FLDS seeks Bush's help, calls raid 'act of terrorism'

James.. your family situation has NO BEARING on the Tx case. None. ZIP! NADA!!

They took those kids and violated people's civil rights.

In America, people are innocent until proven guilty even when small minded little fascists like you want people persecuted because they "might" be doing something your narrow mind doesn't like.

["The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of the people. As long as the government is perceived as working for the benefit of the children, the people will happily endure almost any curtailment of liberty and almost any deprivation."
- Adolph Hitler (Mein Kampf)

Now...try looking at this without emotion.

James Winter wrote:

<quoted text>
are you aware of the REASONS why my father LOST custody of us??
He broke the law repeatedly..and deserved to lose custody! Equally, these people broke the law...just because they haven't been proven guilty on welfare and tax fraud charges is not because they haven't NOR....it means that they haven't been prosecuted on that charge yet and probably won't get caught of the crimes they have committed...
no real surprise...Bush will not face ANY possible war crimes he may have committed...

4liberty1st wrote:

James.. your family situation has NO BEARING on the Tx case. None. ZIP! NADA!!
They took those kids and violated people's civil rights.
In America, people are innocent until proven guilty even when small minded little fascists like you want people persecuted because they "might" be doing something your narrow mind doesn't like.
<quoted text>
Now...try looking at this without emotion.
<quoted text>

calling me a fascist now?? nice...well played...nothing better than name calling...it shows your true level of maturity!

The point was, laws were broken and the authorities came in and handled business and it worked in BOTH situations.

My father lost custody of his kids because of his actions. These people lost their kids because of what they have done for years and got away with..

I am not asking you to like it...in fact...deal with it...YOU are not going to single handedly get all these kids back yourself no matter how much your heart cries for these fraudulent mothers and fathers!

If you act shady, it is bound to kick you in the ass...regardless of how guilty you are or not!

James Winter wrote:

<quoted text>
calling me a fascist now?? nice...well played...nothing better than name calling...it shows your true level of maturity!

SHall I go back and quote some of the vile crap you've claimed about me? HYPOCRITE!!

IMHO, you are a fascist!

James Winter wrote:

<quoted text>The point was, laws were broken and the authorities came in and handled business and it worked in BOTH situations.

If laws were broken... why is it that there have been NO CRIMINAL CHARGES FILED 55 days after the fact? Do tell!!

James Winter wrote:

<quoted text>My father lost custody of his kids because of his actions.

Irrelevant.

James Winter wrote:

<quoted text> These people lost their kids because of what they have done for years and got away with..

The proof of this is.... where?

James Winter wrote:

<quoted text>I am not asking you to like it...in fact...deal with it...YOU are not going to single handedly get all these kids back yourself no matter how much your heart cries for these fraudulent mothers and fathers!

Attacking me again... after mewling about being called a fascist? LOL Very telling indeed.

James Winter wrote:

<quoted text>If you act shady, it is bound to kick you in the ass...regardless of how guilty you are or not!

So... if oen does not act like you think they should... let law enforcement harass them. Thanks for proving my point... YOU ARE A FASCICT!!!

This is America, Adolph. People don't have to worship and live the way you want them to.

Funny thing...last night on 48 hours they called Warren Jeffs a
MODERN DAY HITLER.

If he thinks dogs are evil, they are gone...extinguished.
If he thinks a dad isn't keeping his wife and kids in line, he's gone, vanished and woman reassigned to another man.

He's power hungry.

And even has some power despite being a convicted felon.

If you think living on a compound and being told what to wear, eat, when and if you have sex (only to have babies not for pleasure) is freedom, you are the twisted one.

Warran Jeffs is in Prison.

Thus... the media trying to use him to justify the taking of 460+ people, many of them adulkt females, is dishonest.

4liberty1st wrote:

<quoted text>
SHall I go back and quote some of the vile crap you've claimed about me? HYPOCRITE!!
IMHO, you are a fascist!
<quoted text>
If laws were broken... why is it that there have been NO CRIMINAL CHARGES FILED 55 days after the fact? Do tell!!
<quoted text>
Irrelevant.
<quoted text>
The proof of this is.... where?
<quoted text>
Attacking me again... after mewling about being called a fascist? LOL Very telling indeed.
<quoted text>
So... if oen does not act like you think they should... let law enforcement harass them. Thanks for proving my point... YOU ARE A FASCICT!!!
This is America, Adolph. People don't have to worship and live the way you want them to.

Fascism
A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator (I am a long way from being a dictator), stringent socioeconomic controls, suppression of the opposition through terror and censorship, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism (I am NOTHING close to being a nationalist) and racism(did you see a pic of my wife?).
A political philosophy or movement based on or advocating such a system of government.
Oppressive, dictatorial control.(I have no desire but to provide anything BUT free agency!

Christ died to give us free agency to do that which we will. We all have the ability to do what we want. You can do WHATEVER you want...HOWEVER, you will have 2 types of consequences for every action that you commit or omit. If you drink and drive, naturally, you will face the affects of alcohol on your system, DUE to the alcohol and your lack of judgement and reaction time, you can kill someone with your car.

Now here comes the implicated consequences..you will get a hefty ticket for the DUI and possibly the accident are part of the implicated consequences that you face for breaking the law.

These are consequences placed upon us that are supported by society as a whole.

All I am saying is that these members of the FLDS, decided on their own free will to make their own choices and there will always be consequences for their actions, both of omission and commission.

This has no bearing on my alleged "fascist needs."

All people are hypocrites...we all make hypocritical errors that mar our character, the only thing that matters is how we rebound from those errors and strengthen the core of our beliefs in order to counter the hypocritical decisions that we make.

As far as any crimes being charged, LOOK at all of the cases that are to be held INDIVIDUALLY...they are still in the middle of hearings and getting all of the children where they need to be...before they start wagging fingers.

I am unsure if you understand how the LDS OR the FLDS Churches work...IN THIS ONE AREA we are very similar. If Thomas S. Monson tells us to save 1000 dollars worth of groceries, we are going to do that. There are no IFs, ANDs or BUTTs...we do it and that is all there is to say. We may not HAVE 1000 dollars available at the moment, but regardless of how we do it, we will do our best to do as he asks. If we are told as of today, that WE are to pay more in offerings for the poor, it will also happen. We obey the Prophet, we do not make excuses, we just do it.

Warren Jeffs being in Prison does NOT change his orders any more than it changed Joseph Smith's orders when HE was in prison. The difference is,
Joseph Smith was NOT convicted of ANY crimes, where Jeffs has been convicted and will be sentenced of various crimes and NOW there are PICS of Jeffs kissing 12 year olds!

4liberty1st wrote:

Warran Jeffs is in Prison.
Thus... the media trying to use him to justify the taking of 460+ people, many of them adulkt females, is dishonest.

he was the one who brainwashed them into the people they are today...

if you want to resolve a problem... you have to rip it out by the root...in this situation, that root is Jeffs.

Do you NOT get that these people WORSHIP Jeffs like Catholics or Mormons worship Christ or as Buddhists worship Buddha? He is MORE than just a Prophet...he is their God. you do NOT see pictures of Christ anywhere...you see pictures of Jeffs.

They emulate and follow EVERYTHING that he does. I saw with my own eyes and heard his voice with my own ears today as he announced that HE was NOT a prophet and that HE IS the most evil man in these days! He was saying that HE was decieved by the devil..While that may not be news to most people with a sane mind, it IS news that he would denounce his OWN role as a Prophet to his OWN faith...he has admitted that he does NOT have that authority or capability...

A 52 year old guy that deepthroats a 12 year old with his tongue and celebrates his 1 year anniversary...means he married and screwed her when she was ELEVEN! How incredibly messed up is that???

If that makes me a fascist...then so be it...I will be the fascist who says that 52 yr old men should not be making out and having sex with 11 yr olds ANYDAY! Carolyn Jessop said clearly that THAT level of intimacy is held ONLY for those who are married. In fact, these pictures are of a 1 year anniversary...so they ARE married and they HAVE had sexual relations.

If he is doing that, then Merrill Jessop is doing the same as are other 50+ men.

James... you hate. Nothing more. I see no reason to bother with an obvious hate monger and child who wants a fascist government to force all to worship their faith the way he does.

Narrow minded left wing dolts like you are all the same. FASCISTS!!

THE U.S. IMPACT:
Legal Precedence is being set for'Fringe Groups': Hide, Reproduce, Gather Money = Political Power!
Society & Workers usually Pay the Price!
Isolating kids makes them 'puppets':
(Ex:Iraq-Iran-Sadam Hussein-Castro-Hitler!)
Sects exploit Moral-Legal Limits to get Power!
Texas needs Birth-Death Certificates, NOW!
Birth defects increase in parents under age 18,
over age 40, & 'interbreeding'.How many FLDS babies are 'defective'? FLDS children can die &
disappear without a trace, no Public Records!
Human brains don't mature till age 25!
This Sect is exploiting Morals & Laws, State by
State, using locked fences, secret tunnels, poly-
gamy,'old men' having sex with 13-14 yr.olds.
Get a grip before this Cult gets out of hand!

4liberty1st wrote:

James... you hate. Nothing more. I see no reason to bother with an obvious hate monger and child who wants a fascist government to force all to worship their faith the way he does.
Narrow minded left wing dolts like you are all the same. FASCISTS!!

What exactly do I hate??? I am pro choice, I am for GLAAD rights, I have no problem with interracial marriages, I have no problem with a LOT of things that most Republicans loathe..

I hate it when our free agency is taken from us, because I am in the military and fight for ALL of our rights and freedoms. I sacrifice my rights so that every American, expatriot or otherwise can have ALL of theirs.

If I hate anything, I hate groups who mirror themselves to appear like my faith to the extent that the general public cannot discern one from the other, THEN they break laws and take advantage of the welfare system and the tax system. You ask how I know this, Tom Green was CONVICTED of these same issues and he was part of the FLDS as well. Bleeding the beast will be addressed. Why should I tolerate that?

I don't hate people. I don't care enough about Warren Jeffs to hate him. I hate EVERYTHING he does, save ADMITTING and CONFESSING that he is NOT a Prophet.

Hate the sin, love the sinner. I DO believe strongly in this. I can hate that sin and NOT feel bad at all.

People can do whatever the hell they want, and they WILL....as long as they are willing to face the consequences...regardless if they are good people or not...regardless of whether those actions are good or not. There is cause and effect in all things.

I don't like the FLDS or anything they stand for. They are probably decent people and I am mixed as far as whether I would give the kids back, but I must concede to the Judges who make that decision as they know more than I do.

I have that right...You have the right to talk to me if you want...nobody least of all me, is twisting your arm to talk to me or anyone else. I have the right to decide whether to answer or tell you what I think you want to hear to appease you enough for you to go away...I say it as I see it. You don't like it, then on your way with you...

My calling you a liar, or that you defend the FLDS pales in comparison to be called a fascist...but since that is your favorite word...it falls on deaf ears and its resonance is very limited. They're just words from a stranger..and they will never receive more credit than that.

You're a hate monger. Go practice safe sex and fornicate with yourself.

4liberty1st wrote:

You're a hate monger. Go practice safe sex and fornicate with yourself.

yeah that is what I would expect from you...futile comments from a pariah

Sects-Legal Impact wrote:

THE U.S. IMPACT:
Legal Precedence is being set for'Fringe Groups': Hide, Reproduce, Gather Money = Political Power!
Society & Workers usually Pay the Price!
Isolating kids makes them 'puppets':
(Ex:Iraq-Iran-Sadam Hussein-Castro-Hitler!)
Sects exploit Moral-Legal Limits to get Power!
Texas needs Birth-Death Certificates, NOW!
Birth defects increase in parents under age 18,
over age 40, & 'interbreeding'.How many FLDS babies are 'defective'? FLDS children can die &
disappear without a trace, no Public Records!
Human brains don't mature till age 25!
This Sect is exploiting Morals & Laws, State by
State, using locked fences, secret tunnels, poly-
gamy,'old men' having sex with 13-14 yr.olds.
Get a grip before this Cult gets out of hand!

I agree! Looks like this cult will get out of hand..so to speak. Now they are going to go wild. As all this unfolds..piece by piece is starting to appear. Before you know it the FLDS will have more power then we think. They have bought land in many states..they collect welfare money from all the kids they have...warren jeffs has gotten off on 4 charges. Think the definition of religious freedoms needs to be redefined in the America. Some religions are getting away with crimes all in the name of a religious cult.

In one place, I heard that they apparently had a HUGE expansion project about to happen. I think the people around Eldorado got scared they were going to double or triple in number and no telling what they had in mind.

Now the ranch has been "raped" so to speak. They say their Temple has been desecrated and people fear going back there.

They have found at least one girl who has been sexually assaulted.

I've also read the ranch was self sufficient due to all the mothers and children working the gardens and orchards and now those helping hands are no longer there.

That one couple who got temporary custody still hasn't been released from CPS scrutiny. They're a young couple with kids 4, 2 and 1.

So what's the next step?