rip off when they see one.

Fire personnel and cops are paid handsomely (overpaid) for the risks they assume here in San Mateo County. The risks they assume here in San Mateo County are tiny compared to the risks that people in the military are assuming in Iraq. If we are going to pay the cops and fire personnel in relation to the risks they take, perhaps we should put the firemen and cops in San Mateo County on the same pay and benefit scale that enlisted personnel receive in the military. Well, then again, maybe they still would be earning too much money for the comparative risks they take to the military personnel serving in Iraq.

I wonder why some other employees aren't insisting on higher pay and benefits for high risk work. What about the guys who climb the high voltage poles for PGE, what about tree trimmers, public works people? Those guys risk their lives daily, 8-hours a day five days a week. Firefighter's lives are at risk only when they're on a dangerous fire call, the rest of the time they're training, unlocking doors, onr a medical call, doing inspections or sleeping. What is the number of hours of danger in comparison to the number of hours they are paid for? I would guess 10-hours per year.
Firefighters should stop whining, you've got it good and the public is on to you.

It is easy to take the Police Department or the Fire Department for granted, unless you are calling 911. They will come and help you when you are in trouble, wheather you appreciate them or not. They will come and help you or your family even if you are not nice to them. If one of your family members crashes thier car off of devils slide, there wil be several highly trained firefighters, and police officers and sheriffs deputies that will come to help. They will go over that cliff, without thinking about themselves to help your loved one. I have several family members that are in both the police and fire departments, and I dont believe any of them are in it for the money. I appreciate what they do for us and am glad that I live in a comunity that supports thier police and fire depts. I live in Pacifica and we passed a parcel tax in 2003 to help support our fir dept.

Hey Rob, what is the point of your post? The point is that saving and rescuing people is what the police and firefighters are paid to do. If they didn't do that, they would not be doing their job and would be fired.

Just to let you know, police and firefighters are not the only people who do things for society. Once again, the jobs of the soldiers, sailors, marines, and air force personnel in Iraq are significantly more dangerous than what most local cops and firemen are exposed to in thier jobs; yet these people work for a fraction of what cops and firefighters in San Mateo County earn.

One California law enforcement job that comes close to or in some cases is on par with being as dangerous as being a soldier in Iraq is being a California Highway Patrol Officer. I think a CHP Officer earns about $56,880 per year when they graduate from CHP academy. On a risk adjusted basis, that is not a lot of money. Especially if you are a motorcycle officer who only earns 4% more than the standard base pay.

I think many folks are missing the point of why the election results came out the way they did. If you read the summary of the election results closely you will learn that the apartment owners and business owners in both cities are what caused the assessment election to fail. In both cites, a majority of the residential property owners voted to accept the assessment. I believe that the amount of the assessment was reasonable, but I feel that paying the assessment for fifteen (15) should be re-considered? Somewhere around 5-10 years would probably be more in order. Otherwise, I feel our firefighters deserve our votes. Bob Cancilla, Belmont.

Bob we can all read the results. The reason this failed is the vote was weighted based on the amount of the assessment. The much higher cost to commercial and multi-residential owners obviously would garner a NO vote.

We all support the fire fighters. But it is time for these people to understand there are limits to these rich contracts. That is what is behind this whole mess. Not the cost of a fire truck as was advertised, but the cost of the fire fighter's salaries and benefit package. It has grown so high as to be unaffordable.

There has been at least three votes on this all have been NO. Maybe they should spend this time working within the rich budget they already have.

The fire dept needed the money to fund the very expensive retirement plans. 90% salary after thirty years--not bad. It created a million dollar deficit the first year it was enacted.

The salary, retirement, benefit fiasco that cities in California are facing is a direct result of local politicians who just can't say no to the public employee unions. The public employee unions are very active in local politics. Without the support of these unions it is very difficult (almost impossible) for a council member or supervisor to get elected. When it comes time to negotiate salaries and benefits for the cops and firefighters, the politicians that they helped elect usually roll over and give them almost anything they want.

The problem is that if these pay, retirement, and benefit increases continue; pretty soon the cities and counties in California will be paying so much for the retirement pay and benefits of retired firefighters, cops, and other municipal employees that there will be almost nothing left in the budget to do anything else. In addition, if the pay, benefit, and retirement increases continue, pretty soon you will have a rookie firefighter or cop earning $200,000 or $300,000 per year. After awhile a city or municipal entity, already burdened with having to pay for retired municipal employees will either not be able to afford any firefighters or cops or have to live with a skeleton staff of a few hyper-priced employees.

Of course, there is always the third alternative of municipal bankruptcy which will result in all municipal employees losing the part of their pensions and benefits subsidized by the municipal entity declaring bankruptcy.

firefighters make way too much money, period. Their salaries, overtime pay, pension, retirement are all too much. What government employee deserves to get paid for sleeping, eating, cooking, washing their car, playing sports, working out, watching t.v., and whatever else they do while on the clock? It is an outrage. If firefighters were in the private sector than more power to them. But they are not. Every taxpayer should be outraged with their compensation package.

I am sooo happy to see that people are finally waking up on these way out of control salaries given to the fire fighters. They use this "HERO" shield to justify this obscene system of overpaid salaries.

The solution is simple yet non-acheivable. The problem is these union bums who run these small town's councils. No council member wants to lose the endorsement of the firefighters.

The solution? All new hires are paid a reduced salary and benefit package. Period. We also forbid "double dipping". This is where a fire fighter retires to a full pension then turns around and works again for another fire department and increases his pension and benefit package. San Jose has several fire fighters able to make $200,000 per year and more under this system. We stop that and the control will be back in the hands of the Cities and not the unions.

Oh, by the way, I work as a comptroller for a large company. Hold a graduate degree and make less than the fire fighter who has a glorified high school diploma.

Paul wrote:

In God We Trust has obviously never tried to become a firefighter or fire captain or paramedic. It would be foolish to joke that firing or taking away from those willing to do what she is not is the only or best solution. To answer your question, yes, the Fire Board has heard of the terms layoffs and pay cuts, they're just a bit smarter than some vocal & cheap bible-thumpers. You are requesting very high risks to save a few bucks in leiu of having adequate fire & medical protection. I hope that it works out for you. You can't buy new family members with what you are going to save by voting down the $93/year tax. Good luck. Sleep well.

Thats correct Paul. Firefighters are overpaid, underutilized, and are premadonas....This job should be contracted out. You would get a better product. Welcome to the real world.

Take a look around when was the last structure fire? In the city I live hasn't been a structure fire in 86 days yes no house fires. So how are they having overtime well let's see it's time for my shift to end there is a call across town let's all go for a ride to make sure that the other station can handle that minor fender bender with no injuries. Way over paid and way under worked, how many other people working a real fulltime job can handle a second job as a contractor or Electrician you couldn't but a fireman could because they don't do crap.

I completely concur with your comment that firefighters are overly compensated for their duties. I know several personally and for failing out of highschool, and working 2 days per week, where 80% of their time is spent washing their trucks, working out and playing computer games, the base pay is too much, not even to mention the unlimited overtime they get. Then whenever there is a fire, they all automatically get double-pay, regardless that the state prisoners are the ones actaully fighter the fires.
California has been in a budget disaster and these firefighter unions are killing the taxpayers, with lifetime med/dental benefits and 120% pensions (there isn't a corporation in America that can match those benefits).

In God We Trust wrote:

Fire personnel and cops are paid handsomely (overpaid) for the risks they assume here in San Mateo County. The risks they assume here in San Mateo County are tiny compared to the risks that people in the military are assuming in Iraq. If we are going to pay the cops and fire personnel in relation to the risks they take, perhaps we should put the firemen and cops in San Mateo County on the same pay and benefit scale that enlisted personnel receive in the military. Well, then again, maybe they still would be earning too much money for the comparative risks they take to the military personnel serving in Iraq.

Anytime you have a Union operation, you won't see innovative, efficient value for the dollar. Can't the public see "why" there is such a huge waiting list to become a firfighter -- because of the lucrative benefits, easy work schedule and absolute job security (99.87% will retain their jobs -- no requirement for performance).

Daniel wrote:

<quoted text>Thats correct Paul. Firefighters are overpaid, underutilized, and are premadonas....This job should be contracted out. You would get a better product. Welcome to the real world.

It's silly to argue that firefighters aren't overpaid. You have to be brain dead to think that an occupation that paid $163,000 to a guy (San Jose firefighter) with little more than a high school education and an occupation that the Orange County Register states that there are thousands of applicants every time there's an opening in the fire department isn't overpaid. Get real--they are overpaid! I won't even get into the outlandish pension benefits, getting paid while you sleep, working two to three days per week, phony disability claims, unbelievable "free time" at work, overtime schemes, excessive vacation, etc. It's ridiculous!
The firefighters have the "perfect storm". They pay union dues, the unions pay off the politicians, who in turn give the firefighters whatever they want and pass the costs onto the taxpayer. In my opinion, this is a public function that begs to be privatized. Private equity is spending billions on taking over companies. Their expertise is to turnaround companies that usually have poor management. The Fire Department, when it comes to reducing costs, has no management. It would be interesting to see what the firefighter wages/benefits would be in a free market system. Just think, paying people what they are worth. What a novel idea! They could even keep their union. The union hacks would find it more difficult negotiating with profit minded management rather than just handing out bags of money (figure of speech) to politicians. Hey, the firefighters may even have to go to work five days a week and be required to stay awake like the rest of America's workforce. Sounds impossible but maybe they wouldn't even be allowed to polish their cars, boats and RV's at work!

Ya'll need to stop griping. Youre just jealous that you don't have the same pay, benefits and retirement package where you are employed. If your job offered you that, I'm sure you wouldn't be begging for a reduction in pay because you "didn't think it was fair that you were paid so much, and other people who were probably working harder were getting paid less." Are you aware that firefighters have a significantly reduced life expectancy? Why don't you try and become a firefighter and see how hard it actually is....oh wait, you don't really "care" about the community, so you wouldnt get hired if you tried. And by the way, MOST firefighters stay awake during the day. All you people care about is a number $$$, when most firefighters dont get into this profession for the money. If you ask any of them, they will tell you that they love their job, not because of a paycheck, but because helping people is rewarding far beyond money. What are you going to do.....stick it to the fire department? Your'e a bunch of fools.....

Jenny wrote:

Ya'll need to stop griping. Youre just jealous that you don't have the same pay, benefits and retirement package where you are employed. If your job offered you that, I'm sure you wouldn't be begging for a reduction in pay because you "didn't think it was fair that you were paid so much, and other people who were probably working harder were getting paid less." Are you aware that firefighters have a significantly reduced life expectancy? Why don't you try and become a firefighter and see how hard it actually is....oh wait, you don't really "care" about the community, so you wouldnt get hired if you tried. And by the way, MOST firefighters stay awake during the day. All you people care about is a number $$$, when most firefighters dont get into this profession for the money. If you ask any of them, they will tell you that they love their job, not because of a paycheck, but because helping people is rewarding far beyond money. What are you going to do.....stick it to the fire department? Your'e a bunch of fools.....

I would hope that ALL firefighters stay awake during the day (not just most as you state above). Staying awake during the day is a requirement to do their job and get paid. I agree that a firefighter's job is rewarding. However, the pay, benefits, and pension are way out of line for them having a little more than a high school education. Saving and rescuing people is what firefighters are paid to do. If they didn't do that, they would not be doing their job and would be fired.

Just to let you know, firefighters are not the only people who do things for society. Once again, the jobs of the soldiers, sailors, marines, and air force personnel in Iraq are significantly more dangerous than what most local firemen are exposed to in their jobs; yet these people work for a fraction of what firefighters earn.