Bible study rules for public schools proposed

I suppose folks find it interesting. I do not think that you mean to be arguing that the religion should not be taught in public schools or be a part of state laws BECAUSE there are too many different beliefs and views. It is one argument for the practicality of not trying to do it. But if everyone agreed, it still would be a terrible thing to have church and state joined in a monolithic system of oppression - as has happened in many places throughout history.

JustSaying28 wrote:

Why do you all keep arguing back and forth about it? No one is going to back down from their beliefs or agree. So what's the point. It really simple.. Religion should not be taught in public schools or be apart of state laws. There are to many different beliefs and views. It should be left up to the parents to teach their kids about religion how they want, and no one should have to live their life's by someone else's beliefs. Religion and state should be completely separate.

havent forgotten wrote:

I could sure go for an enema right about now.

obviously some fool from louisiana has tried to use my name. I hate to think that it might be typical of folks from La. I have always protested against imposters, even against those who are mocking people I strongly disagree with. imposters are a form of scam. if anyone has any standards of civility on topix, one should oppose them, no matter whom they impersonate.

Religion should only be taught as culture, not as fact, not by any means.

Quantummist wrote:

<quoted text>
Who said I do? Go slap them for me...
I don't Support Any Individual... I support Specific Policies I agree with from Who Ever proposes them... I have No political or social ideology that out weighs Rational, Logical consideration of an issue... Any Issue... I would support an Obama policy in an Instant if it were in step with My considered position.. I would NOT support a Reagan, Bush or any parties policies that do Not fit My considered position... Then I take the Next step in picking a candidate for any office that Agrees with My views that I consider most important...
I could care less what others think important, including the policy makers....

OK, then do you mind indicating what people in politics you are with on most issues? and what do you think about their records regarding integrity, in various ways - or lack of hypocrisy, in various ways? would those personal character issues have any importance?

juggalo wrote:

<quoted text>
I hear a lot of Christians talking about gods will ..so my question is can prayer change gods will ?

that is a great question. please direct it to some of the fundies on here. I also wonder what they mean by God's Plan? is it something that determines everything that happens? or is it just his wish list that keeps getting thwarted by humans who do not obey it?

If it was God's plan that Jesus be crucified, then Judas was doing God's will, so poor Judas was just a scapegoat or a patsy for a nasty God. Obviously if it was God's Plan that Jesus be born and be crucified in order to die for our sins, it was God's plan that we have sins that needed to be died for - individual or original. Not a very nice plan there, God. lots of getting hurt by lots of living beings - you shoulda done better, if you were any good at being god.

Think wrote:

<quoted text>
But you'd probably have no problem with them teaching about gay rights and how it's ok for two people of the same sex to have sex...du go figure.

I wouldn't have a problem with schools telling students about homosexuals and how they should be more accepting of them. Maybe then they won't be bullied and harassed over their sexual orientation. It's not like they're going to teach the students to be homosexual (which isn't possible in the first place).

As for schools going downhill, part of that is theists trying to remove fact-based science like evolution and force creationism into the classroom. Education has it's funding cut quite often; teachers get fired, classrooms get crowded, various programs are cut.

Your way of thinking is backwards. I guess your idea of freedom of religion is the freedom of forcing your religion onto other people. Your views of homosexuality lead me to believe you're a bigot. Your way of thinking is damaging this country; it's part of the reason we're regressing.

The Specialist wrote:

Religion should only be taught as culture, not as fact, not by any means.

I agree. and most folks would not want it taught about as history, in an honest and comprehensive fashion. I think many things should be taught as intellectual history, a history of what various people thought in different places and different times, including our own in the Western world (socalled), rather than as facts that we know for sure. Even history is a sort of intellectual history of what folks who were known as historians or first rate journalists wrote and said, plus copies of some very helpful documents and some artifacts. Being too sure can lead to omissions of interesting stuff. and interesting stuff to the contrary is what keeps science "on its toes" so to speak.

trusted wrote:

<quoted text>•For those who believe in God no explanation is necessary. For those who do not believe in God no explanation is possible.

whose quote, please? and for what purpose?

havent forgotten wrote:

<quoted text> are you claiming that how yahoo or bing or google lists something in some category is a definative statement of fact? if so, we are at the end of the world already! chaos!

Revelation 21:8

But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death

Mark 16:15-16

And he said to them,“Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation. Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

Romans 10:14

How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching?

havent forgotten wrote:

<quoted text> are you claiming that how yahoo or bing or google lists something in some category is a definative statement of fact? if so, we are at the end of the world already! chaos!

No, I was referencing the real world. Not virtual sales order pitches, delusional, or make believe.

EssentialSalts wrote:

<quoted text>
I wouldn't have a problem with schools telling students about homosexuals and how they should be more accepting of them. Maybe then they won't be bullied and harassed over their sexual orientation. It's not like they're going to teach the students to be homosexual (which isn't possible in the first place).
As for schools going downhill, part of that is theists trying to remove fact-based science like evolution and force creationism into the classroom. Education has it's funding cut quite often; teachers get fired, classrooms get crowded, various programs are cut.
Your way of thinking is backwards. I guess your idea of freedom of religion is the freedom of forcing your religion onto other people. Your views of homosexuality lead me to believe you're a bigot. Your way of thinking is damaging this country; it's part of the reason we're regressing.

I do agree with you that schools should speak out aginst bullying. That everyone should be treated equally no matter what. They should be taught that harrasing people no matter thier diffrence may be is completley wrong.

It is not right that you compare all religious people to a few religious people that use their religion to push hate. I am religious and I do belive and worship God. My Veiw and belifes are that God wants us to judge no one and love all. God told us not to judge anyone for he would do the judging.. Some pople forget that judging someone else for the way they belive or live their lives is just as big as sin.. I have my about God and how I should live my life.. and think that God wants up to treat, help, and love everyone the same, even if they don't live or belive the way I do. God said Love thy neigbor.. not love they neighbor if belives the same you and live the same as you. So please do not refer to all of us like we are bigots.

havent forgotten wrote:

<quoted text> OK, then do you mind indicating what people in politics you are with on most issues? and what do you think about their records regarding integrity, in various ways - or lack of hypocrisy, in various ways? would those personal character issues have any importance?

It Varies... I would say I am a Economic Conservative socially liberal individualist atheistic independent Constitutional originalist. I tend to vote more for Republicans because of the Import I place on Original Intent of the Constitution and Capitalistic construct of my country of birth.

So if I have a Choice between two people I vote dependent of a descending list of importance... If between the choices given those positions taken by all in the running I pick the One that fits my Personal views of import...

Let's take Romney and Obama.. I would vote Romney .. I could care less about either Social positions as the thing I consider Important in this case is which is a Capitalist and which is Socialist.. Socialism Always leads to Totalitarian Rule so if given a choice between a Capitalist that has Horrible views on all social issues and a Socialist that has Great social views I would pick the Capitalist.... Could care less about much else either say or do given those choices...

If the Choices are between two Capitalist then I would look at the Next issue I find of import and compare positions..

I have voted Democratic in some elections, Republican in some, Independent in some... In the last 15 years I have tended to vote republican because the Democratic Party has been taken over by a large number of socialist that have usurped the concept of Liberal because they know that calling ones self Socialist is a losing proposition just as they changed from Communist to Progressive in the past when they were shown the door in the 50's...

JustSaying28 wrote:

<quoted text>
I do agree with you that schools should speak out aginst bullying. That everyone should be treated equally no matter what. They should be taught that harrasing people no matter thier diffrence may be is completley wrong.
It is not right that you compare all religious people to a few religious people that use their religion to push hate. I am religious and I do belive and worship God. My Veiw and belifes are that God wants us to judge no one and love all. God told us not to judge anyone for he would do the judging.. Some pople forget that judging someone else for the way they belive or live their lives is just as big as sin.. I have my about God and how I should live my life.. and think that God wants up to treat, help, and love everyone the same, even if they don't live or belive the way I do. God said Love thy neigbor.. not love they neighbor if belives the same you and live the same as you. So please do not refer to all of us like we are bigots.

I wasn't referring to all Christians as being bigoted or oppressive. When I was talking about bigotry, I was talking about that poster specifically and people who think like him. He seems to hate a specific group and uses religion to justify it (same with YAA and a few other posters who have shown here).

EssentialSalts wrote:

<quoted text>
I wasn't referring to all Christians as being bigoted or oppressive. When I was talking about bigotry, I was talking about that poster specifically and people who think like him. He seems to hate a specific group and uses religion to justify it (same with YAA and a few other posters who have shown here).

Well I don't belive that anyone should use religion justifie hating anyone.. God is about love and forgiveness not hate. I also don't belive state laws should be based on religious belifes. I think everyone should have equal rights comepletley. I don't belive it is right to force someone to live their lives according to someone elses belifes. Just my opion.. I don't belive going around hating others is very christine. They say these people that they are doing this to is going aginst religion, and I feel like they are doing more aginst religion than anyone cause they are pushing people away from God with the hatred.. That is just how I feel about it.

http://youtu.be/wWWOJGYZYpk

havent forgotten wrote:

<quoted text> OK, then do you mind indicating what people in politics you are with on most issues? and what do you think about their records regarding integrity, in various ways - or lack of hypocrisy, in various ways? would those personal character issues have any importance?

I would say my over views fit Penn Jillette's general views on many issues, not all, but most... If I were given a choice between pretty much ANY politician and Jillette , Jillette Wins Hands Down for Any public office including the Presidency

On Obama
http://youtu.be/wWWOJGYZYpk

On The Bible
http://www.youtube.com/watch...

On Drugs
http://youtu.be/mkYTK0s7ZUw

On Feng Shui / Bottled Water
http://youtu.be/mkYTK0s7ZUw

Yes and Amen wrote:

<quoted text>No!
Being Born is NOT their problem....
It's how they ended up, not having Christ in their hearts!
Just as there is hope for you... as long as you live!

Yes and Amen posted this in response to 'bad men' Hitler, etc.

Please for YOUR God's sake, do some reading!! Hitler was raised Roman Catholic!! AKA Christian! The SS Nazi's had German words on their belt buckles that translated into "God is with us"!! Hitler and his 'followers' were doing God's work. I've been to Germany, and I have seen the belt buckles in person.

And just one more thing on abortion, becuase it seems that YOU and many Christians are fixated on it. Why didn't you get on President Bush about abortion? He had 8 years to do something about it. Oh yeah, he and Cheney were too busy making money for themselves in oil and no bid contracts for Cheney's company. Do you think that NO abortions took place when he was President?

The FACT is that no Republican will EVER stop abortion, because that is the ONE wedge issue that keep their uneducated base coming back for more!!

Yes and Amen wrote:

<quoted text>You can say "No thanks!", and go on your way... reading nothing more...
But No!
So who is really shoving it in your face?
YOU!
You have a choice!

Think of what a wonderful world it would be if Christians practiced that

Quantummist wrote:

<quoted text>
It figures you'd support queers.
You are so fearful your bratty, snot-nosed kids will become a "religious nut,"

You're right, but I'd take it one step further. I don't want my children to become like YOU-a close-minded,unloving, judgemental religious nut!! Kind of like the GOD you worship...

OH, the bratty kids, well they're all at LCA and Lexington Catholic...

Occams Razor wrote:

<quoted text>
First off, I can see "QUEER" hurt your widdle feewings. Boo Hoo.
I hope my kids don't turn out to be crybaby pansies like you.
Second, when and where did I say I worshiped any god?
It figures you'd ASSume that because I think kids shouldn't be fags and should be educated, I must be a religious nut.
LOL Talk about paranoia and drama. I bet you're the queen mother on Facebook.

Nice to see you can manipulate TOPIX. BIG MAN. Call me names all you want. But by all means, please do not post anything that would be an 'educated' response. Sure looks like your religious indoctrination..I mean 'education' took...

Historically, it has been the MOST outspoken against homosexuality that were actually homosexual themselves...are you trying to hide something?