Gone with the wind - Business

"First, he ripped out the pineapples."

Ah, those sweet native, organically grown pineapples.... That's how I knew this story was going to be so slanted.

Personally, I think that if Oahu wants to benefit from wind power they should put in some windmills. All this talk of 'green renewable energy" is fine until someone ACTUALLY wants to put in a wind farm. Oahu better do something because they are going to need a crap load more electricity to run their train and the old power plant can't manage to support a new Target Store opening.

If I lived on Lanai, I'd want a few turbines to power the island and then let Oahu do what ever it wants. I'm pretty sure Oahu is planning on building a new oil powered plant to power it's train though. If they want turbines there are few acres left without skyscrapers on them.

Proud from Nanakuli wrote:

Lana'i is by far the most beautiful island with the most friendlist of people. It's the best island to visit, if you want absolute peace and quiet. If they're going to build the windmill farms, shouldn't the people of Lana'i at least benefit from it? I mean come on they pay through their noses for everything. I know the windmill farm would ruin the beautiful scenery of the island, but if it'll make the people of Lana'i not depend on tourism that's a good thing right? Then again I only visit there, I don't live there so perhaps the people of Lana'i should have the right to say yea or nay.

If an owner owns 98% of the island, he should have the right to build his windfarm as long as he keeps it far away from the other 2% owners. Windfarms are not noisy industrial complexes so a windfarm will fit nicely with the peace and quiet of the island.

The residents of Lanai will benefit indirectly with the extra jobs that are created in the construction and running of the windfarm. It's all about jobs just like it is currently in Hawaii. The more jobs created or maintained, the better the economy.

Once the windfarm is established, Lanai should promote ecotourism by providing sightseeing tours of the windfarm. Think of all the Green people who will make a trip all the way to Lanai to see the Lanai windfarm.

open your eyes wrote:

<quoted text>
Has anyone ever gone to Lanai and talked to the people who live there? Some of you people are clueless! The damage this man has done to the island in 20 years is incredible. He may own the majority of the island but he still needs to follow the law like everyone else!
He could put that wind farm anywhere else on the island (remember, a huge chunk of the island was once pineapple) but he wants to put it in an area that is prestine and undeveloped. One of the choice hunting areas with access to some of the best fishing on the island. He will cut public access and make it even harder for people who live there.
And as far as jobs go, do you really think locals will get the jobs? They will bring in people who specialize in winds turbines and the locals will get screwed as usual.

Exactly, and why should lanai be the electricity generator that powers oahu? Lanai people should benefit 100% from this so called wind farm, not Oahu!

People on this board speak of Lanai as if they know the place! Come on, pull your heads out of your a**es and stop speaking from ignorance. As for the guy speaking about hunting and fishing, its a way of life, you wouldn't understand. As for the super rich transplants on Lanai, you aren't the voices of the island, the real local people are. And finally as for murdock owning Lanai, try researching the land title to Lanai and see if its title is perfect, because I can guarantee you there is no perfect title!!!

realmerv wrote:

<quoted text>
If an owner owns 98% of the island, he should have the right to build his windfarm as long as he keeps it far away from the other 2% owners. Windfarms are not noisy industrial complexes so a windfarm will fit nicely with the peace and quiet of the island.
The residents of Lanai will benefit indirectly with the extra jobs that are created in the construction and running of the windfarm. It's all about jobs just like it is currently in Hawaii. The more jobs created or maintained, the better the economy.
Once the windfarm is established, Lanai should promote ecotourism by providing sightseeing tours of the windfarm. Think of all the Green people who will make a trip all the way to Lanai to see the Lanai windfarm.

no lanai people won't benefit from these jobs, like weve seen in the past with 4 seasons, and the various construction jobs, its the mainlanders and off islanders that get priority to the better jobs! Lanai people are given the SH** jobs, even with education. You haven't seen the politics on Lanai, you don't know what you're talking about, stop jumping to conclusions!!!

LanaiGrownNotFlown wrote:

<quoted text>
no lanai people won't benefit from these jobs, like weve seen in the past with 4 seasons, and the various construction jobs, its the mainlanders and off islanders that get priority to the better jobs! Lanai people are given the SH** jobs, even with education. You haven't seen the politics on Lanai, you don't know what you're talking about, stop jumping to conclusions!!!

That is the truth.

LanaiGrownNotFlown wrote:

<quoted text>
no lanai people won't benefit from these jobs, like weve seen in the past with 4 seasons, and the various construction jobs, its the mainlanders and off islanders that get priority to the better jobs! Lanai people are given the SH** jobs, even with education. You haven't seen the politics on Lanai, you don't know what you're talking about, stop jumping to conclusions!!!

I guess you and I are thinking on a different level. You may not want the jobs that will be offered but I'm sure someone will want it. The windfarm will offer some jobs and I believe that some jobs being available is better than no jobs being available. If the jobs offered are unwanted, the developer will have to import all the workers to build and maintain the project. So if workers are imported, they will have to buy some products locally which will help support the local economy on Lanai. If the jobs are the lowest level jobs, they are still jobs and no one is being forced to take the jobs.

If you say that Lanai has the junk jobs, why not create your own jobs by establishing your own businesses. If your children are educated and the jobs they desire aren't available, let them settle elsewhere where the job opportunities are better like the rest of us on the other islands are doing. Did you know that a lot of young people move from the Big Island to work on Oahu or on the mainland? Many of our Big Island people move and most stay put and sacrifice lower job opportunities for higher income ... but it is their choice to do so.

If all you do is thinking locally (like only on Lanai), it's difficult to see the whole picture. I'm sure many of the people on Lanai are dependent on social services or are retired, if the State economy goes downhill even more than it has, social services could be reduced by the State government. What the State wants is more jobs to be available statewide so that there will be less people dependent on social services; otherwise, they may have to cut back on the services they offer. So it doesn't matter if the jobs created on Lanai by the construction of the windfarm are the junk ones, someone will take it and the taxes, local purchasing and lessening on State social service demands are a positive outcome.

This is why I am saying that we are thinking on a different level.

Gosh going green can sure create a lot of controversey. If you own the land you should within reasonable parameters be able to do what you want. But I can see the other points too. It sounds like Lanai needs to encourage some limited soft industry, and hopefully diversify it's economy.

LanaiGrownNotFlown wrote:

<quoted text>
no lanai people won't benefit from these jobs, like weve seen in the past with 4 seasons, and the various construction jobs, its the mainlanders and off islanders that get priority to the better jobs! Lanai people are given the SH** jobs, even with education. You haven't seen the politics on Lanai, you don't know what you're talking about, stop jumping to conclusions!!!

Addressing the 4 Seasons and various construction jobs, when a contractor from off-island is given a job to work on a project, the contractor usually brings their own working crews with them since the know their workers. So it shouldn't be a surprise that the outsiders did most of the construction work. Most contractors have their dependable work crew in place, if they have more jobs than the work crew can handle, they will create another work crew with new workers.

If you put yourself in the contractor's shoes, you may be able to see what I mean. If you were the contractor given a job on another island with time constraints, would you take your old time dependable crew with you or would you go over and try to hire your new work crew with untested workers you know nothing about ... you don't know if the new workers are hard workers or lazy workers, or workers that have little experience. Not all workers are equal in workmanship and talent. Contractors in the business long enough keep the best workers in their crew and let the less talented and unproductive workers go.

Mike wrote:

Gosh going green can sure create a lot of controversey. If you own the land you should within reasonable parameters be able to do what you want. But I can see the other points too. It sounds like Lanai needs to encourage some limited soft industry, and hopefully diversify it's economy.

I knew that this Green project was going to have the NIMBYs coming out and opposing it ... just like everywhere else. But in this case, it seems that some people want to benefit from another party's work and effort. I believe if you want something, go and work for it. If you don't like the high cost of living in your area, move elsewhere or accept the fact that that is how it is when you live in a low population area with less services.

You shouldn't expect the developer to supply electric power to Lanai when it will be costly to supply a small population. And even if it did, the cost wouldn't be very cheap as one would expect since the utility company must recover its cost from the supplier.

Next you may start hearing from people saying that they won't have access to another persons land.

Whoosh. Whoosh. Whoosh. All day long. All night long. Whoosh. Whoosh. Whoosh.

Tree huggers go hug a tree...

I see a lot of "why does Lanai have to serve Oahu's power needs?" If they rectify the policy and divert enough power coming from the wind farm for Lanai's use it's a win-win situation for Lanai. It's not Lanai serving Oahu but rather Lanai exporting a commodity to Oahu, increasing intra-state commerce. People say the windmill will ruin the scenery....so acres and acres of generic suburban tracts will look better? At least with windmills, the land underneath it will remain as is.

HEY WOW LAULAU wrote:

I have an idea. Why doesn't Murdoch grow sugar cane. He can use it to produce biofuel. It is green energy, and agriculture. He won't need a permit. I'm sure those losers with there 2nd homes on Lanai would enjoy the periodic canefires and the smoke that would accompany it. Give me a break!!! BUILD THE WINDMILLS AND GET SOME GREAT JOBS FOR THE ISLAND.

Where is the irrigation water going to come from to grow cane on Lanai? There's barely enough right now.

LNYBOY wrote:

Tree huggers go hug a tree...

And hump a whale...

Watch out, you piss off the wrong haole - they going to go after the Lanai Ferry to keep all of "those Pine Locals" from going to Lahaole (formerly known as Lahaina)!

realmerv wrote:

<quoted text>
Addressing the 4 Seasons and various construction jobs, when a contractor from off-island is given a job to work on a project, the contractor usually brings their own working crews with them since the know their workers. So it shouldn't be a surprise that the outsiders did most of the construction work. Most contractors have their dependable work crew in place, if they have more jobs than the work crew can handle, they will create another work crew with new workers.
If you put yourself in the contractor's shoes, you may be able to see what I mean. If you were the contractor given a job on another island with time constraints, would you take your old time dependable crew with you or would you go over and try to hire your new work crew with untested workers you know nothing about ... you don't know if the new workers are hard workers or lazy workers, or workers that have little experience. Not all workers are equal in workmanship and talent. Contractors in the business long enough keep the best workers in their crew and let the less talented and unproductive workers go.

So you admit it, very few Lanai locals will get jobs. This will only benefit Mr. Murdock and Oahu. The construction workers at each harbor were from other places. Most workers at the past Koele construction were from other places. Just last week I saw "South Americans" on the ferry coming over to work on Lanai. The hotel workers are transitioning to workers from other places. The guys counting birds to get ready for the windmills were from other places. There might be some good things about the windmills, but jobs for locals probably will not be one of them.

Fisherman wrote:

<quoted text>
So you admit it, very few Lanai locals will get jobs. This will only benefit Mr. Murdock and Oahu. The construction workers at each harbor were from other places. Most workers at the past Koele construction were from other places. Just last week I saw "South Americans" on the ferry coming over to work on Lanai. The hotel workers are transitioning to workers from other places. The guys counting birds to get ready for the windmills were from other places. There might be some good things about the windmills, but jobs for locals probably will not be one of them.

I don't know how many Lanai workers would find employment ... no one knows yet. But even if you create 20 jobs, that's 20 jobs more than Lanai would have and I don't know your demographics but one can assume that 20 jobs could support 80 people assuming that there are 4 people per family.

And so what if Murdock makes out, he's the one putting out the investment funds and not the people of Lanai. Why shouldn't the party putting out the capital be entitled to the profits?

If South Americans are coming in to work, maybe you people on Lanai should try to find out if they are illegals being brought in to take your jobs? You can always report them to ICE.

If you people think the way you do, it is no wonder that you think the jobs will not go to Lanai residents.

gotta ask why lanai isn't getting the electricity too........?

...just like with the geothermal...put it where the poor people live that can't fight it...they bear the costs while others bear the gains...

Auwe!!!!!!!!

arm wrote:

gotta ask why lanai isn't getting the electricity too........?
...just like with the geothermal...put it where the poor people live that can't fight it...they bear the costs while others bear the gains...

I read in an earlier news article that it would be too expensive to provide power to Lanai's residents. I think it had to do with a different system or perhaps the power poles needed to get the power from the windfarm to the Lanai residents on the other side of the island.

stanislous wrote:

"The wind farm would move Hawaii toward its goal of being 70 percent green by 2030, he said."
I read that less than 1% of our energy is "green" at the moment.... and the goal is 70%... LOL In 20 years... LOL
Your kidding, right?
LOL LOL LOL

Yeah, you might get 12 miles of rail by then, if you're lucky. Hawaii, land of the corrupt, doing the incompetent, trying to sell a fantasy.