Vatican Keeps Parish Records From Mormons

That's a bit of closing the barn door after the horse has left. The LDS already has most of the pre 1900 Catholic Church records for major USA cities and Europe. They microfilmed then in the 1960s and 1970s. Plus, a second Baptism or Sealing shouldn't matter The deceased can reject the Latter Day Baptism themselves -- if the Church truly believes its own teaching on Free Will.

I admit having the information available would most certain help. On the other hand I can see the Vatican's point. The LDS or Mormons disregarded the wishes of the Jewish community and preformed many baptism by proxy. I agree with the Jewish communities and any other who wish not to have such rituals preformed. Kudos to the Vatican for such a stance, yet we all suffer by the acts of such a cult. (ex-mormon myself and it is my belief it is a cult)

What a bunch of temporal hooey. Let's let God sort it out. Who cares what rituals they do? We should be talking about religious unification, not one more thing to drive us all into more factions.

We need a 'Do Not Baptise' registry, something like the 'Do Not Call' registry.

The Jews and Catholics could sign up, but they wouldn't be the first. That would be me.

Mormons playing church reminds me of the many times we children played at mass in the back yard. they need to be careful though . I tried baptizing a cat and got scratched. It could be that Jesus does not appreciate grown people playing church.

So much for Latter Day Saints.

baptizing the dead, they are just plain weird!

The Catholic church is cutting of their nose to spite their face. The records are also used by more non Mormons than Mormons to trace their personal genealogy. The Mormon data base is the largest depository of names in the world. With this ruling it just means that the Catholic people will not be able to trace their ancestors nearly so easy. This ruling hurts the Catholic population more than it hurts the Mormons. If the Catholic Church doesn't believe in Baptism for the Dead what difference does it make to them if someone preforms an act that is not binding on them. If they think that in some way it makes them a Mormon then the Pope and all the rest of the Catholics should join the Mormon church and be baptised with someone holding the authority from Christ and admit that they don't have this authority. You can't have it both ways, if the Mormons don't have any authority then it doesn't matter anyway and if they are afried that the Mormon's do have the authority to baptize and make them Mormons then they should all join the Mormon Church. So why cut of your nose to spite your face.

Dave wrote:

baptizing the dead, they are just plain weird!

I believe there was some kind of tampering with a corpse at the Branch Davidian deal as well. As the two related?

Do Mormons believe they go to a different heaven than Catholics or that they are the only ones going?

Sorry,but I know more Catholics than Mormons because Tx was once ruled by Spain and you had to be Catholic to own land. It only stands to reason there are many more Catholics than Mormons.

I think there's about 200,000 MM's in the whole of Texas, give or take 50,000.

Dave wrote:

baptizing the dead, they are just plain weird!

Though I may not agree with Mormons on everything, their interpretation of 1 Cor. 15:29 is sustained by the Greek. And besides, it takes care of the soteriological problem of evil, in their view, allowing people who never heard the truth, however defined, an opportunity to receive it with their accompanying rites.

caedmon wrote:

but they wouldn't be the first. That would be me.

I am sensing some underlying hatred towards mormonism. I recently read your post on another forum. Ease up on them hammers: this isn't a crusade.

Tuggs wrote:

The LDS or Mormons disregarded the wishes of the Jewish community and preformed many baptism by proxy.

I'm guessing this wasn't by mandate of their church. Probably just a bunch of people whose relatives were in the Holocaust and still wanted to save their dead ancestors.(As I understand it, that's what they do it for: for their ancestors). I have a hard time blaming an entire church for some guy somewhere ignoring the Jewish community's request.

Confused wrote:

Let's let God sort it out. Who cares what rituals they do? We should be talking about religious unification, not one more thing to drive us all into more factions.

That's how I see it. If some Catholic burned a candle for my dead uncle, I would think it nice of them for caring in their own way. If a Muslim dedicated a Hajj or something, to an infidel friend who passed away, I think it would be nice. If a Baptist or a Pentecostal (I know they don't) cared enough about my ancestors, and started doing baptisms for a loved one, I would be delighted. Or if a Buddhist made a shrine to my dead grandfather and prayed for him, I think that is nice. I don't believe in any of these things. But who cares? Why can't we just use religion as a unifying force instead of a divisive one? Why are people angry?

It seems hypocritical to deny the validity of their baptisms for the dead and then object that it is done.

Human wrote:

<quoted text>

I'm guessing this wasn't by mandate of their church. Probably just a bunch of people whose relatives were in the Holocaust and still wanted to save their dead ancestors.(As I understand it, that's what they do it for: for their ancestors). I have a hard time blaming an entire church for some guy somewhere ignoring the Jewish community's request.

Can I address this point of yours. The agreement between the LDS CHurch and the Jews is that only those LDS who have a direct Jewish ancestor can submitt names for baptism for the dead. The regulations of the LDS Churchare that you can only submit names of direct ancestors without writen permission of the next of kin no matter what the religion of the person is. Now some do claim to be decendants and when found those names are removed from the church rolls. HOwever in cases like a froiend of mine whose grandparents were Holacaust servivers and her parents joind the LDS Church She should not be prohibited from practicing her religion.

Because this personal information was given by people to their church, then this information is part of that church's record. The Roman Church should not have to divulge that to anyone short of legal proceedings where that info is required.

But because Romanism does not abide by Hebrews 9:27 itself by holding masses for their dead and believing prayers will release someone confinded in their pergatory earlier than what would have happened, then it won't receive much sympathy from people like me when Mormonism requests those records.

If both Romanism and Mormonism believes that prayers said on behalf of the dead will help those 'poor souls' then they should be freely exchanging church records shouldn't they?

http://www.allaboutmormons.com/ENG_Video41.ph...

larry wrote:

<quoted text>
Can I address this point of yours. The agreement between the LDS CHurch and the Jews is that only those LDS who have a direct Jewish ancestor can submitt names for baptism for the dead. The regulations of the LDS Churchare that you can only submit names of direct ancestors without writen permission of the next of kin no matter what the religion of the person is. Now some do claim to be decendants and when found those names are removed from the church rolls. HOwever in cases like a froiend of mine whose grandparents were Holacaust servivers and her parents joind the LDS Church She should not be prohibited from practicing her religion.

Thank you for the clarification. That sounds great to me.

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Human wrote:

<quoted text>
Thank you for the clarification. That sounds great to me.

You are welcom. I find that people generaaly do not know much about other religions other than what they hear. So Many people do not get the truth behind a religions teaching because they do not ask someone in the religion. As an example I had heard many explainations about why Catholics pray to Mary inspite of the fact that Jesus tells us to pray to God but I never understood it until I spoke to a Catholic priest about it.

We don't baptize dead people, we baptize living people "for" the dead, big diff! What are the Catholics afraid of--that we're right and people won't want to be Catholic after they die? Or are they just being nasty? Shame on you, may your ancestors haunt you (whoever made that stupid decision). Has anyone considered that Jesus died for everyone who has ever lived on the face of the earth, no matter what religion they were/are? What if we said only Mormons can use familysearch.org ? As for Jewish ancestors, we do have Jews who have become Mormons and they do have ancestors too!

Like I said the Mormons are just wierd

tex wrote:

<quoted text>
I believe there was some kind of tampering with a corpse at the Branch Davidian deal as well. As the two related?
Do Mormons believe they go to a different heaven than Catholics or that they are the only ones going?
Sorry,but I know more Catholics than Mormons because Tx was once ruled by Spain and you had to be Catholic to own land. It only stands to reason there are many more Catholics than Mormons.
I think there's about 200,000 MM's in the whole of Texas, give or take 50,000.

Dave wrote:

Like I said the Mormons are just wierd
<quoted text>

This just shows you know nothing about the LDS CHurch.