GM to pay up to $200M to help end American Axle strike

Good Day,

Seenit - indeed. Like I have said as well many times over, it is not just the folks on the shop florr but the entire company(ies) that are not getting it. If a car is designed or engineered poorly then what do you think the end result will be? Exactly...

Steelie

youranidiot wrote:

<quoted text>
SO why do all you uaw sheep bring up the recalls at toyota or the other car companies? Can't have it both ways.

Because of the arguments that it only the US automakers are built so shabbily to recalled perhaps. Or that it's only union workers that cause recalls, perhaps.

Not so much as can't have it both ways as can't have just one side of the argument.

Did Two Men and a Truck get the contract to move the equipment yet?

youranidiot wrote:

<quoted text>
Really? So only non-uaw recalls count? Ford issued a recall involving 9.6 MILLION vehicles. More than honda,toyota,vw,hyundai combined. 122,000 vibes for window problems, 208,000 regals and grand prix for FIRE potential,up to 400,000 yukons and tahoes for FIRE potential,181,000 hhr for failure to comply with FEDERAL SAFETY STANDARDS,276,000 caddy,pontiac and saturn for OUT OF SPEC pinion seals. GREAT QUALITY CONTROL ON THAT LAST ONE, HUH? There are a lot more on the gm website too. My point? Most recalls are for engineering reasons, but the uaw seems to spew crap about "foreign" automakers recall as being sooooooo bad. I just wanted to point out your shortcomings too. Now people can make an informed decision about american made vs. "foreign" made. BUY A TAHOE, HAVE YOUR HOUSE BURN DOWN.

Find someone else to hurl at. I don't say buy only US or buy only foreign. I would rather U.S but that is just too unrealistic and expectation.

If you will please read carefully I am saying, and I'll repeat it; For the overwhelming number of recalls they are from engineering and/or management decisions on how the vehicles are built. NOT BECAUSE union workers built them. I don't care if the workers are union or not in this case. The point in fact is it's managements decisions and responsibility how and from what the vehicles are built from.

Having experience in quality control I can tell you there were numerous times when I wanted production stopped for fault quality and MANAGEMENT over road it for production/quantity proposes. When parts were not withing specs and management overroad saying they were close enough.

It is ultimately managements right(s), authority, responsibility, decisions for quality control, hiring and firing...or not to, for the final product. I'll lay odds that the vast majority of recalls are caused by management over riding even engineers concerns for quality, safety etc., for the sake of the bottom line. Even when it comes to the management of the parts supplied to the auto manufacturer.

Al those vehicles you listed? Every one GM...right? Bets are that is because all the parts for each vehicle came from the same supplier. Or at least from the same engineering. Be that engineering from GM or the same supplier for GM. Even if it was the engineering of the proximity of where the parts were located to cause the hazard of catching fire. NOT THE UNION WORKERS FAULT. Or the workers fault if they weren't even union. The workers CAN NOT put the parts where they weren't engineered to go. Or for that matter decide which parts to put in. U.S. or foreign.

IT IS MANAGEMENTS responsibility. But oh no, it's just easier for the inexperienced to shout out all the faults can't be be with the poor company management because the big ole bad meanie union or even non union workers are dragging them down.

Why do you buy one vehicle over another? Because of quality, durability, dependability and even price. Well ALL OF THOSE are MANAGEMENTS responsibility. And I don't care if the auto workers cut their wages down to $9.00 per hour with no benefits, the parts ARE STILL going to be made in Mexico because it'll still be cheaper to build them there.

Wake up America, you don't have a clue.

youranidiot wrote:

And FORD recalling 500,000 trucks don't count because they are union made.

LET ME SEE WASN'T FIRESTONE that made the tires that were recalled ? so what the he-l does that have to do with FORD? YES FOOLS LIKE YOU blame FORD but was it not FIRESTONE that should be blamed? DA Blame the auto co. for every thing , at least FORD sends their costomers letters about recalls/ I got one today and it was on my 1993 truck / I know people that own Toyota's that never ever got any info on their cars even if they had 3 or 4 recalls and 17 to 20 service notices. AND IF you bothered to look that 500,000 trucks was over a long period of time . TOYOTA MADE 2,000,000 autos a year for 2005, 2006 and as of jan. 2007 1,000,000 autos and RECALLED 9,500,000 for the same years] let me see they made 5,000,000 autos and had over 9,500,000 for the same time HMMMMM Good quality? In 2007 alone every toyota had 3 recalls and an avg. of 17 service notices/ And maybe some time in the future people will stop and look at the FIT and TRIM [ look at how the doors fit ' trunk lid / tail lights ' how things fit together and you will see that the U.S. auto co are better than Honda . toyota ect. JUST open your eyes / YES the U.S. co. are where the JAP's were 40 yrs ago and now have to get the U .S. people to take a good look at our cars and see that THE so called # 1 car in the U.S. isn't as GOOD as THEY say they are / TAKE A DRIVE and look at the fit and trim of the U,S, cars vs. the Hondas or toyotas. YOU WILL be impressed.

youranidiot wrote:

<quoted text>
Really? So only non-uaw recalls count? Ford issued a recall involving 9.6 MILLION vehicles. More than honda,toyota,vw,hyundai combined. 122,000 vibes for window problems, 208,000 regals and grand prix for FIRE potential,up to 400,000 yukons and tahoes for FIRE potential,181,000 hhr for failure to comply with FEDERAL SAFETY STANDARDS,276,000 caddy,pontiac and saturn for OUT OF SPEC pinion seals. GREAT QUALITY CONTROL ON THAT LAST ONE, HUH? There are a lot more on the gm website too. My point? Most recalls are for engineering reasons, but the uaw seems to spew crap about "foreign" automakers recall as being sooooooo bad. I just wanted to point out your shortcomings too. Now people can make an informed decision about american made vs. "foreign" made. BUY A TAHOE, HAVE YOUR HOUSE BURN DOWN.

I didn't get down this far to read this , well over how many years did this recall cover ? as I said in my last post toyota made a total of 5,000.000 autos in 2005,2006, and 1/2 of 2007 AND RECALLED 9.5 million DA> isn't that almost 2 recalls for every auto they built?

SoLiDaRiTy wrote:

A nice 2nd job??? I highly doubt it honey! Plant work takes alot out of you especially in the summer when it's over 130 degrees in there! Most people would quit after a few hours for sure! <quoted text>

Takes alot out of you? Yeah right. Worked there, did that, nothing but lazy individuals. Welcome to the real world. Put your resume out there with AAM on it and see how many calls you get back for a job offer. Alot of business will not even look at AAM workers due to their ummm "high work ethics"...yeah right

Mark Venture wrote:

Keep striking. AA will cave in if they want to save the business. AA is really trying to screw the union workers over and its wrong. Support the workers.

The union is what bought these places down. that is why the union leader in Buffalo jumped ship before it all happened.

Mike wrote:

<quoted text>
Takes alot out of you? Yeah right. Worked there, did that, nothing but lazy individuals. Welcome to the real world. Put your resume out there with AAM on it and see how many calls you get back for a job offer. Alot of business will not even look at AAM workers due to their ummm "high work ethics"...yeah right

I would have to say I personaly don't think YOU ever did work in an auto plant in the summer / If you ever did YOU would not be saying B.S. like you did / I have seen many people walk in to an auto plant and walk out by lunch and have seen people come back after saying B.S. like you just did and say they were SORRY they ever ? us when we told them how nasty it could be / and that was after the frist day.

tbird19482 wrote:

<quoted text>LET ME SEE WASN'T FIRESTONE that made the tires that were recalled ? so what the he-l does that have to do with FORD? YES FOOLS LIKE YOU blame FORD but was it not FIRESTONE that should be blamed? DA Blame the auto co. for every thing , at least FORD sends their costomers letters about recalls/ I got one today and it was on my 1993 truck / I know people that own Toyota's that never ever got any info on their cars even if they had 3 or 4 recalls and 17 to 20 service notices. AND IF you bothered to look that 500,000 trucks was over a long period of time . TOYOTA MADE 2,000,000 autos a year for 2005, 2006 and as of jan. 2007 1,000,000 autos and RECALLED 9,500,000 for the same years] let me see they made 5,000,000 autos and had over 9,500,000 for the same time HMMMMM Good quality? In 2007 alone every toyota had 3 recalls and an avg. of 17 service notices/ And maybe some time in the future people will stop and look at the FIT and TRIM [ look at how the doors fit ' trunk lid / tail lights ' how things fit together and you will see that the U.S. auto co are better than Honda . toyota ect. JUST open your eyes / YES the U.S. co. are where the JAP's were 40 yrs ago and now have to get the U .S. people to take a good look at our cars and see that THE so called # 1 car in the U.S. isn't as GOOD as THEY say they are / TAKE A DRIVE and look at the fit and trim of the U,S, cars vs. the Hondas or toyotas. YOU WILL be impressed.

Tbird you may want to check your information on the Firestone tires. If you kept up with what was going on you would know that those same make and size of tires were also on GM vehicles. Yet the GM vehicles were never recalled. The reason, the auto manufacture dictates quality standards to the suppliers, GM held firestone to a higher standard of acceptable tire.

Seenitbefore wrote:

Post part 1:
Okay. I'm seeing a lot about agricultural products...food stuffs. Then why are we having a food "crisis"...being expanded prices not seen in decades. "Normal" "market theory is when supplies rise, price drops. Not seeming to making a positive affect.
Thus far it appears to be a bunch of figures without any real world advantage.

You missed something with your explanation of supply and demand. You forgot the demand part. Prices of a product will only drop when the available supply exceeds market demand. Supply did increase but in response to increased demand. The demand is holding so the only way to reduce food prices would be to increase amount produced until it passes demand.

If you want your real world advantage it is simple. We are not using your tax money to pay farmers not to plant fields.

JIMMYK wrote:

<quoted text>
Tbird you may want to check your information on the Firestone tires. If you kept up with what was going on you would know that those same make and size of tires were also on GM vehicles. Yet the GM vehicles were never recalled. The reason, the auto manufacture dictates quality standards to the suppliers, GM held firestone to a higher standard of acceptable tire.

That maybe so/ the point I was trying to make was as per the J.D.Powers list of the top 10 autos that were RECALLED in2007 V.W. was #1/ toyota #2 /lexus was there, there were NO FORDS or G.M. cars or trucks on the list,and that in order to find out about most of the recalls from other CO.'s you have to look and look and look . and as for Ford and G.M. I have even gotten letters telling me to bring in my old cars [ got 1 tues. on my 1993 e150 van ]

Whiny cry babies who work swing shift and everyother week see their kids for an hour a day and thats if after working till 1 or 2 in the morning getting up at 7 with them and taking them to school...paying 90% of our health care costs, not having our childeren covered for eye and dental insurance(dental can be very expensive) which are necessity for kids...working in 130 degree or higher on the floor watchin people drop...or watching a person get mangled from a fork truck and unable to support there family now..yup we are "cry babies"..get a clue instead of bashing us because of jealousy

SO SICK OF CRIMINALS wrote:

hopefully all the whiny cry babies take a long walk off a short bridge so that the company can hire some new workers who will APPRECIATE having a job!!!

Mark Venture wrote:

Keep striking. AA will cave in if they want to save the business. AA is really trying to screw the union workers over and its wrong. Support the workers.

What drugs are you on? AA&M's Guanajuato facility is supplying the parts at the moment and GM still has over 100 days of inventory of their slow selling vehicles. There won't be any caving in.

What you might see is the company lockout the union.

Mike wrote:

<quoted text>
Takes alot out of you? Yeah right. Worked there, did that, nothing but lazy individuals. Welcome to the real world. Put your resume out there with AAM on it and see how many calls you get back for a job offer. Alot of business will not even look at AAM workers due to their ummm "high work ethics"...yeah right

OK, first it was over 100 degrees, then it was over 120 degrees, and now it is over 130 degrees! Who knows, with global warming is might hit 150 degrees in there!

Call OSHA if it gets too toasty. Take your salt tablets.

"If you can't take the heat.....get out of the forge!"

tbird19482 wrote:

<quoted text>That maybe so/ the point I was trying to make was as per the J.D.Powers list of the top 10 autos that were RECALLED in2007 V.W. was #1/ toyota #2 /lexus was there, there were NO FORDS or G.M. cars or trucks on the list,and that in order to find out about most of the recalls from other CO.'s you have to look and look and look . and as for Ford and G.M. I have even gotten letters telling me to bring in my old cars [ got 1 tues. on my 1993 e150 van ]

Just because there was no recall doesn't mean better quality. I don't know the specifics of domestic vs. foreign quality, but I think for you to make a valid argument you need more than just recall #'s, because a lot of vehicles have problems and there is no recalls on them. How about warranty claims in the first 30,000 miles, chronic problems, etc.

Ava wrote:

Whiny cry babies who work swing shift and everyother week see their kids for an hour a day and thats if after working till 1 or 2 in the morning getting up at 7 with them and taking them to school...paying 90% of our health care costs, not having our childeren covered for eye and dental insurance(dental can be very expensive) which are necessity for kids...working in 130 degree or higher on the floor watchin people drop...or watching a person get mangled from a fork truck and unable to support there family now..yup we are "cry babies"..get a clue instead of bashing us because of jealousy <quoted text>

I don't think you can blame the company for the shift you work, you accepted the job. If its so bad and you are so underpaid why don't you find a different job that is first shift so you can spend more time with your kids? If you are such a hard worker and so underpaid then it should be easy to find a new job with better wages and benefits, or maybe you are just a cry baby.

Tourists Wanted wrote:

<quoted text>
OK, first it was over 100 degrees, then it was over 120 degrees, and now it is over 130 degrees! Who knows, with global warming is might hit 150 degrees in there!
Call OSHA if it gets too toasty. Take your salt tablets.
"If you can't take the heat.....get out of the forge!"

he he funny

JIMMYK wrote:

<quoted text>
You missed something with your explanation of supply and demand. You forgot the demand part. Prices of a product will only drop when the available supply exceeds market demand. Supply did increase but in response to increased demand. The demand is holding so the only way to reduce food prices would be to increase amount produced until it passes demand.
If you want your real world advantage it is simple. We are not using your tax money to pay farmers not to plant fields.

Not exactly true. Good theory that really isn't at work anymore. I've traveled extensively around this country. The number of cities, and towns, with the many number of cars on the many number of lots, both new and used, not including the number of cars being sold by private individuals; With so many of those used cars being sold and resold by dealerships...because they aren't moving off the lots, at auction, would seem to indicate there is a glut of supply over demand.

Drive down 131 North or South and look East, I think it's about 100th, and see all the vehicles in the lot at the dealer auction week after week after week. And there are so many more of those auctions week after week after week all around the country. Because these vehicles are being moved by dealers at these auctions continually does not make for an accurate reflection on actual demand. And what we are told continually is vehicles are moving is to why places like KBB and such "set" vehicle prices. It's a fuzzy demand quotient.

You are right about the theory of supply and demand. The facts don't always reflect the reality though.

IMO...of course.

O geeez....The theory doesn't always reflect the reality. AGH.