Upper Macedonia, Southern Vardarska, Gorna Makedonija, or Down Under Kosovo?

Jan 25, 2010 Full story: macedonianissues.blogspot.com 9

Much has been written lately about the future name of the Former Yugoslav Republic of Makedonija, to be settled with Greece.

Full Story
United Macedonians

Lichtenstein, Germany

#1 Jan 25, 2010
Upper Macedonia, Southern Vardarska, Gorna Makedonija, or Down Under Kosovo?

By Miltiades Elia Bolaris

http://macedonianissues.blogspot.com/2010/01/...

Much has been written lately about the future name of the Former Yugoslav Republic of Makedonija, to be settled with Greece. The former Yugoslav province left the collapsing Yugoslav union, in 1991 and declared independence, taking on the misnomer of Ре&#10 87;уб& #1083;ик а Ма&#10 82;ед& #1086;ни ја, transliterated as Republika Makedonija.

The Greeks, whose northernmost province is the historic Μακ εδο νία /Macedonia, home of Aristotle and Alexander the Great among other greats of world history and culture, demanded that their new neighbors must choose a different name, not Macedonia. The former Yugoslav province, the Greeks argued, has no more than a small part (Pelagonia and part of Amphaxitis) of historic Macedonia proper in its land, mainly along its southern provinces.

Even accepting for a moment the Skopjan unhistorical definition of where Macedonia starts and ends, and wrongly for a moment assuming that all of FYROM's land was part of Macedonia proper, FYROM still could not be called Macedonia. Even under that definition, it only constitutes a small part of the whole area of Macedonia proper, about 30%.
United Macedonians

Lichtenstein, Germany

#2 Jan 25, 2010
The use of the names "Macedonia" "Macedonian" to describe the former Yugoslav province, the majority Slavic ethnic group of FYROM, and their language, has created utter confusion to unsuspecting people world-wide. People unfamiliar with ancient Greek history, the Balkans, their history and geography, hear Macedonia and they miss-identify the name Macedonia with FYROM. This transvestite situation is not something that the Greeks and especially the Greek Macedonians could, would or should accept for a long time. This is an issue whose solution is overdue and needs to be resolved through honest negotiations.

Since 1995 an interim accord is in effect, by which the self proclaimed Republika Makedonija was temporarily named FYROM: the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia, for all international purposes and agreements, including use of the name in the United Nations and other international fora like the Olympics, etc. As years passed, instead of trying to reach a final agreement with Athens that would replace the interim, temporary accord, and replace the name FYROM with a new, internationally acceptable name, Skopje chose instead to put all its energy in promoting the acceptance of its so called "constitutional name". It also avoided any real negotiations on the issue, dynamiting any real compromise solution in this dispute. While Athens was pushing for an "inter pares" solution, a name for use "by everyone", Skopje put the breaks and counter-offered that the only compromise it was willing to accept was a dual naming, one name which would be for bilateral usage and acceptable to Greece, while everyone else should call them Macedonia. This, obviously, is not a solution that the Greeks would ever accept.

As time went by, many countries began recognizing FYROM as Macedonia. Greeks felt that the interim agreement had been a diplomatic blunder, a trap into which they had unwittingly fallen, allowing a huge window of escape for Skopje to walk away and do as it pleased. They saw that Skopje was winning the long term game, and they had no reason to compromise, since many countries had already recognized them as RoM. A shift of the identification of the name Macedonia away from the historic Macedonia proper and towards the ex-Yugoslav state, was becoming a fact. Additionally, confusion set in among the less informed in the outside world about the ethnic identity of the ancient Macedonians and about the Hellenic identity of the three or more million Macedonians of the Greek province by the same name.

http://macedonianissues.blogspot.com/2010/01/...

“Mess with the best,”

Since: Apr 08

Location hidden

#3 Jan 25, 2010
No Macedoninja whatever for scupis.

Not a single artifact with slav-bulgarian language, was found. During GA period.

Gorna? Konan? King kong?

Under kosovo? Hahaha Then scupi would be serbian as in 1914.

What were scupis before 1914? Why are scupis afraid to tell us?
Leotyxidis

Athens, Greece

#4 Jan 25, 2010
These Monkeys (the monkeydonians) can finally help scientific progress.

The are a fine example of "Time non-continuity" and "parallel words".

While Europe was living its history, they lived in a "parallel world" where time is not linear.

That Ainstein was an unlucky person. If he new about them the "Theory of Relativity" would be completely different.
Racoco

Sevilla, Spain

#5 Jan 26, 2010
What a load of crap.
It seems to me that Greeks have a something to hide and fear that the truth might come out as a big Greek lie.
If they were so confident of there truth why is it necessary for them to spend so much money(they do not have) on this kind of propaganda??!!!
They should concentrate on there shattered economy to a level which bestow,s a EU country a country Greece who allegedly brought Democracy to the western world yet they show little of it, what a shame.
United Macedonians

Tübingen, Germany

#6 Jan 26, 2010
Racoco wrote:
What a load of crap.
It seems to me that Greeks have a something to hide and fear that the truth might come out as a big Greek lie.
If they were so confident of there truth why is it necessary for them to spend so much money(they do not have) on this kind of propaganda??!!!
They should concentrate on there shattered economy to a level which bestow,s a EU country a country Greece who allegedly brought Democracy to the western world yet they show little of it, what a shame.
What is propaganda, an article written by an academic?

What about the view of 357 academics, would that also be propaganda?
Racoco wrote:
What a load of crap.
It seems to me that Greeks have a something to hide and fear that the truth might come out as a big Greek lie.
If they were so confident of there truth why is it necessary for them to spend so much money(they do not have) on this kind of propaganda??!!!
They should concentrate on there shattered economy to a level which bestow,s a EU country a country Greece who allegedly brought Democracy to the western world yet they show little of it, what a shame.
What is propaganda, an article written by an academic?

Spain is in no better position financially than Greece. Greece is almost as high on the democracy index as Spain. Higher than France or Italy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index

Spain is in no better position financially than Greece. Greece is almost as high on the democracy index as Spain. Higher than France or Italy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index
PAOKARA

Thessaloníki, Greece

#7 Jan 26, 2010
Racoco wrote:
What a load of crap.
It seems to me that Greeks have a something to hide and fear that the truth might come out as a big Greek lie.
If they were so confident of there truth why is it necessary for them to spend so much money(they do not have) on this kind of propaganda??!!!
They should concentrate on there shattered economy to a level which bestow,s a EU country a country Greece who allegedly brought Democracy to the western world yet they show little of it, what a shame.
funny you from Spain talk about economy :)))

you are in worst position than us

if Greece will not save euro you are next malaka
United Macedonians

Tübingen, Germany

#8 Jan 26, 2010
http://macedonia-evidence.org/

On May 18th, 2009, 200 Classical Scholars from around the world, sent a letter to the President of the United States of America, Barack Obama.

Since then, the list of cosigners has grown to 357.

http://macedonia-evidence.org/obama-letter.ht...

Dear President Obama,

We, the undersigned scholars of Graeco-Roman antiquity, respectfully request that you intervene to clean up some of the historical debris left in southeast Europe by the previous U.S. administration.

On November 4, 2004, two days after the re-election of President George W. Bush, his administration unilaterally recognized the “Republic of Macedonia.” This action not only abrogated geographic and historic fact, but it also has unleashed a dangerous epidemic of historical revisionism, of which the most obvious symptom is the misappropriation by the government in Skopje of the most famous of Macedonians, Alexander the Great.

We believe that this silliness has gone too far, and that the U.S.A. has no business in supporting the subversion of history. Let us review facts.(The documentation for these facts [here in boldface] can be found attached and at: http://macedonia-evidence.org/documentation.h... )

The land in question, with its modern capital at Skopje, was called Paionia in antiquity.
Athens calling

Athens, Greece

#9 Jan 28, 2010
United Macedonians wrote:
Upper Macedonia, Southern Vardarska, Gorna Makedonija, or Down Under Kosovo?
By Miltiades Elia Bolaris
http://macedonianissues.blogspot.com/2010/01/...
Much has been written lately about the future name of the Former Yugoslav Republic of Makedonija, to be settled with Greece. The former Yugoslav province left the collapsing Yugoslav union, in 1991 and declared independence, taking on the misnomer of Ре&#10 87;уб& #1083;ик а Ма&#10 82;ед& #1086;ни ја, transliterated as Republika Makedonija.
The Greeks, whose northernmost province is the historic Μακ εδο νία /Macedonia, home of Aristotle and Alexander the Great among other greats of world history and culture, demanded that their new neighbors must choose a different name, not Macedonia. The former Yugoslav province, the Greeks argued, has no more than a small part (Pelagonia and part of Amphaxitis) of historic Macedonia proper in its land, mainly along its southern provinces.
Even accepting for a moment the Skopjan unhistorical definition of where Macedonia starts and ends, and wrongly for a moment assuming that all of FYROM's land was part of Macedonia proper, FYROM still could not be called Macedonia. Even under that definition, it only constitutes a small part of the whole area of Macedonia proper, about 30%.
Pornomacedonia.

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