Members Of The church of Christ?

Rom 5:1Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, 2through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand. And we rejoice in the hope of the glory of God. 3Not only so, but we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; 4perseverance, character; and character, hope. 5And hope does not disappoint us, because God has poured out his love into our hearts by the Holy Spirit, whom he has given us.

6You see, at just the right time, when we were still powerless, Christ died for the ungodly. 7Very rarely will anyone die for a righteous man, though for a good man someone might possibly dare to die. 8But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

9Since we have now been justified by his blood, how much more shall we be saved from God's wrath through him! 10For if, when we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life! 11Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.

No mention of water anywhere. You guys are always saying that even the devil believes. If water baptism saves, will it save the devil?

Beautiful Feet wrote:

<quoted text>
What you do not want is people like me and my buddies to teach what (1Peter 1:22 ; 3:20,21) says.
22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth
in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water. 21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us
We tell people WHAT washes away the sins of people. the blood (Eph.1:7)(Rev.1:5).
We also tell people WHEN those sins are washed away by the blood.
(1Peter 1:22)(Acts 2:38 ; 22:16)(Heb.10:22)(Col.2:12)(Ti t.3:5)
Then by using information the Lord provided each of us can tell when we are saved.
searchingfortruth.org

Bobby, this may be the only thing they're right about. The Bible does say faith saves us but it also says water saves us, right?

I wonder if some of you would join me about the many sheep in probably many folds, but they're all His, and one church in that sense. No one fold is any smarter than any of the others. So Oral Roberts is our brother, as a believer in Christ, right?

Is there a better way of putting it? Any of you who agree, will you state it in your own words which may be better than mine?

Strange Doctrine wrote:

<quoted text>
Bobby, this may be the only thing they're right about. The Bible does say faith saves us but it also says water saves us, right?
I wonder if some of you would join me about the many sheep in probably many folds, but they're all His, and one church in that sense. No one fold is any smarter than any of the others. So Oral Roberts is our brother, as a believer in Christ, right?
Is there a better way of putting it? Any of you who agree, will you state it in your own words which may be better than mine?

No water does not save, if the person believes in Jesus that is enough. I don't believe it takes a lot of knowledge and understanding to be saved. There are those who believe that baptism is necessary and you can see the change in their lives, they are blessed by God.

On the flip side those like me who do not believe water saves, we obey the command to be water baptized. Some on this group say our baptism is no good unless we actually believe it saves.

In reality they are teaching faith in baptism, while at the same time that say faith alone does not save. It is a bit of an oxymoron. These same people will also say they do not believe in or practice works for salvation. Their own words deceive them.

This boils down to something sinister and evil, they reject all Christians in the world not in their denomination, including you. In fact they reject most Christians in their own denomination. This is the reason I stay here.

Bobby wrote:

Rom 5:1Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, 2through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand. And we rejoice in the hope of the glory of God. 3Not only so, but we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; 4perseverance, character; and character, hope. 5And hope does not disappoint us, because God has poured out his love into our hearts by the Holy Spirit, whom he has given us.
6You see, at just the right time, when we were still powerless, Christ died for the ungodly. 7Very rarely will anyone die for a righteous man, though for a good man someone might possibly dare to die. 8But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.
9Since we have now been justified by his blood, how much more shall we be saved from God's wrath through him! 10For if, when we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life! 11Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.
No mention of water anywhere. You guys are always saying that even the devil believes. If water baptism saves, will it save the devil?

The question is, does the New Testament anywhere command,mention (or imply) water baptism saves. Yes or No

(Acts 2:38 ; 8:26-39 ; 16:31-34 ; 22:16)(1Peter 3:20,21)(Heb 10:22)(1Peter 1:22)(Mark 16:16)(Mt.28:18-20).

You are trying to get people to believe the bible does not command water baptism for the forgiveness of sins (Acts 2:38 ; 22:16 ; 16:31-34)(1Peter 3;20,21)(Heb.10:22).

Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,

16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned

22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.


I believe people can read the scriptures above and with a good and honest heart learn truth (Luke 8:15)(John 17:17)(1Tim.2:4).

*Folks, please notice how (Rom 5:1) begins. He is speaking to people who are already Christians (in Rome).

Rom 5:1Therefore, since we have been justified ...

Do you notice the wording here shows they were already Christians.

Now why would he mention water baptism at this point in (Rom.5:1). If you read just one more chapter you will notice that He did mention being buried and rising to walk in newness of life (water baptism)(Rom.6:3-6). Just one chapter later.


11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.(1Cor.6:11)

1. You are washed (water baptism for forgiveness of sins).

2. You are sanctified

3. You are justified

searchingfortruth.org

Bobby wrote:

<quoted text>
No water does not save, if the person believes in Jesus that is enough. I don't believe it takes a lot of knowledge and understanding to be saved. There are those who believe that baptism is necessary and you can see the change in their lives, they are blessed by God.
On the flip side those like me who do not believe water saves, we obey the command to be water baptized. Some on this group say our baptism is no good unless we actually believe it saves.
In reality they are teaching faith in baptism, while at the same time that say faith alone does not save. It is a bit of an oxymoron. These same people will also say they do not believe in or practice works for salvation. Their own words deceive them.
This boils down to something sinister and evil, they reject all Christians in the world not in their denomination, including you. In fact they reject most Christians in their own denomination. This is the reason I stay here.

Bobby - "No water does not save"

God - in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water. 21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (1Peter 3;20,21)

Bobby - "There are those who believe that baptism is necessary"

God - 16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; (Mark 16:16)

...19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them(Mt.28:19)

27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ (Gal.3:27)



Bobby - "Some on this group say our baptism is no good unless we actually believe it saves."

God - 4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.(Acts 19:1-5)

These were baptized in water again because the first baptism was not valid at the time Paul was speaking to them in (Acts 19:1-5).

searchingfortruth.org

1pet 3:18For Christ died for sins once for all, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive by the Spirit,

If we are raised in the likeness of Christ, then we also are made alive by the Spirit.

3:21 and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge[e] of a good conscience toward God. It saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

Ok-water symbolizes baptism. There is a double figure here. The flood symbolizes water baptism and water baptism symbolizes salvation. The flood was a figure of baptism in that both in instances the water that spoke of judgment (in the flood the death of the wicked in Spirit baptism the death of Christ and the believer) is the water that saves.

Water baptism is a symbol of salvation in that it depicts Christ's death burial and resurrection and our identification with him in those experiences.

Rom 6:4 now saves yo also. In reality, believers are saved by what water baptism symbolizes which is Christ's death and resurrection.

Water baptism is a pledge of a good conscience toward God. The act of water baptism is a commitment on our part in all good conscience to make sure that what water baptism symbolizes will become a reality in our lives-saves us by the resurrection of Christ.

in the final analysis we are not saved by any ritual but we are saved by the supernatural power of the resurrection.

Bobby wrote:

<quoted text>
No water does not save, if the person believes in Jesus that is enough. I don't believe it takes a lot of knowledge and understanding to be saved. There are those who believe that baptism is necessary and you can see the change in their lives, they are blessed by God.
On the flip side those like me who do not believe water saves, we obey the command to be water baptized. Some on this group say our baptism is no good unless we actually believe it saves.
In reality they are teaching faith in baptism, while at the same time that say faith alone does not save. It is a bit of an oxymoron. These same people will also say they do not believe in or practice works for salvation. Their own words deceive them.
This boils down to something sinister and evil, they reject all Christians in the world not in their denomination, including you. In fact they reject most Christians in their own denomination. This is the reason I stay here.

It's why I stay, too, and I agree that you did the right thing being baptized.

Beautiful Feet wrote:

BF - I posted this in response to SDs #403.
SD -"I get my info straight from the Bible, and discussing with other people in forums who get theirs direct.
"and discussing with other people in forums who get theirs direct."
BF - DIRECTLY for what?
Since you get your information from the bible,please tell me which scriptures refer to Presidents Obama, JFK, Bush , etc.
Are you once again refering to the letter sent to the seven churches of Asia in the first century? Are you suggesting in it we will find info about these Presidents in the book of Revelation ?

Of course not, BF. You yourself brought up the dragon, 7 heads, etc., which I'm saying symbolize either the series of 7 heads of state, Reagan being the one who received a deadly wound but lived,and/or maybe department heads in some organization, with (maybe) 10 overlords.(Re 13?) I'm just working from memory so you might want to look up for yourself anything I quote. The verse is obviously a prediction of some bad corruption, and, I don't know, don't claim some speculators are right who predict a oneworld gov't, NWO? We had not mentioned the 7 churches of Asia, to my knowledge/remembrance. This is about the time of flying, we know by the persecuted Christian woman flying to a new location, Re 12. On two wings of a great Eagle. Our mascot. So the scenario is evidently not about Israel, as some have traditionally taught, but I never hear that lately.

Abideth Forever, I found "Other sheep have I, not of this fold", John 10:16, who will believe and all the sheep folds will be one flock under one shepherd. Could have meant Gentiles, and also could obviously mean all denominations, and we admit all denominations make some mistakes but we're all believers in Christ, so in that sense we're One, brethren. There's no authorization to avoid associating with the other sheep.(Bit of humor here, unless they're black sheep? Ha ha. Who have their father's wife or something that serious they won't give up?)

While we're on that verse, doesn't it say the 8th king (head, of state) is one of the previous 7? Could it be Bush, whose father had served? Not saying I saw anything that bad about him, but who else could it be? If I remember correctly, and I may not, doesn't it also say the 8th is after one with a short term?

Strange doctrine, there something you probably do not understand about the group on these threads. Most are a-millenial. They believe everything in the book of revelation has already come to pass at the destruction of the temple in AD 70.

I have found there are plenty of things we can discuss here that they can relate to. Besides that biblical end times can very divisive especially when there are 3 or 4 different positions on when the rapture will occur. I have seen churches split over these. To me it's just not worth the effort. That being said, I consider pre-millenial doctrine to be the most accurate but I am un-willing to allow it to create divisions with my brothers in Christ. It is not a salvation issue.

I love your attitude here, you are an asset to the group.

BF - Is Rome set on 7 hills?

SD - "I found "Other sheep have I, not of this fold", John 10:16, who will believe and all the sheep folds will be one flock under one shepherd. Could have meant Gentiles, and also could obviously mean all denominations"

BF - 46 Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles.(Acts 13:46)

No, there is not one shred of evidence that even hints that all denominations are being described in (John 10:16). That is butchering the text.

In fact, these verses prove the Lord built,commanded and is the head of only one church (body) not many churches (1Cor.12:20).(1Cor.1:10)(Phil. 3:16)(Eph.4:1-5)(Eph.5:23-30)( Eph.1:22,23)(Col.1:18,24).

20 But now are they many members, yet but one body.(1Cor.12:20)

The lesson I posted about (Eph.2:16) and all flesh (Jew /Gentile) brought into one body (one church) will be good here.

You must get this,

20 But now are they many members, yet but one body.(1Cor.12;20)

It does not say many churches in one body (or church). That is what denoms teach this verse says. That is wrong.

20 But now are they many members, yet but one body.(1Cor.12;20)

searchingfortruth.org

Bobby - "I love your attitude here, you are an asset to the group."

SD - "I found "Other sheep have I, not of this fold", John 10:16, who will believe and all the sheep folds will be one flock under one shepherd. Could have meant Gentiles, and also could obviously mean all denominations"

...and also could obviously mean all denominations

...and also could obviously mean all denominations

...and also could obviously mean all denominations"

BF - The reason Bobby likes what SD is saying is found above. Yall consider all denoms to be right with God. There is not one shred of evidence for such a position. Yall have just condoned Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormons. Yall best rethink your position. Especially when you consider what these churches teach about Jesus.

Have you thought this through?

searchingfortruth.org

Beautiful Feet wrote:

Bobby - "I love your attitude here, you are an asset to the group."
SD - "I found "Other sheep have I, not of this fold", John 10:16, who will believe and all the sheep folds will be one flock under one shepherd. Could have meant Gentiles, and also could obviously mean all denominations"
...and also could obviously mean all denominations
...and also could obviously mean all denominations
...and also could obviously mean all denominations"
BF - The reason Bobby likes what SD is saying is found above. Yall consider all denoms to be right with God. There is not one shred of evidence for such a position. Yall have just condoned Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormons. Yall best rethink your position. Especially when you consider what these churches teach about Jesus.
Have you thought this through?
searchingfortruth.org

Strange doctrine has a heart for God, that is all I need to know.

The legalist here are closer to the mormons and Jw's. All of you teach you are the only true church, baptismal regeneration, salvation by works and denigrate the Holy Spirit.

Bobby wrote:

<quoted text>
Strange doctrine has a heart for God, that is all I need to know.
The legalist here are closer to the mormons and Jw's. All of you teach you are the only true church, baptismal regeneration, salvation by works and denigrate the Holy Spirit.

Jesus blesses those who obey his commands (John 14:15,21 ; 15:10,14)

20 But now are they many members, yet but one body.(1Cor.12:20)

...he is the saviour of the body.(Eph.5:23)

This doctrine comes from the lord,not me.(1Tim.1:3)

...teach no other doctrine,

searchingfortruth.org

Bobby wrote:

<quoted text>
Strange doctrine has a heart for God, that is all I need to know.
The legalist here are closer to the mormons and Jw's. All of you teach you are the only true church, baptismal regeneration, salvation by works and denigrate the Holy Spirit.

SD - "I found "Other sheep have I, not of this fold", John 10:16, who will believe and all the sheep folds will be one flock under one shepherd. Could have meant Gentiles, and also could obviously mean all denominations"

...and also could obviously mean all denominations

...and also could obviously mean all denominations

...and also could obviously mean all denominations

Bobby, you just said "Strange doctrine has a heart for God",

BF - I have posted what SD said above. If it is true that SD has the heart (Mind) of God,then show me in the word of God where the Lord recognizes and blesses denoms. For when I read the Bible I find that the Lord condemns denoms.(1Cor.1:10)(Phil.3:16-1 9)(2Thess.3:6,14,15).

6 Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.

If "other sheep" is referring to all denoms,then doctrine does not matter and no one can say Jesus is the only way to heaven.(John 14:6)(1Tim.2:4)(1Tim.1:3)(1Cor .4:17)

searchingfortruth.org

This website really, really concerns me, because it appears as if you CofC folks are trying to force people to believe what you believe. Am I wrong about that?

I spent 20 years in the church of Christ, and I have nothing except scathing remarks to give you about it. My family was heavily involved in all phases of the church, and we had a close network of friends. When my marriage started to go south, all those couples whom we had entertained inumerable times in our home, deserted us, like rats fleeing from a sinking ship. "We do not want to even touch you people." Well, can you imagine the damage done not only to me and my ex-husband, but also to our three children. They were totally ostracized. It is sort of like "divorce" might be contagious, and no one wants to catch it.

The church has some serious work to do if it wants to continue to say that it is compassionate.

I now attend the Episcopal Church and find it much more peaceful. No, it does not condone the "sins" you preach against, but it proposes a positive path.

bjreed wrote:

This website really, really concerns me, because it appears as if you CofC folks are trying to force people to believe what you believe. Am I wrong about that?
I spent 20 years in the church of Christ, and I have nothing except scathing remarks to give you about it. My family was heavily involved in all phases of the church, and we had a close network of friends. When my marriage started to go south, all those couples whom we had entertained inumerable times in our home, deserted us, like rats fleeing from a sinking ship. "We do not want to even touch you people." Well, can you imagine the damage done not only to me and my ex-husband, but also to our three children. They were totally ostracized. It is sort of like "divorce" might be contagious, and no one wants to catch it.
The church has some serious work to do if it wants to continue to say that it is compassionate.
I now attend the Episcopal Church and find it much more peaceful. No, it does not condone the "sins" you preach against, but it proposes a positive path.

Hi, It is sad to hear you went through a divorce. I am sure that was very painful. I am sure many members of the coC did not act as they should have when you needed them the most,BUT your eyes are looking in the wrong place. You need to be remembering all the trying times and beatings the lord endured (and apostles) yet still had their minds to follow what God said to do. BTW,I know exactly what you went through for I went through a divorce also.

What we (coC) teach is not our doctrine. If you will go back and read the scriptures I posted you will see that the word of God makes a very good case for "one church' "One doctrine". If we kept these commands in mind we will not have all these differing doctrines today. So it is not me or other men but rather God who said what to preach.

If you attend a church which "agrees to disagree" on doctrinal matters you will find they "go along to get along". In many groups like this they think it is wrong to debate about the word of God (Jude 3).

...exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith

If you will go to missionprinting.us (click on publications) there you will find many bible answers you are looking for.

Thanks for posting

bjreed wrote:

This website really, really concerns me, because it appears as if you CofC folks are trying to force people to believe what you believe. Am I wrong about that?
I spent 20 years in the church of Christ, and I have nothing except scathing remarks to give you about it. My family was heavily involved in all phases of the church, and we had a close network of friends. When my marriage started to go south, all those couples whom we had entertained inumerable times in our home, deserted us, like rats fleeing from a sinking ship. "We do not want to even touch you people." Well, can you imagine the damage done not only to me and my ex-husband, but also to our three children. They were totally ostracized. It is sort of like "divorce" might be contagious, and no one wants to catch it.
The church has some serious work to do if it wants to continue to say that it is compassionate.
I now attend the Episcopal Church and find it much more peaceful. No, it does not condone the "sins" you preach against, but it proposes a positive path.

The Anglican/Episcopal Churches

"From Heaven Or Of Men?"

http://www.gospelpreceptor.com/SismanK1.htm


The above lesson can be found below.

http://www.the-church-at-hatton.org/gospelpre ...

Six bible lessons. Enjoy!

http://www.searchingfortruth.org/

Didn't you hear anything bjreed actually said? This person is so turned off to the coc leglaism there is no way to get this person to return. You will have to change from the inside out or your denomination will become non-existent as many already have.

Have you noticed that when someone drops by on these threads, they are immediately turned off by you guys. Wake up! Smell the roses-the beauty of Christian life.

Bobby wrote:

Didn't you hear anything bjreed actually said? This person is so turned off to the coc leglaism there is no way to get this person to return. You will have to change from the inside out or your denomination will become non-existent as many already have.
Have you noticed that when someone drops by on these threads, they are immediately turned off by you guys. Wake up! Smell the roses-the beauty of Christian life.

There were people who rejected truth when Jesus himself was doing the teaching.

66 From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.(John 6:66).

They did not like the message so they left. Jesus did not change the message to keep those who left. Astonishing as it sounds the Lord turned to those who remained and asked them these words,

"Will ye also go away? " (John 6:67)

Peter had the right attitude when he said,

"Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life."

So changing the doctrine is not the answer as you and others claim. The answer is for the individual to transform to the doctrine.(Rom.12:1,2)(2Cor.3:1 8)(Phil.2:5)(Rom.6:16-18)(2Pet er 1:5-10).

Changing doctrine just starts another denomination (1Cor.1:10). Changing doctrine either adds or subtracts from the word of God,which is not recommended (John 12:18)(1Cor.4:6)(Deut.4:2).

Changing doctrine (the gospel) perverts the word of God (Gal.1:6-9). A changed doctrine (gospel) has no power to save,even though that new doctrine may comfort those who teach said doctrine.

I am to spread the seed (the word of God)(Luke 8:5-15). That is what I am doing. The lady /man you spoke about had already left the church of our Lord. I was pleading in hopes they would come back. You (Bobby) are happy they left the coC. God will deal with you in due time.


searchingfortruth.org

correction:

So changing the doctrine is not the answer as you and others claim. The answer is for the individual to allow himself "to be transformed by" the doctrine.(Rom.12:1,2)(2Cor.3:1 8)(Phil.2:5)(Rom.6:16-18)(2Pet er 1:5-10).

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