OK Health Care Freedom Amendment, State Question 756

Created by CitizenTopix on Oct 11, 2010

1,567 votes

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RedSonja2000

Norman, OK

#19214 May 6, 2012
Packing Heat wrote:
<quoted text>
Obama's policies are Cloward & Piven in action, use all the bad policy possible to cause the economy to collapse in on itself. The Planned destruction of America starring Barack Obama the fascist dictator in charge!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloward%E2%80%93...
collapsing the economy would cause him to lose the election next fall. Why would he do that? Even you seem to realize that if gas prices or unemployment are high he is damaged. You need to get your story straight.

“Whatcha gonna do?”

Since: Apr 12

Tulsa

#19216 May 6, 2012
I wonder why dems always resist the label of Marxist, Leninist, Maoist, etc.. when it's very easy to read the platform of the politi-ocracies(my word) and see the template for what they stand for.
Redsonja2000 seems to accept it from a stand point of balance. It's true, we have welfare which is a socialist platform, I believe, from FDR's Great Society. That was not true to the intentions of our founding fathers, even though dems will reference 'common welfare.' Contextually, a nanny state was not intended. We have grown from a hand up to an expected hand out. It is institutional wards of the state mentality. I'm sure everyone sees how much money(tax) it would take to support that. I say it is unsupportable unless citizens are taxed like in England. You sacrifice the life you want to live to support the community at large.
If that sounds okay to you, then you are Marxist. Read what his philosophy says before you disagree oout of hand.
I couldn't care less how many countries are socialist. I only care that Americans are free and have the guaranteed liberty to go for the life they wish to live. No other country is as free as ours.
I would like all people who embrace socialism to move to Canada. It is so beautiful there. Live as a socialist there, not here. Let Americans be free.
Obamacare is a major step to creating a socialist society in America. It is one step MOST of us wanted dead to begin with.
RedSonja2000

Norman, OK

#19217 May 6, 2012
Packing Heat wrote:
To hear Democrats (and much of the media) tell it, President Barack Obama is a man on the rebound.
There is a big problem with this Pollyanna punditry: There are a bunch of real-time numbers coming in that tell a much different tale.
In short, thereís a new Congressional Budget Office report that shows unemployment likely to climb to nearly 9 percent by the election,....
you forgot to include a link.

here's a link for you:
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/state...
RedSonja2000

Norman, OK

#19218 May 6, 2012
Cocked Hat wrote:
DEMOCRATS will blame the deficit on Bush or anyone except Obama. You already know the talking points. Unemployment numbers are Bush's fault too. Funny thing, everyone here was prospering when Bush was in office and the day Obama was elected, the economy started failing.
the stock market crashed 6 months before Obama took office. For a year before Obama took office, millions of homes were being foreclosed every month. Did Obama have a time machine so he could make it happen?

Bush cut taxes to the bone and then started two wars. It bankrupted us. Live with it.

“Whatcha gonna do?”

Since: Apr 12

Tulsa

#19219 May 6, 2012
Yes, the housing sham screwed us. Barney Frank ring any bells? Democrats were the cause of that failure.
Bush STARTED 2 wars? You don't think it was started by the people overseas? The cost of those wars has been staggering. Bush didn't start them, he stood up to protect this nation like Clinton should have done. Clinton cited the same intel about WMDs in Iraq that Bush referenced. Bush didn't fabricate. He acted on the same intel Clinton referenced in a speach an couple of years before.

“Whatcha gonna do?”

Since: Apr 12

Tulsa

#19220 May 6, 2012
Speculators and ponzi schemers screwed the stock market. Many products were separated into extremely risky dirivatives. The stock market is nothing more than legalized gambling. Greed runs our fuel prices up more than anything else thrugh speculators.
But, business was confident when Bush was in office, so the economy grew.
Obama doesn't inspire confidence, or security, or anything that would build the economy. Look around. Common sense shows how badly he has effected our economy.
RedSonja2000

Norman, OK

#19221 May 6, 2012
Cocked Hat wrote:
I wonder why dems always resist the label of Marxist, Leninist, Maoist, etc.. when it's very easy to read the platform of the politi-ocracies(my word) and see the template for what they stand for.
socialism isn't marxism. I'm a democratic socialist as most Europeans are and that actually is the system we have here in the US. You can't run a modern society without it. All the countries who don't have a good balance of free enterprise and socialism are hell holes. Third world goat farms and failed states or dictatorships (sometimes called "kingdoms" so they don't sound so bad).
Cocked Hat wrote:
I couldn't care less how many countries are socialist. I only care that Americans are free and have the guaranteed liberty to go for the life they wish to live. No other country is as free as ours.
actually, Denmark is far freer. They have the most liberal laws and least restrictions on personal freedom. They also have MUCH greater social mobility than we do. If you want to live the American dream you should move to Copenhagen.
Cocked Hat wrote:
I would like all people who embrace socialism to move to Canada. It is so beautiful there. Live as a socialist there, not here. Let Americans be free.
Obamacare is a major step to creating a socialist society in America. It is one step MOST of us wanted dead to begin with.
Canada is a free country. Like Denmark, their laws are more liberal than ours (they don't bother with as big a drug "war"), and like Denmark have far fewer restrictions on their personal freedom. Their unemployment rate is lower than ours and their gdp growth rate is higher (theirs is 2.2% and ours is 1.5%). AND everyone has access to health care.(I get my figures from the CIA World Factbook. Argue with the CIA. I want to see you try.)

Obama has made NO steps to making us a more socialist society. "Obamacare" is not socialism. It's private insurance, with some people getting help with the premiums. It is the most expensive and least efficient way to get health care, but it does line the pockets of mega-corporations, so it's all good...right? Problem is, it leaves us paying TWICE what the British pay and it still doesn't cover everybody. We need EVERYBODY on Medicare and those of us with the means pay our insurance premiums as part of our tax bill.
Packing Heat

United States

#19222 May 6, 2012
RedSonja2000 wrote:
<quoted text>
you forgot to include a link.
here's a link for you:
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/state...
Here is a better one for you. The story came from here:
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0212/723...
RedSonja2000

Norman, OK

#19223 May 6, 2012
Packing Heat wrote:
In fact, it is a concerted effort on the part of the Democrats to hide the economy from peopleís attention. Like the Great Oz, the Democrats prefer no one pay attention to the economic disaster behind the curtains.
in that case, why does Obama talk about the economy all the time? It's the Rethugs who are trying to distract people with abortion, birth control and gay marriage.
Packing Heat wrote:
When the purchasing power of a dollar declines and unemployment is over eight percent, voters fire the incumbent. I strongly suspect they will fire Obama's ass too.
you guys would LOVE to see some inflation but there is none. Sorry. It's part of Ron Paul's favorite nightmare scenario except that it just keeps not happening.

You are right that they usually do fire the incumbent when times are bad but this time .... well, you guys ran a bunch of joke candidates and that hurt you. Now you are left with a Mormon in an empty suit who you don't trust as far as you can throw him. As far as your constituency is concerned he's a phony aristocrat liberal who belongs to a non-Christian cult. Yeah, your guys are going to turn out in droves to vote for HIM!
RedSonja2000

Norman, OK

#19224 May 6, 2012
Cocked Hat wrote:
Yes, the housing sham screwed us. Barney Frank ring any bells? Democrats were the cause of that failure.
Bush STARTED 2 wars? You don't think it was started by the people overseas? The cost of those wars has been staggering. Bush didn't start them, he stood up to protect this nation like Clinton should have done. Clinton cited the same intel about WMDs in Iraq that Bush referenced. Bush didn't fabricate. He acted on the same intel Clinton referenced in a speach an couple of years before.
Bush started them. Iraq was a monumentally expensive failure and so is Afghanistan. In every instance in the past there has been a war tax to pay for military operations. Not this time. Bush didn't ask for money for those wars, he kept them off the books so it would look like they were FREE! NO CHARGE! Instead of enacting a war tax he cut existing taxes and borrowed every dime he spent on those invasions.

Bush bankrupted us. I'm sure Obama and Clinton talked him into it and it's really all their fault. Boo-hoo.

“Whatcha gonna do?”

Since: Apr 12

Tulsa

#19225 May 6, 2012
I don't live in Denmark or Canada. Our freedoms are lost as each liberal politician is elected. Obamacare is socialist. How can you say it isn't? It is disengenuous to say it's not. When everyone is forced to pay for something that 2/3s of the populace said no to, you have begun to see the rule of the king. We are a representative democracy, not a dictatorship. You put everyone on forced healthcare, then follow that with the next subjecting scheme like hyperinflation or gun control, and viola, the citizens no longer have the power to resist.
Look at pre WWII Germany's policys under Hitler. They were great sociaist programs for a while.

“Whatcha gonna do?”

Since: Apr 12

Tulsa

#19226 May 6, 2012
I agree with you about Romney. He won't win.

“Whatcha gonna do?”

Since: Apr 12

Tulsa

#19227 May 6, 2012
Wow, you're retarded. Bush didn't start any wars. He engaged a war that was started years before. Denial is a wonderful way to argue a point.

The war tax...yeah, maybe you're right. But Bush didn't bankrupt us. I agree, he spent way too much on horse crap programs. I think he sgned everything that crossed his desk. However, you and I both know how much money is generated during wartime through contracts and hiring. It was a boon to our economy in many ways. People were spending, further fueling the economy. Businesses haven't been hiring well for a couple of years. They don't trust Obama or his policies so they probably won't be hiring for a while. People aren't spending because the economy is so shaky. No one wants to spend then lose a job they can't replace. I saw a report last week about how people are going years without a job.
Justaminute

Edmond, OK

#19228 May 6, 2012
Cocked Hat wrote:
Wow, you're retarded. Bush didn't start any wars. He engaged a war that was started years before. Denial is a wonderful way to argue a point.
The war tax...yeah, maybe you're right. But Bush didn't bankrupt us. I agree, he spent way too much on horse crap programs. I think he sgned everything that crossed his desk. However, you and I both know how much money is generated during wartime through contracts and hiring. It was a boon to our economy in many ways. People were spending, further fueling the economy. Businesses haven't been hiring well for a couple of years. They don't trust Obama or his policies so they probably won't be hiring for a while. People aren't spending because the economy is so shaky. No one wants to spend then lose a job they can't replace. I saw a report last week about how people are going years without a job.
Just like Buffet says, a good businessman does business in any environment.

I don't see to many of the big business suffering. In fact many are reporting record profits. And those profits were realized in many cases moving jobs overseas, or taking it off the back of their workers. Salaries for workers have declined while profit margins have increased.

The Republican prescription for an economy they destroyed was austerity. Looking at the rest of the countries that followed the course of debt reduction in a depression, it wasn't the way to go, since it resulted in greater job loss, a larger deficit and the job loss of the leaders that swallowed the whole deficit talk.

And no matter how you want to argue it, the economy started sliding with the Bush tax cuts. And the unfunded wars, no matter who started them or why.

And we are far from bankrupt.

1.Federal Reserve and Intragovernmental Holdings
U.S. debt holdings:$6.328 trillion

Thatís right, the biggest single holder of U.S. government debt is inside the United States and includes the Federal Reserve system and other intergovernmental holdings.

2. China U.S. debt holdings:$1.132 trillion

The largest foreign holder of U.S. Treasury securities, China currently has $1.132 trillion in American debt, although it is down from all time highs of $1.173 trillion in July 2011.

3. Investors/Savings Bonds U.S. debt holdings $1.107 trillion

With the most recent numbers from June 2011, this extremely diverse group includes individuals, government-sponsored enterprises, brokers and dealers, bank personal trusts, estates, savings bonds, corporate and noncorporate businesses for a total of $1.107 trillion."

That's right, most of our debt is owned by us!

And most of our trading partners, which are Europeans whose economy followed the austerity prescription, are in the toilet too. And that had nothing to do with Obama.

And if you knew anything about Economics, you would know the prescription for it is Keynesian. Which would be MORE stimulus. It's not like we don't need to upgrade our infrastructure and build a new electrical grid. The only thing stopping our economy from improving is a party bent on making the Prez a one term President this means everything:

"When Hating Obama trumps love of country" all else is futile."
Justaminute

Edmond, OK

#19229 May 6, 2012
Cocked Hat wrote:
Wow, you're retarded. Bush didn't start any wars. He engaged a war that was started years before. Denial is a wonderful way to argue a point.
The war tax...yeah, maybe you're right. But Bush didn't bankrupt us. I agree, he spent way too much on horse crap programs. I think he sgned everything that crossed his desk. However, you and I both know how much money is generated during wartime through contracts and hiring. It was a boon to our economy in many ways. People were spending, further fueling the economy. Businesses haven't been hiring well for a couple of years. They don't trust Obama or his policies so they probably won't be hiring for a while. People aren't spending because the economy is so shaky. No one wants to spend then lose a job they can't replace. I saw a report last week about how people are going years without a job.
Well, the first Iraq war was started by Bush the elder. At least he was smarter than his son and didn't invade. But only barely. Bush the Younger, was the one who thought he would show daddy a thing or two, lied us into it. Neither one of these wars were because Iraq was a threat to the US. Just like the rest of the Middle East, we are only there for oil.

And as you stated:

"However, you and I both know how much money is generated during wartime through contracts and hiring. It was a boon to our economy in many ways. People were spending, further fueling the economy."

So basically you are saying that the government spent money on the war and the country prospered. By jove, you perfectly described the Keynesian plan.

In times of depression and the economy is stalled, the only one with the ability to move it out of depression is the government.

We need a new and larger stimulus. The last one was to heavy with tax cuts but that was the only way for it to get pass the Republicans and the Blue Dog (conservative dems.)
Justaminute

Edmond, OK

#19230 May 6, 2012
Cocked Hat, or one of the Hat twins.

You've stated again:

"...wonder why dems always resist the label of Marxist, Leninist, Maoist, etc.. when it's very easy to read the platform of the politi-ocracies(my word) and see the template for what they stand for.d"

Would you please reference what Democratic policies follow the path of Lenin, Mao, Lenin with link please.

No more opinions please. We need facts. And as it was stated before it is not common knowledge. So please, share your knowledge with accredited facts. We'll wait again.

Because I'm really concerned that the whole Lenin, Mao and etc. has turned into a kind of Tourettes syndrome with the constant repetition of it, with nothing to show for you constant invocation of them.
TAMARA

Edmond, OK

#19231 May 7, 2012
Have you all forgotten about the Housing market leadding the way to the down fall of the economy?

Those stupid little loans called Variable Loand that the people took out and was buying homes well beyond their means. Then when interest rates kept going up so did their payments and these people could not meet their payments. They stopped paying all together. Economy starts to fall apart and people start loosing jobs. So other than the variable loans people that took out regular home loans were not able to pay either.

This was done under Bush and a Democrat House.
Packing Heat

United States

#19232 May 7, 2012
"When hating the will of the majority trumps love of Obama's Socialist Style Country and Ideology, all else is futile."

Packing Heat - 2012
Tamara

Edmond, OK

#19233 May 7, 2012
RedSonja2000 wrote:
<quoted text>
How do you know they don't have medical degrees? Who is on the panel?
The rest is still bullshit on stilts. Insurance companies have been doing that kind of thing for decades with nary a peep from people like you. They can get away with it because it all happens behind closed doors.
That's not true of government entities. Everything they do is right out in the open. Our culture and society would never put up with what you describe even if there was anybody who wanted to do it that way.
Right now we have doctors and people with a financial interest in running tests and administering "cures" to people who can't be cured and can be harmed by the tests. It is not done for the benefit of the patient. It's done for the benefit of the hospital, the doctor, the clinic. They are harming people and gouging money from the government.
The ACA has dozens of layers of protection to make sure that people who need treatment and would benefit from treatment will get it. That was the whole point of the law in the first place.
About all the bad testing and cures being given to people who can't be cured how would you know this exactly? Do you work for a doctor, hospital, or clinic? Or are you a doctor, nurse and work in one of these places? I don't believe any of them apply to you. So would this be you opinion? You say that are culture or society would not let things be done behind close doors or have ab Ethics Panel. But you said that are culture and society was allowing clinics, hospitals and doctors to do test to harm people and treating people that cannot be cured. It sounds like you are doing alot of double talking here. We know how very much you want government health care and have the government take care of all your needs. We also know that you think Pres. Obama can do no wrong. Oh by the way do you have a creditable link for all this info?
Tamara

Edmond, OK

#19234 May 7, 2012
RedSonja2000 wrote:
<quoted text>
that is funny. I just happened to run across the bookmark and thought I'd check in. And there were all were wondering where I was.:-)
Actually I really don't believe anyone really cared where you went. I know I sure didn't. I think when someone said something about where you might have gone they were just hoping!

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