Troubled times hit Paso lender

So the money is gone (maybe) but you can be rest assured that she won't be around to spend it. She'll be in jail. I've done some case studies of similar situations and found the sentences are long. So I guess Josh can maybe enjoy some of it in his late fifties and Karen at her age will probably pass away in jail with her long sentence to come. I think it's Karen's grandkids that will prosper from the money. Oh, and of course, her fellow business partners that were funded in full, they'll be in jail too since they didn't use much of the money for their projects. At least justice will be served.

I note with keen interest the failed dealing of EFI, a posting on uncovered-slo mentioned the BFA ( Baptist Foundation of Arizona) as being similar to EFI demise. Having been involved in the BFA matter years ago let me tell you two things.
John McCain who was and still is attending the same Church that started the BFA Scandal and who advised me and many others to invest into the BFA telling us is was " Safe & Secured" shortly a Phoenix New Times Story unraveled the mess. Pastor Dan Yearly told us it was a safe investment. Only thing is he too was bilked into telling us and the thousands of others at NPBC ( North Phoenix Baptist Church)As it turned out it was a $ 635 Million Fraud and Ponzi Scam. Now that i have friends who did invest in EFI the only one i knew who got out and got the inside scoop was Cindy and she has now left to enjoy her Monies in Nevada. All the others she warned refused to listen to her, well now they wish they had. She warned us it was a fraud and scam. She was connected to Rodewald who told her get out NOW. The other Hard Money lenders and borrows are doomed as well. The money is now sitting in a Holding Company based in Nevada being moved to off shore accounts in small amounts each week as not to get the attention of the Federal regulators.

Ranndal G Pagie wrote:

I note with keen interest the failed dealing of EFI, a posting on uncovered-slo mentioned the BFA ( Baptist Foundation of Arizona) as being similar to EFI demise. Having been involved in the BFA matter years ago let me tell you two things.
John McCain who was and still is attending the same Church that started the BFA Scandal and who advised me and many others to invest into the BFA telling us is was " Safe & Secured" shortly a Phoenix New Times Story unraveled the mess. Pastor Dan Yearly told us it was a safe investment. Only thing is he too was bilked into telling us and the thousands of others at NPBC ( North Phoenix Baptist Church)As it turned out it was a $ 635 Million Fraud and Ponzi Scam. Now that i have friends who did invest in EFI the only one i knew who got out and got the inside scoop was Cindy and she has now left to enjoy her Monies in Nevada. All the others she warned refused to listen to her, well now they wish they had. She warned us it was a fraud and scam. She was connected to Rodewald who told her get out NOW. The other Hard Money lenders and borrows are doomed as well. The money is now sitting in a Holding Company based in Nevada being moved to off shore accounts in small amounts each week as not to get the attention of the Federal regulators.

Thanks for the information, as a victim of some of these dishonest developers, I do not expect to ever see my returns. I spoke to a local Law Firm who sternly advised us to stay clear of another scam going on in the area. Atascadero Ventures, LLC and VERDOT Group, LLC both are connected to a investment and Real Estate & Winery Con Game. As i dug deeper into the portfolio's some of the same scam artist's are being revealed. Hurst, Kelly G., Ron Hertel, Robert Fowler, Thomas Habbick, Rossi all are connected with ( RW Hertel & Sons) the same people who dumped illegal toxic dirt in the Salinas River and are facing a mjaor fraud and theft suit and the list goes on and on. As the court records now reveal all are being sued for Fraud, and Investment scams. Once again my Lawyer says we should report any activity to the Police, SEC, Realty Department, Dept. of Consumer Affairs, and both the IRS-CID Division and the Los Angeles Office of the FBI White Collar Crimes Division.

Yes, I know of several persons ripped off and cheated by Atascadero Ventures, LLC which is a RW Hertel & Sons defective home project. My husband tells me we should be careful what we reveal on these post since Hertel's people are watching them as well trying to do damage control and stay afloat.

Either way were being told Hertel and Fowler are suspects in a Fraud and Grand Theft matter, of which they know about. So best to file your complaints with the White Collar Fraud Division of the US Department of Justice in Los Angeles and with the FBI as well. Best to your all and with all the current and new legal actions pending against them it is only a matter of time.

I find it curious that all of you are complaining about investments that you never understood or investigated prior to investing. It seems to me that when you got your checks and the money was coming in you didn't bother to ask any questions. It is ulimately your responsibility to check, re-check and keep on top of your money. It is a difficult time for all real estate/mortgage investors, but rather than jump on the "gang bandwagon" maybe wait it out and give the company a chance to work things out. I say keep the lawyers out, so things can get done. NO, I don't work for the company and YES, I do have money invested. Hang in there and wait-be patient. Complaining to the government will slow the process and nobody will get paid!!!

I agree with Bonnie. Ride it out. If your money has been lost due to unforeseen problems, then too bad. Very true about government getting involved. If those picky folks start freezing accounts and auditing, heck golly gee, you're not gonna maximize you earnings. I'll have to cut this short as my pilot tells me we're about to land in George Town. Yeah, it's a bit warm in the Caymans.

There is a difference between poor investments and outright fraud.

Hertel has NOTHING to do with this and you know it Scott!

Jeph wrote:

That is because she is cleaning house. Concealing assets, as an example she sold 5448 Regio Place, Atascadero on paper for 450K to Pagent pocketed the off paper monies under DOYA Partners LLc. This really was and is a ponzi con. Brian Wilson Construction is suing and using Adam M daner a con man lawyer who also represent another associated scam with Atascadero Ventures, LLC and RW Hertel & Sons with the Rossi's and Fowler etc. with Karen. This needs to get a federal investigation for wire fraud, loan fraud, bank fraud and application of investment fraud. Many of the players are concealing ill gotten monies into Holding companies in Nevada, Delaware and off shore. Willian Zech a non bar member lawyer is behind some of this scam he works for Hertel Investment Group and 5 Mile Bridge wines.

Hertel and Sons has NOTHING to do with the Estate financial mess. There is someone out there who would like everyone to think that they are involved but the truth of the matter is that they are not.

Interesting Note wrote:

<quoted text>As i know naught ron is behind the hiring of Private Eye's to keep the lid on this massive financial chaos. I know of two persons who are deeply involved in concealment of the scandal or con as i call it. I do agree with other postings it was in fact a long term smoke screen for a Ponzi Con. The two people are one well known lawyer who's name has been posted. I do NOT want to repeat it because he sues everyone to keep them silent. The other is one of his investor clients who is a member of Astscadero Ventures, LLC. I expect if the meeting goes forth there will be Private Eyes hired as investors to gather names and photos of those pushing to have the entire mess investigated they do not want the Authorities involved it could uncover a criminal enterprise.

Does anyone have any information on how Estate Financial might be linked to Point Center Financial and National Lending which are two firms controlled by Dan Harkey? From what I can tell 90% of Point Center investors are facing huge losses.

Just because investors are losing money on projects doesn't mean that they are involved in fraud. The economy is FAILING! Developers and builders have no control over the housing market as a whole. I am not saying that everyone is innocent of any wrong doing, but trying to link together a huge conspiracy theory is absurd. Leave the speculation and manipulation of reality to the sociopaths.

OMH wrote:

Does anyone have any information on how Estate Financial might be linked to Point Center Financial and National Lending which are two firms controlled by Dan Harkey? From what I can tell 90% of Point Center investors are facing huge losses.

When RE brokers/hard money lenders mislead investors about things like appraised value, status of entitlements, fund control, and generally do not perform the due diligence on project status, etc. that is not having "no control". Dan Harkey will not come out of this unscathed. His firm has misled investors and been incompetent at BEST. At worst I can only imagine what an independent audit would turn up.

OMH you make a good point. I am in no way excusing fraud or illegal dealings. However, my point is that not ALL builders and developers are criminals or involved in scandal. And that trying to tie EVERYONE that has done business through a company who is now suspect is paranoid. I am sure that legit deals have been made even by a company who is now under scrutiny. I personally believe that the Estate financial fiasco has turned into a witch hunt.

Does anyone have the newest information on this case?? Sources?? What are the alleged wrongdoers up to at this point in time?

High risk, high reward. What does that tell you? Who in their right mind thinks they can get 12% on any investment these days without risking a significant loss -- which is exactly what has been encountered. Blame EFI -- or perhaps blame yourself for investing in something you didn't understand. I feel sorry for those who have lost their shirt in these types of investment schemes, but how sorry can I feel? It's been said, real estate is cyclical in nature. And one day there will be another EFI, and another batch of investors ready, willing and able to make unreasonble profits -- and then want revenge if they don't get what they think they're entitled to...
Seems like Karen is just trying to keep the ship afloat. Maybe all those with "inside" information should step into the sunlight and let everyone see who they are. I predict there will be investigations - how could there not be? But in the end, you'll see that EFI is no different than any of the other hard money lenders. Whether they survive, won't depend on anything the Attorney General does -- and if they don't survive, say good-bye to your investments... But then, that's something that can happen when you take chances, whether in SLO or Paso, or even Las Vegas.

Take the time to search and read newspapers (over the past six months) from around the 'west'. You'll find a similar stories of nice folks being conned out of their retirement savings by bankers, agents, brokers and investment counselors. Property values gone, junky houses half finished. Lots of folks out of work (construction), lots of folks on the move.(Check stories about Bend, Oregon, and Riverside/San Bernardino, Ca))

The promise of better than normal earnings is the lure, but validation by media and multiple 'actors' lets folks 'believe' it's real. It's always been there, but the 'culture' growing over the past eight years has encouraged this infection to grow uncontrolled. I doubt a positive outcome.

Well Hertel and Fowler have defaulted on the Atascadero Ventures,LLC El Jardin project the Clerks office posted a notice of default with Hertel and Fowler to the tune of $20,000,000.00 document numbers # 2008023194 and 2008023195 as was posted before they are indeed into fraud. Bye Bye Hertel and Fowler you cheating and lying is over.