Pat Robertson Concludes Sikh Temple Shooting Because 'Atheists Hate God'

Aug 6, 2012 Full story: www.mediaite.com 202

On his 700 Club program Monday morning, televangelist Pat Robertson came to the conclusion that Sunday morning’s Sikh temple massacre in Oak Creek, Wisc., was ultimately because “atheists hate God.”

“What is it?” Robertson wondered aloud. “Is it satanic? Is it some spiritual thing?” Full Story

“ecrasez l'infame”

Since: May 08

Atlanta, Georgia

#22 Aug 7, 2012
NightSerf wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't think either man is dumb--there's a difference between stupidity and delusion. It's said that to make good people do bad things, it takes religion. I'd substitute delusion for religion to make it more general and say the same thing about smart people doing stupid things. We see the same thing here. We have some very smart apologists here using their intelligence to defend ideas that are indefensible. Their emotional attachments to their delusions overwhelm their rational abilities.
That's why this whole IQ argument is apropos of nothing. It's not about who is smarter, stronger, sexier or who can come up with the cleverest insult. It's about ideas and the logic that supports them--or fails to. It's about thinking before we write and moving forward rather than endlessly repeating variants of the same posts, of making interesting, original and unique contributions. I really wish more of us would at least try to do that.
Hear, hear.

I have tried on numerous times to start a reasoned discussion. It typically last about 1/2 day before the emotional posts start inundating the thread. And these "troll" posts always come from both sides of the debate.

I still try on occasions, but it gets frustrating to say the least.

For the most part I've gone to very sporadic posting when the person I'm replying to is just too egregious to ignore. Even then I don't try to engage with any expectation of adult conversation.
havent forgotten

Lamoni, IA

#23 Aug 7, 2012
MrDesoto1 wrote:
"Televangelist Pat Robertson on Monday reviewed the case of a shooting at a Sikh temple in Wisconsin that left at least seven dead and came to the conclusion that places of worship were being attacked because "people who are atheists, they hate God.""
http://videocafe.crooksandliars.com/david/pat...
First: Has anyone found any evidence yet that the alleged perpetrator was indeed an Athiest? The old televangelist did no explicitly say he was one, but how he came to his conclusion above is rather baffling.
Second: How can an Athiest be angry or hate an entity that they believe does not exist or have not seen any evidence for its existence? It's just another perpetration of an old myth.
yes, but it is so reassuring to know that he is always wrong.

“ecrasez l'infame”

Since: May 08

Atlanta, Georgia

#24 Aug 7, 2012
And I still find what I consider to be interesting stories to add to the News feed. Such as --

A recent MRI study finds that, when asked what God believes, people don’t try to remember what the Bible says or what their preacher told them, they just reference their own beliefs.(" http://www.topix.com/religion/atheism/2012/08... ;)
havent forgotten

Lamoni, IA

#25 Aug 7, 2012
TheBlackSheep wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah, I can agree with most of that. Fred Phelps is a dumbass, imo. Pat is a money and power hungry control freak, again, imo.
The leaders are often more intelligent than the followers, but I do know a number of smart believers! Then never discuss the bible, just that they believe and that things happen for a reason. They question everything in life, except their belief in a god.
I don't think you will ever get a good honest discussion going on topix. Too many trolls and ignorant people to fight for time with. I have picked out many gems along the way! Some of you people are brilliant and I love learning new things!
NightSerf if one of the wise and moderate ones. Sometimes attitude counts a lot. People can have similar views and yet express them in very different ways - depending on whether they are being thoughtful or emotional, and on what their emotions are. For example, some of those who are warning us we will go to hell, are secretly very pleased that we will be and they will not, I suspect. Others are desperately trying to save us because they care for us. I think I am acquainted with at least one of each of those types in real life. I would not hazard a guess about the ones on topix with that view! More explicitly, I would not guess which one might actually care about us and want to save us out of good will. i suspect most freethinker types are less emotional, and more intellectual, and are motivated by liking to use our minds.
havent forgotten

Lamoni, IA

#26 Aug 7, 2012
Hedonist wrote:
And I still find what I consider to be interesting stories to add to the News feed. Such as --
A recent MRI study finds that, when asked what God believes, people don’t try to remember what the Bible says or what their preacher told them, they just reference their own beliefs.(" http://www.topix.com/religion/atheism/2012/08... ;)
yes, it is nice to see new threads with new news to discuss.

“In the beginning God Created..”

Since: Feb 12

Southern Illinois

#27 Aug 7, 2012
How do we fix the hate that’s in America?

There’re hundreds of hate groups. Some are black but most are white. Some state militia’s boarder hate groups. Gangs are certainly hate groups. When they are all add up we are not talking hundreds but thousands.

These groups have the right to free speech but they don’t have the right to criminal enterprises and conduct.

On a local level here Topix could help by monitoring it’s forums. Eliminating those that are hateful and obnoxious. Turning these sites into a more decent forum instead of a just about anything goes.

What I see Topix has been an outlet for hate. If we want a safer more civil society. Topix needs to do it’s part. These forums on atheism is a cesspool of hatred. I realize hatred can be a two way street. It doesn’t matter to me as long as a moderator is fair and doesn’t have a dog in the fight.

“Darwin died for your sins”

Since: Aug 08

Nunya

#28 Aug 7, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
How do we fix the hate that’s in America?
There’re hundreds of hate groups. Some are black but most are white. Some state militia’s boarder hate groups. Gangs are certainly hate groups. When they are all add up we are not talking hundreds but thousands.
These groups have the right to free speech but they don’t have the right to criminal enterprises and conduct.
On a local level here Topix could help by monitoring it’s forums. Eliminating those that are hateful and obnoxious. Turning these sites into a more decent forum instead of a just about anything goes.
What I see Topix has been an outlet for hate. If we want a safer more civil society. Topix needs to do it’s part. These forums on atheism is a cesspool of hatred. I realize hatred can be a two way street. It doesn’t matter to me as long as a moderator is fair and doesn’t have a dog in the fight.
Why not just go to a moderated christian website?

“In the beginning God Created..”

Since: Feb 12

Southern Illinois

#29 Aug 7, 2012
madscot wrote:
<quoted text>
Why not just go to a moderated christian website?
Because I feel at home here, lol.

“Darwin died for your sins”

Since: Aug 08

Nunya

#30 Aug 7, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Because I feel at home here, lol.
The why were you griping about the mods and mean posters?

“Darwin died for your sins”

Since: Aug 08

Nunya

#31 Aug 7, 2012
Should be "then" not "the"

Since: Sep 10

Marion, NC

#32 Aug 8, 2012
Why can't a gunman goto pat Robertson's or Fred phelps house?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#33 Aug 8, 2012
Hedonist wrote:
And I still find what I consider to be interesting stories to add to the News feed. Such as --
A recent MRI study finds that, when asked what God believes, people don’t try to remember what the Bible says or what their preacher told them, they just reference their own beliefs.(" http://www.topix.com/religion/atheism/2012/08... ;)
Good link. Thanks.
Punjabi Guy

Omaha, NE

#34 Aug 8, 2012
AmericasBestChristian wrote:
and I can assure you that Pat has attacked the Sikh religion on many occasions because of the FALSE IDOLS they worship. He even sends missionaries to India so that the little brown people can finally accept the TRUE King James God and bow down before HIS majesty. Idol worship ENRAGES the TRUE Christian God, His Son and the Pigeon.
Plus, Sikhs practice some of that hellish Yoga which is as bad as an atheist dabbling in the dark arts of science without the Holy Spirit. My Sunday school curriculum includes lessons about the evils of everything Oriental, including Sikhs and Yoga. Yoga is a religion for sex addicts. Yoga teaches its followers how to contort their bodies into demonic positions with the ultimate goal of being able to place their sexual organs into their mouths!
I am a Sikh, we are not idol or penus worshippers. Sikhism is a monotheistic religion and we only believe in one God. We believe all men are created equal and we are the first native peoples of the Indian sub-continent recognized equality for women. Sikhism outlaws polygamy, bride burning, incest and female infanticide. We believe in one God, and that God is for everyone whether American, Blacks, Muslims, Orientals and whoever.

Sikhs don't practice Yoga. Yoga and idol/stone worshippers are Hindus. Hindus have persecuted Sikhs for 500 years in modern day India which is created by Britain in 1947.

I don't hate Americans, Americans are far more civilized and nicer than Hindus. Hindus have killed more than 100,000 Sikhs since 1947, because we demanded a seperate nation state for our people, and until today this dream is very unlikely because of British political influence on the world stage. We Sikhs are NOT Hindus or Muslims. We are Sikhs and we believe in one God.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#35 Aug 8, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
What I see Topix has been an outlet for hate. If we want a safer more civil society. Topix needs to do it’s part. These forums on atheism is a cesspool of hatred.
The hatred you discuss has been one way for centuries - Christians hating atheists. You burned, stretched, twisted and impaled us when you could, and you have continued to demonized us, dehumanized us and marginalized us since such that atheists has until recently been considered unfit to hold public office, to serve on juries, to be witnesses in court, to adopt children, to teach and to coach.

And it is institutionalized in your dogma. Here it is first in your Old Testament, then again in the new:

[1] "The fool says in his heart,'There is no God.' They are corrupt, their deeds are vile; there is no one who does good" - Psalm 14:1

[2] "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone." - Revelation 21:8 "

In the first, you teach that unbelievers are corrupt and vile. And we all know how your violent and judgmental god feels about such people, right? And you want to please him, don't you?

In the second, the love of Jesus tells us that unbelievers are abominable, all liars, and the moral equivalent of murderers and whoremongers.

That makes your religion an active, aggressive enemy of unbelievers.

We've never had a voice until recently. You've never had to hear it before. Now, billboards are appearing affirming atheism, best sellers from Hitchens, Dawkins, Harris and the like have appeared, and message boards like Topix have arisen, where people like me can safely tell people like you how much we enjoy your religion.

This is probably the only place you hear from us. We're not usually invited to your churches to address you, nor anywhere else.

You come here to preach to us, because you know an atheist forum and atheistic threads is where we'll be. But guess what? Now you have to listen back. And you seem to want moderators to stifle that.

I have no ill will for you. But I detest your church intensely, and will continue to express that opinion wherever I can. Your church is societal burden - a parasite.

It scapegoats gays and atheists.

It undermines scientific education.

It teaches a deep contempt for man and the world, sneeringly calling them "the flesh" and "worldly," respectively.

And it is contemptuous of the principle of secular American government.

What you call hate is your first inkling of how we feel about what your church has done and is doing.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#36 Aug 8, 2012
Punjabi Guy wrote:
we are the first native peoples of the Indian sub-continent recognized equality for women. Sikhism outlaws polygamy, bride burning, incest and female infanticide.
That's a good start, but I wouldn't be bragging about it quite yet. In the West, we include things like reproductive freedom, career opportunities, no fault divorce, and the vote.

Was bride burning big? The Christians were into witch burning in the North American continent, but we installed a secular government and took that from them. That was a few hundred years ago, though.
EdSed

Hamilton, UK

#37 Aug 8, 2012
Punjabi Guy wrote:
<quoted text>
I am a Sikh, we are not idol or penus worshippers. Sikhism is a monotheistic religion and we only believe in one God. We believe all men are created equal and we are the first native peoples of the Indian sub-continent recognized equality for women. Sikhism outlaws polygamy, bride burning, incest and female infanticide. We believe in one God, and that God is for everyone whether American, Blacks, Muslims, Orientals and whoever.
Sikhs don't practice Yoga. Yoga and idol/stone worshippers are Hindus. Hindus have persecuted Sikhs for 500 years in modern day India which is created by Britain in 1947.
I don't hate Americans, Americans are far more civilized and nicer than Hindus. Hindus have killed more than 100,000 Sikhs since 1947, because we demanded a seperate nation state for our people, and until today this dream is very unlikely because of British political influence on the world stage. We Sikhs are NOT Hindus or Muslims. We are Sikhs and we believe in one God.
Hi, PJ.
Where does 'British political influence on the world stage',(such as it is) come into it? Britain hasn't had any power and little particular influence in India since 1947.
Sikh

Omaha, NE

#38 Aug 8, 2012
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
That's a good start, but I wouldn't be bragging about it quite yet. In the West, we include things like reproductive freedom, career opportunities, no fault divorce, and the vote.
Was bride burning big? The Christians were into witch burning in the North American continent, but we installed a secular government and took that from them. That was a few hundred years ago, though.
Bride burning and female infanticide is very common in India even until today. India has one of the lowest female:male ratio in the world.
Yes, Europeans were pagan before. Yeah but then after the Black Death era and reformation in Europe had transformed the European continent.

Yes I believe in secular govt and religion should be kept privately in their own homes and thanks to America for that.
I am Sikh but normally only older generation and relgious Sikhs keep beard and turban just like some orthodox Jews. I have no issues now assimilating in American society except for my first couple of years, but I guess every new comer goes thru that phase.

I have a Christian girlfriend and I don't care if she goes to church or raise our kids as Christians, if we decide to get married. Life is far better than India, where Hindus keep oppressing its minorities and murdering them in thousands especially in the Punjab and Kashmir region.
Sikh

Omaha, NE

#39 Aug 8, 2012
EdSed wrote:
<quoted text>Hi, PJ.
Where does 'British political influence on the world stage',(such as it is) come into it? Britain hasn't had any power and little particular influence in India since 1947.
It is Britian who created India and the legacy of the British Raj is still felt in India because of many states illegally annexed into the Indian Union with back up of the Royal U.K Army, and they keep saying "Indian, Indian, Indian all the time in their history books, documentaries and TV shows".

This kinda of political issues happened not only in India but many in many African countries where political power and creation of states were cut across different ethnicities, religious lines by the British crown. Thats why there is so many ethinic strife, riots and war in Africa and India and the British govt also had a lot of influence even decades after the " false independence" of India.
EdSed

Hamilton, UK

#40 Aug 8, 2012
Sikh wrote:
<quoted text>
It is Britian who created India and the legacy of the British Raj is still felt in India because of many states illegally annexed into the Indian Union with back up of the Royal U.K Army, and they keep saying "Indian, Indian, Indian all the time in their history books, documentaries and TV shows".
This kinda of political issues happened not only in India but many in many African countries where political power and creation of states were cut across different ethnicities, religious lines by the British crown. Thats why there is so many ethinic strife, riots and war in Africa and India and the British govt also had a lot of influence even decades after the " false independence" of India.
Well, it seemed from a UK perspective best to leave India as united a country as possible. The Muslim element under Nehru put paid to a united India and look at the bloodshed associated with that. There wasn't a solution that pleased all Indians and the UK would always be perceived as 'to blame' by many, whatever they did. That is history now. The British have no say now, nor for the last 65 years, but you can blame UKGov if you explain how it helps matters now.

The problem seems to be one of tribalism. The Sikhs want a separate homeland because of oppression by the Hindus? Sounds like why the Zionists, Palestinians, Kurds and everyone else wants a separate national homeland, as if that will lesson violence. I think it is the cause of it.

Anyway, this is the atheist forum and the issue here is the insanity of religion. Even if there is a god (or gods), and there is no evidence of any, why would a god want man divided into lots of different nations based on their different religious beliefs? Or want different nations, come to that.
EdSed

Hamilton, UK

#41 Aug 8, 2012
(Oops! I meant lessen, not lesson!)

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