Union rejects mediator for talks

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tampabay wrote:

Iwouldnt take a $27.oo per hour to an $14.50 pay scale ,not in todays econmy that $14.50 isnt nothing to compare with todays cost of living. And if I did take that ,so would the company and its CEO'S take a big cut in pay.And when the compamy and stock holder start making money and a profit again ,then give the employees a pay raise to. Do we want to make what they make down in Mexico? we will if we dont fight back.

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not a golfer wrote:

$27 for GED or less worker that watches the clock from break to break.... Plus overtime... Move over then and let other US workers have a shot rather than chase these jobs out of the country. Your one big repetetive argument is CEO pay.... there is only 1 CEO but thousands of Union workers sleeping in the racks.

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Confused wrote:

<quoted text>
Interesting...every discussion about unions and the situation includes several entries from pro-union people who are so concerned about how much some CEO makes. Why aren't you just as concerned for your fellow workers who are negatively impacted by your striking??
Interesting...Do you honestly think that by striking and demanding higher wages and benifits that these companies are going to WANT to stay in Michigan?? I can tell by how many businesses are waiting in line to come to Michigan. You are driving them to Mexico.

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not a golfer wrote:

$27 for GED or less worker that watches the clock from break to break.... Plus overtime... Move over then and let other US workers have a shot rather than chase these jobs out of the country. Your one big repetetive argument is CEO pay.... there is only 1 CEO but thousands of Union workers sleeping in the racks.

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tampabay wrote:

<quoted text> Ok ,lets let put the CEO's out of this then. Do you want everybody that works in a union or non union shop to take wage cuts and go backwards in pay? Just because they might take those dam jobs to Mexico ? You give me a list of Businesses ,Other than movie makers, energy ect,,,,,, Im talking about the jobs that have been in Michigan . I see them striking to keep the pay they have ,not getting more.! Im concerned this will be a pattern for others to follow,if they start taking pay from you. You should be concerned that youre kids will not work for Mexicos wages! Unless youre that rich, or just plain jealous youre not making that$27.00 per hour. Get youre head out of youre ..... and fight for fair wages,unless you want to live on 14.50 an hour sir.

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tampabay wrote:

<quoted text> LIke I said take the Ceo out of the this forum ,I still feel its essential to fight for youre wages , I dont care if you feel they shouldnt be making that 27.00 per hour,I dont like what I pay the Dentist either,But To go backwards in pay in any job in todays economy is just ludicrous. If you want to make 14.50 an hour thats fine with me,I worked to hard to get above that pay scale .

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tampabay wrote:

<quoted text> Ok ,lets let put the CEO's out of this then. Do you want everybody that works in a union or non union shop to take wage cuts and go backwards in pay? Just because they might take those dam jobs to Mexico ? You give me a list of Businesses ,Other than movie makers, energy ect,,,,,, Im talking about the jobs that have been in Michigan . I see them striking to keep the pay they have ,not getting more.! Im concerned this will be a pattern for others to follow,if they start taking pay from you. You should be concerned that youre kids will not work for Mexicos wages! Unless youre that rich, or just plain jealous youre not making that$27.00 per hour. Get youre head out of youre ..... and fight for fair wages,unless you want to live on 14.50 an hour sir.

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Confused wrote:

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What you just don't seem to get is you, by your own argument, are giving businesses another reason to consider leaving Michigan. Apparently you have forgotten, or weren't around when General Electric pulled out of Holland over 20 years ago...BEFORE Mexico, BEFORE NAFDA...Why???
Because the union demands were too much...they didn't move to Mexico, they just moved Sout...but out of Michigan.
That having been said...you just keep on believing that fighting for and demanding higher wages is going to somehow help Michigan and keep businesses in Michigan. Sheeesh...
One last thing...I'm sick and tired of hearing about what union people think they deserve. All based on what the last contract says they deserve...not based on performance, education, skills.
READ THIS VERY CAREFULLY...I am in no way jealous of you or your over sized paycheck. Since I got away from union involvement I have now the incentive to learn, not sit on my lazy A** and wait for my next "cost of living" raise. I take great pride in what I've accomplished and the when I'm up for review, I can honestly say I've EARNED it. I've educated myself and I LOVE what I do...I consider it playing every day and I get paid for it.
You have no basis for your argument. My parents were staunch union members for years. I've heard all the arguments, all the reasons, all the justifications before. Nothing you present to me is new. This pattern repeats itself over and over. That's why 20+ years ago General Electric left Holland and today it's ??? The horrifying and sad truth is that as long as you remain within that realm of mis-conception...you lose, I lose and the other workers lose...everyone.
You just keep up thinking like you are...you won't have to worry about who makes more for long unfortunately...you and a whole lot of Michigan workers will all be out of work and the Mexican workers will be thanking you...they will be making more than you because you won't have a job.
I'm done typing now...

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just a worker wrote:

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Bravo Confused, That was excellent. I completely agree. Those are the very same reasons I got my degree.
The sad part is. Pro Union mentality can't see the forest for the trees. It is a shame they can't see what is right in front of them.

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Arctic49519 wrote:

These anti-union whiners have a very simple philosophy for union workers:
Take any cuts an employer makes, no matter how unfair they are, lose your home and everything you have worked for. Do not question your employer, even when they are stuffing tens of millions into their pocket and turning a profit, because other people are jealous of you and would love to have your job.

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Arctic49519 wrote:

These anti-union whiners have a very simple philosophy for union workers:
Take any cuts an employer makes, no matter how unfair they are, lose your home and everything you have worked for. Do not question your employer, even when they are stuffing tens of millions into their pocket and turning a profit, because other people are jealous of you and would love to have your job.

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umaangel00 wrote:

Artic -
What you fail to realize is that in order for a company to still be running, they need to make a profit. It's not up to you to decide what that profit is. And has stated many times, the profit that the CEO makes is a kick in the bucket compared to the wages and benefits they have to pay out for these whiners. You should NEVER be paid based on what you think you are worth. It should ALWAYS be based off of what you provide for the company. If you are a lazy ass all day long then hell no you shouldn't get the kind of pay these people are working. But if you work hard, continue your education, produce quaility work and are a great employee then your pay should reflect that. It shouldn't be based on what the union says these people are worth. If that is how it's going to continue to be run, then union shops are well on their way to fighting themselves ALL OUT OF JOBS!

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havetosay wrote:

<quoted text>
Nice Strawman, Arctic49519. It should make a nice fire when someone sets it aflame.
Why is it that the pro-union mentality tends to assume non-union workers are envious? Why is it that Arctic49519 thinks employers are always out to rape and pillage and that the employee's ONLY option is to bend over unless they have a union?
Guess what, Arctic49519, if you don't have a job because the business went bankrupt or moved south, perhaps you will lose your home anyway.

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umaangel00 wrote:

Artic -
What you fail to realize is that in order for a company to still be running, they need to make a profit. It's not up to you to decide what that profit is. And has stated many times, the profit that the CEO makes is a kick in the bucket compared to the wages and benefits they have to pay out for these whiners. You should NEVER be paid based on what you think you are worth. It should ALWAYS be based off of what you provide for the company. If you are a lazy ass all day long then hell no you shouldn't get the kind of pay these people are working. But if you work hard, continue your education, produce quaility work and are a great employee then your pay should reflect that. It shouldn't be based on what the union says these people are worth. If that is how it's going to continue to be run, then union shops are well on their way to fighting themselves ALL OUT OF JOBS!