Several Santa Fe homes searched in Indian artifact probe

It's something how the gov has plenty of time and money to go back pre 1990, change rules and investigate this issue. Meanwhile, kids are being killed by drunk drivers, gangs are killing people right and left, homes are broken into and robbed and the criminals roam the streets thanks to that judge Virgil, or whatever his or her name is. Priorities are all screwed up, and everything is just backwards.

reporter wouldn't take Chris Seltser's story at face value that "new interpretations" NAGPRA have led to him to being a "target". Ask someone who knows something about NAGPRA.

If he acquired the material after 1990 and, especially if it came through Cavaliere he has no excuses. The story about Sotheby's disproves his point. If it was allowed to have been auctioned, it probably had confirmed provenance in a private hands.

Obtaining artifacts illegally, or dealing in stolen goods is a crime, and the Feds are right to take this seriously. If it seems a little extreme, maybe it's because things were lax for so long, with artifacts being looted and sold with the authorities looking the other way, and no one taking the legitimate concerns of the tribes seriously.

Before more ridiculous and disrepectful quotes like the one from Pryor above, remember it is not a matter of enforcing some laws and not others.
The laws protecting Native antiquities and artifacts are to prevent greedy criminals from looting the graves and sacred sites of their ancestors. How would you like someone to dig up your grandmother and sell her bones and items from her coffin at a gallery or flea market, or to go into your church or temple and steal sacred items??

I think some Indian beliefs are understandable, masks and dolls are living gods, They are fabricated-come on!

Here we go again white people stealing from Native Americans

rivers2bx wrote:

Obtaining artifacts illegally, or dealing in stolen goods is a crime, and the Feds are right to take this seriously. If it seems a little extreme, maybe it's because things were lax for so long, with artifacts being looted and sold with the authorities looking the other way, and no one taking the legitimate concerns of the tribes seriously.

Big deal. This should be a misdemeanor at most.

Oh please, Mestizo, no one would say robing anyone's grave is right. It's not. Anyone who does such a stupid and illegal activity should be locked up. If you sell, or have bones from any grave, you should be put in jail regardless of who it is. There are probably a lot of people (native Indians included) who are selling and trading in artifacts. What seems a lot more important to me, is the crimes going on today of criminal break in's, drunk drivers killing kids and a hosts of other crimes which should be dealt with in a more forceful fashion. And Federal crimes are brought up?? Isn't it a federal crime to come to this county illegally? Shouldn't the feds apprehend
and deport them? I guess they just pick and chose which laws to enforce.

true north wrote:

I think some Indian beliefs are understandable, masks and dolls are living gods, They are fabricated-come on!

Bread is "fabricated," but according to Catholic belief, once it's been consecrated it's the body and blood of Christ. Same thing with masks et al.(Why should one "consecration" be more worthy of respect than the other?)

Pryor wrote:

And Federal crimes are brought up?? Isn't it a federal crime to come to this county illegally? Shouldn't the feds apprehend
and deport them? I guess they just pick and chose which laws to enforce.

think that the feds don't deport thousands of people every year and that there are not multimillions spent on this effort annually?

Pryor wrote:

Oh please, Mestizo, no one would say robing anyone's grave is right. It's not. Anyone who does such a stupid and illegal activity should be locked up. If you sell, or have bones from any grave, you should be put in jail regardless of who it is. There are probably a lot of people (native Indians included) who are selling and trading in artifacts. What seems a lot more important to me, is the crimes going on today of criminal break in's, drunk drivers killing kids and a hosts of other crimes which should be dealt with in a more forceful fashion. And Federal crimes are brought up?? Isn't it a federal crime to come to this county illegally? Shouldn't the feds apprehend
and deport them? I guess they just pick and chose which laws to enforce.

By your two posts I assume the Feds should just be doing one job ONLY and that is ICE.

to see Custer and his troop's graves desecrated and the bones and artifacts put on auction to the highest bidder. Why is it any different for another race?

No, I don't think that at all. I know they want to do their jobs. Problem is they are being hampered by politicians who want to look the other way. Napolitano does as much as she can to hamper ICE from doing their job. I've talked to ICE officials, and it is clear to them that they are to go through the motions and do as little as possible. Also 'raids' have been almost eliminated under her. Sanctuary cities are all over the country. Santa Fe should know, it's one of them.

Pryor wrote:

you are just making stuff up. There are more enforcement actions in one day against the undocumented than there are annually in the artifact trade.

Ugh this white people are too much,, They have no restpec for what soo ever for are reilgon, just leave us alone and return all..

Pryor wrote:

No, I don't think that at all. I know they want to do their jobs. Problem is they are being hampered by politicians who want to look the other way. Napolitano does as much as she can to hamper ICE from doing their job. I've talked to ICE officials, and it is clear to them that they are to go through the motions and do as little as possible. Also 'raids' have been almost eliminated under her. Sanctuary cities are all over the country. Santa Fe should know, it's one of them.

thread hijacked. Pay attention - we are talking about artifacts.

Ret-Cop, With some of the prices people are willing to pay for the higher quality artifacts, these crimes are hardly petty. Besides, many looted sites are on public lands. Why should the public tolerate theft-for-profit of our cultural heritage on our public lands?

Pryor, Let it go--there is no logical connection between sanctuary cities and these crimes.

My point about sanctuary cities defying federal law, and fed laws against theft and sale of artifacts is simply that they are both federal laws. I've never liked the pick and choose high horse people get on where they champion one law or issue, and neglect other laws they don't agree with or benefit from. Not trying to change the subject. I'm just pointing out that the guy who killed those 4 kids did a lot more damage, and that laws to prevent that should have been enforced better. Those 4 kids and the relatives of them paid a dear price for it. They guy had a previous Dwi in 2001. And now you have a chef, same thing, gets probation. When these guys commit crimes, people pay dearly with their lives.

Wonder who they're going to target when they start unearthing some casinos...
lol

Pryor wrote:

.

but it doesn't defy Federal law - it leaves enforcement to the Feds who have jurisdiction and who spend tremendous resources on enforcement and prosecution - unlike artifact theft.

And of course drunk driving is a local matter.

"Santa Fe Resolution No. 1999-6 (1/99)

Prohibits the use of municipal resources to identify or apprehend any non-citizen solely on the basis of immigration status. Prohibits discrimination on the basis of national origin."