Watchtower's 1914 generation teaching - a prophecy?

For decades, the Watchtower Society taught that "The End" would come before the generation who were alive to witness the events of 1914 died off. Some examples:

Kingdom Ministry, 10/1993, p. 8: "This magazine builds confidence in the Creator's promise of a peaceful and secure new world before the generation that saw the events of 1914 passes away."

Watchtower 5/15/1984, p. 6: "Jehovah’s prophetic word through Jesus Christ is:‘This generation [of 1914] will by no means pass away until all things occur.’(Luke 21:32) And Jehovah, who is the source of inspired and unfailing prophecy, will bring about the fulfillment of his Son's words in a relatively short time." (bracketed text "[of 1914]" in original)

Did these predictions that the end would come before the generation of 1914 died off constitute prophecies by the Society's leadership (a/k/a the Governing Body)?

Olin Moyle wrote:

For decades, the Watchtower Society taught that "The End" would come before the generation who were alive to witness the events of 1914 died off. Some examples:
Kingdom Ministry, 10/1993, p. 8: "This magazine builds confidence in the Creator's promise of a peaceful and secure new world before the generation that saw the events of 1914 passes away."
Watchtower 5/15/1984, p. 6: "Jehovah’s prophetic word through Jesus Christ is:‘This generation [of 1914] will by no means pass away until all things occur.’(Luke 21:32) And Jehovah, who is the source of inspired and unfailing prophecy, will bring about the fulfillment of his Son's words in a relatively short time." (bracketed text "[of 1914]" in original)
Did these predictions that the end would come before the generation of 1914 died off constitute prophecies by the Society's leadership (a/k/a the Governing Body)?

Expressing what you believe to be true is NOTHING LIKE "uttering a prophecy".

It was Jesus Christ who uttered the "generation" prophecy, Jehovah's Witnesses are simply trying to understand it.

The Watchtower Defender Formerly Known as Gareth wrote:

Expressing what you believe to be true is NOTHING LIKE "uttering a prophecy".

It was Jesus Christ who uttered the "generation" prophecy, Jehovah's Witnesses are simply trying to understand it.

So, Watchtower defender "Aneirin" (who formerly used the moniker "Gareth" but abandoned it in shame) has taken the position that when his religious leaders interpret Bible texts to make predictions about the future, they are not prophesying.

Does anyone else have thoughts on this subject?

Olin Moyle wrote:

<quoted text>
So, Watchtower defender "Aneirin" (who formerly used the moniker "Gareth" but abandoned it in shame) has taken the position that when his religious leaders interpret Bible texts to make predictions about the future, they are not prophesying.
Does anyone else have thoughts on this subject?

Yeah i do,

THE NUMBERS 1-9-1-4 ARE NOT LITERALLY WRITTEN IN THE BIBLE.

CASE CLOSED.

Olin Moyle wrote:

<quoted text>
So, Watchtower defender "Aneirin" (who formerly used the moniker "Gareth" but abandoned it in shame) has taken the position that when his religious leaders interpret Bible texts to make predictions about the future, they are not prophesying.
Does anyone else have thoughts on this subject?

They do not "make predictions", they interpret the Bible's predictions.

They are VERY clear that they are not "uttering prophecy"

Mr "Olyn Moyle" is dishonestly doing his best to *twist their words* to convince people otherwise.

It was Jesus Christ who said that a "generation" would not pass away before the Great Tribulation.

How is presenting what you believe Jesus meant his use of the word "generation" in any way claiming to be uttering prophecy?

That's pure unadulterated nonsense. The height of dishonesty.

Even the Apostles misinterpreted the words of Jesus Christ:

*** John 21:23 This saying therefore went out among the brothers, that this disciple would not die. Yet Jesus did not say to him that he would not die, but, "If I desire that he stay until I come, what is that to you?"

Were the Apostles "uttering prophecy" that John would never die?

No. They simply misunderstood what Jesus meant.

The Watchtower Defender Formerly Known as Gareth wrote:

They do not "make predictions", they interpret the Bible's predictions.
They are VERY clear that they are not "uttering prophecy"
Mr "Olyn Moyle" is dishonestly doing his best to *twist their words* to convince people otherwise.
It was Jesus Christ who said that a "generation" would not pass away before the Great Tribulation.
How is presenting what you believe Jesus meant his use of the word "generation" in any way claiming to be uttering prophecy?
That's pure unadulterated nonsense. The height of dishonesty.
Even the Apostles misinterpreted the words of Jesus Christ:
*** John 21:23 This saying therefore went out among the brothers, that this disciple would not die. Yet Jesus did not say to him that he would not die, but, "If I desire that he stay until I come, what is that to you?"
Were the Apostles "uttering prophecy" that John would never die?
No. They simply misunderstood what Jesus meant.

Methinks she doth protest too much...

Let's try to simplify this.

Which of these two statements do you agree with:

1) Interpreting scriptures to predict future events is prophesying.
2) Interpreting scriptures to predict future events is NOT prophesying.

When one makes a prediction about the future then it is in fact a prophecy, i totally get your point olin and it is an excellent one!
The bigger issue is clear - false prophets.......
Do not put your trust in the son of earthling man to whom NO salvation belongs! Its funny that the JW's use this scripture on the ministry, i know i used to lol.

P.s. i never knew aneirin was gareth, brilliant hahaaaaa

And, for the benefit of the readers of this forum, below is an excellent example of Watchtower Defender trickery.

The Watchtower Defender Formerly Known as Gareth wrote:

Even the Apostles misinterpreted the words of Jesus Christ:

First, the Watchtower Defender insinuates that he as proof that THE APOSTLES did the same thing his religious leaders did (i.e., misinterpret "inspired" utterances to incorrectly predict future events).

The Watchtower Defender Formerly Known as Gareth wrote:

*** John 21:23 This saying therefore went out among the brothers, that this disciple would not die. Yet Jesus did not say to him that he would not die, but, "If I desire that he stay until I come, what is that to you?"

But did you notice the tricky little bait-and-switch that our resident deceiver pulled?

Well, where does that verse attribute this saying to any apostle--much less "the apostles"?

The answer, for those of you playing at home, is NOWHERE.

The Watchtower Defender Formerly Known as Gareth wrote:

Were the Apostles "uttering prophecy" that John would never die?
No. They simply misunderstood what Jesus meant.

And, our resident deceiver (who formerly went by the pseudonym "Gareth" but abandoned it in shame) continues with his trickery, asserting that THE APOSTLES spread this false prediction.

However, unfortunately for this Watchtower Defender, the scriptures do not state that the apostles spread this prediction.

Aneirin wrote:

<quoted text>
They do not "make predictions", they interpret the Bible's predictions.
They are VERY clear that they are not "uttering prophecy"
Mr "Olyn Moyle" is dishonestly doing his best to *twist their words* to convince people otherwise.
It was Jesus Christ who said that a "generation" would not pass away before the Great Tribulation.
How is presenting what you believe Jesus meant his use of the word "generation" in any way claiming to be uttering prophecy?
That's pure unadulterated nonsense. The height of dishonesty.
Even the Apostles misinterpreted the words of Jesus Christ:
*** John 21:23 This saying therefore went out among the brothers, that this disciple would not die. Yet Jesus did not say to him that he would not die, but, "If I desire that he stay until I come, what is that to you?"
Were the Apostles "uttering prophecy" that John would never die?
No. They simply misunderstood what Jesus meant.

Exactly Gareth that's why they said this!

Watchtower 1972 April 1 p.197

'They Shall Know that a Prophet Was Among Them'

This "prophet" was not one man, but was a body of men and women. It was the small group of footstep followers of Jesus Christ, known at that time as International Bible Students. Today they are known as Jehovah's Christian Witnesses...

----------

Clearly we can all see that Gareth isn't lying because why else would the watchtower call itself a PROPHET!

Olin Moyle wrote:

<quoted text>
Methinks she doth protest too much...
Let's try to simplify this.
Which of these two statements do you agree with:
1) Interpreting scriptures to predict future events is prophesying.
2) Interpreting scriptures to predict future events is NOT prophesying.

He AGREES WITH BOTH STATEMENTS,

YOU SHOULD KNOW THAT OLIN.

Prime wrote:

<quoted text>Exactly Gareth that's why they said this!
Watchtower 1972 April 1 p.197
'They Shall Know that a Prophet Was Among Them'
This "prophet" was not one man, but was a body of men and women. It was the small group of footstep followers of Jesus Christ, known at that time as International Bible Students. Today they are known as Jehovah's Christian Witnesses...
----------
Clearly we can all see that Gareth isn't lying because why else would the watchtower call itself a PROPHET!

Come ON PRIME,

GARETH IS GOING TO TELL YOU THAT THE WORD "PROPHET" HAS MANY DEFINITIONS.

Olin Moyle wrote:

<quoted text>
Methinks she doth protest too much...
Let's try to simplify this.
Which of these two statements do you agree with:
1) Interpreting scriptures to predict future events is prophesying.
2) Interpreting scriptures to predict future events is NOT prophesying.

Here is where Mr "Olyn Moyle" is being deceptive.

Jehovah's Witnesses to not interpret scripture to predict future events.

They interpret predictions of future events from the scriptures.

BIG DIFFERENCE.

Mr "Olyn Moyle" is trying to trick you into thinking that Jehovah's Witnesses make predictions. They do not. They merely present the predictions that are in the Bible to the best of their understanding.

Aneirin wrote:

<quoted text>
Here is where Mr "Olyn Moyle" is being deceptive.
Jehovah's Witnesses to not interpret scripture to predict future events.
They interpret predictions of future events from the scriptures.
BIG DIFFERENCE.
Mr "Olyn Moyle" is trying to trick you into thinking that Jehovah's Witnesses make predictions. They do not. They merely present the predictions that are in the Bible to the best of their understanding.

"They interpret predictions of future events from the scriptures"

SO BEFORE YOU INTERPRET THE SCRIPTURES YOU ARE ALREADY CONVINCED AND CONCLUDE THAT THERE ARE PREDICTIONS TO BE INTERPRETED BECAUSE THE WTS SAYS SO.

THIS MEANS THAT THE WTS COMES TO A CONCLUSION AND YOU MUST BELIEVE IT.

VERY LOGICAL......NOT!!!

Aneirin wrote:

<quoted text>
Here is where Mr "Olyn Moyle" is being deceptive.
Jehovah's Witnesses to not interpret scripture to predict future events.

The deceiver and Watchtower Defender behind the pseudonym "Aneirin" (who, by the way, used the "Gareth" moniker until abandoning it in shame) is up to his old tricks, hoping to prey on the ignorant and those who are too lazy to read.

He expects you to believe that statements such as this are not predictions of future events.

"Jehovah’s prophetic word through Jesus Christ is:‘This generation [of 1914] will by no means pass away until all things occur.’" [1]

If you believe "Gareth/Aneirin," then I have some ocean-front property in Nebraska to sell you.

In any event, this Watchtower Defender and deceiver is doing his best to avoid giving a straight answer (this is par for the course with Watchtower Defenders on this forum).

Is Watchtower Defender "Aneirin" now RETREATING from his former position that interpreting scriptures to predict future events is not prophecy?[2]

Or is he willing to go on the record?

Once more I ask "Aneirin," which of these two statements do you agree with:

1) Interpreting scriptures to predict future events is prophesying.
2) Interpreting scriptures to predict future events is NOT prophesying.

It's either one or the other.

Which is it?

References:
[1] Watchtower 5/15/1984, p. 6 (bracketed text "[of 1914]" in original)
[2] http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/jehovahs-...

Aneirin wrote:

<quoted text>
They do not "make predictions", they interpret the Bible's predictions.
They are VERY clear that they are not "uttering prophecy"
Mr "Olyn Moyle" is dishonestly doing his best to *twist their words* to convince people otherwise.
It was Jesus Christ who said that a "generation" would not pass away before the Great Tribulation.
How is presenting what you believe Jesus meant his use of the word "generation" in any way claiming to be uttering prophecy?
That's pure unadulterated nonsense. The height of dishonesty.
Even the Apostles misinterpreted the words of Jesus Christ:
*** John 21:23 This saying therefore went out among the brothers, that this disciple would not die. Yet Jesus did not say to him that he would not die, but, "If I desire that he stay until I come, what is that to you?"
Were the Apostles "uttering prophecy" that John would never die?
No. They simply misunderstood what Jesus meant.

where did the foundation of 1914 come from?

angelsilv wrote:

<quoted text>
where did the foundation of 1914 come from?

I already DISCUSSED THIS WITH GARETH AND HE SAID THAT 1914 COMES FROM THE BIBLE AND CHARLES TAZE RUSSELL FOUND IT IN THE BOOK OF DANIEL,

GARETH DENIES THE FOUNDATION OF 1914 HAVING ANY RELATION TO PYRAMIDOLOGY BUT ONLY TO THE BIBLE.

We've had this conversation. The understanding of "this generation" is based on Matthew 24:34, the context of the Bible passages and how it relates to the grand theme found of the Bible.

Matthew 24:34 is referring to a generation that would witness events that identify the critical times the Bible refers to as the last days, a generation that keeps on the watch. Jehovah's Witnesses understanding of this overall time frame is clearly within reason.

es12 p. 42 April

This generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur.—Matt. 24:34.

Although we cannot measure the exact length of “this generation,” we do well to keep in mind several things about the word “generation”: It usually refers to people of varying ages whose lives overlap during a particular time period; it is not excessively long; and it has an end.(Ex. 1:6) How, then, are we to understand Jesus’ words about “this generation”? He evidently meant that the lives of the anointed who were on hand when the sign began to become evident in 1914 would overlap with the lives of other anointed ones who would see the start of the great tribulation. That generation had a beginning, and it surely will have an end. The fulfillment of the various features of the sign clearly indicates that the tribulation must be near. By maintaining your sense of urgency and keeping on the watch, you show that you are keeping up with advancing light and following the leadings of holy spirit.—Mark 13:37. w10 4/15 2:13, 14

It makes no sense to criticize the understanding of others unless you can accurately explain its meaning yourself.

SOSEXPOSESCHARLATANWTS wrote:

<quoted text>I already DISCUSSED THIS WITH GARETH AND HE SAID THAT 1914 COMES FROM THE BIBLE AND CHARLES TAZE RUSSELL FOUND IT IN THE BOOK OF DANIEL,
GARETH DENIES THE FOUNDATION OF 1914 HAVING ANY RELATION TO PYRAMIDOLOGY BUT ONLY TO THE BIBLE.

aerinin is this true?

Dream-weaver wrote:

We've had this conversation. The understanding of "this generation" is based on Matthew 24:34, the context of the Bible passages and how it relates to the grand theme found of the Bible.
Matthew 24:34 is referring to a generation that would witness events that identify the critical times the Bible refers to as the last days, a generation that keeps on the watch. Jehovah's Witnesses understanding of this overall time frame is clearly within reason.
es12 p. 42 April
This generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur.—Matt. 24:34.
Although we cannot measure the exact length of “this generation,” we do well to keep in mind several things about the word “generation”: It usually refers to people of varying ages whose lives overlap during a particular time period; it is not excessively long; and it has an end.(Ex. 1:6) How, then, are we to understand Jesus’ words about “this generation”? He evidently meant that the lives of the anointed who were on hand when the sign began to become evident in 1914 would overlap with the lives of other anointed ones who would see the start of the great tribulation. That generation had a beginning, and it surely will have an end. The fulfillment of the various features of the sign clearly indicates that the tribulation must be near. By maintaining your sense of urgency and keeping on the watch, you show that you are keeping up with advancing light and following the leadings of holy spirit.—Mark 13:37. w10 4/15 2:13, 14
It makes no sense to criticize the understanding of others unless you can accurately explain its meaning yourself.

Your right,

I CANT EXPLAIN 1914 BEING IN THE BIBLE,

AM I BLIND OR IS THERE A 1-9-1-4 LITERALLY WRITTEN IN THE BIBLE SOMEWHERE?

I AM SURE THE SAME QUESTION WAS ASKED OF RUTHERFORD WHEN HE SPOUTED OFF THAT 1925 NONSENSE THAT NEVER CAME INTO FRUATION.

angelsilv wrote:

<quoted text>
aerinin is this true?

You BETTER HOPE IT'S NOT TRUE,

BECAUSE WE ALL KNOW THAT CHARLES TAZE RUSSELL CONJURED UP THE 1914 DATE FROM HIS SEVERAL MEASUREMENTS INSIDE THE INTERNAL STRUCTURE OF THE PYRAMID OF GIZA.

WHICH IS WHY THE FOUNDATION OF 1914 IS THE DEVILS.