Evolution vs. Creation

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High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008.

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Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

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#37645
Aug 12, 2012
 
Yankee Yahoo wrote:
<quoted text>
The evidence does not support the theory. Again, you fail to grasp the interpretation of data. Young-earthers can also take the same data and come up with different conclusions.
Evolution has had 150 years to convince the world, but it has not done so. It does not make a strong enough case in light of the absolute complexity of life that recent sciences have shown us. Biology alone is much more complex than ever suspected by Darwin and his community of the time.
All we have is data. Just because there is data, does not mean there are viable conclusions that can be made from it. Evolution, and Creationism, is an attempt to interpret the data based on two different world-views, but neither has a strong foundation at all.
There is nothing to take evolution's place. There is no theory at all that can yet explain the enormous complexity of life on this planet. Does this scare you?
Young Earthers are all idiots. None of their claims can be substantiated by science. And don't be so quick to put down data. In the world of science that is all we ever have. Yes, some religiously backward countries have trouble accepting evolution. That does not make it untrue. Look at how long all of the various religions have been around. By your logic they are all false, hey that's right. They all have had over 1,000 years to convince people. By your reasoning that means they are false since none of them have convinced even a third of the people in the world they are right.

Obviously how many people believe an idea has nothing to do with its validity. What does matter is the sort of people who believe an idea. If only uneducated idiots believe an idea, like a young Earthers, then it is reasonable to assume that idea is wrong. If over 99% of the people who have studied the Earth, applying the scientific method and using all scientific tools available believe the Earth to be 4.5 billion years old, then they are probably right.
HTS

Williston, ND

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#37646
Aug 12, 2012
 
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
Young Earthers are all idiots. None of their claims can be substantiated by science. And don't be so quick to put down data. In the world of science that is all we ever have. Yes, some religiously backward countries have trouble accepting evolution. That does not make it untrue. Look at how long all of the various religions have been around. By your logic they are all false, hey that's right. They all have had over 1,000 years to convince people. By your reasoning that means they are false since none of them have convinced even a third of the people in the world they are right.
Obviously how many people believe an idea has nothing to do with its validity. What does matter is the sort of people who believe an idea. If only uneducated idiots believe an idea, like a young Earthers, then it is reasonable to assume that idea is wrong. If over 99% of the people who have studied the Earth, applying the scientific method and using all scientific tools available believe the Earth to be 4.5 billion years old, then they are probably right.
You are wasting your time with aimless babbling. All you can do is make unsubstantiated generalizations and then attempt to justify your religion by falsely stating that everyone accepts it. The validity of a theory is NEVER established by a vote.

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Everett, WA

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#37647
Aug 12, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>
William B. Provine, Ph.D, a renowned historian of science and professor at Cornell University, summarized the effects of evolution on man's thinking:
"Naturalistic evolution has clear consequences that Charles Darwin understood perfectly. 1) No gods worth having exist; 2) no life after death exists; 3) no ultimate foundation for ethics exists; 4) no ultimate meaning in life exists; and 5) human free will is nonexistent."
*(Provine W.B., "Evolution: Free will and punishment and meaning in life." Abstract of Prof. William B. Provine's 1998 "Darwin Day address, "Darwin Day" website, University of Tennessee Knoxville TN, 1998).
I'm waiting for your "profuse apology".
Sorry, that was that man's own interpretation of evolution. There are many scientists who are Christian and have no problem with evolution. In other words, you failed again, even though you had to quote mine. Try again.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

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#37648
Aug 12, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>
You are wasting your time with aimless babbling. All you can do is make unsubstantiated generalizations and then attempt to justify your religion by falsely stating that everyone accepts it. The validity of a theory is NEVER established by a vote.
Hardly, you bring up a real claim and I will debunk it. You have never posted anything concrete because you know that you will fail. And yes, a theory is not established by a vote. It is established by years of testing and acceptance by the scientific community as a whole. Guess what, evolution is a well established theory. Deal with it.

“Wear white at night.”

Since: Jun 09

Albuquerque

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#37649
Aug 12, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>
You are wasting your time with aimless babbling. All you can do is make unsubstantiated generalizations and then attempt to justify your religion by falsely stating that everyone accepts it. The validity of a theory is NEVER established by a vote.
It's not a religion, you addlepated dolt.
HTS

Williston, ND

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#37650
Aug 12, 2012
 
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry, that was that man's own interpretation of evolution. There are many scientists who are Christian and have no problem with evolution. In other words, you failed again, even though you had to quote mine. Try again.
You asked for a reference and I gave it to you... Now you're back peddling. What do you want to do? Take a vote?

Since: Feb 08

Tampa, FL

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#37651
Aug 12, 2012
 
Yankee Yahoo wrote:
Sorry, Drew. I do not respond to broken up posts.
You mean, you don't like it when your individual claims are laid bare and exposed for what they are.
Yankee Yahoo wrote:
Respond to my whole post in its entirety
Not going to happen. You don't get to dictate how I reply to you.

If you ignore my responses, it won't change the fact that I'll continue to respond to your unsubstantiated claims, making each one of them clear, and everyone else will notice that you're unable to respond to them.
HTS

Williston, ND

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#37652
Aug 12, 2012
 
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
Hardly, you bring up a real claim and I will debunk it. You have never posted anything concrete because you know that you will fail. And yes, a theory is not established by a vote. It is established by years of testing and acceptance by the scientific community as a whole. Guess what, evolution is a well established theory. Deal with it.
Years of testing of evolution? Like the failed junk DNA paradigm and the collapse of genetic determinism?

Since: Feb 08

Tampa, FL

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#37653
Aug 12, 2012
 
Yankee Yahoo wrote:
But the universe is a VERY large place. to bear fruit, and multiply, that won't be a problem. Bring on Isaac Asimov's Galatic Empire of quintillions!
There wasn't any mention of magical spaceships in Genesis.

The Garden of Eden would quickly have filled to capacity, becoming a hell on Earth.

The idea that there was no death prior to Adam's sin is just another silly fairy tale.

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Everett, WA

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#37654
Aug 12, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>You asked for a reference and I gave it to you... Now you're back peddling. What do you want to do? Take a vote?
Hardly, your quote did not prove your point. That is only the belief of one man. I could pull out sayings by crazy homophobic antisemitic racist Christians and apply that to all Christians if you want to go by those rules. So are you ready to admit that all of those traits apply to you?

Logic is not your strong point HTS.

“Wear white at night.”

Since: Jun 09

Albuquerque

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#37656
Aug 12, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>
William B. Provine, Ph.D, a renowned historian of science and professor at Cornell University, summarized the effects of evolution on man's thinking:
"Naturalistic evolution has clear consequences that Charles Darwin understood perfectly. 1) No gods worth having exist; 2) no life after death exists; 3) no ultimate foundation for ethics exists; 4) no ultimate meaning in life exists; and 5) human free will is nonexistent."
*(Provine W.B., "Evolution: Free will and punishment and meaning in life." Abstract of Prof. William B. Provine's 1998 "Darwin Day address, "Darwin Day" website, University of Tennessee Knoxville TN, 1998).
I'm waiting for your "profuse apology".
"The theory of evolution assumes there is no God."

"No gods worth having exist."

The devil is in the details.

Anyway, your quote is not scientific, it is philosophical.
HTS

Williston, ND

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#37657
Aug 12, 2012
 
15th Dalai Lama wrote:
<quoted text>
It's not a religion, you addlepated dolt.
While you arrogantly mock the faith of others, you yourself play god by imagining what the world would be like if you designed it. Then you take your childish intuitions and use them to prop up what you consider "science". Evolution is clearly a secular religion, requiring faith in myth and miracle. The only difference between an atheist and a theist is that the atheist propagates scientific fraud in the vain attempt to validate his religion.

“Wear white at night.”

Since: Jun 09

Albuquerque

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#37658
Aug 12, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>Years of testing of evolution? Like the failed junk DNA paradigm and the collapse of genetic determinism?
I don't understand. Please be kind enough to explain what that means and how it falsifies evolution.

Please provide reverences and citations, hopefully from websites that don't proclaim the Westminster Profession of Faith or any of its many variants.

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

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Since: Dec 10

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#37659
Aug 12, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>
You are wasting your time with aimless babbling. All you can do is make unsubstantiated generalizations and then attempt to justify your religion by falsely stating that everyone accepts it. The validity of a theory is NEVER established by a vote.
Neither does repeating a false one repeatedly make it true.

“Wear white at night.”

Since: Jun 09

Albuquerque

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#37660
Aug 12, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>
While you arrogantly mock the faith of others, you yourself play god by imagining what the world would be like if you designed it. Then you take your childish intuitions and use them to prop up what you consider "science". Evolution is clearly a secular religion, requiring faith in myth and miracle. The only difference between an atheist and a theist is that the atheist propagates scientific fraud in the vain attempt to validate his religion.
I've got a religion: "We profess your resurection until your return."

I've got an education: Two science degrees with strong foundation in literature, languages and theology.

I know the difference between science and religion.

In the future, as I've requested before, don't be so arrogant as to tell me what I think.

“Wear white at night.”

Since: Jun 09

Albuquerque

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#37661
Aug 12, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>
While you arrogantly mock the faith of others, you yourself play god by imagining what the world would be like if you designed it. Then you take your childish intuitions and use them to prop up what you consider "science". Evolution is clearly a secular religion, requiring faith in myth and miracle. The only difference between an atheist and a theist is that the atheist propagates scientific fraud in the vain attempt to validate his religion.
I'm not mocking your faith. I'm mocking your moronic equation of science to atheism.

You never did indicate anything in the entire universe you feel qualified to debate. Did you?

“Fear is the Mind-Killer”

Level 1

Since: Jun 08

Albuquerque, NM

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#37662
Aug 12, 2012
 
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
Young Earthers are all idiots. None of their claims can be substantiated by science. And don't be so quick to put down data. In the world of science that is all we ever have. Yes, some religiously backward countries have trouble accepting evolution. That does not make it untrue. Look at how long all of the various religions have been around. By your logic they are all false, hey that's right. They all have had over 1,000 years to convince people. By your reasoning that means they are false since none of them have convinced even a third of the people in the world they are right.
Obviously how many people believe an idea has nothing to do with its validity. What does matter is the sort of people who believe an idea. If only uneducated idiots believe an idea, like a young Earthers, then it is reasonable to assume that idea is wrong. If over 99% of the people who have studied the Earth, applying the scientific method and using all scientific tools available believe the Earth to be 4.5 billion years old, then they are probably right.
You are not paying attention. I never put down the data, not once. That would be madness. It is how it is interpreted that remains, and will always remain, in question.

“Fear is the Mind-Killer”

Level 1

Since: Jun 08

Albuquerque, NM

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#37663
Aug 12, 2012
 
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry, that was that man's own interpretation of evolution. There are many scientists who are Christian and have no problem with evolution. In other words, you failed again, even though you had to quote mine. Try again.
That is correct. It was Christians and others that came up with the foundation of evolution before Darwin.

But there has always been problems with evolution as a theory, problems that, without all the ideological and political corruption, would have passed into obscurity with all bad theories.

The Big Bang theory, for example, is far from secure, just as many theories.

To deny this, is to do a grave disservice to science. Stop it.

“Fear is the Mind-Killer”

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#37664
Aug 12, 2012
 

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Drew Smith wrote:
<quoted text>
You mean, you don't like it when your individual claims are laid bare and exposed for what they are.
<quoted text>
Not going to happen. You don't get to dictate how I reply to you.
If you ignore my responses, it won't change the fact that I'll continue to respond to your unsubstantiated claims, making each one of them clear, and everyone else will notice that you're unable to respond to them.
No, Drew, I plainly don't respond to broken posts, on any topic whatsoever. Now you are being dishonest, and uncivil. Yes, I DO GET TO DICTATE HOW YOU REPLY TO ME. If you do not comply, I will never comply with you. You may, of course, do the same.

You method is unnecessary, and often too abused on forums to take points out of context. I choose not to accept such a dialogue. This will be your last warning.

“Fear is the Mind-Killer”

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Since: Jun 08

Albuquerque, NM

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#37665
Aug 12, 2012
 
Drew Smith wrote:
<quoted text>
There wasn't any mention of magical spaceships in Genesis.
The Garden of Eden would quickly have filled to capacity, becoming a hell on Earth.
The idea that there was no death prior to Adam's sin is just another silly fairy tale.
What is a magical spaceship, Drew?

Why do you think that the Bible is literal?

Fairy tales are from the Celts. There are no fairies in Middle Eastern lore, unless you count the Persian peri and devi.

Are you claiming that science will not one day conquer death? What can be done in the future, could have been done in the past. The universe is very old, and very large, Drew.

Your closed-minded, intolerant attitude will not be tolerated. ;)

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