Our Apologies

Debbiez wrote:

I'm proud to be a straight woman and proud that I am raising god fearing law abidding staight citzens. Yes I am ANTIGAY.

What would you do if one of your children told you they were gay? Something tells me you would either kick him or her out of the house or shoot them. I bet you call yourself a Christian too?

Barbara Wilcox wrote:

Wasn't OKC bombed by a terrorist 13 years ago? Didn't dozens of people die? Haven't terrorists killed thousands of Americans since? How can having gay neighbors be worse than that? I'm not saying Sally Kern has to LIKE gay people. She just needs to exhibit some common sense.

Thank you for not yelling your remarks. This is how the dialogue should go.

Carl wrote:

Sally Kern, her ilk and the Republican's narrow-mindedness shows why our nation, as a whole, are in the condition it is today. Go back 8 years ago before the Bush regime and Republican surge and you will find that our nation was respected by other nations, gas was $1.47 a gallon, OPEC was at $28 dollars a barrel (today it neared $110), we were not at war (especially with a nation that had nothing to do with 9/11), the stock market was booming, jobless rates were down, and the nation was not in a steep recession.
While other free nations move forward and into the 21st century, Sally Kern wants to step backward, into biblical times. As such, she should be reminded that her opinion and her freedom of speech, which she so falls back on, is non-existent in the Bible. She, as a female is subserviant to the male, and would have no power.
I find it amazing when people use the Bible to promote their hate, but they themselves don't follow the scripture. If that was so, Sally Kerns would have to remain silent, and not hold any power. I wonder how many of these posters who support Sally Kerns are divorced and remarried? There are a few verses concerning that in the Bible. Those of you who want to quote the Bible for hate, seem to forget that we have moved on since Biblical/Puritan times. If you want to, for the most part, live by the Bible then live as the respected Amish do. Then, just then, maybe I will show these 'Christians' some respect.
Ms. Kern and her followers are no better than Rev. Fred Phelps. Of the seven deadly sins, the most prevalent on this board promoting hate to homosexuals is "WRATH". So, next time you see a Bible thumper promoting hate, make sure you remind them that they are going to the devil, because, we are all GOD's children, at least that was what I was taught.

Eloquently stated.

Sally Kern's remarks are rediculous to say the least! For someone who holds office to make such hatred filled comments is unacceptable. Maybe Mrs. Kern needs to listen to her husbands sermons a little more closely. I am embarred about the fact she grew up in Arkansas! She needs to be stripped of any political power and cast aside. Old women in glass houses shouldnt be the first to cast biblical stones!!

BOYS KEEP SWINIGING wrote:

<quoted text>
What would you do if one of your children told you they were gay? Something tells me you would either kick him or her out of the house or shoot them. I bet you call yourself a Christian too?

Debbie have you read your bible? Have you had premarrital sex? umm hummm thought so.. What an ignorant person YOU ARE!!

Sorry, but I had to yell!

Lynn wrote:

Freedom of speech is a precious right. Intimidating people into silence is the highest form of fear. If you believe in allowing that discussion without shouting, death threats and mob mentality then it reveals confidence the truth of your position. Is Rep. Kern revealing the hidden fears of some politically driven groups?

Kern has tried to silence the gay voice in this state many times. Where were you in challenging Kern over that?

Death threats and mob mentality? Sorry, when you use hate speech that happens. Both sides will respond. Some on one side will be violent because Kern has convinced them gays are after their children and some on the gay side will be violent trying to squash a nutcase inciting hate towards them.

This is Oklahoma City. We endured a major terrorist attack on our city that left 168 dead, including 19 children. Kern wasn't even a resident of the state at that time or perhaps she'd have had more sympathy to the citizens that suffered through that bloodbath.

Then to have her say gays are worst than terrorists? Excuse me but in Oklahoma we have a real body count when it comes to terrorists. We have a real body count when it comes to Christians murdering gay people. We have a real record of Christians burning crosses on the lawns of gay people. We have a real record of Christian packs going to gay establishments and terrorizing and assaulting the patrons. We have a real record of police and government agents doing the same.

What we don't have is a record of gays killing people for being Christian or straight.

If Kerns is hearing death threats...good. Now she'll get a bit of understanding to what her hate speech causes.

Mark wrote:

<quoted text>
Not sure why, I just found this forum recently. If you want to discuss other sins, fine with me, I was just keeping to this one.
But you are correct, there is no hierarchy to sins, they are all sins in God's sight. I think it is just because Kern made the comments she did.
There are 2 reasons I have been posting.
#1 Is because I believe it to be my calling to witness to others. I will not do this by cramming my religion down anyone's throat. If you disagree, that's your prerogative, and I will still pray for you. If you believe I have, I apologize, it was not my intention, I was only trying to pass along what I believe to be the Gospel of Jesus Christ, but sometimes (often) my sinfulness gets the best of me.
#2 It is very intellectually stimulating to find other intelligent people of differing views to debate with. I hope I have done my best to not degrade anyone or treat anyone with the respect--THEY DESERVE. If you're a troll, you deserve little, but politeness goes a long way and I will try to reciprocate.
I know is impossible for me to change anyone's mind, that is up to God. But He does call me to tell others about Him. So I know that since we are debating from 2 completely opposite standpoints, we have very little chance of convincing someone differently. You won't change my mind, just like I won't change yours, I don't consider either of us small-minded, just convinced that our views are the correct ones.

Well stated Mark

Was she, as a Christian woman, talking about matters of faith, with a bare head? He needs to cover her head, so the angels don't get all hot and bothered, go home and talk to her husband about it, and let him decide whether or not to talk about it. At least if she wants to follow what the BIBLE has to say. 1 Corinthians 2-16, concerning the propriety in worship.

Jillian_Philadelphia wrote:

<quoted text>
Eloquently stated.

I'm soooo tired of hearing Christians being compared to Fred Phelps. That's like comparing Muhammad Ali to Osama Bin Laden! Fred Phelps is not a true Christian, he's a poor example of a human being, much less a representative of Christ. As far as your applauding the comments stated about how great America was before the Bush administrations, give me a break! The RADICAL Islamists have always hated Christians and the western way of life, maybe gas was a $1.47 ten years ago, hey guess what 10 years before that it was less than a dollar, and so on, and so on.

Terry wrote:

<quoted text>
I'm soooo tired of hearing Christians being compared to Fred Phelps. That's like comparing Muhammad Ali to Osama Bin Laden! Fred Phelps is not a true Christian, he's a poor example of a human being, much less a representative of Christ. As far as your applauding the comments stated about how great America was before the Bush administrations, give me a break! The RADICAL Islamists have always hated Christians and the western way of life, maybe gas was a $1.47 ten years ago, hey guess what 10 years before that it was less than a dollar, and so on, and so on.

Most Christians I know are not like Fred Phelps, even the ones who believe homosexuality a sin. The comments made by Sally Kerns were very much like him.
Again, Mrs. Kerns said gays are more a threat than terrorists. We are at war with terrorists. We can enlist in the military, receive a rifle, and shoot them. She also said gays are a cancer that need to be removed. Those are chilling words. Remove like a cancer?
These words can and most likely will bring on more violence toward gays. However fun a blog may be for some, remember, people can die because of these words. This is not a free speech issue, its a violence issue.
Sally Kern needs to say publicly that she denounces all violence towards gays and lesbians. After the statements she made, she needs to be that forceful.
And in the future, she will do well to grab her concordance and look up all references to the tongue and its destructive power. It is, after all, the soft word which crushes bone, not the angry rant.
Either way you believe, if the possibility of people being shot or tied to cars and pulled to their deaths(removed as a cancer) doesn't at least bring a pause, well, that too is quite chilling.

It is amazing to see that many people of Oklahoma "100%" back the remarks of this Representative. I think that many of the ignorant people remarking their congratulations forget to remember that the expressions of hate through WORDS have been used in the past against others with different "lifestyles" and beliefs with dire consequences. Hitler voiced his hate through strong words and brainwashed people into thinking others were morally wrong. In the 1960's Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. was killed because certain groups of people thought and expressed his and other African American lives were invaluable. Many of you talk of teaching your children what is right. This surely cannot be the correct stance. This kind of bigotry, ignorance and hate goes much further than a point of view. Hate is hate. Remember that the hate and willful ignorance you practice and express today will be the hate ignorance others remember you by in the future. For those of you speaking especially of the Bible, I would guess this to be particularly important to you.

dan wrote:

<quoted text>
Most Christians I know are not like Fred Phelps, even the ones who believe homosexuality a sin. The comments made by Sally Kerns were very much like him.
Again, Mrs. Kerns said gays are more a threat than terrorists. We are at war with terrorists. We can enlist in the military, receive a rifle, and shoot them. She also said gays are a cancer that need to be removed. Those are chilling words. Remove like a cancer?
These words can and most likely will bring on more violence toward gays. However fun a blog may be for some, remember, people can die because of these words. This is not a free speech issue, its a violence issue.
Sally Kern needs to say publicly that she denounces all violence towards gays and lesbians. After the statements she made, she needs to be that forceful.
And in the future, she will do well to grab her concordance and look up all references to the tongue and its destructive power. It is, after all, the soft word which crushes bone, not the angry rant.
Either way you believe, if the possibility of people being shot or tied to cars and pulled to their deaths(removed as a cancer) doesn't at least bring a pause, well, that too is quite chilling.

I agree, most Christians are nothing like Phelps, but I disagree that Sally Kerns remarks were like his.I don't know if you listened to the twenty minute interview she gave, but she stated in that interview that she did not hate gays, she just disagrees with their lifestyle.
Yes our war against terrorism is a physical battle, but it is also a spiritual battle as well. I don't think her statements will be the motivation for violence against gays (not sane people anyway) anymore than legalizing guns will cause people to murder others.
The battle against terrorism is spiritual, and the battle to preserve the american family is a spiritual one! I think what Ms. Kern meant by saying homosexuality is like a cancer was not so much that it needs to be removed like a cancer, but rather it spreads like a cancer.
I think she knows that homosexuality will never be removed from our society, at least not until Jesus returns.
Indeed, words are powerful, they can either build up, or tear down. It's really tough to be in the public eye, I for one am praying for her, and for this great nation.

Today my nephew attempted to deliver a letter to Sally Kern but was stopped by a highway patrol man. With his permission I am distributing the letter to all news stations and thought I would include it here.

Maybe we can all stand to learn a listen from this smart, loving, young man. He more than most has reason to hate. He lost his mother, my sister, in the Murrah Building bombing.

I am doing this in two parts because of how long it is.

Rep Kern:

On April 19, 1995, in Oklahoma City a terrorist detonated a bomb that killed my mother and 167 others. 19 children died that day. Had I not had the chicken pox that day, the body count would've likely have included one more. Over 800 other Oklahomans were injured that day and many of those still suffer through their permanent wounds.

That terrorist was neither a homosexual or was he involved in Islam. He was an extremist Christian forcing his views through a body count. He held his beliefs and made those who didn't live up to them pay with their lives.

As you were not a resident of Oklahoma on that day, it could be explained why you so carelessly chose words saying that the homosexual agenda is worst than terrorism. I can most certainly tell you through my own experience that is not true. I am sure there are many people in your voting district that laid a loved one to death after the terrorist attack on Oklahoma City. I kind of doubt you'll find one of them that will agree with you.

I was five years old when my mother died. I remember what a beautiful, wise, and remarkable woman she was. I miss her. Your harsh words and misguided beliefs brought me to tears, because you told me that my mother's killer was a better person than a group of people that are seeking safety and tolerance for themselves.

As someone left motherless and victimized by terrorists, I say to you very clearly you are absolutely wrong.

-cont-

Today my nephew attempted to deliver a letter to Sally Kern but was stopped by a highway patrol man. With his permission I am distributing the letter to all news stations and thought I would include it here.

Maybe we can all stand to learn a listen from this smart, loving, young man. He more than most has reason to hate. He lost his mother, my sister, in the Murrah Building bombing.

I am doing this in two parts because of how long it is.

Rep Kern:

On April 19, 1995, in Oklahoma City a terrorist detonated a bomb that killed my mother and 167 others. 19 children died that day. Had I not had the chicken pox that day, the body count would've likely have included one more. Over 800 other Oklahomans were injured that day and many of those still suffer through their permanent wounds.

That terrorist was neither a homosexual or was he involved in Islam. He was an extremist Christian forcing his views through a body count. He held his beliefs and made those who didn't live up to them pay with their lives.

As you were not a resident of Oklahoma on that day, it could be explained why you so carelessly chose words saying that the homosexual agenda is worst than terrorism. I can most certainly tell you through my own experience that is not true. I am sure there are many people in your voting district that laid a loved one to death after the terrorist attack on Oklahoma City. I kind of doubt you'll find one of them that will agree with you.

I was five years old when my mother died. I remember what a beautiful, wise, and remarkable woman she was. I miss her. Your harsh words and misguided beliefs brought me to tears, because you told me that my mother's killer was a better person than a group of people that are seeking safety and tolerance for themselves.

As someone left motherless and victimized by terrorists, I say to you very clearly you are absolutely wrong.

A Believer wrote:

<quoted text>I see you are correct; you aren't an expert on the Bible. Even if you believed David and Jonathan were homosexual, which they weren't, you need to know that Jesus is the only perfect person who has ever lived.

Oh I do believe Jesus is perfect. Where you there, how do you know Jonathan and David where not homosexual? My view is that some of the people who claim to be the 'most Christian', are the least Christian acting. Seems to me that for a country that claims to be so Christian, there are no laws against adultry, keeping the seventh day holy, honoring your parents, coveting thy neighbors wife or house.

Afraid gays are running this country? Want to protect marriage? Lets implement a new law.

You get married in a church, you must get divorced by your church. If you church refuses, tough luck.

After all, I am not the one to made a promise to God and breaking the promise.

my nephew tried to deliver a letter to Sally Kern but was stopped by a highway patrol man. With his permission I am sending the letter to all news and include it here.
Rep Kern: On April 19, 1995, in Oklahoma City a terrorist detonated a bomb that killed my mother and 167 others. 19 children died that day. Had I not had the chicken pox that day, the body count would've likely have included one more. Over 800 other Oklahomans were injured that day and many of those still suffer through their permanent wounds. That terrorist was neither a homosexual or was he involved in Islam. He was an extremist Christian forcing his views through a body count. He held his beliefs and made those who didn't live up to them pay with their lives.
As you were not a resident of Oklahoma on that day, it could be explained why you so carelessly chose words saying that the homosexual agenda is worst than terrorism. I can most certainly tell you through my own experience that is not true. I am sure there are many people in your voting district that laid a loved one to death after the terrorist attack on Oklahoma City. I kind of doubt you'll find one of them that will agree with you. I was five years old when my mother died. I remember what a beautiful, wise, and remarkable woman she was. I miss her. Your harsh words and misguided beliefs brought me to tears, because you told me that my mother's killer was a better person than a group of people that are seeking safety and tolerance for themselves.
You represent a district in Oklahoma City and you very coldly express a lack of love, sympathy or understanding for what they've been through. Can I ask if you might have chosen wiser words were you a real Oklahoman that was here to share the suffering with Oklahoma City? Might your heart be a bit less cold had you been around to see the small bodies of children being pulled out of rubble and carried away by weeping firemen?
I've spent 12 years in Oklahoma public schools and never once have I had anyone try to force a gay agenda on me. I have seen, however, many gay students beat up and there's never a day in school that has went by when I haven't heard the word **** slung at someone. I've been called gay slurs many times and they hurt and I am not even gay so I can just imagine how a real gay person feels. You were a school teacher and you have seen those things too. How could you care so little about the suffering of some of your students?
Let me tell you the result of your words in my school. Every openly gay and suspected gay in the school were having to walk together Monday for protection. They looked scared. They've already experienced enough hate and now your words gave other students even more motivation to sneer at them and call them names. Afterall, you are a teacher and a lawmaker, many young people have taken your words to heart. That happens when you assume a role of responsibility in your community. I seriously think before this week ends that some kids here will be going home bruised and bloody because of what you said.
I have not had a mother for nearly 13 years now and wonder if there were fewer people like you around, people with more love and tolerance in their hearts instead of strife, if my mom would be here to watch me graduate from high school this spring. Now she won't be there. So I'll be packing my things and leaving Oklahoma to go to college elsewhere and one day be a writer and I have no intentions to ever return here. I have no doubt that people like you will incite crazy people to build more bombs and kill more people again. I don't want to be here for that. I just can't go through that again.
You may just see me as a kid, but let me try to teach you something. The old saying is sticks and stones will break your bones, but words will never hurt you. Well, your words hurt me. Your words disrespected the memory of my mom. Your words can cause others to pick up sticks and stones and hurt others.

The biggest threat to our country and democracy is not homosexuality. It's ignorant people like you. You are an embarrassment both to our government and your religion.
I was amused that you consider yourself to be a religious person. I was never under the impression that Jesus was a hate-mongering bigot like yourself.

You young man are gifted and you have much to teach us older adults. I join in your tears.

Please try to understand something though. Your mother never left you, she left you her heart and you are doing a **** good job in using it.