Coal silo protest

Do you not realize you are on a site for yapping and if you don't like don't read or respond. OK

Uh, sorry. But the overtime is part of our yearly wages. I wouldn't even start to understand where you are coming from or why you would say that. A person's income consists of what they make. I will tell you one thing, they tax our overtime, so it is included in the wages. And it is something that is very consistent, so yes, dear, it counts. That is just crazy. Second of all, my dad is a union miner and we make more than he does. Of course, he will have great benefits after he retires and that was a wonderful benefit of union mines. But in a union mines, you are just a number. When lay offs happen, if you were the last one in, you are the first one out. Your hard work does not speak for itself. That is one reason we are not in a union mines. Matter of factly, the union mines are hiring just the same as the non union, so there are way more than enough jobs to go around. If a miner cannot find a job right now, then that really is there own lazy fault. Mines everywhere are begging for workers. If wages would drop any at all, men would quit. There is not enough workers now, do you think that the companies would take that chance? They would not jeopardize their profits by taking away pay and benefits. Men would quit and they should do so. It is dangerous work and not to be taken likely. Who would come in and do it cheaper? What dummy would come in and say "Ok, I know that you would have paid me $27 an hour, but I will take $15 to do the work for you'. That is stupid. WV has hard working people. That is why people don't come in from other states to work in the mines.......they would be expected to work and alot of people don't like do have to do that. You say we expect things to be handed to us. Those that do, I can promise, are not miners. They may be the ones out there on welfare, but a miner is a hard working person.
Now, what we all really need to do is to team up to fight against mountain top removal. It is bad and very destructive. And like I said before, one strip mine can cause more damage and more waste than about 10 underground mines. I would like to see them remain the minority in the mining world.
At any time that my husband would loose his job, we would have to leave the state. There would be nothing left here for him, or me, to do that would take care of us. Even as a nurse, the best I could do starting out would be $18 an hour. Losing his job could be a fact of life. Could be the same for you or anyone else. It happens everyday. I dont' see it happening in our lifetime. YOu say coal is going, but it is stronger than ever before. The need for coal has drove its price from $45 a ton 5 years ago to over $250 a ton now. The nation's main focus now is how to get away from oil. They can only do one thing at a time. Coal may go away, but it will take several decades before that happens. It is too reliable when everything else is in such turmoil right now. The nation will worry about their oil crisis first..

And the thing about the land being taken from a family or owner.....the same thing happens in other parts of the nation. When the government or a big construction business wants land, they will take it from you even if they have to get it condemned first. So I don't see how coal is that different than any other big business out there. Money talks. It talks in politics, it talks in election times, it talks in business. Just a fact of life. If a government (local, state, national) decides that it is in the best interest of a location to have the land to build 20 condos so that more people can live there and more people can vacation there, then they will take it, at any cost, and build for what they consider the betterment of the community. If one little ole family has owned 100 acres for 100 years, but they state sees opportunity that the communtity can benefit from, they will take what they want. You see.....it is alway 'about me'. Happens everywhere. Government, people, businesses, etc. it is all about what is best for 'me'. That is what I am standing for. Coal is what is best for my family right now. Takes wonderful care of us and when you come in, talking about something you know very little about, then I get upset and start defending what is best for 'me'. But I am not doing a thing that any of you would do if you, your family, or your way of life was being jeopardized.
And WV Owner, you must not have kids. If you did, you wouldn't take medical benefits so lightly or even bash them. It would be a terrible thing to watch your kids suffer. Or to expect them to tough a sickness out because you just didn't have the money at the time to go to the doctor or buy their medicine. Medical benefits are a part of our wages and benefits. It also carries the benefits of giving a loving mother the peace of mind that she doesn't have to worry as much when her child is sick. That in itself is worth it all when you have little ones

Wages are based on a 40 hour work week because you are not always given overtime. Thats why it is full time or part time. You need to say my husband wage is 56,000 a year and on the average 70,000 with overtime. Massey is being suied right now for illegally getting rid of union miners because they pay out more union workers because of the benefit package. Yes I do have 2 children and yes I own three businesses that I run and my husband is in the union. If I ever had to I would get state medical untill a job provides insurance. I believe if your not scamming and you really need the help go for it.
Coal is stronger than ever right now becuase they are trying to get as much threw incase a dem gets in and laws are stricter for coal companies.

I can and will do whatever I want.. reguardless.. haha

Wow you really seem like a winner.

I only asked about the land because when I buy properties you hardly ever get the mineral rights. I am always told the state can come in and do what they want but not if you own the mineral rights.

In the Know,

I agree about teaming up against Mountain top removal and strip mining. More jobs for our Coal miners, better living conditions for our communities would be the result.

But even we people that support coal will get crushed by the mere mention of this. Tree-hugging environmentalist usually is the mantra from the coal companies when a protest or opposition is given.

So, if loving my community, my State and my family's health makes me a tree-hugging environmentalist, then so be-it.

God forbid it would be because there is an option to get coal with less devastation resulting in 60% more jobs... As long as we are focused on arguing with ourselves, we do not look at the problem.

Magicians call this "misdirection". Coal companies call this "an excellent idea"...

Here you go in the know things are changing for the better for everyone.
New Technology Will Enhance Coal Mine Safety
(July 22, 2008)— Working in coal mines can be backbreaking labor, not to mention dangerous. But a new technology invented by researchers at Southern Illinois University Carbondale will make it easier for miners to ensure their safety as they brace the roofs of mine shafts.
The new method involves simple, but specially designed stackable wood braces that are lighter and stronger than conventional wooden blocks used by miners for centuries. Yoginder Paul Chugh, professor of mining and mineral resources engineering in the SIUC College of Engineering, devised the materials, with the help of several others.
The technology, which several area mines are testing, represents a major improvement over bracing and cribbing methods used by miners for more than 200 years, even though it utilizes the same materials and builds on the same concepts involved. If all goes as planned, the new technology will mean more jobs for Southern Illinois, where some lumber yards already are experimenting with manufacturing the devices.
The new braces, called Atlas Cribs, are comprised of a mix of hardwoods and include a main lateral element made from a board with shorter boards nailed on both sides at both ends. The engineered braces hold many advantages over current methods for bracing roofs and seals.
First, Atlas Cribs are much lighter than the traditional 6-inch square blocks of wood miners use now, making it easier for the miners to handle and stack them. Also, the wood grain orientation in the braces make them stronger than the traditional methods. The new brace design also makes it easier to circulate air around the cribs, which could cut down on one of a mine’s biggest operating costs -- circulating fresh air.
“Air has to circulate in a mine to dilute the methane gases and provide fresh air (to breathe),” Chugh explained.“Moving air through a mine is the second largest energy consumer for a mine, next only to the transportation of coal out of the mine. That’s a pretty substantial amount of energy you’re spending on moving air.”
The new cribbing system takes up 41 percent less area than existing ones and may be up to 50 percent more efficient in terms of airflow, Chugh said.
The system’s strength comes from several design factors. First, the contact areas -- the area where the braces touch each other and the load is actually borne -- are equivalent to the traditional systems. This area is about 6 inches square.
Also, the shorter boards that are nailed to both sides of both ends of the lateral board are cut and positioned so that their grain runs vertically between the roof above and the floor of the mine. This axial grain orientation is much stronger than a parallel one.
“When you compress wood in a parallel direction it is very, very soft,” Chugh said.“So our central element has parallel grains, but the grain on the end pieces are axial to the load, and the strength of wood in this direction is about four times larger.”
For example, a traditional crib about 6 feet high will compress 12 to 14 inches under 70 tons of load. The same size crib made of Atlas Cribs will compress just 6 inches under more than twice the load -- 150 tons.

The lighter weight also means lighter work for the miners charged with building the cribs. Several former miners -- Bill Bell, Harrold Gurley and John Pulliam -- worked with Chugh on the design, with that perspective in mind. The new braces weigh 18 pounds, about half what a traditional cribbing timber weighs, meaning they can also work faster.

“Sometimes miners have to carry the timbers a couple of hundred feet before stacking them,” Chugh said.“So this will be easier on their backs.”

The braces are made from readily available hardwoods including oak, sycamore, poplar and hickory. They come in several sizes -- Atlas 100, 200 and 300 -- with various numbers of contact areas that allow for different cribbing configurations depending on the situation. A six-point configuration, for example, will carry 195 tons while a nine-point one would take about 300 tons of load.

Chugh began working on the concept about one year ago, after experimenting with a brace made from manufactured wood products, such as plywood. The economics of that concept did not work out, and driving back from a meeting in Harrisburg, Pa., the idea for an engineered natural hardwood brace took hold.

“I told the team to stop the car, I had an idea here,” Chugh recalled. A year later, several mines are either testing or plan to test the method this summer, he said, using it to brace mine seals, which are critical stability points. At the same time, several local sawmills also are putting in bids to manufacture the braces, which they could then sell under license to mines throughout the Midwest.

The market potential -- and potential to create more local jobs -- is huge, Chugh said.

“One local mining company uses 400,000 of these each year,” Chugh said.“The total demand within Illinois, Indiana and western Kentucky is about 1.5 million a year.”

The initial price the University will provide to the mines is about 3 cents cheaper per brace than the current method.

I am a winner..

Wv owner, I don't think anyone really ever get to own the mineral rights. I think that they can write up a land deed and say that you do, but I am pretty sure that a person never owns the mineral rights to their land.

And I still do not understand why you keep saying that our income is only $56k For the past 8 years our W2 forms have $65k or above. That is our wage. The men work 5 days one week and then 6 the next, so yes, overtime is always there. You are trying to twist this to suit your arguement. When our pay has been consisent (or consistently growing) every year for the past 7-8 years, then that is what we make. That is our earnings. Wage -- money paid for work done. When we are paid $70k for working, then $70k is our wages. Doesn't seem that hard to figure out. I guess that you just don't want to believe that we make that amount. Oh well.

Heres why I say it lke that. Banks and all other institutions do not consider overtime part of your base salary. Which is 27x40x52=56160. This is due to the fact no one is always granted overtime in the eyes of business.

This is right from the irs which I am provided for my corporations:
Gross Income: Gross income is your income before income taxes. You are given full credit for your base salary. Overtime, commissions and bonuses are usually averaged over the previous 24 months.

I am sure he made that but that would be like me saying my husband makes 120,000 a year because thats what he made last year. He dosen't he makes 75,000 with out overtime. I am not sure I can get you to understand because you do not run any businesses. But go ahead and tell who ever you want that.

My grandfather owns land in Raleigh County and ICG (International Coal Group) wanted to core drill. My grandfather said NO and that's the end of the story. They have never attempted to contact him back - no letters, no calls, no harassment, that's been over 5 years ago!

For this wage/hourly issue, my husband works for a coal company and it is MANDATORY 5 days a week, 10 hour days! MANDATORY!! No 4/10's, no 5/8's, no 4 on/4 off - 5/10's or your behind is fired! This schedule has been in affect for over 15 years. Different businesses, different companies, different work schedules - period!

I am not the one who says overtime is not part of you base salary the governments does. It has nothing to do with your business how hard is that to understand or is it you are trying to make yourselves feel better for what you are doing.Get some dam! experience past wv and you would know this shi!.

Speaking of understanding, how hard is it for you to understand the concept of the basic English language. Your poor grammar and arrogant mind set reek of ignorance. You need to get some experience of some standard education beyond your stubbornness to hear one's opinion. I only commented about my personal experience, which I know quite well considering it's personal EXPERIENCE! You, for one, had a minor melt down! And for feeling better about my self, every time I read your posts, I feel better about myself!

Your right I am subborn and arrogant and thats why I am not a miner I have a respected job! I got where I am today by being the a!! I am. Just now I got an important email from one of my family members which is well known in the investment word. What she was just featured in Minnesota Business and it gets better she and many of her rich friends are going to donate lots of money. Wow maybe this will get the word out.
Thats how I know that overtime does not count as your base salary. I did not have a melt down thats just the way I speak to everyone no wonder I am rich I don't take anyones shi!!. It's a shame that I am going to have my family donate to a cause where the people do this to themselves. Now thats ignorant.

Well, while you are at it, tell the IRS to only tax my husband's 40 hours. I would like to keep the rest.

Once again, your post made me feel better about myself!

It shows how low you are because it does not take much.