Vallejo City Council creates citizen public safety committee

Vallejo City Council creates citizen public safety committee
http://www.timesheraldonline.com/ci_19875432

The Vallejo City Council has voted to create a nine-member temporary fact-finding committee to investigate city public safety improvements.

The proposal, which initially helped pack council chambers last month, received a more muted response Tuesday night, with only a handful of speakers commenting for and against the issue.

The committee's creation, designed to stretch over a seven-month period, was approved on a 5-2 vote, with Councilmembers Erin Hannigan and Hermie Sunga dissenting.

Past and former public safety employees and their supporters originally spoke out against the proposal, saying it was timed too closely to the on-duty shooting death of Vallejo police Officer Jim Capoot in November.

On Tuesday, committee critics told the council that the Vallejo Police Department, in particular, knows how to take care of its own issues and does not need public oversight. Those critics, primarily police officers, seemed not to distinguish between the temporary fact-finding group and a longer-term police review board provided as a point of study for the committee.

Detective Ted Postolaki shared concerns that citizen committee members would become involved simply for "political leverage or as a hobby."

"As the city council, you should stop hostilities against the Vallejo police department," Postolaki said. "I'm asking you to let us do our job, free from the circus-type environment ...."

Resident Kathy Beistel, meanwhile, defended the committee's creation.

"Instead of getting defensive and angry and frustrated, why don't you look at this as an opportunity to use the people that are out there that love this city, just as much as you do," Beistel said.

Councilwoman Marti Brown, one of the proposal's authors, stressed that the citizens' panel would not mean residents would be wandering through the police and fire departments, looking over employees' shoulders. Brown said she sees the committee as "so relatively benign."

"This is not unusual, this is not outrageous, this isn't something that's happening in Vallejo and has never happened anywhere else," Brown said, adding that other cities have created citizen oversight boards before Vallejo. "I think at the end of the day, it's an opportunity for us to work together."

Sunga and Hannigan, separately termed the move a "rush job" and "putting the cart before the horse."

Hannigan, who recently announced her intention to run for a Solano County Supervisor seat representing Vallejo, said she feels the city should focus on the root causes of crime, potentially with creation of city policies and ordinances. Other council members argued that the two goals were not mutually exclusive.

In hopes of alleviating some concerns, the ad hoc committee was modified to include one police and one fire department representative, in addition to the originally planned seven residents named by the council.

The council also voted to expand its own recently created standing Public Safety subcommittee to three persons. Mayor Osby Davis and Councilwoman Stephanie Gomes will be joined by an as-of-yet-undetermined third council member.

Good. It is a start.

"In hopes of alleviating some concerns, the ad hoc committee was modified to include one police and one fire department representative, in addition to the originally planned seven residents named by the council."

Oh boy, you would think that having an expert or two in the field of study would have been included in the initial concept stage. It's analogous to saying, the downtown arts committee was modified to include an artist to avoid concerns.

Good on you though council for getting this right.

"Citizens" are not trained police graduates nor are the generally psychologicaly adapted to do this work; this meddling in serious public service work will only result in increased divisiveness, rancor and reduced efficiency. This is apparently what the repulsive gomes and our worthless, crooked, dishonest "mayor" want; these people are Vallejo's real enemies. Police personal are not "bad" as these self-absorbed egomaniacs would have us believe; police are the first defenders of OUR safety and protection, not a bunch of old women and retired morons who have nothing else to do.

Probably could have even been better with experts that work for departments in other cities that have a better track record of utilizing resources in the most efficient way possible while successfully policing. Vallejo certainly fails in the most efficient use of resources department.
LOL!

(t)urd enragement!

There should be a mandatory requirement that all applicants who think they have better ideas should do a ride along with police and fire plus spend some time in dispatch. It's easy to sit in the safety of a conference room trying to figure out "better" ways of service delivery but going out on the streets in a screaming police car or fire engine is quite an experience few will ever forget.
(t)urd enragement!

Wanglow wrote:

"Citizens" are not trained police graduates nor are the generally psychologicaly adapted to do this work; this meddling in serious public service work will only result in increased divisiveness, rancor and reduced efficiency. This is apparently what the repulsive gomes and our worthless, crooked, dishonest "mayor" want; these people are Vallejo's real enemies. Police personal are not "bad" as these self-absorbed egomaniacs would have us believe; police are the first defenders of OUR safety and protection, not a bunch of old women and retired morons who have nothing else to do.

Nice sentiments but you miss the point.

There is plenty room for looking at ways to more effectively make Vallejo safer...police activities are only part of the equation.

Police personnel are "bad" if they can't endure an examination of best practice both here and elsewhere. They are "bad" if their "club" mentality supercedes the understanding that they are paid
emplyees by the citizens of Vallejo and are just as accountable as the next person.

Yes they have to face some lousy people in the course of a day. So do I. The difference is that they are armed and are authorized to use legal force IN THEIR CHOSEN PROFESSION.

I reserve the right to monitor how that is going.

I totally agree Salty. Examining best practices also is informative for the citizens. The review may bring new ideas on how to improve services and on the same hand may show that some of our safety services are not needing improvememt. But without a review, how would the average citizen know?

Salty Dog wrote:

<quoted text>
Nice sentiments but you miss the point.
There is plenty room for looking at ways to more effectively make Vallejo safer...police activities are only part of the equation.
Police personnel are "bad" if they can't endure an examination of best practice both here and elsewhere. They are "bad" if their "club" mentality supercedes the understanding that they are paid
emplyees by the citizens of Vallejo and are just as accountable as the next person.
Yes they have to face some lousy people in the course of a day. So do I. The difference is that they are armed and are authorized to use legal force IN THEIR CHOSEN PROFESSION.
I reserve the right to monitor how that is going.

Wanglow wrote:

"Citizens" are not trained police graduates nor are the generally psychologicaly adapted to do this work; this meddling in serious public service work will only result in increased divisiveness, rancor and reduced efficiency. This is apparently what the repulsive gomes and our worthless, crooked, dishonest "mayor" want; these people are Vallejo's real enemies. Police personal are not "bad" as these self-absorbed egomaniacs would have us believe; police are the first defenders of OUR safety and protection, not a bunch of old women and retired morons who have nothing else to do.

I couldn't agree with you more.

No one has any "right" to "monitor" the actions or decisions of our Police personel. Police are almost always at a location after the fact and as such don't have time to co-ordinate their work with a bunch of whiners who think they THEY know better. This group (WHO are they?) will only add further disent and disgust to our overburdened public safety departments. Vallejo doesn't need any watchdog group, Vallejo needs citizens who are willing to support the efforts of the VPD, who are willing to address the SOURCE of OUR major problems; "homeless" bums, "barber shop" loiterers, out-of-town slum kings (and their legal defenders, viz. osby davis), the Vallejo Housing Authority, Department of Code "Enforcement" (ha, ha, ha, ha) and the unioncrats who (dysfunctionally) run the planning and building departments. Help Vallejo rid itself of low-income trash and the percieved "need" for this additional level of obstruction whould be moot. Honest, decent citizens of our town have no "need" to fear the police, their actions or attitudes, it is only those who are looking for a scapegoat to blame the crime and hatred so many locals have toward the VPD that advocate this useless, senseless charade. Will this group also monitor and determine the actions of the other civil-service employees in Vallejo, or just the police? And, why is that?

Ride Baby Ride wrote:

There should be a mandatory requirement that all applicants who think they have better ideas should do a ride along with police and fire plus spend some time in dispatch. It's easy to sit in the safety of a conference room trying to figure out "better" ways of service delivery but going out on the streets in a screaming police car or fire engine is quite an experience few will ever forget.
(t)urd enragement!

Excellent idea

Wanglow wrote:

No one has any "right" to "monitor" the actions or decisions of our Police personel. Police are almost always at a location after the fact and as such don't have time to co-ordinate their work with a bunch of whiners who think they THEY know better. This group (WHO are they?) will only add further disent and disgust to our overburdened public safety departments. Vallejo doesn't need any watchdog group, Vallejo needs citizens who are willing to support the efforts of the VPD, who are willing to address the SOURCE of OUR major problems; "homeless" bums, "barber shop" loiterers, out-of-town slum kings (and their legal defenders, viz. osby davis), the Vallejo Housing Authority, Department of Code "Enforcement" (ha, ha, ha, ha) and the unioncrats who (dysfunctionally) run the planning and building departments. Help Vallejo rid itself of low-income trash and the percieved "need" for this additional level of obstruction whould be moot. Honest, decent citizens of our town have no "need" to fear the police, their actions or attitudes, it is only those who are looking for a scapegoat to blame the crime and hatred so many locals have toward the VPD that advocate this useless, senseless charade. Will this group also monitor and determine the actions of the other civil-service employees in Vallejo, or just the police? And, why is that?

100% correct

If they are going to look into best practices, why stop with the bay area. go national or international. here's a "best practice" idea for the police department:

Caning in Singapore - Wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caning_in_Singap...

think about it. no cameras, and everyone knows the consequences of their actions - swift and immediate. how much does it cost to import those martial arts instructors from there?

You guys just can't get past the notion that the police are going to be the object of a Committee's ire....with "civilians" running around and "monitoring" their every move.

Nobody on Council is suggesting that they will oversee the police or offer "suggestions" as to how they undertake their daily work. That is just plain silly. Give your Council a little bit of credit for their initiative.

Public safety is bigger than just the police. Their primary duty is to enforce the law, which fom all accounts, they appear to be doing well, albeit a little understaffed. Their are many facets that need to be examined that don't include police work.

Let's be brave little soldiers and see what falls out of a review. Perhaps some positives may develop. Or are you against that too.

Just like Wanglow said about the cameras, "if you aren't breaking the law you have nothing to hide". Well coppers? What do you have to hide?

LOL!

(t)urd enragement!

Ride Baby Ride wrote:

There should be a mandatory requirement that all applicants who think they have better ideas should do a ride along with police and fire plus spend some time in dispatch. It's easy to sit in the safety of a conference room trying to figure out "better" ways of service delivery but going out on the streets in a screaming police car or fire engine is quite an experience few will ever forget.

Yes indeed, make it a requirement to participate in a ride-along with the patrol officers and on the fire truck when out on a call..... not in the command vehicles, but the every day grunt wagons ...and preferably on the bench seat in the back, where the last perp has lost control of his bodily functions!

In principle, I am not against a fact finding group, however why are the few comprising the committee chosen by the council? One hand picked and chosen by each council member, to ensure what?
Are the applicants going through the same process as our commission members, who later are considered stupid and worthless when they come to unpopular conclusions?

I would want an every day Joe, the registered voter and law abiding resident of this city on this fact finding group.(This would already exclude a large chunk of individuals.)

Since this is a day for predictions: I predict, that after much fact finding, hand wringing, finger pointing and final suggestions how to do things more effectively, cheaper and with more volunteers, it will be determined that both Police and Fire are dreadfully understaffed.

Ride Baby Ride wrote:

There should be a mandatory requirement that all applicants who think they have better ideas should do a ride along with police and fire plus spend some time in dispatch. It's easy to sit in the safety of a conference room trying to figure out "better" ways of service delivery but going out on the streets in a screaming police car or fire engine is quite an experience few will ever forget.
(t)urd enragement!

yes, let them experience the atmosphere of the public safety community first hand. put a disclaimer on the application that they consent to participating in a ride along as part of their willingness to volunteer. see who steps up to this level. this will weed out those with a political motivation. i believe there are those that genuinely want to be helpful and others that desire to fuel animosity towards our police and fire with the "accountability" mantra.

Ride along with idiots like the officer staring down public speakers at last Tuesday's council meeting. You fellows have a long way to go in rebuilding trust with the community.

" Brown said she sees the committee as "so relatively benign." "

LOL
Even one of the she who sits on the Council and thought this would ingratiate her constituents to her political career is basically saying - Relax, nothing will come of this, it's a pacifier for the political activists.- What a slap in the face to the Malcontents. LOL

Citizen Involvement wrote:

Examining best practices also is informative for the citizens. The review may bring new ideas on how to improve services and on the same hand may show that some of our safety services are not needing improvememt. But without a review, how would the average citizen know?<quoted text>

Good points.
The average resident already knows that safety services need improvement, hammered home every day when their call for service can not be answered due to lack of officers. The officers will come eventually, but as a society that demands instant responses, not receiving assistance when we demand it,is hard to digest.

The average resident already knows that we have not enough officers on our streets and when their call is not answered as quickly as in the past, these officers are otherwise occupied by the large perp community in our town, not because they want to punish the residents, as some have suggested.

Since the decision to establish a committee that will look into Police and Fire practices has been made, it should be noted that every department of this city government will be next on the list of fact finding in the future!