Workshop to hear public on St. Cloud downtown makeover

Mach II wrote:

One has to wonder if the Mayor and the council members have been listening to the people of St. Cloud (myself included).......The citizens are overtaxed as it is and we're doing beautification projects? Only projects that are a necessity should be happening......What is wrong with our elected officials..........

Sub Sonic wrote:

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In what way are the citizens of St. Cloud overtaxed? The millage rate has not increased in years, and as a matter of fact was recently lowered, despite directives of the state. That to me would seem to indicate concern on the part of the City Council and Mayor for the citizens.
The article that is a basis for this thread contains the following:
"The project is estimated at more than $3 million, which will come from Community Redevelopment Agency funds."
Even a basic knowledge of govermental budgeting would show that fund disbursement from taxes is dictated by law. Those monies that are, by statute, deposited into the CRA fund are legally bound to be used for CRA projects.
What, in your opinion, are projects that are a necessity? It would depend on what you think is necessary. Want to reduce crime? Improve your downtown business district. Want to attract more people to the area, thereby enhancing the economy? Improve your downtown business district. Want to attract business and industry to the area? Improve your downtown business district.
At least you'll be able to attend the public meeting on the issue and voice your opinion. You may want to make it a more educated opinion before you do so, though.

Mach II wrote:

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You can throw a stone from 13th to 10th street and from 10th to City Hall. Our downtown is no where near the size of Kissimmee’s; in my opinion a grand archway is really not warranted. I think most citizens of St. Cloud only want quality businesses in the city, for instance the medical facility going in Stevens Plantation. Downtown St. Cloud is all "mom & pop" businesses. Most citizens of St. Cloud do not want anymore growth than there has to be other than quality business; this will keep the keep the unwanted people out and people that live here could work here instead of driving long distances to work elsewhere. We all know there is already way too much housing. I think drainage and other projects like this should come first and foremost. Putting stone pavers in and an archway downtown isn't going to bring quality businesses there. It didn’t bring more business to Kissimmee either, at least quality business. I think the money could be spent wisely elsewhere......My taxes more than doubled in the 4 years I have been living in my current home (my other home was 3 miles from my current one), I never said anything about the millage rate, my home must be worth a small fortune, at least according to the tax appraiser.....

Sub Sonic wrote:

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Notwithstanding the fact that it is doubtful you could throw a stone three city blocks, you completely overlooked the fact that CRA funding cannot go towards drainage and other projects.
The archway is going to be funded by the Main Street organization, which is a private venture organized by business owners and has nothing to do with taxes.
I'm curious as to what your opinion of a "quality business" is. Kissimmee seemed to have had many and varied businesses, both name brand and "Mom and Pop" organizations, and a good number of them have since disappeared. However, Kissimmee's downtown area has profited a great deal from the refurbishment of a few years ago. The downtown area seems to be about the only worthwhile part of that city these days.
The money could not be spent more wisely elsewhere. To do so would be illegal.
If your taxes have more than doubled since moving into your current home, your argument is with the property appraiser, not the City of St. Cloud or any of its elected officials. More than likely what happened is that you moved at the height of the housing boom, which was about 4 years ago, and paid the first year under the previous owners tax assessment, after which the newly assessed property value was calculated based on the same millage rate. It's happened to a lot of people, for the same reason your statements are flawed: They did not take the time to educate themselves.

Mach II wrote:

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I did educate myself, don't assume I didn't. It was NOT at the "height" of the housing boom when I purchased my home it was just before it began, and it didn’t double the next year it took 4 years of continually rising over a four year period to more than double. I know very well who my fight is with and don't think I didn't call them either, I believe I stated that in my last post...The appraisers office said it's supposed to go down this year we'll see if that's true or not. Quality business is business that provides very good paying jobs for professionals....not, for example, Lowes Warehouse, low paying jobs and low income housing makes a good recipe for crime...Quality business is what St. Cloud needs, not strip centers and the like, that way people who live here can work here and not worry as much about crime......

Sub Sonic wrote:

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No, four years ago the housing boom was in full swing. What you state makes no sense. There are people living in Osceola County who are paying approximately the same property tax that they have paid for 20 to 30 years. The reason for that is that taxes are figured on the assessed value of the home at the time of purchase, and the assessment value increase each year is capped. Unless you are the most unlucky person in the world, it is mathematically impossible for your taxes to have doubled in four years. If it goes down this year it is because Amendment 1 passed, which is another argument against your "overtaxed" statements.
I don't have to assume you did not educate yourself. Your statements are proof enough.
So what high paying quality businesses do you suggest be courted to move to St. Cloud?

Mach II wrote:

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So now you're are going to tell me what I know and don't know. I bought my home at a very inexpensive price (way under market value), The previous owners were being transferred to a different state and needed to move in a hurry (they were in a bind because they needed to get to the state they were transferred to as soon as possible). The home was not a new home (about 16 years old). The fact that I added an addition and pool also played a factor in the taxes going up. I hung onto the home I was living in and rented it for about two years after I purchased my current home (4 years ago), until the "height" of the market then sold it to the people renting it and more than doubled my money. You seem to want to lump me into the same group of fools that are losing their homes to foreclosures and taxes because they overpaid for their homes and took out high interest loans. Since you're so smart and obviously know everything, then you figure out what type of businesses should come to St. Cloud. As stated in my previous post the last thing we need is “junk” business, we need more business like the medical center going into Stevens Plantation. I still think putting an archway and pavers in the downtown area is a waste of money, it isn't going to bring in quality business, incentives do that or as you say “court” but hey, if it's "free" money as you say then I say let them do it, as long is the money didn't come from my pocket I could care less......

Sub Sonic wrote:

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Obviously somebody needs to tell you. If what you say is true, then you have gotten royally screwed, and I have some swamp land in Arizona I want to sell you.
We don't need more businesses in the area, we need industry. Unfortunately the economy of central Florida is based on service, and in this pending recession time it will be the unnecessary services that are passed over before the necessities, or at least what are perceived as necessities in our privileged society.
As for the archway, had you read the story before commenting you could have saved yourself a lot of time, as it plainly states the proposed archway will be paid for by the Main Street society, composed of business people in the area.

Mach II wrote:

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You sound as if I didn't know something was wrong with the taxes.....I'm well aware I was being overtaxed. Actually....I was in Arizona 3 weeks ago and I can tell you there isn’t any swamp land there….I really don't need you or anyone else for that matter to tell me anything, so sell your “swamp land” elsewhere. If things don’t look corrected this year the appraiser and I will be having a discussion…..We need more high paying jobs, not just industry, tech jobs and research facilities for starters……I do agree with one thing, with the economy the way it is, things will be stagnant. I think St. Cloud has the opportunity to become a unique and diversified city if things are done right, if not, it will just be another “Kissimmee”………

just thinking wrote:

Please don't forget to mention the taxes that the businesses have to pay in St. Cloud. Why would a reputable business want to locate downtown, when taxes have DOUBLED for them? <quoted text>

just thinking wrote:

My boyfriend has several rental properties in the downtown area, and the tax increase has about killed him. He's able to hold it together, barely. It's the same for all smaller businesses downtown. How can they be expected to make it when the taxes are about the same, if just under, the mortgage payments? Re-doing the downtown area won't help that problem...

Mach II wrote:

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The merchants/restaurants in the downtown area should band together and have a meeting with the county/city to let them know the taxes are killing small business. As I stated before in my previous posts, the work they will be doing will not bring anymore business downtown or the city in general....I personally haven't been downtown in about two years, there is really nothing down there (for me anyway), the wife goes there once a week to have breakfast with some of her friends. The city could probably care less about the "mom & pop" businesses anyway so your fight will more than likely be futile. When downtown looks like a ghost town, they will look out of the windows of City hall, scratch their heads and wonder what happened, but at least the sidewalks and the archway will look nice......

Sub Sonic wrote:

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Obviously the city doesn't care anything about the "Mom & Pop" businesses. If they did, they'd be doing something to improve the downtown area..........Oh, wait, they are.
No swamp land in Arizona?!?!? Really ?!?!?! Are you sure ??????? I'm shocked.
I do have a bridge in Brooklyn for sale, if you're interested.

Mach II wrote:

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Yes, really there is no swamp land in Arizona...but of course I already knew that before going...Maybe you didn't....I have no desire to buy the brooklyn bridge either...but I hear people try to sell it several times a year (rolls eyes)....If you think the city cares about the downtown merchants then why don't you lead the parade when the downtown project is done and after that you can have a meeting with the merchants and explain to them that you and the city really do care......See how many show up....if any are left.....

Sub Sonic wrote:

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Yes, the merchants are a splintered group, despite having that whole Main Street merchants organization.
They obviously have no money either, despite volunteering to pay for an archway into the downtown area that apparently somebody in the group believes is a good idea.
And, to top it off, they are prevented from being around the city politicians, even though the farthest of the businesses are only 3 blocks away from City Hall.
No swamp land in Arizona? Seriously? You must be kidding. Next thing, you'll be telling me it's all arid, rocky desert.
Act fast, and not only can I get you the Brooklyn Bridge, but I'll throw in the Golden Gate Bridge for half price.
Gotta go and organize a parade. Will you be the clown?

Mach II wrote:

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Downtown could use any help it can get in the “looks” department.....If I were a merchant located there I would want to do something to make it look better. It might make them feel better (after paying those high taxes), at least they'll have something nice to look while they write the check for the taxes, however, it's not going to bring anymore businesses there. As the person that posted earlier stated, a lot of the merchants feel the same way in that regard, they are also feeling "squeezed" between the taxes and mortgage....The parade could use more than one clown....So I'll suggest you join me......

Sub Sonic wrote:

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You obviously haven't been downtown in a couple of years. If you had been, you would see the facade improvements and area enhancements. But, in keeping with the rest of your comments on this thread, you have made yet another uneducated statement. We'll take into account your advanced business degree, plainly with an emphasis on business development, and just abandon all attempts at improvement.
Too bad all those merchants who feel squeezed can't make the long and arduous journey to City Hall to voice their opinions.
Nope, I checked with the parade organizer, and only one clown is needed. Thanks for volunteering. You're uniquely qualified.
Are you sure there's no swamp land in Arizone? Seriously?