Church of Christ Legalism

I think Bobby makes a good point.

"Do you really believe that h2o washes away our sins?

If all you have is water baptism you have nothing. In it's proper place it is a wonderful experience. You elevate it beyond it's purpose. In doing so you disrespect the power of God."

This is where 'some' Churches of Christ has failed. They have raised Baptism to an idol - a deed that causes salvation. Doing so, they place Jesus work below Baptism and make Baptism the agent whereby one is forgiven. They condemn Catholics for bringing alive the Lords supper but then do the same with baptism.

BTW, I happen to agree with baptism being an act of faith, but lets not make it the source of salvation and many times we present baptism as such. We need to make Jesus central and allow baptism to have its place as a response to the gospel.

Bobby wrote:

<quoted text>
Do you really believe that h2o washes away our sins?
If all you have is water baptism you have nothing. In it's proper place it is a wonderful experience. You elevate it beyond it's purpose. In doing so you disrespect the power of God.

"Do you really believe that h2o washes away our sins?" NOPE (1 Pet. 3:21)

"If all you have is water baptism you have nothing." AMEN!

Now tell us about the United Methodist church. Where is it found in the Bible?

www.roysecitycoc.org

www.

Bill wrote:

I think Bobby makes a good point.
"Do you really believe that h2o washes away our sins?
If all you have is water baptism you have nothing. In it's proper place it is a wonderful experience. You elevate it beyond it's purpose. In doing so you disrespect the power of God."
This is where 'some' Churches of Christ has failed. They have raised Baptism to an idol - a deed that causes salvation. Doing so, they place Jesus work below Baptism and make Baptism the agent whereby one is forgiven. They condemn Catholics for bringing alive the Lords supper but then do the same with baptism.
BTW, I happen to agree with baptism being an act of faith, but lets not make it the source of salvation and many times we present baptism as such. We need to make Jesus central and allow baptism to have its place as a response to the gospel.

Where does the gospel leave room for infant baptism?

www.roysecitycoc.org

When we speak of “legalism,” we don’t mean someone who insists on obedience to God’s commands. We insist on obedience to God’s commands. Rather, by “legalist” we mean someone guilty of the Galatian heresy — that is, insisting that we should add certain works to faith in Jesus as conditions for a Christian to remain saved.

From my friend Brian another ex-coc.

Once again, there are various positions on this issue within the Church of Christ denomination, but this is probably their most grievous error. Because it goes way beyond just rejecting the Gifts of the Holy Spirit, as recorded in I Corinthians chapters 12-14. It also includes the rejection of His "enduement of power." Jesus said in Acts 1:4-8 that He would "baptize them in the Holy Spirit" and they would "receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you." And we see the fulfillment of this promise on the day of Pentecost. Peter said in Acts 2:39, that the promise of receiving the baptism of the Holy Spirit was for every believer, for "as many as the Lord our God shall call!" In the Gospel of Mark, Jesus had also promised that the miraculous would follow those that believed, in Chapter 16, verse 17. Jesus promised in John 14:16, that the Holy Spirit "would be with us FOREVER!" Paul said in Romans 11:29 that, "The gifts and calling of God are irrevocable."

Some (not all) of the members of the Church of Christ denomination go even further in their defiance of the Holy Spirit, and say that he is not even a person of the Trinity. The Bible is very clear in attributing personhood to the Holy Spirit by stating that the Holy Spirit has a will (I Cor 12:11); that He can be grieved (Eph 4:30); that He would be our Teacher (John 14:26) and more. Many of the Church of Christ denominations even come dangerously close to committing blasphemy of the Holy Spirit (Matt. 12:31) by saying that any manifestation of the miraculous in this day and age are all 100% demonic!

Heath, how do know when God answers your prayers?

If you pray for your child to get well and he does, to whom do you give the praise?

Maybe the best question is "how ans why do you pray"?

It seems to me that if you cannot expect God to help in times of need, Why pray at all, just trust the doctor or the counselor and give them the praise along with a big fat check.

My God answers prayer and even if I do not receive what I ask for, I believe he still works miracles today. God has never lost His authority in the earth nor His power. He is not sleeping, He has not stopped being God. He is the same yesterday, today and forever. He is not mean, he did not come to kill steal and destroy. He came with healing in his wings with mercy and un-failing love, while at the same time he will finish what he began including destroying the wicked and eradicating evil. Come quickly Lord Jesus!

What kind of God do you serve.

Army of God wrote:

When we speak of “legalism,” we don’t mean someone who insists on obedience to God’s commands. We insist on obedience to God’s commands. Rather, by “legalist” we mean someone guilty of the Galatian heresy — that is, insisting that we should add certain works to faith in Jesus as conditions for a Christian to remain saved.

"When we speak of “legalism,” we don’t mean someone who insists on obedience to God’s commands. We insist on obedience to God’s commands." Army

Then you insist that people who were baptized as infants must be baptized as a believer, right?

Then you insist that those who were baptized by pouring must be immersed in water, right?

Then you insist that those who teach one MUST tithe today should stop teaching that, right?

Then you insist that those play instruments in worship today must stop doing so because there is no N.T. command to do so, right?

Then you insist that those who teach women can be pastors are wrong and forbid women from that position, right?

Then you insist that those practice polygamy must give up all but their first wife, right?

www.roysecitycoc.org

Bobby wrote:

Heath, how do know when God answers your prayers?
If you pray for your child to get well and he does, to whom do you give the praise?
Maybe the best question is "how ans why do you pray"?
It seems to me that if you cannot expect God to help in times of need, Why pray at all, just trust the doctor or the counselor and give them the praise along with a big fat check.
My God answers prayer and even if I do not receive what I ask for, I believe he still works miracles today. God has never lost His authority in the earth nor His power. He is not sleeping, He has not stopped being God. He is the same yesterday, today and forever. He is not mean, he did not come to kill steal and destroy. He came with healing in his wings with mercy and un-failing love, while at the same time he will finish what he began including destroying the wicked and eradicating evil. Come quickly Lord Jesus!
What kind of God do you serve.

"He is not mean, he did not come to kill steal and destroy." Bobby

Acts 5:1-11; 12:23

www.roysecitycoc.org

HEATH wrote:

<quoted text>
"He is not mean, he did not come to kill steal and destroy." Bobby
Acts 5:1-11; 12:23
www.roysecitycoc.org

This has nothing to do with what I said. God is not like Satan,he is Holy and righteous and he will exercise his authority over all living creatures. We may appear at times to get away with things but God will eventually straighten out the crooked paths.

Bobby wrote:

<quoted text>
This has nothing to do with what I said. God is not like Satan,he is Holy and righteous and he will exercise his authority over all living creatures. We may appear at times to get away with things but God will eventually straighten out the crooked paths.

You're right. The Bible has nothing to do with what you post.

www.roysecitycoc.org

HEATH wrote:

<quoted text>
You're right. The Bible has nothing to do with what you post.
www.roysecitycoc.org

Wrong, you were using it out of the context of my message. You are still a twister, aren't you?

Bobby wrote:

<quoted text>
Wrong, you were using it out of the context of my message. You are still a twister, aren't you?

You then PUT THEM IN CONTEXT FOR ME.

www.roysecitycoc.org

HEATH wrote:

<quoted text>
You then PUT THEM IN CONTEXT FOR ME.
www.roysecitycoc.org

Every time I put things in context you twist it, so go figure it out for yourself. I don't have much patience for you anymore.

Bobby, don’t be discouraged by their games. See, this is a tool of tactics often employed by these men. When they cant answer, they will either attack you or ignore your points. If that fails, they twist things around so that it makes you to say something you did not. Just keep hammering the truth and if they want to play games let them play. What Shawn Paden fails to realize is that one day people will read the history of these men and see what damage they have done. They are a dying breed within the Churches of Christ. Their membership falls each year. The reason is because people are seeing them for who they are and see thru their games. You know if they really could answer, they would have ran to Grace Conversation and signed up there to defend what they teach --- do you see them there? Nope. Shawn ducked in once to make a passing comment about Mac, then he ran out.