Blaming Israel for carnage

Hello From America wrote:

<quoted text>*** Please excuse me I had to edit your post to fit in all the junk I was writting.*** Your time in the IDF maybe the biggest personal challenge you have faced so there is nothing wrong with being scared .
I went through this for my training in the Fire Department.
The important thing is not to look at the big picture it is to large and complicated for any one person.
You will find comfort in the way you act as an individual as you show class on here you will show it in your service.
Follow orders but there are always small nuances that will make a difference.
Maintain your feelings of friendship and even strengthen them with your friends , Arab or Jew .
The day will come and you may not notice it at the time but you will have the opportunity to see first hand what is right and wrong and if you see something that you feel is wrong given time you may find yourself in a position to do a small deed that will make it better.
Most of the time we crawl before we walk and in time you will find yourself to be the person you want to be as long as you are not to hard on yourself.
Remember when in the IDF you serve your country . Leaders come and go.
You are a class act.
You will also have to get use to the fact that when you put on a uniform some will not see you but just the uniform.
I have had to tell myself it is always darkest just before dawn so many times I should have it as a tattoo.
You are a class act.
Have confidence in yourself and you will be surprised at what one person can achieve.
I live in Naples Florida but you will almost always see another city , just a limitation of technology.
The six day war and the Yom Kipper war were not that long ago when you think about history so a lot of people on both sides are polarized.
I still have strong feelings about Arab countries being client states of the Soviet Union.
Time heals all wounds , the trouble is we don't always have the luxury of time.

thank you for your understandment, means a lot.sorry for not responding earlier, but i had to wait for Yetziat Shabat. i hope that my IDF service will go well. while going there ill feel that im giving something from myself for Israel, a country that gave me so much. there are expactations for war, and we all know that, but i have strong hopes that things will get better. i believe that the IDF service is very importent.make me feel more Zionist.
i wish that when the time passes people will start looking at the Jews with different eye. nore friendly eye, if to be exact. i wish that we could be better people, so we can really show we deserve the respect that we dement. light of the goyim. i believe in us.
AM ISRAEL HAI

Hello From America wrote:

<quoted text>
I don't belive in god.
If you want to hate "the Jews" thats your bag.
I don't fight raceism either.
Instead of you trying to tell me what I am you could have proven me wrong by telling me all the good things your Islamic "brothers" have contributed to the modern world.

beliving in god is a very personal thing. i, personally grew in a very believing sorounding, although i, myself, am not a religios person. i dont think it make us better or less better people. although i think that fighting racism is a very noble thing to do. but maybe thats only me.
considering the fact that the muslems and the jews came from the Semite race, Shem, son of Noah, who was blessed by god, were supposed to be "brothers" to each other. but well...we all know how the reality is. i believe that the hate between us and the muslems in some point like siblings fight. it will have to be over soon. wuestion is when? and what price we will have to pay?

Sorcerer wrote:

<quoted text>
Actually I know quite a lot about Jewish migrations round the world and those that are converts not original. Especially a lot of the "speculation" re lost tribes. But I also know a lot about the atrocities on man by man through history as well.
In factI also know a great deal of the actions of us suposedly intelligent species on all other of Gods creatures on this planent.
If humans ceased to exist we would be "sorely missed" there would be nothing trying to destroy everything on this "beautiful planet" anymore it would return to being a true "Garden of Eden" not the "human slum" that it is. Then I would not have my other name on other "forums" ......."concience of Noah"

I do not understand your obsession with convert Jews.Your family is in a sens a convert to Christianity and many semite are convert to Islam it is not relevent at all to the birth of Israel.Convert were always in Judisem and many in the Bible itself so why are you mignifing it ? Israel is for all Jews.There is no diference for Jews between a convert Jews or not and if you want to refer to the bible it was a home for convert Jews also. Who know even may be Lipush is convert does it make her less jew if she is a convert? I know you want the UN decree but what you want for the Palestinian you should want for all the Jews that were kicked out of the Arab lands and put them back in the home of the current Muslims that took their place. Then I'll agree with you but you want justice for Palestinian and what about the Arab Jews?No justice for them? they were suposedly the citezen of Egypt ,Syria Yemen, Iraq Lebanon and more...ho I forgot Saudi Arebia. will jews be able to claim their lands in Saudi Arabia?Do you know that Jews own the best part of Baghdad will they get it back.You dream justice for the Palestinian but you do not dream justice for the Jews many Arab Jews have memories of their homes in Arab lands, and like the Palestinian they also passed their memories of pain and happiness to their children.Israel is not the answer for all the Jews that lost their homes many of them not by choice are in England USA Canada Australia France and many other countries and I'm not talking about the EE Jews.Are you willing to give them back the land and homes that they lost in Arab countries and had to start from scratch completely from scratch.60 years ago their home was in the ME.All that happened because Arabs did not want majority of Jews in the ME and they are the first that started with TERROR 1920 before that it was Jews and Muslims setteling in Israel but Muslims did not want JEWS I think it is "RACISEM" by the MUSLIMS.

Tina from USA wrote:

<quoted text>I do not understand your obsession with convert Jews.Your family is in a sens a convert to Christianity and many semite are convert to Islam it is not relevent at all to the birth of Israel.Convert were always in Judisem and many in the Bible itself so why are you mignifing it ? Israel is for all Jews.There is no diference for Jews between a convert Jews or not and if you want to refer to the bible it was a home for convert Jews also. Who know even may be Lipush is convert does it make her less jew if she is a convert? I know you want the UN decree but what you want for the Palestinian you should want for all the Jews that were kicked out of the Arab lands and put them back in the home of the current Muslims that took their place. Then I'll agree with you but you want justice for Palestinian and what about the Arab Jews?No justice for them? they were suposedly the citezen of Egypt ,Syria Yemen, Iraq Lebanon and more...ho I forgot Saudi Arebia. will jews be able to claim their lands in Saudi Arabia?Do you know that Jews own the best part of Baghdad will they get it back.You dream justice for the Palestinian but you do not dream justice for the Jews many Arab Jews have memories of their homes in Arab lands, and like the Palestinian they also passed their memories of pain and happiness to their children.Israel is not the answer for all the Jews that lost their homes many of them not by choice are in England USA Canada Australia France and many other countries and I'm not talking about the EE Jews.Are you willing to give them back the land and homes that they lost in Arab countries and had to start from scratch completely from scratch.60 years ago their home was in the ME.All that happened because Arabs did not want majority of Jews in the ME and they are the first that started with TERROR 1920 before that it was Jews and Muslims setteling in Israel but Muslims did not want JEWS I think it is "RACISEM" by the MUSLIMS.

Not obsessed but holding the ZE from EEurope that were primarily convert responsible for most of Israels ills (in parallel thoyugh I hold the UN responsible for lack of control in 46/47). I will always feel that way from looking and comparing many web sites from all points of view. By that I mean pro Jew Pro Arab and apparently neutral.
Personally mush as I support the "safe haven" Israel that was the reason the UN set up Israel while the ZE attitude exists then I do not think there will ever be the peace either of us would like to see.
For me the biggest "mistake of all was the ZE "The Greater Israel" wish instad of contentmnt that the Jews finally had a "haven".
I do know that while the likes of the ZE, Khaybar and the twit on the link Oriana gave at "Human right" the Jews have a "house to put in order".
You now know my other activities re other creatures as put in post to Khaybar, I tell you honestly if my contact knowledge of Jews were limited to the three examples then were I to have the choice of saving 10 Jew or one Panda, the Panda would come first every time. Fortunately I know most Jews are "sane" and not like them.
I still cannot make up my mind what Khaybar is, we knoww by his statement he is Athiest, we know by his statement that he is at least 1400 years of trace Israelite .......... but . I see in his hatred something else.... I often ask if really he is actually a " Full Orthodox" and really doing it to turn supporter of the Zionist Jews preseence in Israel against them. If Stan came on I was going to ask what he thought as he seems to be able to "differentiate extremely well" and also says he has "many Jewish friends".
Any way I an now off for a while have to fix kitchen as "the lirttle lady here" managed to set oven on fire so have to sort out.
Peace to you ... Lipush .....Otter .........and Awead keep your sane discussions going

Remember KHAYBAR wrote:

P.S. Your mistake was touching the race issue. Before i showed-up on this forum, You probably never heard of the Mesopotamian-Jews, their Ancient-history and their plight. You probably thought all Jews came from Europe. To this day my mother speaks at home only Aramaic mixed with Arabic.
A little secret i would like to share with you. Before i came to this forum and witnessed all the Jew-hate, i personally couldn't stand Ashkenazim (E.Euro-Jews) But now i understand our internal (Jewish) divisions are our worst enemy's. I went so far as to write a thread on the "Israel-Forum" and on the "Judaism-Forum" (in Topix.net ) called: "The Jewish community within KHAZARIA"
After much study's. Aside from that i'll have you Know that Islam will be the End of all Ancient-Peoples, including Awad's Christian minority in Lebanon. Not neceserilly by flesh-death but mostly cultural-death.

Please copy and paste the site about Khazaria it will make it easy to find and read.Many use the argument of convert Jews to make Israel as unlitigement as a Jewish country and that is bogos because convert existed since Bible time and convert Jews from where ever they come become part of Israel. That argument is a racist argument in my opinion.Ruth from the Bible is a convert and many as well.Rabi Akiva is a convert.It is irrelevent to Israel Jew is a Jew a convert just have to study extra hard.Rabi hillel said it is OK to teach the Tora standing on one leg to a convert.On the other hand Bit Shamai did not agree he want to teach extra hard but the fact remain both agree to convert.If it is in Khazaria or in Bagdad, Or in NYC.

Remember KHAYBAR wrote:

<quoted text>I'm sure when he says Arabs, He means Muslim-Arabs. Your enemy's too, in Lebanon. In 15 years there will be no Christians in Lebanon, and those that stayed will be under their cruel rule and would try to seek refuge in Israel, where the Christian and Druze Arabs are KINGS !!!

I certainly hope it will not come to that. Looking back when Rafik Hariri, it was the first time that Lebanon of all religions came together for a common cause.

Throughout the war years, Rafiq El Hariri spent a considerable portion of his personal wealth assisting his less fortunate countrymen. He began by building schools and hospitals in his native Sidon and setting up foundations to educate young Lebanese. At his personal expense, over thirty thousand students were given full scholarships for undergraduate and graduate studies in universities all around the world. One thousand of Hariri’s kids went on to earn doctorates.

By 1990, Rafiq El Hariri had become a Lebanese legend. His construction business in Saudi Arabia had become an international consortium. His charitable work had made him a popular national hero in his native land. He leveraged his considerable influence, international connections and charisma to help hammer out the Taif agreement which ended the Lebanese civil war.

Once the hostilities were over, Rafiq El Hariri went home to pitch in and rebuild Beirut. Unlike Europe after the war, Lebanon did not have the luxury of a Marshall Plan to assist in reconstruction. In fact, the United States placed punitive sanctions on the country and continued to finance the Israeli occupation of the south.

Even so, American sanctions did nothing to slow down the Lebanese renaissance. Rafiq El Hariri staked his own personal fortune on Beirut. And the city rose from the ashes like a Phoenix. It didn’t take long for foreign and Arab investors to scramble back to Beirut to get a piece of the pie.

But the people of Beirut did not go out to mourn Rafiq because he was a philanthropist or a visionary real estate developer. El Hariri’s real gift to the Lebanese was that he restored their self-confidence and sold them a futuristic secular democratic vision where Sunnis, Maronites, Greek Orthodox, Shia, Druze and Armenians could abide and prosper together in a united Lebanon.

He was Muslim. That is why I only judge people on their character.

Hello From America wrote:

<quoted text>
I don't belive in god.
If you want to hate "the Jews" thats your bag.
I don't fight raceism either.
Instead of you trying to tell me what I am you could have proven me wrong by telling me all the good things your Islamic "brothers" have contributed to the modern world.

The post above about Rafiq Hariri I guess could also be directed to you also. By the way I am not Muslim.

Hello From America wrote:

<quoted text>
I don't belive in god.
If you want to hate "the Jews" thats your bag.
I don't fight raceism either.
Instead of you trying to tell me what I am you could have proven me wrong by telling me all the good things your Islamic "brothers" have contributed to the modern world.

I have never said I hated Jews, in fact my best friend is Jewish and have Jewish and Muslim friends. The non ZE Jews are the most kindest and loving people. And the non ME's are the most friendly and inviting people you will meet.

In fact I respect and admire Otter, Lipush, and Tina and would have no issues building a friendship between them, even thou there are some disagrements between us. So why the friendship if there is disagreements? Because they respect a person by their character and not by race or religion. They do not "group" people.

Hello From America wrote:

"Hello From America wrote:
<quoted text>I think this more then anything pisses the Arabs off.
Look at all the Arabs and look at all the money they have and what do they contribute to modern society , NOTHING.
The sad thing is that some Jews like yourself fight against racisim towards the Jews and yet the same racisim you fight is in you.
This is the post that you sent tom me , if it is buy mistake I understand.
You say you are not an Islamic , I cannot dispute that as we do not know each other. Your post seem to be very one sided against the west are you Arab dissent ?
You do treat our friend Lipush well and because she is 18 and starting out in the world your gentlemanly treatment of her is commendable.

Yes to be precise, I am Lebanese Christian. If you have followed my posts, you will see I am also against ME's (Muslim Extremists). Also you will see with my posts that I would be the last to support Palistinians based on what the contribution they have done to my country by partly causing war. However, it is not ALL Palistinians that are to blame. Just the few ME's. What I am against is Israel's land Policies and the states that continue to support, and only country, to keep Vetoing U.N reselutions. Israel, with the support of the States, continue to break internantional law by continuing to migrate illegal Jewish settlers on the occupational land. It is not only I that is against it but ALL of the U.N nations excluding U.S.A, Israel Human rights, and international human rights.

Just like any other race/religion, there is good and bad in all, you seem very intellectual, that is why I am confused on how you "group" people to all be bad.

correction:

Part of my last post was written:

"It is not only I that is against it but ALL of the U.N nations excluding U.S.A, Israel Human rights, and international human rights."

Should be:

It is not only I that is against it but ALL of the U.N nations, Israel Human rights, and international human rights. Excluding U.S.A.

Sorry.

Hello From America wrote:

<quoted text>....
take the politicians out of the world and we find ourselves with more alike then separate....

I agree with you on that.

Hello From America wrote:

<quoted text>If I may so bold as to give you one final thought on training , at some point because you are being challenged as well as challenging yourself you may find a point where you feel you cannot go one.
If this happens take a look around you and remind yourself that the people around you went though the same training and made it and they are no better then you.
Train hard but remember to eat well and stay hydrated.
I am very confident you will do well , some set backs are all part of personal growth.

thanks for that:)

if you dont mind, i want to adress your hearts in the next sentences.
Jews all over the world will celebrate tomorrow the Seder of Passover. all isarels will unite with their families to celebrate our freedom.
However, there are three people that will not celebrate with us, becuase they are captured by the fanatic muslem enemy. i, asking you all, especially jews but also christians and muslems with heart to pray for our three heroes-
Gilad Shalit..
Ehud Goldvaser..
Eldad Regev..
and RON ARAD.
soldiers who protected israel and pay the price of freedom. the jewish agency publihed different prayers for the soldiers return.fight with us.
Dont let the apathy KILL THEM.

Sorcerer wrote:

<quoted text>
Not obsessed but holding the ZE from EEurope that were primarily convert responsible for most of Israels ills (in parallel thoyugh I hold the UN responsible for lack of control in 46/47). I will always feel that way from looking and comparing many web sites from all points of view. By that I mean pro Jew Pro Arab and apparently neutral.
Personally mush as I support the "safe haven" Israel that was the reason the UN set up Israel while the ZE attitude exists then I do not think there will ever be the peace either of us would like to see.
For me the biggest "mistake of all was the ZE "The Greater Israel" wish instad of contentmnt that the Jews finally had a "haven".
I do know that while the likes of the ZE, Khaybar and the twit on the link Oriana gave at "Human right" the Jews have a "house to put in order".
You now know my other activities re other creatures as put in post to Khaybar, I tell you honestly if my contact knowledge of Jews were limited to the three examples then were I to have the choice of saving 10 Jew or one Panda, the Panda would come first every time. Fortunately I know most Jews are "sane" and not like them.
I still cannot make up my mind what Khaybar is, we knoww by his statement he is Athiest, we know by his statement that he is at least 1400 years of trace Israelite .......... but . I see in his hatred something else.... I often ask if really he is actually a " Full Orthodox" and really doing it to turn supporter of the Zionist Jews preseence in Israel against them. If Stan came on I was going to ask what he thought as he seems to be able to "differentiate extremely well" and also says he has "many Jewish friends".
Any way I an now off for a while have to fix kitchen as "the lirttle lady here" managed to set oven on fire so have to sort out.
Peace to you ... Lipush .....Otter .........and Awead keep your sane discussions going

I Understand that you do not hate Jews BUT EE just came to live in Israel they were not extrimist when they came the Muslim Arabs started to be the Extrimist with them because they did not want Jewish Majority and that is racist.By EE jews coming to live in Israel I do not see any wrong in that it was no one country at the time so why it is OK for Arabs to migret there and not for EE Jews.The begining of the terror started by MUSLIMS in order to scare them and not by JEWS.

F#@k all the Jews!!!!!

i will probebly won't be here all day, and if i will, it will be from my uncles house, where the family is doing the Seder. to all of which celebrate Passover today, have a mice seder with your families. bless you all.

Tina from USA wrote:

<quoted text>I .

Hi Tina
Just a quick look on.
What have they done to Topix none of the refs re posts came up and I do not like this new form.
Did see your wishes thanks but with Son continue not to be good news.

Been quite some battles going on on here I see.
I will just comment on two things
Seems Sorcerer is as much holding those from east europe responsible a I do. I can only presume it is because he has researched and found the way the Extreme element treated the other Jews as I already knew. It is also true that these extremists were already active in especially Russia before they went to Palestine. You refer to events later in Palestine, but it was those Extremist from east europe that really triggered the troubles. Most ordinary Arabs were very protective of the Ordinary Jews when the Arab backlash to the ZE activities started.
Mosha and I often talked on this and it was his belief two.
The second point is that Sorcerer's comment abouty the Danish Jews brought back a conversation I had with Mosha once on them.
I think it raises a very interesting point of why perhaps Jews are so often "in trouble" in other countries.
I asked himwhy he thought a whole nation had een so protective his answer was very "enlightening" It went along these lines:-
In many countries small areas of the Jews integrated into the local community, while keeping their customs and faith, while others would form effectively "ghettos" and this seems to be why the difference. Those that integrate are "normally accepted" and treated as equal, Denmark was unusual as throughout the country they integrated everywhere.
I thought now about that and really for the first time I see the significance of what he said.
He is effectively saying in Denmark the Jews integrated as did those of all other groups just as happens when new arriving groups come to UK ....first there is the isolation groups but then they adapt and integrate. I thought of those two stages re the Wst Indian mass arrivals and the Greek /Turkish Cypriot arrivals in UK and in fact se the parallel. It makes a lot of sense and even more so when I also remembered my Persian friend had said similar re the remaining Jews in Iran. His words were they are accepted because they work with their neibours for mutual benefit.

Finally another point you really are correct at Soercerer and I seeming like "twins" as I also am active in protection of species though whales dolphins and gorilla my main area. but it means I take interest in "nature programs".
While away I have been watching a series on the meerkat studies by cambridge university. It has convinced me that the ME conflicts as conflicts in many other areas really are more the resultof "human overpopulation" than any other reason. Basically there are several "colonies" in a desert valley and the contraints mean a limited food supply and one colony can only expand its area by robbing the adjacent colony of some of its area,(sound a familiar scene so far).. so what happens well the stronger expansionist colony when its the breeding season raids the other colony killing off every youngster it can... they commit effectively genocide. Obviously eventually they capture the area of the other colony. I was aware of different species attacking another speciesbut never the same species as is the case here.
Guess evolution still got a long way to go before we humans know what "living in peace" really is. Guess it also why we ignore so much of "mans inhumanity to man"......... Darfur ect with basic in activity "unless there something in it for us" .......... LIKE OIL. But also why things like the US caused events currently taking my Son from me do not get the condemnation they should.

Nick wrote:

F#@k all the Jews!!!!!

GO PLAY WITH A HUNGRY PACK OF "DINGO'S" AT AYERS ROCK AND GET YOUR JUST REWARD. "D(n)ick.head"

lipush wrote:

<quoted text>

:)

Not sure when willbe on again .. but think it nearly time for your compulsory service.
Tak care be safe it been real nice to post you as a "sane Jew" ..remember your "Arab" friendships because in you and them is a new generation that may "work out the key" to the mess there.
Obviously protect yourself while on "duty" but remember those friends as you decide how to act in forthcoming events " God be with you Always"

Hello From America wrote:

I ment to say I wish you well with life and your IDF service.

Thank you. take care