Evolution vs. Creation

Full story: Best of New Orleans

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008.

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Level 5

Since: Apr 12

Beijing, China

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#37381
Aug 11, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>If you think anyone has anything more than a miniscule understanding of embryogenesis you're gravely mistaken.
All right, then, I'll admit it: I don't know what creates embryos.
Now what does that prove, that God did it?

At one time, people didn't know that the Sun is a mass of hydrogen and helium, so they had to invent a Sun god.
At one time, people didn't know that thunder was caused by hot air meeting cold air, so they had to invent a thunder god.
In short, for every gap, there is a god.

Maybe there is a god who created that mass of hydrogen and helium.
I don't know.
Maybe there is a god who puts hot air in contact with cold air.
I don't know.
What I do know is that it is not constructive to abandon all scientific inquiry with the words "God did it."

So with all due respect to your embryo god, I continue to hope that we will someday find out what creates embryos.
Dr Rain

Stratford, Canada

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#37382
Aug 11, 2012
 
wolverine wrote:
Heres One Fine Example Of Agendas In Science....Greedy Big oil Buys Sciences Findings To Falsely Project Peak Oil And A Finite Limit, To Force The Price Higher.
Theres More Oil In The Corners Of Colorado, Utah, And Wyoming, Then All Of The Acknoledged Oil Combined In The World....If Fact, Enough To Last 400 Years At Todays Pace.
For Awhile My Dad Was A Head Driller In Wyoming, I Was Fortunate Enough To Read A Report By Rand Corp....Peak Oil Is A Myth
Wolverine you have a poor understanding of how oil prices are set. Speculators are who set prices. It is not based on limits but on greed. I'd be happy to provide you with many primers but my guess is you arent interested in the facts.

What is sad is that we have all the necessary tech to move away from oil (e.g. electric) but because there is more to bilk of the masses through ignorance and stupidity we are where we are today.

So please stop with your tin hat consipracies and read the facts.
Dr Rain

Stratford, Canada

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#37383
Aug 11, 2012
 
wolverine wrote:
This Came From Religious Patriots...Who Understand Liberty And Freedom Does Not Mean Entitlements. It Does Not Mean Free Health Care,
You do recall Jesus was a Liberal and believed in helping the less fortunate and hence was all for free health care. The real hypocrisy is that you religious types don't read your own Bible before making things up.

Studies show more Atheists have read the Bible than religious folks. No one is surprised by that.

Since: Mar 11

St. Croix valley

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#37384
Aug 11, 2012
 
Dr Rain wrote:
<quoted text>
You do recall Jesus was a Liberal and believed in helping the less fortunate and hence was all for free health care. The real hypocrisy is that you religious types don't read your own Bible before making things up.
Studies show more Atheists have read the Bible than religious folks. No one is surprised by that.
Not only read the bible but undrstood it. Atheists have a far better understanding of religions than those that purport to be of that faith.(probably why they are atheists...understanding a religion is the first step to shunning it.)

"Religion allows you to understand everthing without knowing anything..." Can't remember who said that, maybe it was me...

Level 5

Since: Apr 12

Beijing, China

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#37387
Aug 11, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
I there a scientific explanation for how naturalism produced migratory instincts and navigational ability in whales?
No, but scientists are trying to find out.
Scientists are interested in learning.
It would be easy to say "God did it," but it wouldn't be very constructive.

I recently moved to China.
I don't know the Chinese language very well yet, but I'm trying to learn.
I purchased a Chinese bamboo flute and a Chinese instrument much like a violin.
I can't play those instruments very well yet, but I'm trying to learn.
It would be easy to give up and say "I don't do it," but it wouldn't be very constructive.

Will you please be patient while I learn the Chinese language, the Chinese flute, and the Chinese violin?
Then why can't you be patient while scientists learn more about the world around us?

Level 1

Since: May 08

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#37388
Aug 11, 2012
 

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Elohim wrote:
<quoted text>Wrong. You follow a false blasphemous creed. There is only 1 true God and He is Bob. The Stark Fist of Removal will be upon you!!
http://www.slobgenius.com/index.htm
That's because you serve "the phony god of self" and that false god allows you act any way you want. But no matter how much you desperately try to deceive yourself, the truth always resurfaces and you are accountable to it. There is freedom and deliverance from the spirit of Perversion. Furthermore, you prove my point that most Atheists are homosexuals. Romans 1:16-32

The Psychology of Atheism
http://cross.tv/84577

.

Level 5

Since: Apr 12

Beijing, China

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#37389
Aug 11, 2012
 
Subduction Zone wrote: "Name at least one bit of evidence that supports the existence of a god."

HTS wrote: "Biological altruism."

Let me see if I understand HTS correctly:
Not only humans, but animals of other species, often often make sacrifices, and even jeopardize their own lives for someone else, right?

W. D. Hamilton commented on this in 1964.
In his example, a ground squirrel sees a predator.
The squirrel gives off an alarm which warns the rest of the colony, but renders itself an easy target for the predator.

Hamilton inferred that what is passed from one generation to another is not so much genes which insure survival for the bearer, but rather genes which insure survival for the population.

In this example, the gene which causes a ground squirrel to give off an alarm makes dead meat out of that one ground squirrel, but is beneficial to the population.
drinK The HivE

New York, NY

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#37390
Aug 11, 2012
 

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Evolutionary Survival Tactic - Children Less Than Two Yr' Old In S.Guatemala Look At My Blond Hair - White Skin And Blue Eyes And Scream 4 Their Mother' Weird Shit)...

http://www.youtube.com/watch...
bohart

Morristown, TN

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#37391
Aug 11, 2012
 

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The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually life COULD have quite easily started with GODDIDIT WITH MAGIC.
But that has no bearing on the validity of evolution. It would still happen even if God magically poofed the first life into existence.
See, this is why you guys are so fixated on abiogenesis - you need to tie it to atheism and evolution for theological reasons, not logical or evidence-based ones.
Any reason why (a) God couldn't have used chemical abiogenesis to get evolution rolling?
Why yes - cuz that ain't how the Bible sez it is!
There we have it again, your concrete unalterable faith that life sprang into existence. What did you say,...life could quite easily have started? As I said you have absolutely ZERO EVIDENCE yet you causally say it was quite easily done. I see the brainwashing of the puddle goo congregation has rendered you incapable of rational independant thought . Just stick to your parroted lines of , fundie, liar and uneducated responses. The more you divert from the script the more galactically stupid you are.

P.S. You need to get into MIT or Harvard and tell them how simple life creation is, they've been at a roadblock for over a hundred years.

Since: Nov 07

St. James, NY

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#37392
Aug 11, 2012
 

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Let's try this again:

Questions:

How do you think the modern Theory of Evolution developed?

Why is it supported by so many scientists?

What 'agenda' does science have (beyond expanding our knowledge)?

Why are there Christians and other religious people that have no problem reconciling their beliefs with Evolution?

Was there ever a time when there was no life on Earth?

Are humans mammals? Are humans Primates?

Statements:

Evolution has absolutely nothing to do with Atheism. No one cares if you believe in God, it is only when your belief interferes with science and education do we care.

No one arguing for or supporting Evolution has anything invested in Evolution being true. If Evolution were disproved tomorrow it would actually be a pretty exciting time to be a Biologist.

All science is mechanistic. All science is naturalistic. There is not one scientific discipline that is not so. Evolution is no different then the rest of science.

Level 5

Since: Apr 12

Beijing, China

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#37393
Aug 11, 2012
 
HTS, why this regard for Intelligent Design?

The panda has a hand which is very clumsy for eating bamboo shoots.
Doesn't God love pandas?

I feel sorry for Mommy Kiwi Bird.
It must be uncomfortable for such a small bird to lay such a large egg.
Scientists tell us that kiwis are descended from a larger species.
This seems to me to be a reasonable explanation for Mommy Kiwi's misfortune, and not that God wanted to punish female kiwi birds.

And what of vestigial organs?
We carry around an appendix which we don't need.
It was good for our ancestors, who had to digest tree bark.
But we have lost our taste for tree bark since then.
Is God telling us that he wants us to continue eating tree bark?

And what about claws on their wings, which ostriches don't need?
Could this be a vestige from their past as theropod dinosaurs, or does God just want them to carry those claws around for the exercise?

And why do embryos go through useless stages?
Why do elephant embryos grow an extra pair of tusks which they later resorb?
Why do whale embryos grow leg bones which they later resorb?
Could this be because ontogeny recapitulates phylogeny, or because God enjoys the video display?

And what about junk DNA which nearly every species is carrying around?
Why do birds carry teeth DNA which they no longer need?

The squid has an eye which is more efficient than that of humans, and would work perfectly in a human body.
Does God love squids more than he loves humans?

The only reason our numerical system is based on 10 is because we have 10 fingers on both hands.
A duodecimal system, based on 12, would be more efficient.
I say that because 12 is divisible by 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, and itself.
10, however, is divisible only by 1, 2, 5, and itself.
Doesn't this all-knowing God know his math?

Last but not least, why are the sexes so badly mismatched?
A man wants to hop in bed with every attractive woman he sees.
A woman, on the other hand, wants time for a relationship to warm up.
The logical explanation seems to me that it was once in the evolutionary interests for a men to leave as much seed as possible.
However, it was in the evolutionary interests for a woman to look before she leaps. Otherwise, she ends up with a cave full of young'uns with no mate to help care for them, and with little chance of survival.
Could this be the explanation, or is God merely testing us?

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

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#37395
Aug 11, 2012
 
wolverine wrote:
<quoted text>
Well....Aren't You The Intellectual ?
Is This How You Promote Your Faith ?
In Real Life...Id Bend You Like A Pretzel And Let You Drink A Straw Out Of Your Azz.
Other Then That....I Appreciate Your Juvenile Combativeness.
Sorry but everyone who thinks oil is not biotic and the government is keeping it a secret that there is plenty of it is a stupid idiot. This is not personal.

Oil is found where there were shallow seas , these shallow sea teem with life , and when they periodically dry up the life would die.
Layers of this would build up as it happened over thousands of years. This would get buried over time forming layers in the rock strata. Heat and pressure would leach the oil out of these layers and it then collects in porous rock , but most of it is to deep to retrieve , but when a fault fractures the rock that traps it it seeps upward from the pressure and that is where it is found.

The main reason this is known to be factual is that ever since
standard oil started pumping it geologist knew the thing to look
for when looking for oil was the salt left behind from the drying sea. I can prove this to you, because there is a special place in Iran where you can see exactly where it comes from.

Start watching this at 37.00 minutes , but I suggest you watch the whole thing it's really interesting. It explains the whole oil cycle . Then you will know the abiotic oil hypothesis is wrong.

http://www.youtube.com/watch...

But the main reason the abiotic oil myth has been brought back is that governments don't want you to know why we will soon be going to war . The oil supply will be exhausted in 40 years , but dwindling before then. When this happens and the machine run dry
what do you think will happen?

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

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#37396
Aug 11, 2012
 
TheBlackSheep wrote:
<quoted text>
You mean, after they ate his body and drank his blood?
They just did what he told them to do.
Dr Rain

Stratford, Canada

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#37398
Aug 11, 2012
 
Tom, you are a true credit to scientific facts!
Thomas Robertson wrote:
HTS, why this regard for Intelligent Design?
The panda has a hand which is very clumsy for eating bamboo shoots.
Doesn't God love pandas?
I feel sorry for Mommy Kiwi Bird.
It must be uncomfortable for such a small bird to lay such a large egg.
Scientists tell us that kiwis are descended from a larger species.
This seems to me to be a reasonable explanation for Mommy Kiwi's misfortune, and not that God wanted to punish female kiwi birds.
And what of vestigial organs?
We carry around an appendix which we don't need.
It was good for our ancestors, who had to digest tree bark.
But we have lost our taste for tree bark since then.
Is God telling us that he wants us to continue eating tree bark?
And what about claws on their wings, which ostriches don't need?
Could this be a vestige from their past as theropod dinosaurs, or does God just want them to carry those claws around for the exercise?
And why do embryos go through useless stages?
Why do elephant embryos grow an extra pair of tusks which they later resorb?
Why do whale embryos grow leg bones which they later resorb?
Could this be because ontogeny recapitulates phylogeny, or because God enjoys the video display?
And what about junk DNA which nearly every species is carrying around?
Why do birds carry teeth DNA which they no longer need?
The squid has an eye which is more efficient than that of humans, and would work perfectly in a human body.
Does God love squids more than he loves humans?
The only reason our numerical system is based on 10 is because we have 10 fingers on both hands.
A duodecimal system, based on 12, would be more efficient.
I say that because 12 is divisible by 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, and itself.
10, however, is divisible only by 1, 2, 5, and itself.
Doesn't this all-knowing God know his math?
Last but not least, why are the sexes so badly mismatched?
A man wants to hop in bed with every attractive woman he sees.
A woman, on the other hand, wants time for a relationship to warm up.
The logical explanation seems to me that it was once in the evolutionary interests for a men to leave as much seed as possible.
However, it was in the evolutionary interests for a woman to look before she leaps. Otherwise, she ends up with a cave full of young'uns with no mate to help care for them, and with little chance of survival.
Could this be the explanation, or is God merely testing us?
HTS

Williston, ND

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#37399
Aug 11, 2012
 

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woodtick57 wrote:
<quoted text>Not only read the bible but undrstood it. Atheists have a far better understanding of religions than those that purport to be of that faith.(probably why they are atheists...understanding a religion is the first step to shunning it.)
"Religion allows you to understand everthing without knowing anything..." Can't remember who said that, maybe it was me...
Like the religion of atheistic evolution.
HTS

Williston, ND

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#37400
Aug 11, 2012
 
Thomas Robertson wrote:
<quoted text>
No, but scientists are trying to find out.
Scientists are interested in learning.
It would be easy to say "God did it," but it wouldn't be very constructive.
Give me a logical reason why you assume "evolution did it".
HTS

Williston, ND

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#37401
Aug 11, 2012
 
Thomas Robertson wrote:
HTS, why this regard for Intelligent Design?
The panda has a hand which is very clumsy for eating bamboo shoots.
Doesn't God love pandas?
I feel sorry for Mommy Kiwi Bird.
It must be uncomfortable for such a small bird to lay such a large egg.
Scientists tell us that kiwis are descended from a larger species.
This seems to me to be a reasonable explanation for Mommy Kiwi's misfortune, and not that God wanted to punish female kiwi birds.
And what of vestigial organs?
We carry around an appendix which we don't need.
It was good for our ancestors, who had to digest tree bark.
But we have lost our taste for tree bark since then.
Is God telling us that he wants us to continue eating tree bark?
And what about claws on their wings, which ostriches don't need?
Could this be a vestige from their past as theropod dinosaurs, or does God just want them to carry those claws around for the exercise?
And why do embryos go through useless stages?
Why do elephant embryos grow an extra pair of tusks which they later resorb?
Why do whale embryos grow leg bones which they later resorb?
Could this be because ontogeny recapitulates phylogeny, or because God enjoys the video display?
And what about junk DNA which nearly every species is carrying around?
Why do birds carry teeth DNA which they no longer need?
The squid has an eye which is more efficient than that of humans, and would work perfectly in a human body.
Does God love squids more than he loves humans?
Your logic proves what I've been saying... Evolution is religion. All you can do is play God and imagine that if you designed a panda you'd give him an opposable thumb. You would give a human a better eye. You would create life so that embryos wouldn't produce redundant structures. You wouldn't make junk DNA. You expect people to accept evolution by default because you have philosophical problems with God. You're using the identical logic that Darwin used, and it's fundamentally flawed because it relies on philosophical assumptions.
If religion is stripped away from Darwinism, what is left is a naked theory that is entirely unsupported by any science.
Furthermore, you know nothing about creating life, writing a genetic code, how to design an embryo or what the purpose of "junk DNA" is. If you were up to date on your facts, you wouldn't bring up junk DNA, because major evolutionary zealots are eating crow because it's entire premise is collapsing.

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Level 8

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#37402
Aug 11, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>
Give me a logical reason why you assume "evolution did it".
They remember it as a safe place to reproduce after all it is where they were born.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

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#37403
Aug 11, 2012
 
wolverine wrote:
Next, Discord...We Have Global Warming
You are a serious kitten hater, aren't you?
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

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#37404
Aug 11, 2012
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>It's obvious that you blindly accept what you want to believe, rather than actually examining the eivdence. You think that if a lot of people with credentials agree with you that you're safe.
DNA from cactus producing a human... So you think I need to show you a scientific impossibility for you to reject evolution?
Why would that be scientifically impossible? How do you know it is?

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