Woo hoo... Obamacare passed!

2cents wrote:

the only answer, IMO, is:
1. oust O in November
2. repeal this mess of a bill
3. attempt true reforms
Look, we all know healthcare is a mess in this country. Pharm has us addicted to pills, the docs are dictated by protocols for outcomes (economic) and the income, plus the attorney's huge slice. Deal with these issues rather than shove a gov't mandate and tax down our throats and call it positive reform.

No matter what we do it will be some sort of government mandate if we do any sort of reform at all, someone somewhere will be pissed off and butt hurt. The medical field and insurance companies are not going to just change for the hell of it.

You know as well as I do that the ones opposing this are doing so because of politics, the same politics that have handcuffed and nearly destroyed this country. This policy is modeled after ones already in effect in other capitalist nations and they work just fine, its just new to us and people freak the hell out over new things. They took the best ideas from many different countries and put them together here. Most people opposing it haven't even read it, they just believe what they see on biased "news" programs.

If Obama came out in favor of oxygen the Republicans would suffocate themselves, hey wait, I may be on to something here.

oh BS wrote:

Actually it really shouldn't be your right to not carry health insurance unless you sign a waiver stating that you will never ever visit a hospital even in an emergency. Hospitals are going broke because of the millions without insurance that cant pay their pills.
When your right to do something simply because you think you can affects others then no you don't have a right. This will give everyone the opportunity to afford insurance even if it means government insurance. No one will fall through any cracks unless they choose to and they will fund the rest by paying a tax.
The only way anyone would be guilty of anything is if they utterly refused any insurance private or government then refused to pay the tax levied against you for refusing insurance.

I pay my bills thanks. Nice arguement in a convoluted way I guess.
You justify an intrusive government mandated insurance by saying that it isn't my right to have health care....double speak master indeed.

oh BS wrote:

<quoted text>Well that's exactly what this bill will do. It not only mandates that everyone has insurance, thereby increasing profits for the insurance companies but as a trade off insurance companies are tightly controlled by the government, they cant do the denial and rejection they did before. Basically the government is force increasing their customer base by a lot but in return they have to make it affordable to everyone and accept everyone.
As for the religion argument well I don't give a damn about anyone's religion. The majority shouldn't have to shoulder the burden because some moron doesn't believe in medicine until something bad happens then they don't have insurance to cover it. If these same people refuse to allow children or family medical care because of a religion they should be jailed (I would rather do something else to them).

so you are fine with violating the constitutional right concerning religious freedom and the right to practice that religion and its aspects any way you choose?

and why are you in the US? There's at least China and Russia that comes to mind as places where you would be more comfortable than here.

This is not what soldiers over the 200+ years of this country's existance have been fighting for. You aren't about freedom, you are about government control of everything and anything.

Sickening.

Look right wingers, "who alot of you get social security and medicare' if you don't like the benefits you receive: Don't accept them. Period. I personally want both and if you guys refuse, than I will benefit. This is just another benefit for all American people. We have needed healthcare for all for a long, long time. You rant and rave about SS and Medicare, but you would not give it up NO matter what. Hypocrites at best. The Democrats passed both of these in 1935 and 1965. Now, finally in 2012 we have health care. Passed by DEMOCRATS!!! I used to be a Red Dog Republican. I was. Until I woke up and saw the light. If you think Millionaire Mitt is going to help you Middle Classers, Or the poor. You are BADLY MISTAKEN!!!

oh BS wrote:

<quoted text>No matter what we do it will be some sort of government mandate if we do any sort of reform at all, someone somewhere will be pissed off and butt hurt. The medical field and insurance companies are not going to just change for the hell of it.

You know as well as I do that the ones opposing this are doing so because of politics, the same politics that have handcuffed and nearly destroyed this country. This policy is modeled after ones already in effect in other capitalist nations and they work just fine, its just new to us and people freak the hell out over new things. They took the best ideas from many different countries and put them together here. Most people opposing it haven't even read it, they just believe what they see on biased "news" programs.

If Obama came out in favor of oxygen the Republicans would suffocate themselves, hey wait, I may be on to something here.

Very true, 99% opposed have no clue why other than party lines. I have read thru the briefs and agreed, it contains many bad points but as well it contains many good points, if the parties would stop party line politics and focus on refining the healthcare reform bill, it would be great benefit to all of us. But policy can never be set because politics and money get in the way. As our politicians continue to play games with our nations future, china has quickly slipped in the backdoor and ripped the soul of our economy and country away. Sadly we are in a decline that may or may not be recoverable from as a society in whole.

Harry wrote:

Look right wingers, "who alot of you get social security and medicare' if you don't like the benefits you receive: Don't accept them. Period. I personally want both and if you guys refuse, than I will benefit. This is just another benefit for all American people. We have needed healthcare for all for a long, long time. You rant and rave about SS and Medicare, but you would not give it up NO matter what. Hypocrites at best. The Democrats passed both of these in 1935 and 1965. Now, finally in 2012 we have health care. Passed by DEMOCRATS!!! I used to be a Red Dog Republican. I was. Until I woke up and saw the light. If you think Millionaire Mitt is going to help you Middle Classers, Or the poor. You are BADLY MISTAKEN!!!

They are all just puppets on strings. There is no for the people by the people anymore. People are just too dumbed down and accepting of a free ride to figure that out.

As for your remark about SS and medicare-the people who are receiving SS had that money taken out of their paychecks without any say so about it. It isn't a FREE government hand out, it is money the seniors have put long hours in for. The government has loaned out the majority of the money that has been paid into SS over the years knowing that it would never be paid back and the people paying it in would be the ones who suffered. That is exactly what has happened too.

And, for as much as you seem to think you know, there is a premium taking out of the senior citizen's social security check every month to cover costs of their medicare, likewise the same for many concerning their prescription drug coverage as well.

It's one thing when you have worked for what you are seeing in return, and it is another thing entirely when you're sitting around not even trying with your hand out saying GIMME...

EARN IT

reality wrote:

<quoted text>
so you are fine with violating the constitutional right concerning religious freedom and the right to practice that religion and its aspects any way you choose?
and why are you in the US? There's at least China and Russia that comes to mind as places where you would be more comfortable than here.
This is not what soldiers over the 200+ years of this country's existance have been fighting for. You aren't about freedom, you are about government control of everything and anything.
Sickening.

Maybe you should brush up on your Bill of Rights.
The First Amendment does not protect a religious practice that may cause harm to others and infringe on the rights of others if that's what you are trying to insinuate, a good example is the ban on snake handling. You would probably think that is a violation of the First Amendment. Would the jihad by Muslims on America not be covered by the First Amendment? Of course not. You cant do whatever you like just because we live in America and claim you have a God given right to do it. We do have limits and the Constitution only broadly covers certain things, I see nothing about this in any violation of the Constitution. People start this flag waiving patriotism every time the Fed comes up with a new law but at the same time sits back and complains about the Fed not doing this and that. People bitch about medical costs and insurance among other things then bitch when the government does something about it.

Its all about politics. Had this been introduced by Bush or Romney you guess would be calling them Jesus Christ and the savior of humanity. We LOST more rights when the Patriot Act was introduced BY REPUBLICANS but you all were like "Oh it's for the best and for our safety" and you want to speak of government intrusion LOL. You want to bitch about a smart health care plan but wire tapping our phones is ok, just like this post will be seen by some government worker because I used certain red flag words, HI CIA and FBI, LOL. What about the fact that Bush was going to give amnesty to illegal immigrants while in office but was unable to get it passed before he left office, yet now Obama is doing it he is the devil lol.

really wrote:

<quoted text>
Very true, 99% opposed have no clue why other than party lines. I have read thru the briefs and agreed, it contains many bad points but as well it contains many good points, if the parties would stop party line politics and focus on refining the healthcare reform bill, it would be great benefit to all of us. But policy can never be set because politics and money get in the way. As our politicians continue to play games with our nations future, china has quickly slipped in the backdoor and ripped the soul of our economy and country away. Sadly we are in a decline that may or may not be recoverable from as a society in whole.

I agree 100%, nothing more I can add to that.

oh BS wrote:

<quoted text>Maybe you should brush up on your Bill of Rights.
The First Amendment does not protect a religious practice that may cause harm to others and infringe on the rights of others if that's what you are trying to insinuate, a good example is the ban on snake handling. You would probably think that is a violation of the First Amendment. Would the jihad by Muslims on America not be covered by the First Amendment? Of course not. You cant do whatever you like just because we live in America and claim you have a God given right to do it. We do have limits and the Constitution only broadly covers certain things, I see nothing about this in any violation of the Constitution. People start this flag waiving patriotism every time the Fed comes up with a new law but at the same time sits back and complains about the Fed not doing this and that. People bitch about medical costs and insurance among other things then bitch when the government does something about it.
Its all about politics. Had this been introduced by Bush or Romney you guess would be calling them Jesus Christ and the savior of humanity. We LOST more rights when the Patriot Act was introduced BY REPUBLICANS but you all were like "Oh it's for the best and for our safety" and you want to speak of government intrusion LOL. You want to bitch about a smart health care plan but wire tapping our phones is ok, just like this post will be seen by some government worker because I used certain red flag words, HI CIA and FBI, LOL. What about the fact that Bush was going to give amnesty to illegal immigrants while in office but was unable to get it passed before he left office, yet now Obama is doing it he is the devil lol.

You need to stop assuming. I am not registered as a republican, nor do I vote a republican ticket. Nor am I registered democrat, nor do I vote a democratic ticket.

I happen to have a brain. I happen to refuse run like a mindless lemming over the cliff to my demise. I don't support either party.

I happen to be an independant. I am sure you will have something to say about that as well, but quite frankly, your opinion doesn't matter to me.

This current govern is a progression of a devil that has existed since Kennedy was assassinated.

People shouldn't put trust in either party....they lie, and thats all they do.

Everything that they seem to "give" to the people has a much larger price than worth.

Remember that when obamacare kicks into action.

myself? I won't be utilizing the medical/healthcare system at all.

I'll take my chances on my own.

oh BS wrote:

<quoted text>Maybe you should brush up on your Bill of Rights.
The First Amendment does not protect a religious practice that may cause harm to others and infringe on the rights of others if that's what you are trying to insinuate, a good example is the ban on snake handling. You would probably think that is a violation of the First Amendment. Would the jihad by Muslims on America not be covered by the First Amendment? Of course not. You cant do whatever you like just because we live in America and claim you have a God given right to do it. We do have limits and the Constitution only broadly covers certain things, I see nothing about this in any violation of the Constitution. People start this flag waiving patriotism every time the Fed comes up with a new law but at the same time sits back and complains about the Fed not doing this and that. People bitch about medical costs and insurance among other things then bitch when the government does something about it.

Its all about politics. Had this been introduced by Bush or Romney you guess would be calling them Jesus Christ and the savior of humanity. We LOST more rights when the Patriot Act was introduced BY REPUBLICANS but you all were like "Oh it's for the best and for our safety" and you want to speak of government intrusion LOL. You want to bitch about a smart health care plan but wire tapping our phones is ok, just like this post will be seen by some government worker because I used certain red flag words, HI CIA and FBI, LOL. What about the fact that Bush was going to give amnesty to illegal immigrants while in office but was unable to get it passed before he left office, yet now Obama is doing it he is the devil lol.

The constitutional had been repeatedly trampled on for several decades now by both parties, including a substantial thrashing by the Patriot Act yet no one seems to react unless they think it may cost them a few dollars. They fail to realize with or without obamacare, we are still going to pay the cost either way. I am republican but I still agree with the amnesty. We must have healthcare reform yet to accomplish anything the party line politics must end. Once again the republicans inner fighting has all but handed Obama his second term, when will we learn. 2016 maybe? In my opinion 2012 is already a done deal, clearly because of republican pride and arrogance.

really wrote:

<quoted text>
The constitutional had been repeatedly trampled on for several decades now by both parties, including a substantial thrashing by the Patriot Act yet no one seems to react unless they think it may cost them a few dollars. They fail to realize with or without obamacare, we are still going to pay the cost either way. I am republican but I still agree with the amnesty. We must have healthcare reform yet to accomplish anything the party line politics must end. Once again the republicans inner fighting has all but handed Obama his second term, when will we learn. 2016 maybe? In my opinion 2012 is already a done deal, clearly because of republican pride and arrogance.

I agree again. I have been Republican my entire life up until the last year when I switched to Independent. I thought for a long time that the party could be saved and I am for the most part always conservative in my idea's but I have seen there is no hope for the R party anymore, the NeoCons have taken over and the party has attracted all sorts of far right scum. These Gadsden flag waiving Tea Baggers and new age wanna be patriots have become so afraid of their own shadows to the point they will attack anything no matter how good it is just because it was thought of by the wrong side.

Both sides are so self serving and stupid that I see no reason to be a part of either one. I make my opinion on each bill or situation depending on what I have read and researched but which political party made it never enters the equation. I vote the same way, depending on what I know about the person and their record and stances on things I know about.

I agree with Obamacare, not because of which party it belongs to but because it make sense and its good economics. People don't want to directly pay anything, they are completely fine with paying as long as they don't see the money trail or see it leaving their hand. The Patriot Act has cost us billions (not to mention how it really has trampled the Constitution) but because the money isn't directly coming out of peoples pockets they are fine, it comes out indirectly through taxes people never see.

I also agree with amnesty, lol how people cant put two and two together is amazing. The amount of illegals in this country is amazing and the amount of money they will be paying in taxes is also going to be amazing. They are here and always will be, draining the system but not paying in anything much, now they will and they will also be buying insurance.

oh BS wrote:

<quoted text>I agree again. I have been Republican my entire life up until the last year when I switched to Independent. I thought for a long time that the party could be saved and I am for the most part always conservative in my idea's but I have seen there is no hope for the R party anymore, the NeoCons have taken over and the party has attracted all sorts of far right scum. These Gadsden flag waiving Tea Baggers and new age wanna be patriots have become so afraid of their own shadows to the point they will attack anything no matter how good it is just because it was thought of by the wrong side.
Both sides are so self serving and stupid that I see no reason to be a part of either one. I make my opinion on each bill or situation depending on what I have read and researched but which political party made it never enters the equation. I vote the same way, depending on what I know about the person and their record and stances on things I know about.
I agree with Obamacare, not because of which party it belongs to but because it make sense and its good economics. People don't want to directly pay anything, they are completely fine with paying as long as they don't see the money trail or see it leaving their hand. The Patriot Act has cost us billions (not to mention how it really has trampled the Constitution) but because the money isn't directly coming out of peoples pockets they are fine, it comes out indirectly through taxes people never see.
I also agree with amnesty, lol how people cant put two and two together is amazing. The amount of illegals in this country is amazing and the amount of money they will be paying in taxes is also going to be amazing. They are here and always will be, draining the system but not paying in anything much, now they will and they will also be buying insurance.

who are you kidding ..you are a life long democrat whos looking for a handout

jon wrote:

<quoted text>who are you kidding ..you are a life long democrat whos looking for a handout

lol whatever makes your small mind feel better about its self. I bet I have never been on welfare, can you say that? Why would I lie about what party I am or what I was? If were a Democrat I would have no problem admitting it, I think being a Republican is just as embarrassing and I admitted that. You are one of the problems that make up the brain dead new Republican party. Go count your food stamps and have another beer, be sure you get your nightly dose of right wing propaganda on Fox and Youtube, buy that super ninja sword you've been eyeing on QVC in preparation of the coming race war, zombie apocalypse, government takeover, etc. etc. Most of all bring in your "south's gonna rise again" rebel flag before you go to bed, you know how them others in the trailer park have been eye balling it HA HA HA.

oh BS wrote:

<quoted text>lol whatever makes your small mind feel better about its self. I bet I have never been on welfare, can you say that? Why would I lie about what party I am or what I was? If were a Democrat I would have no problem admitting it, I think being a Republican is just as embarrassing and I admitted that. You are one of the problems that make up the brain dead new Republican party. Go count your food stamps and have another beer, be sure you get your nightly dose of right wing propaganda on Fox and Youtube, buy that super ninja sword you've been eyeing on QVC in preparation of the coming race war, zombie apocalypse, government takeover, etc. etc. Most of all bring in your "south's gonna rise again" rebel flag before you go to bed, you know how them others in the trailer park have been eye balling it HA HA HA.

You summed it nicely, in today's political environment it is embarrassing to be democrat or republican however, currently we have no viable third party option due to the money machines funding the red and blue. As long as people continue voting along party lines, then nothing will change and it will be politics as usual. Unfortunately, this brainwashing of the American political landscape will continue to lead us on a steady decline as the worlds super power.

info on policy wrote:

http://news.yahoo.com/tax-man- cometh-police-health-care-1157 36849--finance.html
Now how is this going to help things? Look at all the money that will be spent to start it. If your income is under approx $28,000 you will pay $695 per adult per year not to have insurance and then there will still be the medical bills. We still don't know how much insurance will be per month if you buy it but I bet it won't be cheap. But we do know as far as medicaid goes adults don't qualify if they make over 4,800 per year gross if they are working. They will be requiring proof on your tax return. There is another problem.
I forsee more people quitting work and going on government assistance because they won't get a tax return anymore and can't afford the penalty. I also see even more tax fraud coming to make your fee less on the tax return and even more people that simply won't file one. This still doesn't take care of the ones that don't work or work under the table and still don't have insurance. It also does not address children's insurance.

The most info on the policy we have heard yet. That is probably more than congress knows.

An Obama classmate speaks out
Yes, Wayne Allyn Root's statement below has been "Correctly
Attributed." The link to Snopes.com is at the end of his statement. If Obama is re-elected in 2012, the US is finished.
The following is in simple language that everyone can understand.
Not the gibberish that our government keeps telling people. Please read this carefully and make sure you keep this message going. This needs to be emailed to everyone in the USA ...
OBAMA'S COLLEGE CLASSMATE SPEAKS OUT
By Wayne Allyn Root
Barack Hussein Obama is no fool. He is not incompetent. To the contrary, he is brilliant. He knows exactly what he's doing. He is purposely overwhelming the U.S. Economy to create systemic failure, economic crisis and social chaos - thereby destroying capitalism and our country from within.
Barack Hussein Obama was my college classmate.( Columbia University , Class of '83). He is a devout Muslim; do not be fooled. Look at his Czars.... Anti-business.anti-American. As Glenn Beck correctly predicted from day one, Barack Hussein Obama is following the plan of Cloward & Piven, two professors at Columbia University ... They outlined a plan to socialize America by overwhelming the system with government spending and entitlement demands. Add up the clues below. Taken individually they're alarming. Taken as a whole, it is a brilliant, Machiavellian game plan to turn the United States into a socialist/Marxist state with a permanent majority that desperately needs government for survival... And can be counted on to always vote for even bigger government. Why not? They have no responsibility to pay for it.

Universal health care! The health care bill had very little to do with health care. It had everything to do with unionizing millions of hospital and health care workers, as well as adding 15,000 to 20,000 new IRS agents (who will join government employee unions). Obama doesn't care that giving free health care to 30 million Americans will add trillions to the national debt. What he does care about is that it cements the dependence of those 30 million voters to Democrats and big government. Who but a socialist revolutionary would pass this reckless spending bill in the middle of a depression?
Cap and trade! Like health care legislation having nothing to do with health care, cap and trade has nothing to do with global warming. It has everything to do with redistribution of income, government control of the economy and a criminal payoff to Obama's biggest contributors. Those powerful and wealthy unions and contributors (like GE, which owns NBC, MSNBC and CNBC) can then be counted on to support everything Obama wants. They will kick-back hundreds of millions of dollars in contributions to Obama and the Democratic Party to keep them in power. The bonus is that all the new taxes on Americans with bigger cars, bigger homes and businesses help Obama "spread the wealth around."
Make Puerto Rico a state. Why? Who's asking for a 51st state? Who's asking for millions of new welfare recipients and government entitlement addicts All
those public employees will vote loyally Democrat to protect their bloated salaries and pensions that are bankrupting America ...
The country goes broke, future generations face a bleak future, but Obama, the Democrat Party, government, and the unions grow more powerful. The ends justify the means. Raise taxes on small business owners, high-income earners, and job creators. Put the entire burden on only the top 20 percent of taxpayers, redistribute the income, punish success, and reward those who did nothing to deserve it (except vote for Obama). Reagan wanted to dramatically cut taxes in order to starve the government. Barack Obama wants to dramatically raise taxes to starve his political opposition. With the acts outlined above, Barack Hussein Obama and his regime have created a vast and rapidly expanding constituency of voters dependent on big government; a vast privileged class of public employees who work for big government; and a government dedicated to destroying capitalism and installing themselves as socialist rulers by overwhelming the system. Add it up and you've got the perfect Marxist scheme all devised by my Columbia Universitycollege classmate Barack Hussein Obama using the Cloward and Piven Plan...
http://www.snopes.com/politics/soapbox/overwh...
Last point: think about what this designed "rule of the rabble" will do to anyone successful.and everyone receiving this is.
What will your lives be like under communism? The time to fight this abomination is now.
I hope each of you will forward to at least a dozen people.

in the middle of a depression? Certainly not American taxpayers! But this has been Barack Hussein Obama's plan all along. His goal is to add two new Democrat senators, five Democrat congressmen and a million loyal Democratic voters who are dependent on big government.(This will tip the balance of those living off the government to more than those who must pay for it; and we're done for.)
Legalize 12 million illegal Mexican immigrants. Just giving these 12 million potential new citizens free health care alone could overwhelm the system and bankrupt America . But it adds 12 million reliable new Democrat voters who can be counted on to support big government. Add another few trillion dollars in welfare, aid to dependent children, food stamps, free medical, education, tax credits for the poor and eventually Social Security...(see note above re: Puerto Rico)
Stimulus and bailouts. Where did all that money go? It went to Democrat contributors, organizations (ACORN), and unions -- including billions of dollars to save or create jobs of government employees across the country. It went to save GM and Chrysler so that their employees could keep paying union dues. It went to AIG so that Goldman Sachs could be bailed out (after giving Obama almost $1 million in contributions)..A staggering $125 billion went to teachers (thereby protecting their union dues).

Why would a citizen vote for a leing POS like Obama...why??