Muslim Americans Feel Marginalized

They are radicalized based on friendship and kinship.

Yes, when that friend or that kin points them to the verses in the Quran stating they should kill non-believers in the name of Allah.

And that is exactly what the terrorists are doing.

Islam needs to reform itself ... or be held accountable for sanctioning mass murder.

We heard the same song here, in France, two or three years ago.

Beware. They will be soon your masters as they are ours.

Dan wrote:

They are radicalized based on friendship and kinship.
Yes, when that friend or that kin points them to the verses in the Quran stating they should kill non-believers in the name of Allah.
And that is exactly what the terrorists are doing.
Islam needs to reform itself ... or be held accountable for sanctioning mass murder.

Klanners, Skinheads and Earth Liberation Fronters feel marginalized, too, and for much the same reason. Using violence to intimidate and spread their messages of hate.

Any group that identifies itself with unique religious rituals, dress, eating habits, and laws (sharia) is isolating itself intentionally.
Muslims are marginalizing themselves. It is not the fault of the rest of the world.
www.thereligionofpeace.com

Hmmm...They reacted sympathetically after 9/11. A poll last month among Muslim-Americans showed 60% believe it wasn't Arabs who did 9/11. Also, 25% of Muslims under 30 are cool with suicide bombings. I wonder why America doesn't get a warm, fuzzy feeling about Muslims here in America. Hmmm.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/ali-eteraz/us-m...

ilivienct said:
im not muslim,but i study religion.have you ever read the quran,it says nothing in it about killing non believers.

Well, you don't study the Koran very well. The passages you put forth are instruction to Jews who had fallen under Islamic rule that if they killed just one Muslim, it would be like killing all the Muslims and they would suffer from it. Don't delude yourself. Islam most certainly is not the religion of peace. To deny its violent nature isn't Islamic.

Sura (2:216)- Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not.

Sura (2:191)- And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution [of Muslims] is worse than slaughter [of non-believers]

Sura (9:29)- Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth,(even if they are) of the People of the Book(Christians and Jews), until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.

Sura (9:123)- O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness.

Also, noe of the groups you mentioned do their evil deeds in the name of Christianity. Even if they did, you will find no passage in the New Testament to justify it. Stop trying to morally equate things. It just makes you look uninformed and most definately, not a true student of religion.

iliveinct wrote:

<quoted text>
im not muslim,but i study religion.have you ever read the quran,it says nothing in it about killing non believers.

Sura 4-89:“They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): but take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (from what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks…”

(By 'slay', the author means, peacefully grab the infidel and stop his or her life.)

Sura 47-4:“When you meet the unbelievers, strike off their heads; then when you have made wide slaughter among them, carefully tie up the remaining captives”

(By 'strike of their heads' the author means to say, peacefully separate the infidel's head from his or her body.)

Sura 9-29:“Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth,(even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.”

(Well that last one is less violent, since, if the muslims are nice enough not to kill you, then you get the infidel tax.) Niiiiiice.

Being "marginalized" in American society is better than being a Bud-Lite swilling, football-watching, gas-guzzling war monger. The American way is built on a global system of violence and exploitation. And it is unsustainable, which means more deperate futile wars to try to hold onto what is dissolving.

iliveinct wrote:

<quoted text>
exactly,they do it in the name of christianity,there is no difference.

The difference is that the most violent thing you can find Jesus telling his disciples to do is to sell their cloaks for a sword. And yet when one of them actually tries to use it at the end of the novel, Jesus tells him not to.
He's not out there telling his followers to go kill in his name. Those that do are disobeying his instructions.
Now mohommed is quite a different animal altogether. One with blood on his hands.(and I don't mean is own - see crucifix scene at the end of the N.T. screenplay). Killing people, raiding villages, silencing critics, channeling satan, and then telling his followers that he is the role model for muslim behavior...
Yep, sliiiight difference.
People should stop rationalizing bad behavior based on the actions of ancient, flea bitten savages and look around themselves at people who are genuinely liked and admired.
These living examples of good behavior inevitably perform acts of selflessness on a consistent basis.
These are God's true prophets - the guys and gals who treat others with respect and aid or teach those less fortunate, and don't make a big display of it "Hey, everybody, look at me! I'm holy, I'm a prophet, I've got a book to sell you." They just go about their business and you hardly notice them, but there they are, just when you need a helping hand, and they're on their way again.
Me, I'm a sinner.

For all you folks attempting to create a moral equivelance between the miniscule number of abortion clinic bombings / killings and the day-in and day-out reports from all over the world of Muslims murdering Muslims, Christians, Buddhists, etc -

Maybe you can do a quick chart comparing the number and frequency of attacks on abortion clinics to the number and frequency of attacks committed by Muslim extremists?

As far as I know, the last fatal attack on an abortion clinic was in the late '90s while the death toll from Murderous Muslims escalates daily.

Not-so-Bad writes: Being "marginalized" in American society is better than being a Bud-Lite swilling, football-watching, gas-guzzling war monger. The American way is built on a global system of violence and exploitation. And it is unsustainable, which means more deperate futile wars to try to hold onto what is dissolving."
It is also apparently better than being marginalized in a Muslim country. they don't leave sothey must like something about being here. do you? Why don't you leave?

Not so bad wrote:

Being "marginalized" in American society is better than being a Bud-Lite swilling, football-watching, gas-guzzling war monger. The American way is built on a global system of violence and exploitation. And it is unsustainable, which means more deperate futile wars to try to hold onto what is dissolving.

So you've renounced your citizenship then, eh?

If not, here is your chance. Go ahead. Renounce your citizenship.

tomaig wrote:

Maybe you can do a quick chart comparing the number and frequency of attacks on abortion clinics to the number and frequency of attacks committed by Muslim extremists?

Better to make a chart of the number of deaths caused by the US-led sanctions on Iraq compared to the number of deaths by all Muslim extremists plus the regime of Saddam Husein.

Over a million Iraqis, disproportionately children, died as a result of the sanctions. UNICEF has put the number of child deaths to 500,000. The reasons include lack of medical supplies, malnutrition, and especially disease owing to lack of clean water. Among other things, chlorine, needed for disinfecting water supplies, was banned as having a "dual use" in potential weapons manufacture. On May 10, 1996, appearing on 60 Minutes, Madeleine Albright (then U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations) was presented with a figure of half a million children under five having died from the sanctions. Not challenging this figure, she infamously replied "we think the price is worth it." Denis Halliday was appointed United Nations Humanitarian Coordinator in Baghdad, Iraq as of 1 September 1997, at the Assistant Secretary-General level. In October 1998 he resigned after a 34 year career with the UN in order to have the freedom to criticise the sanctions regime, saying "I don't want to administer a programme that satisfies the definition of genocide". Halliday's successor, Hans von Sponeck, subsequently also resigned in protest. Jutta Burghardt, head of the World Food Program in Iraq, followed them. According to von Sponeck, the sanctions restricted Iraqis to living on $100 each of imports per year.

For more background on the genocidal American policies against the people of Iraq, see "How the US deliberately destroyed Iraq's water" at this link:

http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/NAG108A...

Despite all the genocidal US aggression against the Iraqi people, the Iraqis still had nothing to do with the 9-11 attacks, yet using the post-911 hysteria and insinuations of their collaboration with the terrorists, a second war against Iraq was launched by the USA, resulting in many thousands more Iraqi deaths by the US govt.

Nobody likes Islamist terrorism but those using it to justify US wars and deadly seige of Mesopotamia are the BIGGEST mass murderers and hypocrites.

Oh, I see what these muslims are getting at. don't speak, don't listen, don't see anything bad about their islamic cult religion an dverything will be ok. oh yes also keep giving them money as jiyaza.

iliveinct wrote:

<quoted text>
and again,god had moses rape and murder.god told his followers not to hate theyre own enemies,but hate his,and also remove them from earth.all im saying is all religions have theyre wackos.koresh,jim jones,,etc etc.all had followings willing to kill on the behalf of the "true" god they worshipped.all religions have crazy people,some of those muslims live in countries where there is no television,alot of them did not no we were coming over to attack,and some still dont know why we are there,they just see us as invaders.i agree that there are muslim scum,trust me.but in the same sense our current christian run government is showing that they are terrorists just the same.

No one tries to be like moses unles they're a 'tard. There are no religious movements in the modern world which call for the destruction of idolators the way moses went old testament on the golden calf boys. Oh wait, there is one - islam.

I wish there was a post-post edit function. s 're

I'll file this under "more of the same." Until the people of the West submit to Islam, we are oppressing and radicalizing Muslims. It's ridiculous. Why can't they assimilate into Western society like all the other immigrant groups that came before them? Why can't Muslims in the West firmly denounce terrorism, instead of silently giving it their tacit approval, or openly supporting it, as is common in Great Britain? If Muslims in the West really want the trust of their fellow citizens, then they should make some effort to earn that trust. Frankly, it is hard not to be suspicious of a group when all you see of them is demonstrations and near-riots, where the members of the mobs all carry placards that promise murder and enslavement to non-Muslims. How about a counter-protest, o ye misunderstood, put-upon moderate Muslims?

It's true that Muslims are viewed as supicious characters. But that's because of what their historical Muslim documents teach. For example, the Muslim Taqiyya teaches that Muslims may tell big lies and use deception if it enhances their evil religion. So, how can we trust Muslims when they tell us anything? If the Muslims threw the Taqiyya and their other violent documents away, then I could believe their sincerity.

Philip Saenz wrote:

It's true that Muslims are viewed as supicious characters. But that's because of what their historical Muslim documents teach. For example, the Muslim Taqiyya teaches that Muslims may tell big lies and use deception if it enhances their evil religion. So, how can we trust Muslims when they tell us anything? If the Muslims threw the Taqiyya and their other violent documents away, then I could believe their sincerity.

1) Do you believe a woman can be a teacher to you? Do you believe a woman can have authority over you? Should women be Governor, President, Senator, CEO, shift supervisor, etc? If so, then why aren't you asking the Christians and Jews to throw out their Holy books? See 1 Timothy 2:11-12, also 1 Cor 14:34-35 and Numbers 31:14-18.

2) Do you believe that in war if the enemy fails to surrender then we should put all the men to the sword and enslave all the women and children, as the Torah illustrates in the righteous Israeli slaughter of the Midianites? If not, then why aren't you asking the Christians and Jews to renounce their Holy books? See Numbers 31:1-18. See also Deuteronomy 21:11-14 for more sanction of the rape of female prisoners of war.

3) Do you believe homosexual men should be executed as the Torah commands? If not, then why arent you asking the Jews to renounce their Holy books? See Leviticus 20:13.

4) Do you believe that those who blaspheme God shall be stoned to death as the Torah and haftarah command? If not, why aren't you asking the Jews to renounce their Holy books? See Leviticus 24:16; also 2 Chron 15:12-13 and Deut 13:12-16. See also Hosea 13:16 describing the righteous punishment of unbelievers, including the massacre of women and children: "Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up."

5) Do you believe we have the right to own slaves and treat them as property, as is clearly established in the scriptures, both by precept and example? If not, then why aren't you demanding the Christians and Jews renounce their Holy books? See Leviticus 25:44; also Col. 3:22 and Titus 2:9. Of course there are many, many more Bible passages regulating and sanctioning slavery. But I am unaware of any that prohibit slavery or pronounce it a moral injustice.

6) Do you believe our slaves should be beaten, as condoned in the Torah? If not, why are you not demanding the Jews renounce their Holy books? See Exodus 21:20.

7) Do you believe that people who work on the sabbath should be put to death as the Torah commands? If not, then why aren't you asking the Jews to renounce their Holy books? See Exodus 31:15 and Exodus 35:2; also see Isaiah 40:8.

8) Do you believe that if I want to marry a young virgin that catches my eye, that if I rape her then she must be compelled to marry me, as commanded in the Torah? If not, then when will you demand the Jews renounce their Holy books? Note: I can afford the 50 shekels the Torah requires me to pay. See Deuteronomy 22:28-29.

9) Do you believe that I should have the authority to assign one of my female slaves to be the wife of one of my male slaves, without consulting her? If not, when will you demand the Jews renounce the Torah? This is, after all, how slave marriages are regulated in Exodus 21:4.

10) Do you believe we should use torture against war captives? If not, when will you demand the Jews renounce their Holy books? For example, as 2 Samuel 12:26-31 righteously describes how David "gathered all the people together, and went to Rabbah, and fought against it, and took it...And he brought forth the people that were therein, and put them under saws, and under harrows of iron, and under axes of iron, and made them pass through the brick-kiln: and thus did he unto all the cities of the children of Ammon."

Philip Saenz, do you believe devout religious people must do everything exactly as the scriptures say, especially on these issues I have put before you? Like Christians and Jews, Muslims too make judgements about which lines will continue to be taken literally and which are cast aside as artifacts from a culture far away in time and place. Don't let the Islamofascists define Islam, for they are only a tiny fragment of a diverse billion people.