New Ethanol Fuel Flows in Metro Atlanta

which cars and what years can use this fuel

The story was very misleading. The reporter said to go the 11alive.com to see if your vehicle is E85 compatible, but didn't point out that a very small percentage of vehicles currently on the road actually are. Sounds like another effort by 11alive to track viewership by getting people to go to their website. Well, it worked on me.

The E85 may be cheaper, but a vehicle using it get fewer miles per gallon than the same vehicle using gasoline.

I haven't crunched the numbers, but I suspect that $2.49 for E85 at a reduced MPG compared to gasoline at $2.93 would turn out to be equivalent.

So comparing cost on a per mile basis would result in very little if any savings from using E85 (at the stated prices). The only E85 benefits I can see is to the environment (and this is debatable) and less dependence on foreign oil.

E85 does not perform better than gasoline. E85 has just 72% of the energy that gasoline does. So the E85 should cost at least 28% less than gasoline in order to save some money.

what ever wrote:

which cars and what years can use this fuel

your car or truck has to have a yellow gas cap. if im not misstaken its 2006 up.

your car or truck has to have a yellow gas cap. i think the vehicles have to be 2006 and up. not positive.my husband has a 2007 silveraldo and its E85 compatible

Does fuel ethanol policy increase oil use and oil profit?

* Some folks think so

* Clean Air Performance Professionals

E85 has 28% less energy per gallon, so MPG will be less than with gasoline. The price of E85 needs to be 28% lower than regular gasoline to make economic sense. Current price is only 18% less. So E85 is already more expensive per mile than regular gasoline.

The current 51 cents a gallon federal subsidy for alcohol fuels is set to expire at the end of next year. That tips the economic balance even further in favor of regular gasoline.

It takes 1200 gallons of water to produce 1 gallon of E85.

1/3rd of our fresh water supplies are used by agriculture, with growing corn one of the thirstier users of water. If we try to increase corn production so that E85 can become a major auto fuel, we will put an added large strain on our fresh water supplies.

As a scientist, I deal with energy content issues all the time. People who buy the E85 at $2.49/gallon will be very sorry when their fuel gauge goes to E faster than ever. There is generally recognized to be a 25% lower fuel economy using E85 over standard gasoline (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ E85). The federal government lists the fuel economy for most vehicles capable of utilizing this fuel comparativley with their mileage using gasoline (http://www.fueleconomy.gov/fe g/byfuel/FFV2000.shtml).

Hopefully your listeners are intuitive enough to quickly realize their mistake once they've filled their tank for the first time. With gasoline at $3.00/gallon, E85 would have to be less than $2.25 to make economic sense. Without subsidy, E85 won't be viable on its own till oil is well over $100/barrel, though that may be sooner than we all would like. I applaud its use for being a cleaner fuel, but economically, it doesn't make sense.

It is misleading to say that ethanol gets lower MPG. It has much higher octane than gasoline. If you engine is properly tuned to make use of ethanol's burning properties, the difference in MPG can be negated to barely noticeable.

TheTruth wrote:

It is misleading to say that ethanol gets lower MPG. It has much higher octane than gasoline. If you engine is properly tuned to make use of ethanol's burning properties, the difference in MPG can be negated to barely noticeable.

Alcohol does have a higher octane rating than regular gasoline (approx 120 octane). What that means is that it won't spontaneously combust (knock) until a higher temperature is reached in the combustion chamber. It is important to understand that it is energy content that's primary, octane rating merely sets the maximum compression ratio the engine can have.

Now fuel alcohol can run a higher compression ratio (about 14:1), which allows the engine to be somewhat more efficient, making up in part for the lower energy per gallon of fuel alcohol. But, if an engine were marketed with a compression ratio that high, it couldn't burn regular gasoline, so it could not be flex fuel. With the relatively poor availability of E85, that would cause drivers to have real problems finding a place to refuel on trips.

With the compression ratios achievable with regular gasoline, use of E85 causes a net efficiency decline, a 25 to 30 percent loss of fuel economy, and due to the lower energy content raw performance also declines.

Now the benefits of high compression shouldn't be overlooked. A diesel with a compression ratio of 22:1 is almost twice as thermally efficient as a regular gasoline engine, and diesel fuel has a slightly higher energy content per gallon than gasoline too. That's why most European cars, and most trucks everywhere, are diesel instead of gas.

Diesel is currently taxed at a higher rate than gasoline, so it costs more per gallon, but even allowing for that, it still saves those using it money because it allows much higher engine efficiency. Biodiesel produces the same results as petroleum diesel, and can be used interchangeably with it.

So if you care about the environment, and about saving money, you'll buy a diesel powered vehicle, and lobby your representatives to quit subsidizing that environmental and fiscal loser fuel alcohol, and lower the unfair tax on diesel to parity with the tax on gasoline.

If anyone is buying it at $2.49 vs $2.95 for the price, they will be in for a rude awakening when they find themselves getting 70 to 80% of the fuel mileage that they get with gasoline.

Hot rodders are exited about this fuel because it has a higher octane rating, however the research shows you need to burn 25% more of it to achieve the same fuel economy. And make sure you don't run it on a vehicle that is not equipped to burn it. I am still researching to find out what percentage of it you can mix in with regular gas to boost performance.

the trouble with e85 is we use corn,like idiots we are. corn actually uses more fuel to produce than it saves.sufar is a better choice,but that would make to much sense.

charles wrote:

the trouble with e85 is we use corn,like idiots we are. corn actually uses more fuel to produce than it saves.sufar is a better choice,but that would make to much sense.

or sugar cane like brasil