Church of Christ

I can't believe you guys are still debating this same stuff. Nathan, if your real intention is to expose the fundamentalist church of Christ, why don't you start a thread in Top Stories where a whole lot more people will see it?

sorry, didn't sign

Pamela

(I changed my skin a while back, I wasn't satisfied with the old one and I kept getting called he)

Dryad wrote:

I can't believe you guys are still debating this same stuff. Nathan, if your real intention is to expose the fundamentalist church of Christ, why don't you start a thread in Top Stories where a whole lot more people will see it?

That which you call "fundamentalist" the Bible calls sound and faithful.

www.roysecitycoc.org

Hi Pamela,

I'm not trying to expose "the fundamentalist church of Christ". I do hope to expose Shawn Heath and Nova (and any others who might be interested) to the fact that they aren't the only Christians in the house.

I also hope that those of us who have hyper-conservative (I don't use the word "fundamentalist" w/re: to Shawn Heath and Nova and others like them) Churches of Christ in our community will learn what they believe so that we can engage in balanced discussions, because they certainly learn what everyone else believes.

Besides, the "Top Stories" threads can often turn into melees and chaos (especially where talking about faith issues are concerned), and I like participating in conversations with small groups of people who act (mostly) responsible and adult.

Thanks,

Nathan
http://answeringchurchofchrist.wordpress.com

Heath wrote:

<quoted text>
That which you call "fundamentalist" the Bible calls sound and faithful.
www.roysecitycoc.org

And where would that verse be? Where does the Bible say these words Heath?

Nathan wrote:

Hi Pamela,
I'm not trying to expose "the fundamentalist church of Christ". I do hope to expose Shawn Heath and Nova (and any others who might be interested) to the fact that they aren't the only Christians in the house.
I also hope that those of us who have hyper-conservative (I don't use the word "fundamentalist" w/re: to Shawn Heath and Nova and others like them) Churches of Christ in our community will learn what they believe so that we can engage in balanced discussions, because they certainly learn what everyone else believes.
Besides, the "Top Stories" threads can often turn into melees and chaos (especially where talking about faith issues are concerned), and I like participating in conversations with small groups of people who act (mostly) responsible and adult.
Thanks,
Nathan
http://answeringchurchofchrist.wordpress.com

This shows your lack of logical common sense. If what you are saying is true then you MUST expose us as false teachers because we speak against the "truth" of infant baptism and justification by faith alone.

Balanced discussion means you have a dialogue with Nathan according to HIS rules or he'll ban you from his blog. It also involves blogging about a T.V. show and when invited on the T.V. show to give an "answer" cowardly refusing.

Yeah, that's balanced. ;)

www.roysecitycoc.org

Gail wrote:

<quoted text>
And where would that verse be? Where does the Bible say these words Heath?

Rev. 2:10

1 Tim. 1:10

www.roysecitycoc.org

Pamela,

There is no need to expose them. They do a good making themselves look silly and immature.

Heath wrote:

<quoted text>
Rev. 2:10
1 Tim. 1:10
www.roysecitycoc.org

No try again. These verses don't say what you say they say do they? In fact, they never do. You say they mean anything you want them to but all the verses you quote never say what you say they say.

JP Manzi wrote:

Pamela,
There is no need to expose them. They do a good making themselves look silly and immature.

That's true.

JP Manzi wrote:

Pamela,
There is no need to expose them. They do a good making themselves look silly and immature.

JP, you never look silly when you cuss on topix in a religious discussion, right?

www.roysecitycoc.org

Gail wrote:

<quoted text>
No try again. These verses don't say what you say they say do they? In fact, they never do. You say they mean anything you want them to but all the verses you quote never say what you say they say.

Then teach us, oh wise Gail, what they mean.

www.roysecitycoc.org

Nova, I've figured it out. We are dealing with religious agnostics who do not believe in the absolute truth of the Bible. They have a subjective approach to the Bible. They simple want to have a feel good philosophical discussions about certain passages they like and judge us (while telling us not to judge) for striving to be consistent with the truth of the Scriptures.

John 8:31-32

www.roysecitycoc.org

Nathan wrote:

Hi Pamela,
I'm not trying to expose "the fundamentalist church of Christ". I do hope to expose Shawn Heath and Nova (and any others who might be interested) to the fact that they aren't the only Christians in the house.
I also hope that those of us who have hyper-conservative (I don't use the word "fundamentalist" w/re: to Shawn Heath and Nova and others like them) Churches of Christ in our community will learn what they believe so that we can engage in balanced discussions, because they certainly learn what everyone else believes.
Besides, the "Top Stories" threads can often turn into melees and chaos (especially where talking about faith issues are concerned), and I like participating in conversations with small groups of people who act (mostly) responsible and adult.
Thanks,
Nathan
http://answeringchurchofchrist.wordpress.com

Why would you be so concerned about this one little church in a small town? Are you helping the members of that church in any way? Do you think anyone looking for a church is going to come on Topix to check out churches? Does it really matter that Shawn doesn't accept the rest of us as Christians? I don't think so. There are other denominations that say anyone outside of them is lost. I came across Oneness Pentecostals that the Trinity is Pagan and anyone who believes in the Trinity is lost to satan. Many Seventh Day Adventist say that Sunday gathering is the mark of the beast.

Also, I have found some wonderfuly productive conversations in both the Top Stories and Christian forum.

I'm not judging. I'm just wondering why this debate is still going on.

Heath wrote:

<quoted text>
That which you call "fundamentalist" the Bible calls sound and faithful.
www.roysecitycoc.org

You keep telling yourself that Heath.

Heath wrote:

Nova, I've figured it out. We are dealing with religious agnostics who do not believe in the absolute truth of the Bible. They have a subjective approach to the Bible. They simple want to have a feel good philosophical discussions about certain passages they like and judge us (while telling us not to judge) for striving to be consistent with the truth of the Scriptures.
John 8:31-32
www.roysecitycoc.org

If it makes you feel better about yourself to believe that, go ahead - whatever helps you sleep at night. I hope you enjoy your stay in Babylon.

Heath wrote:

<quoted text>
Then teach us, oh wise Gail, what they mean.
www.roysecitycoc.org

You quoted them not me. I was just pointing out that you spout scripture all the time saying they say something when they really don't. As far as teaching you Heath. I don't see it happening. Not because I can't teach, but I don't see you opening up your mind to learn something new not found in some church brouchure.

"You quoted them not me. I was just pointing out that you spout scripture all the time saying they say something when they really don't. As far as teaching you Heath. I don't see it happening. Not because I can't teach, but I don't see you opening up your mind to learn something new not found in some church brouchure."

Right from the "Strange but True" Files. His passages never do mean what he wants them to mean. But after years of twisting and manipulating tiny scraps of scripture it has become the most natural thing in the world for him to do. He understands no other way. I feel sorry for him, that his denomination has turned him into what he is.

Are We Saved By Faith Only?
By Ron Boatwright

Today the vast majority of the religious world says that they are saved by "faith only". Many good people erroneously think they are saved when they "accept Jesus as their personal saviour" and say the "sinner’s prayer". But where in the Bible are we told this? It is not there. This may sound good and impressive, but this is false. This is a lie of Satan. This is something man has dreamed up. Then two or three weeks later many churches encourage people to be baptized to join that denomination. They say that one does not have to be baptized to be saved because they say you are saved before you are baptized. I cannot think of a more flagrant crime against both God and Man than to teach lost sinners, who want to be saved something different than what God says in the Bible.

In this case if they are eventually baptized, their sins are not forgiven and they are not saved because their baptism was not for this purpose. They still have every sin they have ever committed and are still lost because they have believed a lie. As we read in 2 Thessalonians 2:11-12, "And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion that they should believe a lie: that they all might be damned who believed not the truth."

"Faith only" will not save anyone. In James 2:19 & 24 we read, "You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the devils believe and tremble….You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only." If all we do is believe, then we are no better than the devils. We must obey what God says to do, when God says to do it, how God says to do it, and for the reason God says to do it.

Jesus says in Mark 16:16, "He that believes and is baptized shall be saved". There is nothing hard to understand about this. A person has to have help to misunderstand what the Lord says here. Until people do what Jesus says that one must do to be saved then they are still hopelessly lost.

www.roysecitycoc.org

The Thief On The Cross
By Ron Boatwright

The sad thing is that there are many people today who try to use "the thief on the cross" as their justification for not obeying the clear and plain command of Jesus to be baptized. On the Day of Judgment it will not be the case of "what about the thief on the cross". The thief on the cross was before the death of Christ and before the New Testament took effect. Hebrews 9:17 says, "For a testament is in force after men are dead, since it has no power at all while the testator lives." We cannot be saved like the thief because Christ’s New Testament is in effect for us today. Anyone refusing to obey Jesus on His terms has no legitimate claim on the salvation that Jesus offers. One will certainly be held accountable for his disobedience by the eternal loss of his soul. He will only have himself to blame.

People need to stop spending their time in trying to figure out a way to get around doing what the Lord said, but rather they need be willing to submit to the final authority of our Lord. When we stand before the Lord on the day of judgment to be judged by Him, there are going to be many who have chosen not to do what the Lord has said. Romans 10:3 tells us that people are "Seeking to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted to the righteousness of God."

Jesus said in Mark 16:16, "He that believes and is baptized shall be saved." How are people going to explain to Jesus on the Day of Judgment why they did not do what He says and for the reason He says? The New Testament of Christ requires us to be baptized for the remission of our sins (Acts 2:38, Acts 22:16) so that we can be saved (Mark 16:16, 1 Peter 3:21). It did not take effect until after the death of Christ. The thief did not come under the New Testament as we do today. It will be too late on Judgment Day to find out that one hasn’t obeyed the Lord and is still lost.

www.roysecitycoc.org