Turkey's Military Requires Soldiers to Prove That They're Gay

"The Ottoman Empire legalized gay sex in 1858 and it has been legal ever since"
Wow. I never would have guessed an arab country to have done that.

Sure. And South Africa has glbt rights enshrined in its Constitution. Where they often kill gay activists and gang rape lesbians to cure them.

The Ottoman Empire no longer exists.

Some of the guys in that photo look nothing less than pretty, though.

Brian wrote:

"The Ottoman Empire legalized gay sex in 1858 and it has been legal ever since"
Wow. I never would have guessed an arab country to have done that.

TURKEY is NOT an ARAB country. Nor IRAN is an Arab country. They have one thing in common though: they are Muslims.To most ignorant Americans, Muslim is the same as Arab! That is why chief of ignorants Geoerge W Bush talked about the "axia of evil".

carlos wrote:

<quoted text>TURKEY is NOT an ARAB country. Nor IRAN is an Arab country. They have one thing in common though: they are Muslims.To most ignorant Americans, Muslim is the same as Arab! That is why chief of ignorants Geoerge W Bush talked about the "axia of evil".

If that were the entire explanation of d.W.i. Bush's difficulties then he and his junta would have considered North Koreans to be Muslims....

On second thought, I do not for a fact they did not.

LOL
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They have so many stereotyped misconceptions about gay people its a wonder anybody qualifies
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What turkeys!
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It would be easier just to drop down on our knees and give the commanding officer a snarling BJ. It could be over and done with in 15 seconds or less

I read about this the other day and it made me laugh because, according to their standards I'm not gay.

Sure, I've tried bottoming because if 90% of gay guys are bottoms then I figured there has to be something to it.

And before anyone comes at me about how they're versatile, answer me this honestly:

If you were given a choice, would you rather top or bottom? Sure, get on your high horse and say how you like to do both but both you and I know versatile really means "I'll f*ck you if you won't f*ck me."

Ex Senator Saintpornum wrote:

Sure. And South Africa has glbt rights enshrined in its Constitution. Where they often kill gay activists and gang rape lesbians to cure them.
The Ottoman Empire no longer exists.
Some of the guys in that photo look nothing less than pretty, though.

Your point about South Africa is absurd. Would you rather have them NOT enshrine gay rights in their constitution?! All countries have an ongoing struggle to enforce their constitutions -- the US included. We have Civil Rights enshrined in our constitution and yet we still have hate crimes (including gays killed and assaulted) on a daily basis. So what?? Shall we just cancel all Civil Rihgts provisions? Or are you trying to minimize the efforts of South Africa and Turkey just to make the United States' pitiful record look a little better? Don't kid yourself -- for a 'civilized' country, in this respect we are still far behind many others in the developing world.

Umninimuzi wrote:

<quoted text>
Your point about South Africa is absurd.

My point about South Africa was a sensible rejoinder to the following, absurd claim made in the thread:

"The Ottoman Empire legalized gay sex in 1858 and it has been legal ever since"

The obvious point was that that, in particular, means nothing. It's a homophobic society...although the Ottoman Empire no longer exists, anyway.

If you talk to glbt activists you will learn the S. African breakthrough of including glbt rights in the Constitution is highly, highly compromised. This is what links the two examples.

Perhaps you have trouble with context or with how things can be similar and different, but at any rate you're a bore.

Mitt s Santorum Slippage wrote:

<quoted text>
My point about South Africa was a sensible rejoinder to the following, absurd claim made in the thread:
"The Ottoman Empire legalized gay sex in 1858 and it has been legal ever since"
The obvious point was that that, in particular, means nothing. It's a homophobic society...although the Ottoman Empire no longer exists, anyway.
If you talk to glbt activists you will learn the S. African breakthrough of including glbt rights in the Constitution is highly, highly compromised. This is what links the two examples.
Perhaps you have trouble with context or with how things can be similar and different, but at any rate you're a bore.

What do you mean that the SA breakthrough is "highly, highly compromised?" And specifically which GLBT "activists" are you citing? Have any of them even lived in South Africa? I'm aware of what's constantly repeated in the news, but I'm also aware that a lot of people are always willing to find fault with whatever progress South Africa makes. As for me being a bore, well, that's your opinion, isn't it? If you don't want to debate this with me then just don't respond. Either way, I'm going to question the veracity of your hearsay.

Umninimuzi wrote:

<quoted text>
What do you mean that the SA breakthrough is "highly, highly compromised?" And specifically which GLBT "activists" are you citing? Have any of them even lived in South Africa? I'm aware of what's constantly repeated in the news, but I'm also aware that a lot of people are always willing to find fault with whatever progress South Africa makes. As for me being a bore, well, that's your opinion, isn't it? If you don't want to debate this with me then just don't respond. Either way, I'm going to question the veracity of your hearsay.

Go be stupid somewhere else._Everyone_ knows about the 2006 case of the four men who "reparatively" raped a lesbian there. And of the many similar cases, and the violence directed at glbt activists there.

Where have you had you stuck?

>South African Social Attitudes Survey (SASAS)[2008]

>South Africa is characterised by the co-existence of progressive legislation upholding the rights of lesbians and gay men, and discrimination and violent hate crimes perpetrated against them.

http://www.hsrc.ac.za/HSRC_Review_Article-121...

"Where have you had your head stuck?"

Any beefy, rugged Turkish guys want me to help them prove this? Would be happy to bang and oblige.

:-)

I've had my head stuck in South Africa ... actually living there, and I know from PERSONAL experience that conditions for GLBT are VASTLY improved compared to 30 years ago. You are citing incidents from 6 years ago, and the HSRC Review, while sobering, is not nearly as scathing as the wording of your post. Yes, intolerance there is cited as being a third higher than in the US, but that still leaves a vest section of the population that is NOT intolerant, AND we talking about a society that has been pummeled far worse by the christians than anywhere else in the world. Every American missionary and his uncle are always being sent to Africa. What do you expect?

Be careful -- Americans are very fond of stereotyping entire societies based on imperfect perceptions. That's what led us to using terms such as "Axis of Evil" and "Evil Empire." And the more we repeat derogatory assumptions, the more they become "truth" to us. Rather, we would be better served by acknowledging the progress that others are making -- we in the US are not exactly in a position to throw stones!

And now I'm leaving this thread, so you can hurl the rest of your insults -- behind my back.

Umninimuzi wrote:

Yes, intolerance there is cited as being a third higher than in the US, but that still leaves a vest section of the population that is NOT intolerant....

The disjunction between enshrining g/l rights in the Constitution and the reality is glaring, my point.

You "white" washed it.