Club still in Burnett chase, agent says

Fire Trembley---

What do you mean "alienate players"??

You mean like withholding Ponson's salary for years and going to court to duke it out?

Ponson deserved to get cut, but don't think that other FA's aren't going to think twice about signing a contract with an owner who is willing to keep their pay.

And can you really blame Tejeda? Here are his first three Oriole seasons:

2004 34HR 1150RBI .311BA All Star
2005 26HR 98RBI .304BA All Star
2006 24HR 100RBI .330BA All Star

Miguel was trying hard. Was the rest of the franchise trying hard? He was in the playoffs four years in a row before joining this sinking ship.

He made a bad choice.

Now, goofy O's fans are clamoring to pay a first baseman at least 50% more money than Tejeda was being paid at shortstop. Why? Because the guy was born in Maryland.

That has to be one of the stupidest reasons in the world to overpay for a player.

Fire Trembley wrote:

<quoted text>
I'm as pessimistic as the come regarding the O's, but even I'll be shocked if Wieters doesn't pan out as a hitter. I think his future is at another position as, he's too good of a hitter, too tall, and too inexperienced at calling games to be a MLB catcher...but he'll hit well in the bigs.

2006 Alex Gordon AA (only year in minors) 29HR 102RBI .325BA 1.015OPS
2007-2008 Gordon's MLB Totals (combined) 31HR 119RBI .253BA .753OPS

2005 Delmon Young AA/AAA 26HR 99RBI .315BA 881OBP
MLB Career Young (combined) 334 games 26HR 172RBI .292BA .739OPS

I don't know how Wieters will hit in his first year, but some very good hitters have stumbled out of the gate in MLB.

I agree that he shouldn't be forced to catch for very long due to his size. Additionally, he'll have to sit at least one day a week to rest (as opposed to playing every day at 1B).

Worst case scenario: his defense and game-calling cost the O's some games early, and it's gets in his head (see Jeff Clement, Seattle Mariners).

Oops. I meant OPS for Young.

An 881 OBP would be pretty good.

again the bottom line is this. the Orioles are not going to sign anyone who they feel is overpriced. this applies not only to Burnett but Texiera as well. I would much more overpay for a great hitting first baseman than a pitcher with a history of arm problems. you know Texiera will hit anywhere. Can you imagine the blasts he could hit at Camden yards? He's young enough that he can be a part of the plan for the future. In the next five years he will average over 30 homeruns and over a hundred rbi's Mr.MacPhail, I know it's not the fans money your spending, but if there is any way you could get Texiera, get him. It will be worth the investment. You will see. You could use him as the cornerstone to the lineup. If you don't sign anyone else this offseason, sign Mark Texiera. The pitching in the long run will take care of itself. Pitchers take time to develope. Remember two guys by the name of Schilling and Harnisch? Guys like Liz and Olsen were thrown right into the fire. You can't expect those guys to be allstars over night. There are alot of arms coming back this year too Albers, Patton, Baez, Ray, Tillman, Matusz, etc. When it comes to pitching you have to be patient. I like many other fans are frustrated at the teams misfortunes but everything balances out in the end. Everyone will see. Let's only due signings that make sense for the long run only. Baltimore's a great baseball town with a rich tradition of pitching, defense, and hitting. The last ten years have been real rough but it's going to get better. If you noticed the Yankees and Red Sox are getting quite older. And the Orioles are younger. Build a great farm system, keep your star players and sign a few key free agents that make sense and you will see a winner.

Fire Trembley wrote:

<quoted text>
I am a football genius. My insights are just so far beyond the reach of the average man that people have trouble grasping what I'm saying and dismiss it as garbage.

I believe your insights told you the Ravens would go 4-12. Nough said this is an O's post and you do know a little about the subject.

Angelos is a thief. Plain and simple.

He stopped paying rent, and the Maryland Stadium Authority just ignored it.

They're all crooks, stealing from the fans, taxpayers and MLB.

Unreal.

I would like to see a defense from one of the "real fans" on how the owner of the O's can justify stealong from the taxpayers of Maryland.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/nov/...

Angelos only had to pay 7% of ticket sales in the first place.

It's one of the most generous stadium arrangements in MLB, and he STIFFS the Maryland Stadium Authority.

And worse yet, they look the other way instead of doing their job.

Crooks. Plain and simple.

How many times does the MSA have to get busted for financial shenanigans before someone shuts it down?

We will see in the next couple of months whether McPhail truly wants to upgrade his pitching staff. And that means trading Brian Roberts for a couple of decent pitchers, preferably ones that know how to throw strikes. But my guess is that Roberts will still be on the team come spring training and the pitching staff will enter March intact- meaning, get ready for another long, long, year of futililty and abomination. Thank God it's still football season.

Ghost Oriole wrote:

Angelos is a thief. Plain and simple.
He stopped paying rent, and the Maryland Stadium Authority just ignored it.
They're all crooks, stealing from the fans, taxpayers and MLB.
Unreal.
I would like to see a defense from one of the "real fans" on how the owner of the O's can justify stealong from the taxpayers of Maryland.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/nov/...

WTF do you care? Do you pay Maryland taxes?

jon dey wrote:

<quoted text>I believe your insights told you the Ravens would go 4-12. Nough said this is an O's post and you do know a little about the subject.

This clown is a legend in his own mind.

Tom wrote:

<quoted text>
WTF do you care? Do you pay Maryland taxes?

Oh, I see you don't care if the team's owner is a crook.

You are an EXCELLENT O's fan. No morals. No standards. Low character.

Fan of the month!

Ray Lewis is probably your favorite football player.

And this Angelos/MSA story should get some legs. It's fairly obvious that there was criminal activity.

The O's have been tenants and renters for over 15 years. Everyone knows that rent is due. Suddenly, Angelos stops paying, and the head of the MSA says, "That's OK, Uncle Pete. You don't have to pay."

Then, the head of the MSA is fired after the $1.7 million is found to be missing.

Since there aren't any stadiums to build, the basic job of the MSA is to COLLECT THE RENT.

Why would the head of the MSA suddenly forget their primary purpose, and why in the world would they let the O's off the hook for paying? Take a wild guess as to why someone would do that.

If that non-transaction had been above board, the head of the MSA wouldn't have been fired.

Every time I think Angelos cannot stoop any lower, he does.

If you or I stole $170, we'd face charges. Peter Angelos steals $1.7 million, and no one does anything about it.

NO9108OSFAN wrote:

again the bottom line is this. the Orioles are not going to sign anyone who they feel is overpriced. this applies not only to Burnett but Texiera as well. I would much more overpay for a great hitting first baseman than a pitcher with a history of arm problems. you know Texiera will hit anywhere. Can you imagine the blasts he could hit at Camden yards? He's young enough that he can be a part of the plan for the future. In the next five years he will average over 30 homeruns and over a hundred rbi's Mr.MacPhail, I know it's not the fans money your spending, but if there is any way you could get Texiera, get him. It will be worth the investment. You will see. You could use him as the cornerstone to the lineup. If you don't sign anyone else this offseason, sign Mark Texiera. The pitching in the long run will take care of itself. Pitchers take time to develope. Remember two guys by the name of Schilling and Harnisch? Guys like Liz and Olsen were thrown right into the fire. You can't expect those guys to be allstars over night. There are alot of arms coming back this year too Albers, Patton, Baez, Ray, Tillman, Matusz, etc. When it comes to pitching you have to be patient. I like many other fans are frustrated at the teams misfortunes but everything balances out in the end. Everyone will see. Let's only due signings that make sense for the long run only. Baltimore's a great baseball town with a rich tradition of pitching, defense, and hitting. The last ten years have been real rough but it's going to get better. If you noticed the Yankees and Red Sox are getting quite older. And the Orioles are younger. Build a great farm system, keep your star players and sign a few key free agents that make sense and you will see a winner.

Nice to see a positive post!

The last ten years have been real rough but it's going to get better. If you noticed the Yankees and Red Sox are getting quite older.
----------
Let's look at those "old" Red Sox

ROY/MVP Pedroia age 24
OF Ellsbury age 24
OF Bay age 29
1B/3B Youk age 29
SS Lowrie age 24
SP Lester age 24
SP Matsuzake age 27
SP Beckett age 28
SP Buchholz age 23
SP Masterson age 23
Closer Papelbon age 27

The Red Sox are considerably younger than the "rebuilding" Orioles. Sure, they have a 41 year-old Tim Wakefield. But the rest of the rotation is far, far younger than Baltimore's (and much better).

Another DUMB analysis by an uninformed O's fan (there are only two types of O's fans---- dishonest and ignorant).

As far as the Cubs fans, they used to go to the games just to party and for many, they seemed to care less who won. Not that there's anything wrong with that but let's not try to compare fans bases. The O's fans have stopped going because the team has become a losing team that is depressing to watch. You would to really bleed black and orange to steadily attend games where guys like Payton/Ramon etc are in there daily and pitchers can't throw strikes. Personally, I've followed the O's for a long time and fan stomach a few more losing seasons if there is an upside/light at the end of the tunnel. That can only happen if we field a young team that can grow better together.
Ghost. I have to comment on your Ponson reference re: treatment of players/influence potential free agentsetec. Sir Syd was one of a kind but I have to side with King Peter on this one. It's not like Ponson didn't have enough chances so why not challenge the conduct clause? I'm sure the O's don't want to sign anymore Ponson-types so I don't think that decision is going to scare too many players away(in fact, I'm sure many players secretly applauded the Sir Syd dumping). Some players are avoiding Baltimore because they've been consistent losers but even with that, we still manage to sign some free agents, just not the 'right' ones in many cases.

Ghost Oriole wrote:

The last ten years have been real rough but it's going to get better. If you noticed the Yankees and Red Sox are getting quite older.
----------
Let's look at those "old" Red Sox
ROY/MVP Pedroia age 24
OF Ellsbury age 24
OF Bay age 29
1B/3B Youk age 29
SS Lowrie age 24
SP Lester age 24
SP Matsuzake age 27
SP Beckett age 28
SP Buchholz age 23
SP Masterson age 23
Closer Papelbon age 27
The Red Sox are considerably younger than the "rebuilding" Orioles. Sure, they have a 41 year-old Tim Wakefield. But the rest of the rotation is far, far younger than Baltimore's (and much better).
Another DUMB analysis by an uninformed O's fan (there are only two types of O's fans---- dishonest and ignorant).

You continue to miss the point of the rebuilding orioles. The ones you see on the field aren't part of the plan (give or take Markakis and Jones). It's the guys who are in the minors who are the real rebuilding acquisitions. The guys on the field are place holders. So yeah, we get cheap older seasoned players to keep the seats warm for the youngsters we hope to bring up to the show some time down the road. Expect a lot of folks in their 30s on the field the next few years, as we groom a troup of 20 year olds to take their spots. THAT is the O's rebuilding plan. If you focus on what they throw onto the field the next few years, you are basically focusing on the afterbirth and ignoring the baby. I don't know why this is such a hard concept for you, but you've essentially made the same above post several times and don't seem to get who we are actually trading for, and who's a seat filler.