Flyers visit cross-state rival Penguins

So much for the Flyers' turnaround. If Laviolette wants to change this team, he's going to have to change the whole culture, which means ditching this supposed "tough guy" mentality that intimidates exactly no one. At least they didn't bite anyone at the end of the game, so that's a start for them.

Trout, apparently there is a rumor that Carter has been sleeping with Hartnell's wife (a credible source told philly.com or some other website), which is one of the things that has caused the alleged division in the Flyers' locker room.

The Flyers' struggles are offensive but mostly due to the lack of chemistry that this team has developed and all that crap going on in the locker room. The Flyers may need to just start over. Carter, Hartnell, Gagne, and Coburn could all be trade bait during the season.

An option for them is to trade Carter and Coburn to Atlanta for Ilya Kovalchuk or package those two for a first round pick from some team (maybe Columbus, along with Umberger returning). Gagne may never be the same again with the Flyers and probably needs a change of scenery so trade Gagne to Montreal for Halak and a Sergei Kostitsyn. If this is a lost season for the Flyers, then they need to start collecting picks and low-price players, so they can draft high this year and next year (if necessary). The Flyers gotta dump salary cause they're in salary cap hell right now.

Red Wings25 wrote:

Trout, apparently there is a rumor that Carter has been sleeping with Hartnell's wife (a credible source told philly.com or some other website), which is one of the things that has caused the alleged division in the Flyers' locker room.
The Flyers' struggles are offensive but mostly due to the lack of chemistry that this team has developed and all that crap going on in the locker room. The Flyers may need to just start over. Carter, Hartnell, Gagne, and Coburn could all be trade bait during the season.
An option for them is to trade Carter and Coburn to Atlanta for Ilya Kovalchuk or package those two for a first round pick from some team (maybe Columbus, along with Umberger returning). Gagne may never be the same again with the Flyers and probably needs a change of scenery so trade Gagne to Montreal for Halak and a Sergei Kostitsyn. If this is a lost season for the Flyers, then they need to start collecting picks and low-price players, so they can draft high this year and next year (if necessary). The Flyers gotta dump salary cause they're in salary cap hell right now.

Whoa!! No kidding, RW--I hadn't heard anything about that, though I'm not surprised that Hartnell's wife might want to sleep with somebody else once in a while. Would the Thrashers really do that trade? I thought they loved Kovalchuk down there.

Philly fan getting ready for a Pens/Flyers game (or any game for that matter):
1. Watch "Invincible" while chugging 15 Pabst Blue Ribbons and puke - check
2. Kick dog - check
3. Punch girlfriend/boyfriend - check
4. Put on outdated cheese doodle colored jersey - check
5. Whine that the refs favor the Pens and handed them a Cup - Check
6. Yell "Crosby sucks" for 3 hours while the Flyers get their @sses handed to them - Check
7. Take bus or walk home while soiling themselves cause too drunk to drive - Check
8. Repeat Steps 1 - 7 for next loss!!!

Flyers are trash!! Let's Go Pens!!!

Red Wings25 wrote:

Trout, apparently there is a rumor that Carter has been sleeping with Hartnell's wife (a credible source told philly.com or some other website), which is one of the things that has caused the alleged division in the Flyers' locker room.
The Flyers' struggles are offensive but mostly due to the lack of chemistry that this team has developed and all that crap going on in the locker room. The Flyers may need to just start over. Carter, Hartnell, Gagne, and Coburn could all be trade bait during the season.
An option for them is to trade Carter and Coburn to Atlanta for Ilya Kovalchuk or package those two for a first round pick from some team (maybe Columbus, along with Umberger returning). Gagne may never be the same again with the Flyers and probably needs a change of scenery so trade Gagne to Montreal for Halak and a Sergei Kostitsyn. If this is a lost season for the Flyers, then they need to start collecting picks and low-price players, so they can draft high this year and next year (if necessary). The Flyers gotta dump salary cause they're in salary cap hell right now.

by the time things turn around after all the trades and dumpings you have suggested,pronger will be eating food through a straw in an old folks home... He should have never been aquired...Total waste of time money and futures for the flys........He just hasnt lived up to the hype that surrounded the flys when he showed up...

Dave wrote:

Philly fan getting ready for a Pens/Flyers game (or any game for that matter):
1. Watch "Invincible" while chugging 15 Pabst Blue Ribbons and puke - check
2. Kick dog - check
3. Punch girlfriend/boyfriend - check
4. Put on outdated cheese doodle colored jersey - check
5. Whine that the refs favor the Pens and handed them a Cup - Check
6. Yell "Crosby sucks" for 3 hours while the Flyers get their @sses handed to them - Check
7. Take bus or walk home while soiling themselves cause too drunk to drive - Check
8. Repeat Steps 1 - 7 for next loss!!!
Flyers are trash!! Let's Go Pens!!!

This is REALLY funny! I'll be thinking of it watching all those orange-clad mongoloids foaming at the mouth tonight.

DEV STARR wrote:

<quoted text>by the time things turn around after all the trades and dumpings you have suggested,pronger will be eating food through a straw in an old folks home... He should have never been aquired...Total waste of time money and futures for the flys........He just hasnt lived up to the hype that surrounded the flys when he showed up...

It's pretty clear now that you're right. The Pens got to rip off Anaheim in the Ryan Whitney trade, and then the Ducks got to rip off Philly right back. So we got to rip off Philly second-hand! I never looked at it that way, but I like it. But back to that trade, it probably comes down to that Flyer insecurity again--Joffrey Lupul was just too gay-sounding a name for these wannabe Broad Street Bullies.

Trout, Lupul had too high of a salary and was going to be moved anyways, but they figured that getting Pronger would give them two shutdown defensemen (him and Timonen) but no one foresaw all the division and turmoil in the Flyers' locker room that's going on. Unlike a lot of Pens fans such as Dave, who feel that the Flyers are trash, they're not...they just don't play with a consistent effort each game and haven't grown up yet. Besides the fact that the Pens are a better team because they play better as a TEAM and have two gamebreakers, the Penguins have learned from their mistakes and are mature. The Flyers let their emotions get the best of them, haven't learned from their mistakes, and haven't matured as a team. I was glad to see that the Flyers didn't pull any crap at the end of the game on tuesday cause that doesn't solve anything.

What the Flyers need to do is get ready for next year. Flyers' top brass (Holmgren and Snider) need to admit that they've made mistakes with bringing in certain guys and start dumping salary via trades. Atlanta would accept a trade of Carter, Coburn, and a 2nd rounder and/or prospect for Kovalchuk because they dont wanna get screwed over like Florida did with Bouwmeester (who the Flyers wanted to get last season, but Florida asked for too much in JVR and Giroux). Carter would give the Penguins a very good no.2 center, while Evander Kane would become their no.1. Waddell would happily accept Coburn back after getting ripped off by Holmgren when Zhitnik was traded to the Thrashers for Coburn. Kovalchuk would give the Flyers a game breaker on offense. They could do that...or could decide to blow the team up, keeping Giroux, JVR, Richards.

Then, they trade Hartnell to Columbus for RJ Umberger (penguin killer and versatile forward). They trade Timonen to Dallas (needs defensive help) for a 2nd round pick. They trade Carter, instead, to Anaheim for the first round pick back. Coburn gets traded to Phoenix for Upshall. Gagne gets traded to Montreal for Jaroslav Halak, Sergei Kostitsyn, and a 3rd rounder. Briere gets traded somewhere, as long as we can dump his salary. Then, with the first overall pick in the draft, they select Taylor Hall (center) to replace Carter or Kirill Kabanov (Left Wing), the most hyped russian forward since Malkin and Crosby. Depth down the middle rules, though, so the Flyers would most likely select Hall, giving them these lines:

JVR-Richards-Giroux
Umberger-Hall-Kostitsyn
Upshall-Powe-Asham
Cote-Betts-Laperriere

Pronger-Carle
Parent-Bourdon
Tollefsen-Bartulis

Halak-Boucher

They'd be out of salary cap nightmare, would have a good team again, and would have plenty of cap room to add pieces to their defense and offense.

Thats a complicated scheme wang,and I dont think much will happen in that area. Its hard to move players with such big contracts and its hard to get them first rounder trades because new players in the league play for a lot less than your vetrans... Not many teams want to give up these young prospects.. Maybe at the trade deadline some good moves will be made,but dont count on the trades you have mentioned materializing.. Thats the problem with the flys,they dont get the results,then blow their future with a hasty move. I.e. pronger... You cant build a winner over night... Its a long and slow process.

DEV STARR wrote:

Thats a complicated scheme wang,and I dont think much will happen in that area. Its hard to move players with such big contracts and its hard to get them first rounder trades because new players in the league play for a lot less than your vetrans... Not many teams want to give up these young prospects.. Maybe at the trade deadline some good moves will be made,but dont count on the trades you have mentioned materializing.. Thats the problem with the flys,they dont get the results,then blow their future with a hasty move. I.e. pronger... You cant build a winner over night... Its a long and slow process.

Very true Dev, about building a winner. Maybe the Flyers can just try to get what they can, in terms of picks and prospects, for their high paid players. They could just do whatever is needed to get rid of those players and then they could follow the Penguin rebuild plan...tank the next 4 seasons and collect no.1 overall picks. Philadelphia is a big media market and could afford to do that because the fans will keep coming and support their plan.

Red Wings25 wrote:

<quoted text>
Very true Dev, about building a winner. Maybe the Flyers can just try to get what they can, in terms of picks and prospects, for their high paid players. They could just do whatever is needed to get rid of those players and then they could follow the Penguin rebuild plan...tank the next 4 seasons and collect no.1 overall picks. Philadelphia is a big media market and could afford to do that because the fans will keep coming and support their plan.

If the flys really want to get rid of their high priced players,about the only way to do it is to put them on waivers,then send them to the minors when they clear waivers,which they probably will,because no one wants a hefty contract,then recall them... Someone may pick them up at half the salary... Only problem with this is the flys then have to claim half the salary on their cap...You then are paying players who dont even play for you... e.g. tucker and raycroft are still being paid by the leafs,although these were buyouts... The flys should stick with what they have.....tough it out ,and maybe someone will be silly enough to take some of these high contracts off their hands.....dont count on it though...The rangers were lucky enough to sucker the habs into taking one of their overpaid players,but it doesnt happen much anymore..

you guys are out of your minds. Keep Carter and Richards as the 1 2 centres. What they need is a physical defenceman. Pronger is great but they need more than 1 defenceman that can lay the body. Apparently phaneuf is available in calgary. I didnt hear anything about carter sleeping with hartnells wife. I dont believe it for a second. People come up with stuff like this all the time. If that happened it would be alot biiger of a story. Anyways there going to come out of it soon, and we can all forget about this episode of the season. There might be a trade comming soon if so I welcome a change. I hope they get an imact player to take the heat of some of the stars currently on the team.

Flyersfan12,

If the Flyers were to be acquiring Phaneuf (who has a cap hit above 6M, I believe), they'd be moving Timonen or Carle to another team (to provide extra cap relief), while trading Carter or someone with a high cap hit to get him. I doubt Calgary would be trading that guy, though. I'd love to see your source though...where did you see this? The Flames would want Jeff Carter and that would force the Flyers to put Briere or Giroux at second line center (which they could do), but that would still take away from their forward depth. I'll be interested to see what happens in the next week or so with trades and see who they acquire.

Red Wings25 wrote:

Trout, Lupul had too high of a salary and was going to be moved anyways, but they figured that getting Pronger would give them two shutdown defensemen (him and Timonen) but no one foresaw all the division and turmoil in the Flyers' locker room that's going on. Unlike a lot of Pens fans such as Dave, who feel that the Flyers are trash, they're not...they just don't play with a consistent effort each game and haven't grown up yet. Besides the fact that the Pens are a better team because they play better as a TEAM and have two gamebreakers, the Penguins have learned from their mistakes and are mature. The Flyers let their emotions get the best of them, haven't learned from their mistakes, and haven't matured as a team. I was glad to see that the Flyers didn't pull any crap at the end of the game on tuesday cause that doesn't solve anything.
What the Flyers need to do is get ready for next year. Flyers' top brass (Holmgren and Snider) need to admit that they've made mistakes with bringing in certain guys and start dumping salary via trades. Atlanta would accept a trade of Carter, Coburn, and a 2nd rounder and/or prospect for Kovalchuk because they dont wanna get screwed over like Florida did with Bouwmeester (who the Flyers wanted to get last season, but Florida asked for too much in JVR and Giroux). Carter would give the Penguins a very good no.2 center, while Evander Kane would become their no.1. Waddell would happily accept Coburn back after getting ripped off by Holmgren when Zhitnik was traded to the Thrashers for Coburn. Kovalchuk would give the Flyers a game breaker on offense. They could do that...or could decide to blow the team up, keeping Giroux, JVR, Richards.
Then, they trade Hartnell to Columbus for RJ Umberger (penguin killer and versatile forward). They trade Timonen to Dallas (needs defensive help) for a 2nd round pick. They trade Carter, instead, to Anaheim for the first round pick back. Coburn gets traded to Phoenix for Upshall. Gagne gets traded to Montreal for Jaroslav Halak, Sergei Kostitsyn, and a 3rd rounder. Briere gets traded somewhere, as long as we can dump his salary. Then, with the first overall pick in the draft, they select Taylor Hall (center) to replace Carter or Kirill Kabanov (Left Wing), the most hyped russian forward since Malkin and Crosby. Depth down the middle rules, though, so the Flyers would most likely select Hall, giving them these lines:
JVR-Richards-Giroux
Umberger-Hall-Kostitsyn
Upshall-Powe-Asham
Cote-Betts-Laperriere
Pronger-Carle
Parent-Bourdon
Tollefsen-Bartulis
Halak-Boucher
They'd be out of salary cap nightmare, would have a good team again, and would have plenty of cap room to add pieces to their defense and offense.

You've convinced me on Kovalchuk. I'm not as sure about Hartnell for Umberger. If I was Columbus, I sure wouldn't do it. Hartnell is an intriguing blend of grit and skill, but there are a lot of guys like that out there, and his antics are such a distraction.

The Trout wrote:

<quoted text>
You've convinced me on Kovalchuk. I'm not as sure about Hartnell for Umberger. If I was Columbus, I sure wouldn't do it. Hartnell is an intriguing blend of grit and skill, but there are a lot of guys like that out there, and his antics are such a distraction.

hartnell is an idiot. his stupid penalties cost his team big time. sure was fun watching the pens beatcrap out of yet another team. lol.

Red Wings25 wrote:

Flyersfan12,
If the Flyers were to be acquiring Phaneuf (who has a cap hit above 6M, I believe), they'd be moving Timonen or Carle to another team (to provide extra cap relief), while trading Carter or someone with a high cap hit to get him. I doubt Calgary would be trading that guy, though. I'd love to see your source though...where did you see this? The Flames would want Jeff Carter and that would force the Flyers to put Briere or Giroux at second line center (which they could do), but that would still take away from their forward depth. I'll be interested to see what happens in the next week or so with trades and see who they acquire.

Hockeybuzz was my source for the flyers wanting to make a trade. After today the christmas freeze comes up so i dont think they are doing anything for a while. They also said phaneuf is available i dont think they mentioned a trade between the two clubs. They mentioned kovalchuk, brown, lecavalier, and staal.

flyersfan12 wrote:

<quoted text>
Hockeybuzz was my source for the flyers wanting to make a trade. After today the christmas freeze comes up so i dont think they are doing anything for a while. They also said phaneuf is available i dont think they mentioned a trade between the two clubs. They mentioned kovalchuk, brown, lecavalier, and staal.

Hey flyboy,there is a new thing out called salary cap....so I think your sources are dreaming or cant do math very well....The numbers just dont add up in any of these dreams you say are possibly becomeing reality...

Trout your lucky your in slippery rock and not on the eastern half of pa bc youd never get away with your shit here. You obviously dont even know flyers fans if thats your assumption because your head is prolly too far up malkins ass. and here are your steps for western pa (pens fans)

1.Jerk off to game 7 of last years stanley cup
2.Get a shower with your boyfriend
3.Put your pussy i mean crosby jersey on
4.do your boyfriends hair to make it look like crosbys
5.Stay sober bc pens fans are lame
6.Cheer LETS GO PENS and think youre the shit when in reality nothing is worse than a pens fan

MJB wrote:

Trout your lucky your in slippery rock and not on the eastern half of pa bc youd never get away with your shit here. You obviously dont even know flyers fans if thats your assumption because your head is prolly too far up malkins ass. and here are your steps for western pa (pens fans)
1.Jerk off to game 7 of last years stanley cup
2.Get a shower with your boyfriend
3.Put your pussy i mean crosby jersey on
4.do your boyfriends hair to make it look like crosbys
5.Stay sober bc pens fans are lame
6.Cheer LETS GO PENS and think youre the shit when in reality nothing is worse than a pens fan

"Nothing is worse than a Pens fan?" I don't know, it felt pretty good to be a Pens fan during the victory parade. Maybe it's better to follow a bunch of biters and other assorted scumbags who have to wear orange uniforms with an ugly 70's logo and who always choke in the playoffs. I don't see how it could be better, but like you say, I don't know Flyer fans.

DEV STARR wrote:

<quoted text>Hey flyboy,there is a new thing out called salary cap....so I think your sources are dreaming or cant do math very well....The numbers just dont add up in any of these dreams you say are possibly becomeing reality...

Hey, Dev, some little AOL troll is taking your name in vain on another thread (the one about Forbes magazine naming Pens' fans the best).