Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#1112 May 31, 2012
Kevin 321 wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, either Jesus lied, or you are, because Jesus plainly said "destroy this temple, and I......."
Jesus doesn't lie my friend, welcome to the trinity!
Kevin,

Now you are beginning to sound and reason like Dan or Will.

I never said that Jesus lied, I just understand what he meant. His faithful life course assured him of a resurrection.

Acts 2:32 (KJV)
This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.

Galatians 1:1
Paul, an apostle,(not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead;)

Romans 8:11
But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

Over and over, God's inspired Word says that God the Father resurrected Jesus.

Even Jesus taught us this fact. Just as Jesus was hated and despised, he endured to the end, and was saved from death.

Matthew 10:22
And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.

Hebrews 5:7
Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared;

Who was Jesus praying to?

Who was able to save Jesus from death?
Snorkler

Alberton, South Africa

#1113 Jun 1, 2012
Kevin 321 wrote:
<quoted text>
Only someone sooooo deeply soaked in the WT, could not see the correlation between these verses and the trinity. Or, you have ZERO to back the WT doctrines, so you are now deflecting.
Dont worry, the lurkers and silent viewers see completely. And once you have been shown, the blame no longer resides on my shoulders, but on yours.
The truth is that there has been no scripture that you posted that correlates to the Trinity ....not one ...and you know it .

Since: May 08

Location hidden

#1114 Jun 1, 2012
eagleeye2 wrote:
<quoted text>
You better get out of here. pam and mixed media and dan and pat and rhw have been crouching, ready to pounce, at the first sign of you. They have searched and cried for you, they have accused dozens of other posters of being you, they have nearly lost their will to live since you were gone. It's been hilarious watching them moan and groan and complain about you not being here and trying to pretend it doesn't bother them. This is going to be like being given a new lease on life for them.
I just peeked in for a few so they will have to get over the fact that "they do not matter to me". I'm sure they made quite a spectacle of themselves. They need to worry about their own lives and their friends. I have a life and am enjoying it. I'll send you some pictures.
Snorkler

Alberton, South Africa

#1115 Jun 1, 2012
JWForever wrote:
<quoted text>
I just peeked in for a few so they will have to get over the fact that "they do not matter to me". I'm sure they made quite a spectacle of themselves. They need to worry about their own lives and their friends. I have a life and am enjoying it. I'll send you some pictures.
Hello JW4EVA I missed you ...agape.

Since: May 08

Location hidden

#1116 Jun 1, 2012
Snorkler wrote:
<quoted text>Hello JW4EVA I missed you ...agape.
Hey brother Snorkler!! Missed you too! Hope all is well.

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#1117 Jun 1, 2012
Richardnak wrote:
<quoted text>
Kevin,
Now you are beginning to sound and reason like Dan or Will.
I never said that Jesus lied, I just understand what he meant. His faithful life course assured him of a resurrection.
Acts 2:32 (KJV)
This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.
Galatians 1:1
Paul, an apostle,(not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead;)
Romans 8:11
But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
Over and over, God's inspired Word says that God the Father resurrected Jesus.
Even Jesus taught us this fact. Just as Jesus was hated and despised, he endured to the end, and was saved from death.
Matthew 10:22
And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
Hebrews 5:7
Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared;
Who was Jesus praying to?
Who was able to save Jesus from death?
Sorry, Richardnak, I dont know who those people are. Back to the subject.

In John 2:18 the Jews were questioning Jesus' authority to cleanse the temple, and asked for a sign to signify this authority. Jesus answers them in verses 19-21.…
John 2:19-21 “Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up. Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days? But he spake of the temple of HIS BODY.”

Also, something very interesting also lies in this verse. Jesus informs everyone in verse 19 exactly who will perform this miraculous resurrection. He uses the word “I”, indicating that HE would be the one to raise himself from the dead. Now how would Jesus be able to perform this miracle if He was in a state of non-existence?

Did Jesus use the word "I" when He stated who would raise Him from the dead?

Now lets look at these verses a little closer, as there are some other very significant points that need to be considered.

Jesus may have even gestured, by pointing at his body as he used the words,“this” and “it”. But in no way can it be denied that he was speaking of his physical body! And the words “THIS” and “IT” does NOT allow for a substitute body to be used in future interactions with disciples.“This” and “it” indicate the exact same body that was crucified, would be the body that was raised from the dead. Remember that He stated that “THIS” temple will be destroyed, and “IT” would be raised again. These 2 very important words COMPLETELY ELIMINATE any possibility that the temple that was raised, would be a DIFFERENT temple than the one that was destroyed. Since the Christian congregation was not destroyed, then neither was this “temple” that was raised, a reference to the Christian congregation in this context. Since His physical body WAS put to death, then when Jesus said “IT” will be raised again, He could only be talking about that same physical body which was “destroyed”(put to death).

“The proof is in the pudding!”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#1118 Jun 1, 2012
Kevin 321 wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry, Richardnak, I dont know who those people are. Back to the subject.
In John 2:18 the Jews were questioning Jesus' authority to cleanse the temple, and asked for a sign to signify this authority. Jesus answers them in verses 19-21.…
John 2:19-21 “Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up. Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days? But he spake of the temple of HIS BODY.”
Also, something very interesting also lies in this verse. Jesus informs everyone in verse 19 exactly who will perform this miraculous resurrection. He uses the word “I”, indicating that HE would be the one to raise himself from the dead. Now how would Jesus be able to perform this miracle if He was in a state of non-existence?
Did Jesus use the word "I" when He stated who would raise Him from the dead?
Now lets look at these verses a little closer, as there are some other very significant points that need to be considered.
Jesus may have even gestured, by pointing at his body as he used the words,“this” and “it”. But in no way can it be denied that he was speaking of his physical body! And the words “THIS” and “IT” does NOT allow for a substitute body to be used in future interactions with disciples.“This” and “it” indicate the exact same body that was crucified, would be the body that was raised from the dead. Remember that He stated that “THIS” temple will be destroyed, and “IT” would be raised again. These 2 very important words COMPLETELY ELIMINATE any possibility that the temple that was raised, would be a DIFFERENT temple than the one that was destroyed. Since the Christian congregation was not destroyed, then neither was this “temple” that was raised, a reference to the Christian congregation in this context. Since His physical body WAS put to death, then when Jesus said “IT” will be raised again, He could only be talking about that same physical body which was “destroyed”(put to death).
*** rs p. 423 - p. 424 Trinity ***
John 2:19-22:
By what he here said, did Jesus mean that he would resurrect himself from the dead? Does that mean that Jesus is God, because Acts 2:32 says,“This Jesus God raised up”? Not at all. Such a view would conflict with Galatians 1:1, which ascribes the resurrection of Jesus to the Father, not to the Son. Using a similar mode of expression, at Luke 8:48 Jesus is quoted as saying to a woman:“Your faith has made you well.” Did she heal herself? No; it was power from God through Christ that healed her because she had faith.(Luke 8:46; Acts 10:38) Likewise, by his perfect obedience as a human, Jesus provided the moral basis for the Father to raise him from the dead, thus acknowledging Jesus as God’s Son. Because of Jesus’ faithful course of life, it could properly be said that Jesus himself was responsible for his resurrection.
Says A. T. Robertson in Word Pictures in the New Testament:“Recall [John] 2:19 where Jesus said:‘And in three days I will raise it up.’ He did not mean that he will raise himself from the dead independently of the Father as the active agent (Rom. 8:11).”—(New York, 1932), Vol. V, p. 183.

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#1119 Jun 1, 2012
Snorkler wrote:
<quoted text>The truth is that there has been no scripture that you posted that correlates to the Trinity ....not one ...and you know it .
Would you agree that if I prove that Jesus is God, that you would have to consider the other scriptures showing the personhood of the Holy Spirit? We have not even begun all the verses that speak of the HS.

Man oh man, I told you this would be a long thread.....lol.

I am pleased that we have kept it pleasant thus far. Lets continue.

“The proof is in the pudding!”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#1120 Jun 1, 2012
Kevin 321 wrote:
<quoted text>
Would you agree that if I prove that Jesus is God, that you would have to consider the other scriptures showing the personhood of the Holy Spirit? We have not even begun all the verses that speak of the HS.
Man oh man, I told you this would be a long thread.....lol.
I am pleased that we have kept it pleasant thus far. Lets continue.
YOU WILL NEVER PROVE JESUS IS ALMIGHTY GOD! The bible simply does not teach this, because if it did I would believe it.

“The proof is in the pudding!”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#1121 Jun 1, 2012
Jesus is the only-begotten Son of God, the only Son produced by Jehovah alone. This Son is the firstborn of all creation. By means of him all other things in heaven and on earth were created. He is the second-greatest personage in the universe. It is this Son whom Jehovah sent to the earth to give his life as a ransom for mankind, thus opening the way to eternal life for those of Adam’s offspring who would exercise faith. This same Son, restored to heavenly glory, now rules as King, with authority to destroy all the wicked and to carry out his Father’s original purpose for the earth. The Hebrew form of the name Jesus means “Jehovah Is Salvation”; Christ is the equivalent of the Hebrew Mashiach (Messiah), meaning “Anointed One.”

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#1122 Jun 1, 2012
Duh-boy wrote:
<quoted text>
*** rs p. 423 - p. 424 Trinity ***
John 2:19-22:
By what he here said, did Jesus mean that he would resurrect himself from the dead? Does that mean that Jesus is God, because Acts 2:32 says,“This Jesus God raised up”? Not at all. Such a view would conflict with Galatians 1:1, which ascribes the resurrection of Jesus to the Father, not to the Son. Using a similar mode of expression, at Luke 8:48 Jesus is quoted as saying to a woman:“Your faith has made you well.” Did she heal herself? No; it was power from God through Christ that healed her because she had faith.(Luke 8:46; Acts 10:38) Likewise, by his perfect obedience as a human, Jesus provided the moral basis for the Father to raise him from the dead, thus acknowledging Jesus as God’s Son. Because of Jesus’ faithful course of life, it could properly be said that Jesus himself was responsible for his resurrection.
Says A. T. Robertson in Word Pictures in the New Testament:“Recall [John] 2:19 where Jesus said:‘And in three days I will raise it up.’ He did not mean that he will raise himself from the dead independently of the Father as the active agent (Rom. 8:11).”—(New York, 1932), Vol. V, p. 183.
I am saying this to you in a friendly way, stop the copy and pastes from the Watchtower. All it shows is that you can not defend the doctrine yourself.

I will ask you once again.....Did Jesus say HE would raise it up?

John 2:19-21 “Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up. Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days? But he spake of the temple of HIS BODY.”

Just a YES or NO.

“The proof is in the pudding!”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#1123 Jun 1, 2012
Kevin 321 wrote:
<quoted text>
I am saying this to you in a friendly way, stop the copy and pastes from the Watchtower. All it shows is that you can not defend the doctrine yourself.
I will ask you once again.....Did Jesus say HE would raise it up?
John 2:19-21 “Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up. Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days? But he spake of the temple of HIS BODY.”
Just a YES or NO.
I'm so well equipped. There is no need to waste time and put things in my own words. Reasonable people will read the c/p and see the truth, while bias people like you will not consider the information because of preconcieved ideas about the authors.
Snorkler

Alberton, South Africa

#1124 Jun 1, 2012
Kevin 321 wrote:
<quoted text>
Would you agree that if I prove that Jesus is God, that you would have to consider the other scriptures showing the personhood of the Holy Spirit? We have not even begun all the verses that speak of the HS.
Man oh man, I told you this would be a long thread.....lol.
I am pleased that we have kept it pleasant thus far. Lets continue.
Are You here admitting that you do not have scripture speaking of a Trinity or Proving a Trinity ? If you could prove that Jesus was God that would then mean that you proved that Jesus was God , but the "Deal" was that you would prove the Trinity by7 us going through them one by one which you have failed to do ....Again ...Where do we have a Scripture telling us that " God , Jesus and the Holy spirit are one and the same person or Equal.....this is what you need to do ...this is what you said you would do.

“The proof is in the pudding!”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#1125 Jun 1, 2012
Kevin 321 wrote:
<quoted text>
I am saying this to you in a friendly way, stop the copy and pastes from the Watchtower. All it shows is that you can not defend the doctrine yourself.
I will ask you once again.....Did Jesus say HE would raise it up?
John 2:19-21 “Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up. Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days? But he spake of the temple of HIS BODY.”
Just a YES or NO.
Other scriptures say the Father raised Jesus. So do you conclude that Jesus is the Father? Your understanding of the scriptures makes the bible look like a contradictory mess!

(Galatians 1:1). . .God the Father, who raised him up from the dead. . .

God the Father, Jehovah raised him. So how do you harmonize these two scriptures? Is Jesus God the Father!?!?

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#1126 Jun 1, 2012
Duh-boy wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm so well equipped. There is no need to waste time and put things in my own words. Reasonable people will read the c/p and see the truth, while bias people like you will not consider the information because of preconcieved ideas about the authors.
You are so "well equipped" with the ramblings of men, trying to hold power with an ever changing doctrine.

So by your assertion, the reasonable people will view the WT article as truth, and discard the BIBLE VERSES I post. Why would they consider the WT information reliable, when they have been wrong so many times in the past.

Stop "tacking in the wind", drop anchor, and just accept the bible as truth.

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#1127 Jun 1, 2012
Snorkler wrote:
<quoted text>Are You here admitting that you do not have scripture speaking of a Trinity or Proving a Trinity ? If you could prove that Jesus was God that would then mean that you proved that Jesus was God , but the "Deal" was that you would prove the Trinity by7 us going through them one by one which you have failed to do ....Again ...Where do we have a Scripture telling us that " God , Jesus and the Holy spirit are one and the same person or Equal.....this is what you need to do ...this is what you said you would do.
I accept God for who He is, not who I wish Him to be.

Modalism is not biblical, but that is what you are describing.

Modalism states that God is a single person who, throughout biblical history, has revealed Himself in three modes, or forms. Thus, God is a single person who first manifested himself in the mode of the Father in Old Testament times. At the incarnation, the mode was the Son and after Jesus' ascension, the mode is the Holy Spirit. These modes are consecutive and never simultaneous. In other words, this view states that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit never all exist at the same time, only one after another. Modalism denies the distinctiveness of the three persons in the Trinity even though it retains the divinity of Christ.

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#1128 Jun 1, 2012
Duh-boy wrote:
<quoted text>
Other scriptures say the Father raised Jesus. So do you conclude that Jesus is the Father? Your understanding of the scriptures makes the bible look like a contradictory mess!
(Galatians 1:1). . .God the Father, who raised him up from the dead. . .
God the Father, Jehovah raised him. So how do you harmonize these two scriptures? Is Jesus God the Father!?!?
Just answer YES or NO!!!!

Did Jesus say that HE would raise His body?

“The proof is in the pudding!”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#1129 Jun 1, 2012
Kevin 321 wrote:
<quoted text>
Just answer YES or NO!!!!
Did Jesus say that HE would raise His body?
His faith is how he was raised! Jesus didn't not literally do the raising of himself. The bible clearly states that the Father raised his Son!

Yes or no does not sufficiently answer the question.

“New one man.”

Since: Jan 11

Location hidden

#1130 Jun 1, 2012
Duh-boy wrote:
<quoted text>Other scriptures say the Father raised Jesus. So do you conclude that Jesus is the Father? Your understanding of the scriptures makes the bible look like a contradictory mess!

(Galatians 1:1)...God the Father, who raised him up from the dead...

God the Father, Jehovah raised him. So how do you harmonize these two scriptures? Is Jesus God the Father!?!?
The bible is a contradictory mess.

“The proof is in the pudding!”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#1131 Jun 1, 2012
MixedMedia wrote:
<quoted text>
The bible is a contradictory mess.
See what you did Kevin!? lol

No it's not Mix, if you really take the time to study it and consider all factors.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Jehovah's Witness Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
The About Pat topic 5 min JLK 99
Child abuse facts 5 min lol 11
Please remember Jehovah's Witnesses are victims 6 min Maravilla 302
Why aren't jw's Jesus Witnesses? 8 min bystander no more 2
Is Little Lamb mentally diseased? 14 min witchie poo 127
Does Mark Sanderson........ 17 min wireshark 77
The Blood Thing Made Simple 19 min Sparlock 1,158
How to distinguish between a religion & a cult: 37 min lol 98
Does anyone actually defend the "two witness ru... 1 hr Aneirin 80
More from around the web